Hoffy95
Norm Smith Medallist
You can't have him batting too high up the order. It takes a while to erect the Louis Vuitton sports locker at each venue before adorning a freshly pressed shirt and re-activating the Baggy Green.
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Why the hate for Michael Clarke?
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Part of the reason Hussey and Clarke play down the order is because most of the other prospective batsmen are top-order players. Look at where they play for their states:
Hughes - Opener
Khawaja - #3
Doolan - #3
Quiney - #3
I don't buy this argument that these guys should be brought into the side down the order just because Clarke and Hussey are better than them. These guys are going to have enough trouble adapting to Test cricket without being played out of position.
If you brought an actual middle order batsman into the side (e.g. Henriques) or decided that Watson should go back to batting further down the order to make better use of his bowling, then absolutely Hussey and Clarke as senior players need to move up to make room for them. But until that happens I really don't think there is any benefit to be had by playing the entire batting order out of their preferred positions.
Hughes - Opener
Khawaja - #3
Doolan - #3
Quiney - #3
I don't buy this argument that these guys should be brought into the side down the order just because Clarke and Hussey are better than them. These guys are going to have enough trouble adapting to Test cricket without being played out of position.
If you brought an actual middle order batsman into the side (e.g. Henriques) or decided that Watson should go back to batting further down the order to make better use of his bowling, then absolutely Hussey and Clarke as senior players need to move up to make room for them. But until that happens I really don't think there is any benefit to be had by playing the entire batting order out of their preferred positions.
Rocky_Star_Pro
Cancelled
Goose huh? What do you think of his twin double centuries this series? He plays one stupid shot after a brilliant series and you're jumping onto his back, ffs
Wasn't quiney a victorian? perhaps we should pick more victorians??
1st one was made on a road and second one Kallis was on fire and then did his hammy as clarke got out there. Not just 1 bad innings. Did you see his asshes series 2 years ago?
peternorth
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dont know where this vitriol has come from. OP asked whey the hate for mc, i presented my reason for hating him back when.
you obviously did not read "not his fault but".
your post really makes no sense
I see, but you can comment without being a plonker about it. He/she has just gone about it the wrong way. All it is, is trying to take pot shots at Clarke, which is totally unfair, and pointless.
None of them are even in the side.
We're talking about reshuffling the order with players coming in, are we not?
we should replace him with someone better...oh wait
even greg chappell thinks he should move up the order to 4. but then again what does he know
Ill Chicken
Premiership Player
You know Faf bats top four for his domestic team in SA? You do realise that test cricket is a level up yeah? You must also realise that the only batsmen in the team that play out of position are openers? Everyone else requires a wicket to fall before they are in. This whole batting out of position is a load of shit. You're saying they're having enough trouble adapting to test cricket batting in the toughest position in test cricket? No shit, thats why basically every great number three has come into that position from a 5-7 position.
Lets take the Adelaide Test Match, Warner is blasting them, someone else is three, gets out, Ponting gets out and oh then Warner and Clarke have a massive partnership and then Quiney comes in at 6 with the score what? So not only is batting with a set batsman, the bowling team is under the pump. Even if the team was 4 for 60, Quiney gets to play to the situation without having to set the situation.
In the Perth test, how many players positions were under threat? Three quick bowlers. That is all. No one else in the side is going to be dropped. No motivation maybe isn't correct, no heart probably a better description.
Ill Chicken
Premiership Player
He played plenty of shit shots earlier in Brisbane and Adelaide. He got in and capitalised, there was nothing different about his performance at the WACA.
Not bashing Clarke at all here but one criticism of him, and Arthur for that matter, that I have is the way they publicly set high expectations of new/under pressure pressure. Clarke saying Quiney will definitely make a hundred in the lead up to his debut. Arthur saying Ponting will make 250*. I know they're just backing them in and trying to give them confidence but i don't see the need to put that pressure on them. Ponting's intention would have been to score runs no matter what Arthur said so I don't see why Clarke and Arthur set the lofty expectations. Surely there are other ways to give them confidence.
Rocky_Star_Pro
Cancelled
And Faf made his match saving century in Adelaide as soon as Pattinson went down and we were restricted to two quicks...see I can do this too. Yes I did, have you seen his four double centuries this year?
Ill Chicken
Premiership Player
On debut don't forget.
Not only is Clarke excelling in his current position of 5, I think it's important to instil confidence in the top order. To me, moving yourself up to 3 sends a message that there's a lack of confidence in those players picked in the top order. That said, I acknowledge that our order could probably do with a reshuffle with perhaps Watson moving down to 5-6 and bowling more and another batsman coming in at 3.
It is true that 3 is a very demanding position that between the years 1998-2011 were more or less settled (Langer and then Ponting) and throughout the first half of the 1990s (Boon). The years 1996-1998 were slightly more turbulent with Langer, Hayden, Blewett? Elliot? all being tried there at times but if we are looking for precedents I'd say we look to the early 80s. This was an era that has many parallels to the environment we're currently in. I say this in a sense that we have left a period of success and are now tapping into a talent/personnel pool that's much more scarce than it was from say 1995-2008 (though I believe we have more raw talent at our disposal now). My point is that we do not necessarily have the luxury of allowing players to develop at 5-6 or spend years in Shield even. We must identify personnel that we think will be long-term players, give them exposure and back them in. A baptism of fire, some might say. Having Clarke as the steadier at 5 may take some of the pressure off whoever assumes the top order positions from here, knowing that they have their captain in the form of his life ready to either do a rescue mission or complement the work they have done.
Clarke has never struck me as a top order player. He could perhaps move to 4 but Id be reluctant to unsettle the one cog in the machine that's working we'll at the moment. To me, Kawaja looks like a born first drop batsman. I hope he can sort his game out and flourish in the Baggy Green.
Just back on the faith/confidence thing, I really like how Clarke has placed confidence in Lyon, especially considering the number of spinners that have been tried since Warne. Another mark of his captaincy which has been very impressive to date
It is true that 3 is a very demanding position that between the years 1998-2011 were more or less settled (Langer and then Ponting) and throughout the first half of the 1990s (Boon). The years 1996-1998 were slightly more turbulent with Langer, Hayden, Blewett? Elliot? all being tried there at times but if we are looking for precedents I'd say we look to the early 80s. This was an era that has many parallels to the environment we're currently in. I say this in a sense that we have left a period of success and are now tapping into a talent/personnel pool that's much more scarce than it was from say 1995-2008 (though I believe we have more raw talent at our disposal now). My point is that we do not necessarily have the luxury of allowing players to develop at 5-6 or spend years in Shield even. We must identify personnel that we think will be long-term players, give them exposure and back them in. A baptism of fire, some might say. Having Clarke as the steadier at 5 may take some of the pressure off whoever assumes the top order positions from here, knowing that they have their captain in the form of his life ready to either do a rescue mission or complement the work they have done.
Clarke has never struck me as a top order player. He could perhaps move to 4 but Id be reluctant to unsettle the one cog in the machine that's working we'll at the moment. To me, Kawaja looks like a born first drop batsman. I hope he can sort his game out and flourish in the Baggy Green.
Just back on the faith/confidence thing, I really like how Clarke has placed confidence in Lyon, especially considering the number of spinners that have been tried since Warne. Another mark of his captaincy which has been very impressive to date
indeed. It reeks of players lookign after themselves and their averages
I alway though th best batsmen should bat at 3 or 4 not hidden at 5 or 6
Bucking Beads
Brownlow Medallist
Clarke has always been a middle order batsmen not a top order batsmen. It is like some people don't get it. KP is the poms best batsmen but he didn't move up to 3. Chanderpaul is the West Indies best batsmen but he hasn't moved up to 3. Ross Taylor is NZ best batsmen but he doesn't bat at 3. Sometimes batsmen aren't suited to bat at the top of the order so they stay batting at 5. It happens so get over it.
He should still have a crack, is he scared of failure ?
peternorth
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he has withdrawn from the big bash game with back spasms
Is that from his boyfriend (Smith) playfully punching him in the back while they're getting it on?
Dan
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How noble of him, considering he is a super star at the 20/twenty format.
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