Who will be better in 2024? Hawthorn or Essendon?

[Yoda_]

People suggesting Parish > Newcombe, laughable.

Nash > Parish

Day > Parish

Worpel > Parish

Parish should be in the VFL, doesn't go hard enough. Essendon's best players (other than obviously Merrett), are blokes who've not yet been ruined by the culture and development at their club. Durham, Martin and Caddy all guns.

When Essendon recruited 2MP and their fans talked about him like the second coming, I laughed for weeks. I've got a good mate who is a suns supporter so I'd watched plenty of their games. He kicks goals but doesn't offer enough around the ground. Just like Mckay now, he can win big 1 on 1's, but his groundball work is atrocious.

Bombers should build the forwardline around Caddy.

To be fair, Parish's last two weeks have been reminiscent of his AA years so that could still be a close run race my friend

 

[Dewyyyyy]

if you check my posting on the board tonight I am fed up with the inaction my football club is taking. The fact that so much talk happens every single year and so little changes says enough.

Spineless, gutless, inept, could go on and on. Im happy to see North, Hawthorn even the Suns looking to shoot past us and quickly

They are a pretty private department, we don’t get to do much work with them, but the times we have, he has been there but roleless in an official sense.

 

[Yoda_]

They are a pretty private department, we don’t get to do much work with them, but the times we have, he has been there but roleless in an official sense.

the fact that some don't even know what he does anymore yet is still at the club shows how amateurish we run things.

 

[Holy Rioli]

One things clear about this year.

At the start of the season Essendon blew out the hawks and looked a class above despite having some obvious flaws. Then they challenged Sydney punch for ouch for 7/8ths of a game before running out of gas in the final quarter and losing by 30 as Sydney ran up the score.

Essendon continued to largely do the same thing and once other teams worked out those flaws began to lose games against everybody remotely competent. (And a few teams that weren’t)

Hawthorn to their credit got some players back, kept working hard and kept improving. Are a physical side that’s good in transition. Selected on merit as opposed to status and reputation and are now peaking at the right time.

It’s clear that the answer to this question this season is Hawthorn. (Even though I’m heavily biased to still be skeptical of their overall talent level when compared to the top sides)

Lol you kicked eerily straight but at no stage were we outplayed in round 1. Champion data had us winning on xScore but you converted basically every opportunity (I think 17.2 at one stage before a couple of late rushed behinds).

 

[jdstorm]

Lol you kicked eerily straight but at no stage were we outplayed in round 1. Champion data had us winning on xScore but you converted basically every opportunity (I think 17.2 at one stage before a couple of late rushed behinds).

I just remember being at the game and it not being close and a lot of those shots being easy.

Memories aren’t always accurate but I’ll back that one in

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

On topic discussions in the relevant threads.
Nothing abusive or aggressive.
If it’s not to your liking, you can always ignore it.
Interested posters like yourself should be encouraged … not threatened …

You don’t post much any more

 

[RCAB]

You don’t post much any more

Red Bull was posting yesterday, again trolling for what he perceives as low hanging fruit at Essendon supporters, who could for all their failures, surpass Carlton soon.

He accused Hawthorn of tanking.

On the weekend the Hawks stole Carlton's eight spot in a 12 point game they never saw coming, they never thought it would've been Hawthorn, the team that was tanking, that would take their spot in the eight, not even in their worst nightmare; and now here they are living it.

 

[HairyO]

You don’t post much any more

He used to pop up in every Hawthorn thread. Yet, not so much now.

Im trying to work out why.

 

[Dan26]

My favourite part of this thread is the very reason the Bombers are still so mediocre - they would prefer a vanilla mid in Parish who racks up getting the ball with zero hurt factor over an absolute midfield bull in Newcombe. That's the microcosm of everything that's wrong with the Bomber mentality.

Also saw the Gresham v MacDonald comparison. One flashy soft flanker past his peak vs a high impact gut running half forward. Of course Bomber fans prefer the guy who burns his teammates, doesn't run both ways or put his head over the ball.

Parish's last two weeks he has had 27 and 34 possessions and was close to back to his best. He might not be a "bull" but not everyone can be. There are different midfielders with different styles. Durham is more a "bull" type player. What Parish knows how to do is find the footy. Two years ago, he polled 27 votes in the Brownlow. When Parish is at his best (such as his 2022 season) he's not unlike Sam Mitchell as a player in terms of his style. After having time off with injury he usually takes a couple of weeks to find his form.

We have all sorts of issues but Parish isn't one of them. He's our second best player behind Merrett and he's still only 26 years old.

The issues are at the other end of the list.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

When Parish is at his best (such as his 2022 season) he's not unlike Sam Mitchell as a player in terms of his style.

 

[Strange Cat]

Hawks culture is far superior to anything Ess can muster up …why these two are being compared is laughable Hawks will a flag long before Ess does

 

[Dan26]

Have a look mat Parish's 2022 season. He was one of the best players in the league. I think he might have been the leading possession winner for the entire league (or top two or three). 27 votes in the Brownlow.

His champions data ranking points for the last three seasons are 114.1, 110,9 and 108.1. He's obviously a vital player.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

I just remember being at the game and it not being close and a lot of those shots being easy.

Memories aren’t always accurate but I’ll back that one in

That's the thing. Those shots were very very easy as the hawks were just not working hard enough defensively
Bombers did nail quite a few that would would normally miss.

It was also 4 goals and hardly a blow out. If my memory serves me correctly, the hawks had 10 extra scoring shots

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Have a look mat Parish's 2022 season. He was one of the best players in the league. I think he might have been the leading possession winner for the entire league (or top two or three). 27 votes in the Brownlow.

His champions data ranking points for the last three seasons are 114.1, 110,9 and 108.1. He's obviously a vital player.

View attachment 2077172

Parish is a gun midfielder.

But he's not like Sam Mitchell at all. Zerrett is a much better comparison in terms of his ball use (30m dart kicks), movement around packs and his vision.

 

[Dan26]

Parish is a gun midfielder.

But he's not like Sam Mitchell at all. Zerrett is a much better comparison in terms of his ball use (30m dart kicks), movement around packs and his vision.

Parish has had three good years. One super year. Michell was a star for 10 years. I agree. Parish at his best is a gun as you say. You don’t average 110 ranking points over three years unless you are a really good player.

The point is that Darcy Parish is not the cause of Essendon’s problems. There are a million other things to consider before being critical of the teams second best player.

 

[H00t]

Parish has had three good years. One super year. Michell was a star for 10 years. I agree. Parish at his best is a gun as you say. You don’t average 110 ranking points over three years unless you are a really good player.

The point is that Darcy Parish is not the cause of Essendon’s problems. There are a million other things to consider before being critical of the teams second best player.

Parish is more like Tom Mitchell post broken leg. Gets a lot of disposals and looks great for your SuperCoach team but has next to no hurt factor. His team would benefit from him getting less of the ball and being more team orientated.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Have a look mat Parish's 2022 season. He was one of the best players in the league. I think he might have been the leading possession winner for the entire league (or top two or three). 27 votes in the Brownlow.

His champions data ranking points for the last three seasons are 114.1, 110,9 and 108.1. He's obviously a vital player.

View attachment 2077172

Mitchell was an absolute weapon with ball in hand. His ability to change the flow of play with precision kicking off each leg was a key part of our dominance over 5 years. On top of his hall winning ability.
He and Hodge were the two generational players our list management team were told they needed to deliver a flag with in 2010.

To claim Parish is the same “style” of player is just utter nonsense.

 

[Knighta21]

Well done hawks. 0-5 to finals is huge. Essendon is a rabble.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Hawthorn should improve
Essendon will start strong but fall away at the end of the season. I've seen the script too many times!!!

Scary March prediction

 

[Xtreme]

Scary March prediction

I'm not as dumb as people think

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Parish has had three good years. One super year. Michell was a star for 10 years. I agree. Parish at his best is a gun as you say. You don’t average 110 ranking points over three years unless you are a really good player.

The point is that Darcy Parish is not the cause of Essendon’s problems. There are a million other things to consider before being critical of the teams second best player.

I wasn't being critical of Parish. I was just questioning the comparison to Mitchell, as they are really nothing alike as players.

It was an especially strange comparison given Zerrett is probably the most similar player to Mitchell in the league currently, and he plays in the same team as Parish.

 

[BIGHAWK23]

One things clear about this year.

At the start of the season Essendon blew out the hawks and looked a class above despite having some obvious flaws. Then they challenged Sydney punch for ouch for 7/8ths of a game before running out of gas in the final quarter and losing by 30 as Sydney ran up the score.

Essendon continued to largely do the same thing and once other teams worked out those flaws began to lose games against everybody remotely competent. (And a few teams that weren’t)

Hawthorn to their credit got some players back, kept working hard and kept improving. Are a physical side that’s good in transition. Selected on merit as opposed to status and reputation and are now peaking at the right time.

It’s clear that the answer to this question this season is Hawthorn. (Even though I’m heavily biased to still be skeptical of their overall talent level when compared to the top sides)

When did this happen?

 

[hawkman]

Scary March prediction

You could make that prediction about Essendon in March every year and be correct 99% of the time

 

[HirdsTheWord]

People suggesting Parish > Newcombe, laughable.

Nash > Parish

Day > Parish

Worpel > Parish

Parish should be in the VFL, doesn't go hard enough. Essendon's best players (other than obviously Merrett), are blokes who've not yet been ruined by the culture and development at their club. Durham, Martin and Caddy all guns.

When Essendon recruited 2MP and their fans talked about him like the second coming, I laughed for weeks. I've got a good mate who is a suns supporter so I'd watched plenty of their games. He kicks goals but doesn't offer enough around the ground. Just like Mckay now, he can win big 1 on 1's, but his groundball work is atrocious.

Bombers should build the forwardline around Caddy.

RE Parish;

Bit hard to suggest that right now, at least outside of this year. This year parish has definitely been hampered by injury.

Parish was an all Australian contested mid in 2021 at age 23/24 (none of those hawks blokes have got close yet to an AA), but he has been battling calf issues for a couple of years now, mostly this year.

Need to see if Parish can get his 2021 form back before you make that call IMO, if he has lingering calf issues, i'd agree those hawks would go well past him, not quite yet though.

RE 2MP;

Reckon you are pretty spot on. get his hands on it but doesn't take the mark nearly enough. The good news is we aren't paying him much, so on that basis you can't expect much.

Not sure what bombers supporters you saw that were thinking he was the second coming, from what i have seen it's been pretty measured expectations from a bloke we aren't paying much salary wise.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

RE Parish;

Bit hard to suggest that right now, at least outside of this year. This year parish has definitely been hampered by injury.

Parish was an all Australian contested mid in 2021 at age 23/24 (none of those hawks blokes have got close yet to an AA), but he has been battling calf issues for a couple of years now, mostly this year.

Need to see if Parish can get his 2021 form back before you make that call IMO, if he has lingering calf issues, i'd agree those hawks would go well past him, not quite yet though.

RE 2MP;

Reckon you are pretty spot on. get his hands on it but doesn't take the mark nearly enough. The good news is we aren't paying him much, so on that basis you can't expect much.

Not sure what bombers supporters you saw that were thinking he was the second coming, from what i have seen it's been pretty measured expectations from a bloke we aren't paying much salary wise.

Re: this comment.

Newcombe was in the AA squad last year and high in coaches votes + Brownlow votes as a 21/22 year old.