Opinion Why are the interstate teams so bad? How do we fix them?

Ron The Bear · Sep 12, 2021

Since 1997

Club	P	W	L	D	Win %
Geel	589	374	210	5	63.92
Syd	587	338	244	5	58.01
Haw	576	314	257	5	54.95
W.C.	579	314	261	4	54.58
Adel	577	310	266	1	53.81
P.A.	572	304	263	5	53.58
Coll	579	303	272	4	52.68
W.B.	573	287	281	5	50.52
N.M.	571	286	281	4	50.44
Ess	566	279	281	6	49.82
Rich	563	270	286	7	48.58
Bris	572	272	294	6	48.08
St.K	569	268	293	8	47.80
GWS	228	102	122	4	45.61
Frem	560	251	308	1	44.91
Melb	562	226	332	4	40.57
Carl	560	213	343	4	38.39
G.C.	237	59	176	2	25.32

I see clubs with more to complain about than Port.

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

Elmer_Judd said:
You guys joined our league.

Feel free to form your own breakaway leagus if you expansion 'franchises' from non Victoria are finding it too hard to win flags because of your own club inadequacies.

The arrogance and ignorance of that diatribe is appalling.

Yes, and if we werent in your league now you wouldnt have a league because 5 games per week wouldnt bring in enough revenue from TV deals, what dont you get about that.

Coolangatta · Sep 12, 2021

doppleganger said:
Compared to one league with
A butchered fixture where the local rivalries are locked in as priority
Some teams whining they travel more
Some teams whining they don't get to pick where they play away games
Teams with a home advantage in finals, and other don't

We currently have two divisions as it is - Melbourne teams and non-Melbourne teams. Just make it official and design the competition that then ensures you are competing equally amongst your group.

But no, instead we will have non-Melbourne teams smoking about how hard they have it

I think what I suggested is reasonable, two conferences with five Vic teams each in it, and everyone playing once from the other conference, 4 home and 4 away. That's 24 rounds and every Vic side travelling six times a year and getting to play 6 interstate sides on their home ground as well. I think that's pretty reasonable, as I do understand Vic v Vic games are neutral, so you can't expect Vic sides to travel 8 times a year without getting their fair share of home games against non-Vic sides either.

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

Elmer_Judd said:
I think the AFL should perhaps ease up on SANFL and WAFL father-son eligibility qualification as one way to help the WA and SA clubs.

At least you're prepared to throw us a bone rather than tell us to just get better.

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

doppleganger said:
But no, instead we will have non-Melbourne teams smoking about how hard they have it

Or Melbourne teams satisfied with the status quo, the argument can be spun both ways.

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

Ron The Bear said:
Since 1997

Club
P
W
L
D
Win %
Geel
589
374
210
5
63.92
Syd
587
338
244
5
58.01
Haw
576
314
257
5
54.95
W.C.
579
314
261
4
54.58
Adel
577
310
266
1
53.81
P.A.
572
304
263
5
53.58
Coll
579
303
272
4
52.68
W.B.
573
287
281
5
50.52
N.M.
571
286
281
4
50.44
Ess
566
279
281
6
49.82
Rich
563
270
286
7
48.58
Bris
572
272
294
6
48.08
St.K
569
268
293
8
47.80
GWS
228
102
122
4
45.61
Frem
560
251
308
1
44.91
Melb
562
226
332
4
40.57
Carl
560
213
343
4
38.39
G.C.
237
59
176
2
25.32

I see clubs with more to complain about than Port.

Redo that from 07 please.

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

Coolangatta said:
I think what I suggested is reasonable, two conferences with five Vic teams each in it, and everyone playing once from the other conference, 4 home and 4 away. That's 24 rounds and every Vic side travelling six times a year and getting to play 6 interstate sides on their home ground as well. I think that's pretty reasonable, as I do understand Vic v Vic games are neutral, so you can't expect Vic sides to travel 8 times a year without getting their fair share of home games against non-Vic sides either.

About as fair as could be without a 34 game h&a season of playing each other twice, it still favours Vic clubs, but nope, not interested.

They're not interested because you don't fix what doesn't need fixing, unless it does, so you hold an inquiry, but only for some.

Ron The Bear · Sep 12, 2021

PenfoldsFan said:
Redo that from 07 please.

Club	P	W	L	D	%	Win %
Geel	361	262	97	2	130.72	72.85
Haw	351	219	128	4	118.43	62.96
Syd	351	206	141	4	116.30	59.26
Coll	352	205	143	4	111.56	58.81
W.C.	344	189	154	1	106.30	55.09
Adel	338	175	162	1	107.19	51.92
Rich	340	173	160	7	100.02	51.91
W.B.	344	177	165	2	100.29	51.74
P.A.	338	172	165	1	101.41	51.04
St.K	338	160	172	6	96.64	48.22
Frem	336	158	177	1	95.07	47.17
N.M.	337	157	177	3	97.39	47.03
GWS	228	102	122	4	89.92	45.61
Ess	331	145	182	4	91.38	44.41
Bris	333	134	196	3	88.85	40.69
Carl	331	124	205	2	90.19	37.76
Melb	330	116	211	3	84.54	35.61
G.C.	237	59	176	2	72.76	25.32

Port still in the top half and still in the black. Their record is quite good for a small club.

Perhaps it's just a case of adjusting to not winning premierships as often as in the SANFL?

doppleganger · Sep 12, 2021

Coolangatta said:
I think what I suggested is reasonable, two conferences with five Vic teams each in it, and everyone playing once from the other conference, 4 home and 4 away. That's 24 rounds and every Vic side travelling six times a year and getting to play 6 interstate sides on their home ground as well. I think that's pretty reasonable, as I do understand Vic v Vic games are neutral, so you can't expect Vic sides to travel 8 times a year without getting their fair share of home games against non-Vic sides either.

Two conferences with 5 Vic teams, is again 2 conferences of 9.

If you are playing the other conference it is 9 games, some get 4 home others 5?

And it wouldn't change any travel inequality.

Coolangatta · Sep 12, 2021

The AFL is too taxing of a game for everyone to play each other twice, unfortunately.

You'll never get a fair and balanced fixture, but the non-Vic v Vic should be as symmetrical as possible.

I still think 24 rounds with everyone getting 12 home and 12 away games each is optimal.

Vics get 6 of those 12 home games against interstate teams, non-Vics get 6 of those 12 home games against Vics. Non-Vics get more MCG exposure.

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

Ron The Bear said:
Club
P
W
L
D
%
Win %
Geel
361
262
97
2
130.72
72.85
Haw
351
219
128
4
118.43
62.96
Syd
351
206
141
4
116.30
59.26
Coll
352
205
143
4
111.56
58.81
W.C.
344
189
154
1
106.30
55.09
Adel
338
175
162
1
107.19
51.92
Rich
340
173
160
7
100.02
51.91
W.B.
344
177
165
2
100.29
51.74
P.A.
338
172
165
1
101.41
51.04
St.K
338
160
172
6
96.64
48.22
Frem
336
158
177
1
95.07
47.17
N.M.
337
157
177
3
97.39
47.03
GWS
228
102
122
4
89.92
45.61
Ess
331
145
182
4
91.38
44.41
Bris
333
134
196
3
88.85
40.69
Carl
331
124
205
2
90.19
37.76
Melb
330
116
211
3
84.54
35.61
G.C.
237
59
176
2
72.76
25.32

Port still in the top half and still in the black. Their record is quite good for a small club.

Right, so the top two are Vic clubs that have benefitted most from FA, theres 5 Vics in the top 8 including 3 of top 4 along with Sydney Cola/Academy.
Looking at the bottom half, Carlton cheated the salary cap and have been a basket case ever since, Essendon cheated with drugs and were decimated for a few seasons.
Melbourne have no excuses apart from just being shit and churning through coaches.
NM have been a basket case since Duck poked his mates Wife
All of these Vic clubs have themselves or their players to blame or they'd be further up the ladder at our expense.

doppleganger · Sep 12, 2021

PenfoldsFan said:
Right, so the top two are Vic clubs that have benefitted most from FA, theres 5 Vics in the top 8 including 3 of top 4 along with Sydney Cola/Academy.
Looking at the bottom half, Carlton cheated the salary cap and have been a basket case ever since, Essendon cheated with drugs and were decimated for a few seasons.
Melbourne have no excuses apart from just being sh*t and churning through coaches.
NM have been a basket case since Duck poked his mates Wife
All of these Vic clubs have themselves or their players to blame or they'd be further up the ladder at our expense.

The top two are the teams who play the least games in Melbourne!!

Geelong and Tassie have more in common with Port - ie travelling 9+ times a season, than they do with Collingwood.

Not surprising that 5 of the 9 Melbourne teams have a losing record.

kaiserchief13 · Sep 12, 2021

Blackas87 said:
Tim Kelly to West Coast, Lachie Neale to Brisbane, Buddy Franklin to Sydney, last year Aliir Aliir and Fantasia to Port, every club can pick up players regardless of which state they are in, just have to make your club attractive enough. While a lot of players return to Vic there are also a lot of clubs competing for those players.

Non Vic to Vic list (free agents or players who asked for trade to certain club):

- Zac Williams
- Devon Smith
- Jye Caldwell
- Dylan Shiel
- Jeremy Cameron
- Patrick Dangerfield
- Tom Mitchell
- Jaeger O'Meara
- Steven May
- Jake Lever
- Ed Langdon
- Adam Tomlinson
- Dion Prestia
- Tom Lynch
- Brad Crouch
- Jack Steele
- Dan Hanneberry
- Zak Jones
- Dougal Howard
- Alex Keath

Vic to non Vic list:

- Bryce Gibbs
- Joe Daniher
- Marcus Adams
- Reece Conca
- James Aish
- Travis Colyer
- Brandon Ellis
- Jarrod Harbrow
- Oleg Markov
- Callan Ward
- Lance Franklin
- Tim Kelly
- Jamie Cripps
- Steven Motlop

Look at quality of players going from non Vic to Vic compared to other way around, it also occurs more often.

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

doppleganger said:
The top two are the teams who play the least games in Melbourne!!

I didnt say they weren't.
This suggests mature bodies overcome travel, you dont get any less experienced or lose bulk when travelling.

Blackas87 · Sep 12, 2021

kaiserchief13 said:
Non Vic to Vic list (free agents or players who asked for trade to certain club):

- Zac Williams
- Devon Smith
- Jye Caldwell
- Dylan Shiel
- Jeremy Cameron
- Patrick Dangerfield
- Tom Mitchell
- Jaeger O'Meara
- Steven May
- Jake Lever
- Ed Langdon
- Adam Tomlinson
- Dion Prestia
- Tom Lynch
- Brad Crouch
- Jack Steele
- Dan Hanneberry
- Zak Jones
- Dougal Howard
- Alex Keath

Vic to non Vic list:

- Bryce Gibbs
- Joe Daniher
- Marcus Adams
- Reece Conca
- James Aish
- Travis Colyer
- Brandon Ellis
- Jarrod Harbrow
- Oleg Markov
- Callan Ward
- Lance Franklin
- Tim Kelly
- Jamie Cripps
- Steven Motlop

Look at quality of players going from non Vic to Vic compared to other way around, it also occurs more often.

Buddy Franklin the best there. Quality all round

blue harvest · Sep 12, 2021

PenfoldsFan said:
Right, so the top two are Vic clubs that have benefitted most from FA, theres 5 Vics in the top 8 including 3 of top 4 along with Sydney Cola/Academy.
Looking at the bottom half, Carlton cheated the salary cap and have been a basket case ever since, Essendon cheated with drugs and were decimated for a few seasons.
Melbourne have no excuses apart from just being sh*t and churning through coaches.
NM have been a basket case since Duck poked his mates Wife
All of these Vic clubs have themselves or their players to blame or they'd be further up the ladder at our expense.

Benefited the most from free agency?

Through free agency we got Frawley, a delisted Henderson, a delisted Simpkin, Minchington and Vickery lol.
We have lost Buddy, Suckling, Ellis, Young, Murphy, Birchall.

doppleganger · Sep 12, 2021

PenfoldsFan said:
I didnt say they weren't.
This suggests mature bodies overcome travel, you dont get any less experienced or lose bulk when travelling.

Or it suggests that travel isn't really the burden that SA fans like to make out.

Hawks decided to travel to actually get an an advantage!!

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

kaiserchief13 said:
Non Vic to Vic list (free agents or players who asked for trade to certain club):

- Zac Williams
- Devon Smith
- Jye Caldwell
- Dylan Shiel
- Jeremy Cameron
- Patrick Dangerfield
- Tom Mitchell
- Jaeger O'Meara
- Steven May
- Jake Lever
- Ed Langdon
- Adam Tomlinson
- Dion Prestia
- Tom Lynch
- Brad Crouch
- Jack Steele
- Dan Hanneberry
- Zak Jones
- Dougal Howard
- Alex Keath

Vic to non Vic list:

- Bryce Gibbs
- Joe Daniher
- Marcus Adams
- Reece Conca
- James Aish
- Travis Colyer
- Brandon Ellis
- Jarrod Harbrow
- Oleg Markov
- Callan Ward
- Lance Franklin
- Tim Kelly
- Jamie Cripps
- Steven Motlop

Look at quality of players going from non Vic to Vic compared to other way around, it also occurs more often.

Then you've got the Jack Gunstons of the world who just get homesick after 2 years and end up with 3 medals back home or draftee's saying they wont go interstate.

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

blue harvest said:
Benefited the most from free agency?

Through free agency we got Frawley, a delisted Henderson, a delisted Simpkin, Minchington and Vickery lol.
We have lost Buddy, Suckling, Ellis, Young, Murphy, Birchall.

FA or home sickness/ trade requests, all the same, we couldn't keep them, end result the same.
Jake Kelly off to Essendon as we speak.

Blackas87 · Sep 12, 2021

PenfoldsFan said:
Then you've got the Jack Gunstons of the world who just get homesick after 2 years and end up with 3 medals back home or draftee's saying they wont go interstate.

Remember Wingard refused to go to GWS

PenfoldsFan · Sep 12, 2021

Blackas87 said:
Remember Wingard refused to go to GWS

Yep, and where is he now?

FreoFan85 · Sep 12, 2021

Blackas87 said:
Remember Wingard refused to go to GWS

Archie Perkins, Bailey Smith, LDU… other top end talent that sold the idea that as a draftee they would only want to be in vic.

STFU Donnie · Sep 12, 2021

I can remember in '07 people asking the exact opposite question after interstate teams had won the preceding six flags.

In the last 10 years, by my reckoning, interstate teams have made the GF seven times. So what's the issue?

EDIT: I forgot the Swans in '16. So that's actually eight (consecutive) of the last 10 years.

Blackas87 · Sep 12, 2021

PenfoldsFan said:
Yep, and where is he now?

Why didn’t Port retain him?

Big Crow · Sep 12, 2021

PenfoldsFan said:
6 years it took for an inquiry into Vic football, 15yrs later and nothing for our struggles and will continue that way unless we do something to make them change their MO.

This hits the nail on the head.

All “interstate” fans need to realise this. This league is not for us. Never has been. We just prop things up financially while the system works to celebrate Victorian football. Unless something changes, best we can hope for is the pinch a flag every now and then.

See West Coast being a 5 goal better side than Collingwood, but falling over the line at the pies home ground for reference. If that doesn’t do it for you, consider back to back to back to… Grand Finals of the higher ranked team having to play away and losing.

The AFL is a total joke. You’re 100% better off following something else, or at least recognising it for what it is and not taking it too seriously.

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