Will Luke Ball result change things?

[Furn]

Luke Ball is really the first "top" player to go through the national draft as a required player that could name terms under the new rule.

Now, i think if we go back to trade week most people would have said that he was worth more than a straight swap for pick 30. Yet he ended up getting to his team of choice by a combination of refusing to talk to other clubs or get a medical and putting a hefty price on his services.

So here is my question.

With LB getting to the club of his choice through the ND, will players in the future look at this as a viable option and will the trade value of players that have "walked out" drop, because more teams will believe they can get there man in the ND.

For example my team Hawthorn traded for Burgoyne and Gibson and during the pre trade week arguments between Hawks fans and Port and North fans, the threat of "we'll just take him at 9 or 25 in the Nd" was constantly brought up.

Having seen the draft, id be pretty confident that had Burgoyne and Gibson taken a LB stance and refused to talk to any other team, they would have lasted to picks 9 and 25 respectively.

So do people think that this will be seen as a behind the back form of free agency with teams being relunctant to burn a high pick on a player that doesnt want to play for them.

 

[Masto]

What I want to know is - what stopped Jack Trengove from putting 500k on his head in the hope of getting through to the Crows?

 

[Furn]

What I want to know is - what stopped Jack Trengove from putting 500k on his head in the hope of getting through to the Crows?

Rules.

He has to sign at least at least 2 years at a set amount for for his pick. In the NFL players that are drafted still have to come to terms with the club that drafted them and sometimes never end up signing. Not a situation we wanna see here.

 

[Marklar_33]

What I want to know is - what stopped Jack Trengove from putting 500k on his head in the hope of getting through to the Crows?

You can name your price in the PSD, not the ND. Im pretty sure you must nominate for the ND at some stage before you can nominate for the PSD also...or maybe not (Anyone know Jurrah's situation last year?)

 

[snrub]

Rules.

He has to sign at least at least 2 years at a set amount for for his pick. In the NFL players that are drafted still have to come to terms with the club that drafted them and sometimes never end up signing. Not a situation we wanna see here.

Yes all first year draftees are on basic wage

 

[Masto]

Rules.

He has to sign at least at least 2 years at a set amount for for his pick. In the NFL players that are drafted still have to come to terms with the club that drafted them and sometimes never end up signing. Not a situation we wanna see here.

OK then, my question is whats to stop any of this years draftees from pulling a Luke Ball in 2 years?

 

[Selective Retention]

There were enough question marks over Ball's longetivity and suitability to the modern game for him to fall through. I can't see it becoming the norm personally. A fit and in form player trying it on might be shocked to find a different ending.

 

[Punt_Road_Roar]

It may change the introduction of free agency in the pure form, in todays day and age, young kids are valued extremely highly even though they havent even played a game yet.

If you look at Ball there were question marks over his body, rightly or wrongly. IMO Collingwood are LOLing big time. I think it could be a good thing for injury striken players or players over 27 year old who want a fresh start.

If a kid 2 years in the system who can play a bit tries I bet you would find the result very different. lol

 

[EssendonPride]

You can name your price in the PSD, not the ND. Im pretty sure you must nominate for the ND at some stage before you can nominate for the PSD also...or maybe not (Anyone know Jurrah's situation last year?)

Wrong, have you been living under a rock? How do you think Ball put a price on his head?

If you've been on an AFL list before, you can put a price on your head in the ND.

 

[Masto]

There were enough question marks over Ball's longetivity and suitability to the modern game for him to fall through. I can't see it becoming the norm personally. A fit and in form player trying it on might be shocked to find a different ending.

Player managers are going to be pushing this big time. It worked for Ball, why not other players?

 

[stickman11]

What I want to know is - what stopped Jack Trengove from putting 500k on his head in the hope of getting through to the Crows?

I think you'll find that Jack Trengove is looking forward to begining his career at Melbourne, and from what I hear, Tappers was hoping to be picked up by the Dee's. People who don't play football tend to place too much emphais on who someone barracked for. But most footballers I doubt care.

 

[Punt_Road_Roar]

Player managers are going to be pushing this big time. It worked for Ball, why not other players?

Age is the big factor, a youngster can try it but I bet they dont end up where they want. Lets take Deledio for example, say he want to play for West Coast in 2 years time and he has no injury concerns and is playing as freely then as he is now.

Do you honestly think he would end up taken as a pick 30 in the draft just because its West Coast's first real pick ? I bet he would more than likely go top 10 and be playing on the Gold Coast or Western Sydney if he tried what Luke Ball did.

 

[BEEG]

Squizzy might have alot less to say

 

[ant22]

I think people are getting massively carried away with this and while I am happy to have ball I think people are seriously overating his value. If we go back 3 or 4 years the calls of Gun, Top player etc would have been spot on but Bal has struggled for 2 or 3 years now. Balls own coach the man who refused to deal did not have him in his best 22 for several weeks. Im glad to have him but I would have not been happy with any more than we offered. I would have been very unhappy if we gave up a good young player for him because he is not a gun. If is a good hard ball winner. If he gives us more than that then great but based on the past few seasons and the way his own coach rated him I cannot believe people are saying the offer of pick 25(not 30 as people are suggesting) was well short of market value.
I doubt he would have been rated in the leagues top 100 players by too many people in the last 2 seasons and I cannot see too many players at his age demanding a first round pick based on this. Especially someone who is not a matchwinner.
Good player but lets not get to carried away people.

 

[EagleMan87]

I think people are getting massively carried away with this and while I am happy to have ball I think people are seriously overating his value. If we go back 3 or 4 years the calls of Gun, Top player etc would have been spot on but Bal has struggled for 2 or 3 years now. Balls own coach the man who refused to deal did not have him in his best 22 for several weeks. Im glad to have him but I would have not been happy with any more than we offered. I would have been very unhappy if we gave up a good young player for him because he is not a gun. If is a good hard ball winner. If he gives us more than that then great but based on the past few seasons and the way his own coach rated him I cannot believe people are saying the offer of pick 25(not 30 as people are suggesting) was well short of market value.
I doubt he would have been rated in the leagues top 100 players by too many people in the last 2 seasons and I cannot see too many players at his age demanding a first round pick based on this. Especially someone who is not a matchwinner.
Good player but lets not get to carried away people.

Tell Collingwood that, they're paying him half a million dollars a year.

 

[lenny&carl]

Tell Collingwood that, they're paying him half a million dollars a year.

That was just a mechanism to help him get to 30. It's not like we could've kept the cash and gone on a big holiday instead, or gotten a house extension. It's bucks no one's worried about.

 

[HFF]

Tell Collingwood that, they're paying him half a million dollars a year.

As another poster said, it was only a draft mechanism so some clubs are automatically ruled out. If he entered the draft like say Hooper or Maguire, he would have been snapped up instantly in the mid-teens because he would be on the same salary as a 1st yr draftee which is about 50K.

Also, his contract is almost certain to be extended to 3yrs, which in his 3rd year he will receive around 75K. If you break that down it is equivalent to just over 350K a season.

Pretty good business and list management if you ask me.

 

[madfootyfan]

Collingwood don't have to pay him half a million, they can pay him a couple of hundred thousand but they do have to show half a million on salary cap.

 

[Swampfox]

Luke Ball is a good player

Nothing More Nothing Less

Collingwood is a good team

Nothing More Nothing Less

There ability to play finals and not win premierships is

Nothing More Nothing Less

 

[robertg22]

Luke Ball is a good player

Nothing More Nothing Less

Collingwood is a good team

Nothing More Nothing Less

There ability to play finals and not win premierships is

Nothing More Nothing Less

Wow, so deep. I feel so much smarter having read your post.

 

[ant22]

Luke Ball is a good player

Nothing More Nothing Less

Collingwood is a good team

Nothing More Nothing Less

There ability to play finals and not win premierships is

Nothing More Nothing Less

very funny that this has been written by a melbourne supporter

 

[Furn]

Age is the big factor, a youngster can try it but I bet they dont end up where they want. Lets take Deledio for example, say he want to play for West Coast in 2 years time and he has no injury concerns and is playing as freely then as he is now.

Do you honestly think he would end up taken as a pick 30 in the draft just because its West Coast's first real pick ? I bet he would more than likely go top 10 and be playing on the Gold Coast or Western Sydney if he tried what Luke Ball did.

Im not saying any player is going to last to pick 30 but wil lthey last to a pick thats lower than their trade value.

For example lets say in the above scenario the Eagles have pick 8 and they offer that for Lids. Richmond would want more than just 8, the question becomes would Richmond end up taking just 8 because they feel that if deledio did a ball he would end up at the eagles anyway.

 

[Wally Carter]

As another poster said, it was only a draft mechanism so some clubs are automatically ruled out. If he entered the draft like say Hooper or Maguire, he would have been snapped up instantly in the mid-teens because he would be on the same salary as a 1st yr draftee which is about 50K.

Also, his contract is almost certain to be extended to 3yrs, which in his 3rd year he will receive around 75K. If you break that down it is equivalent to just over 350K a season.

Pretty good business and list management if you ask me.

Actually it's risky list management if you ask me.

Paying $500,000 a season for a 26 and 27 year old inside midfielder with serious OP recurrence is a big risk, as he may only be worth $75,000 a year by the time he's 28.

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

Actually it's risky list management if you ask me.

Paying $500,000 a season for a 26 and 27 year old inside midfielder with serious OP recurrence is a big risk, as he may only be worth $75,000 a year by the time he's 28.

Don't worry - We have the money.

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

Im not saying any player is going to last to pick 30 but wil lthey last to a pick thats lower than their trade value.

For example lets say in the above scenario the Eagles have pick 8 and they offer that for Lids. Richmond would want more than just 8, the question becomes would Richmond end up taking just 8 because they feel that if deledio did a ball he would end up at the eagles anyway.

That's a different situation, because the teams picking before West Coast would draft Deledio anyway.

The real issue with Ball is that ultimately in the last draft for a few years that won't have all the top picks monopolised by an expansion team, teams wanted to go young with their picks.

Younger, rebuilding teams weren't crash hot on taking Ball because he's probably a bit too old to be a part of when they are serious contenders again, and more mature teams didn't really want to draft him because he didn't want to play for them, and he wasn't a particularly large need for them.

The situation played out in the way that it did due to a combination of his injury history, his overall quality in recent years, the situation of this draft coming before GC and WS take all the picks, and the fact that he really only wanted to play for Collingwood. He wasn't really worth a pick any higher than #20, and from #20 through to #30, there were a variety of reasons those teams didn't draft him.

Even if Deledio, in your example, only wanted to play for West Coast, the other factors wouldn't be there, and someone would take him higher than pick #8 because his overall worth is higher than pick #8, and so in comparison to the player they might get in the draft, Deledio would be a better option to most teams.

I don't think it's going to spawn a new trend now - I think this one situation happened to pan out in this way for all of the reasons I listed above, and for the fact that we were unable to get a deal with St Kilda for Ball during trade weekm largely due to the competitive nature of two top-four sides.

I think this was just a perfect storm of circumstances that saw a strange situation arise, and there's too many factors that have gone into it to see comparable situations coming up in the future.