List Mgmt. Nick Austin - Head Of List Management

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

Hollands is shitting on his output after like 4 games in the position. Boyd unfortunately plays like a plodder who tries to contest in the air, and has overbuilt his body. We have no use for him at the moment despite his ability to hit a flat 50m pass.

Our defensive issues - beyond McGovern's ankle, and Haynes' cohesion with the team and his fitness levels - revolve around pressure up the field and perhaps the balance of personnel, though the small forward group were doing their job in this respect.

Does Boyd have the capability to build up his aerobic capacity and play the Hayden Young/Jordan Dawson link up mid?

 

[Jimmae]

Does Boyd have the capability to build up his aerobic capacity and play the Hayden Young/Jordan Dawson link up mid?

Maybe if his ankles/feet are ok and he can return to his natural weight a bit? Just lumbers most of the time, and looks nothing like this guy:

Highlights | Jordan Boyd

The smooth-moving Jordan Boyd has made his way from Whitten Oval as a VFL Bulldogs to IKON Park.

www.carltonfc.com.au

 

[GT619]

rather boyd in that position.

I'd try boyd half forward

 

[JustOneTime]

Does Boyd have the capability to build up his aerobic capacity and play the Hayden Young/Jordan Dawson link up mid?

You mention some best in class names there C4. Boyd doesn't quite belong in the same sentence.

Periphery.

 

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

You mention some best in class names there C4. Boyd doesn't quite belong in the same sentence.

Periphery.

Good call - agree.

 

[agro]

We have no use for him at the moment despite his ability to hit a flat 50m pass.

I do believe we are a bit light fir this skill - and really do have much use for it.

 

[Arr0w]

Hollands is shitting on his output after like 4 games in the position. Boyd unfortunately plays like a plodder who tries to contest in the air, and has overbuilt his body. We have no use for him at the moment despite his ability to hit a flat 50m pass.

Our defensive issues - beyond McGovern's ankle, and Haynes' cohesion with the team and his fitness levels - revolve around pressure up the field and perhaps the balance of personnel, though the small forward group were doing their job in this respect.

Ollie shitting on Boyd in what areas exactly?

 

[JustOneTime]

Being in the game for starters!!

 

[Arr0w]

Ollie must be better than Newman then

 

[therubbernub]

Something i noticed apart from speed and kicking skills, as a differential, we simply don't draft mongrel and hunger.... think of tigs cats hawks dynasties... all packed to the rafters with angry players. Even the pies premiership team had a bit of go.
To many lygon latte sippers.

And then you have the Cats from their golden era. Hardly a nasty one among them

 

[JustOneTime]

And then you have the Cats from their golden era. Hardly a nasty one among them

Millburn, Selwood, Chapman, Scarlett, Mooney. Hawkins you wouldnt stir up either.

 

[DangerousD]

And then you have the Cats from their golden era. Hardly a nasty one among them

Just had a look at their 09 team and they have toughness in spades

 

[gbatman]

It's easy to judge our recruiting.

We have around 10 smaller forwards on our list and none of them have ever proven they can make a significant impact at AFL level.

There is your problem.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

It's easy to judge our recruiting.

We have around 10 smaller forwards on our list and none of them have ever proven they can make a significant impact at AFL level.

There is your problem.

If you project forward with the list another 3-4 years our biggest issue is still going to be the small forward role no matter how we spin it. Going all in for Harley Reid, trading out some big names, keeping it how it is and playing it safe... It all leads to having the same issue with that small forward line to me.

We need to find a way to solve the issue before Charlie, Mckay and Weiters finish up which is essentially when the window of potential success closes imo.

Half back rebound, 2nd KPD, Midfield pace etc all have multiple options coming OOC in coming years and we have some quality F/S and NGA talents coming through that could help address all of those in the future. If you look at who might be available in the next 2-3 years for small forwards there is just bugger all out there.

 

[Stamos]

F/S and NGA talents coming through that could help address all of those in the future. If you look at who might be available in the next 2-3 years for small forwards there is just bugger all out there.

Gresham & Clark this year.
It's too early to tell if they're going to be any good, but they are both small forwards.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Gresham & Clark this year.
It's too early to tell if they're going to be any good, but they are both small forwards.

Pretty well the great white hopes for me this year. Unfortunately I haven't seen any of Clark yet and only a little of Gresham who was alright without being spectacular.

Will be watching them very closely in their games this year hoping and praying that they may be the answers we're desperately looking for up forward.

 

[gbatman]

If you project forward with the list another 3-4 years our biggest issue is still going to be the small forward role no matter how we spin it. Going all in for Harley Reid, trading out some big names, keeping it how it is and playing it safe... It all leads to having the same issue with that small forward line to me.

We need to find a way to solve the issue before Charlie, Mckay and Weiters finish up which is essentially when the window of potential success closes imo.

Half back rebound, 2nd KPD, Midfield pace etc all have multiple options coming OOC in coming years and we have some quality F/S and NGA talents coming through that could help address all of those in the future. If you look at who might be available in the next 2-3 years for small forwards there is just bugger all out there.

Half back rebound is potentially ok.

But yes, nothing changes until the forward line is fixed. Does not matter how good the backline and midfield is, that result against Richmond will become quite common with the current forwards.

We will win when our big forwards have big day outs and that may happen against sides who aren't as defensive but it won't take us far.

Other teams have done it. Get stuck into poaching players from other clubs and get some picks to use in the draft and turnover the ones we have.

Unfortunately you look at the contracts of the current small forwards, there are some shockers there.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Half back rebound is potentially ok.

But yes, nothing changes until the forward line is fixed. Does not matter how good the backline and midfield is, that result against Richmond will become quite common with the current forwards.

We will win when our big forwards have big day outs and that may happen against sides who aren't as defensive but it won't take us far.

Other teams have done it. Get stuck into poaching players from other clubs and get some picks to use in the draft and turnover the ones we have.

Unfortunately you look at the contracts of the current small forwards, there are some shockers there.

Yep, could fix the half back rebound issue in 1-2 moves this off season imo. The midfield issue is unfortunately a waiting game for Jagga to come back and Cody to come of age. 2nd KPD I have a lot of faith in O'Farrell. Really rated him in his draft year and has impressed at training since arriving. Hopefully with Dean rising in status he may also be an option down the track.

With Elijah's situation adding uncertainty to our forward line theres genuinely only 2 players I would be confident locking in for a spot in the team re how they perform over a season and thats Mckay and Curnow. All the rest are complete question marks or certified duds.

 

[gbatman]

Yep, could fix the half back rebound issue in 1-2 moves this off season imo. The midfield issue is unfortunately a waiting game for Jagga to come back and Cody to come of age. 2nd KPD I have a lot of faith in O'Farrell. Really rated him in his draft year and has impressed at training since arriving. Hopefully with Dean rising in status he may also be an option down the track.

With Elijah's situation adding uncertainty to our forward line theres genuinely only 2 players I would be confident locking in for a spot in the team re how they perform over a season and thats Mckay and Curnow. All the rest are complete question marks or certified duds.

Jagga is a real kick in the guts. His footy IQ is really high. Would have made a lot of players look foolish whether that's our half forwards or mids. Would have ran all day and just found it.

The Walker boys will be a gift. A genuine helping hand as we go through our next rebuild. They might catch the end of this group if they can hang on long enough.

O'Farrell looks good and Dean has been talked up so I'm not worried about the future defensive talls.

McKay and Curnow are the only players on our list who look like they can have a solid impact as forwards at AFL level. Glimpses of Moir last year suggested he might have it but we will see.

I think there will be a big delisting of forwards next season that would be even bigger if we weren't restricted by some stupid long contracts to D grade forwards.

I think I said this early last season, we will be going hard at forwards in this years draft. If I am wrong, heads need to roll at the club.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Jagga is a real kick in the guts. His footy IQ is really high. Would have made a lot of players look foolish whether that's our half forwards or mids. Would have ran all day and just found it.

The Walker boys will be a gift. A genuine helping hand as we go through our next rebuild. They might catch the end of this group if they can hang on long enough.

O'Farrell looks good and Dean has been talked up so I'm not worried about the future defensive talls.

McKay and Curnow are the only players on our list who look like they can have a solid impact as forwards at AFL level. Glimpses of Moir last year suggested he might have it but we will see.

I think there will be a big delisting of forwards next season that would be even bigger if we weren't restricted by some stupid long contracts to D grade forwards.

I think I said this early last season, we will be going hard at forwards in this years draft. If I am wrong, heads need to roll at the club.

The unfortunate reality is the better our NGA and F/S kids go the next two years the harder it's going to be to address our immediate issues.

Clark and Gresham are massive unknowns but both present some talent as small forwards we could pick up. If either make a bolt this year and show some genuine signs of being guns we'd obviously be wrapped to pick them up but then a points deficit will become an issue.

Cody from what I've seen would be an absolute shock to go anywhere later than pick 5 in 2026 and more than likely a top 2 pick which is going to cost every draft pick we have to match.

Realistically there's a very good chance we're going to be without any picks of note for the next 2 years if things go as expected.

So that leaves us in the predicament of not being able to make any considerable list changes at the end of the year unless someone of note or even multiple names of note go out the door.

This season will be critical in terms of making that decision on the current list and how we go forward.

 

[Juddernaut08]

It's easy to judge our recruiting.

We have around 10 smaller forwards on our list and none of them have ever proven they can make a significant impact at AFL level.

There is your problem.

Not just this - how many others have clogged up spots in recent years that also didnt make it. It's taken its toll ok the rest of the list.

It's like operating with 6 less list spots and the proportionate cap space year after year.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

The way I see it theres 3 outcomes for this year re Austin's direction for the list.

Option 1 - Stick fat with the group (2025 goes fairly well, we make and win some finals)
- Minor list changes, maybe pick up a RFA, take our F/S and NGA boys and hope on natural improvement to take us the next step

Build around this core of players

-------- Jacob Weitering - Jack Silvagni
Adam Saad --------- Nic Newman
Blake Acres - Patrick Cripps --------
Zac Williams - Harry Mckay --------
---------- Charlie Curnow ----------
Tom De Koning - Sam Walsh - George Hewett

Adam Cerra --------- ---------- ----------


Option 2 - Rebuild on the run (2025 goes the same as 2024, we make finals and do sfa or just miss)
- Start looking at rejigging the list aggressively, keep the big names but move on some quality players to try and get some picks and free up some salary space to bring in other mature players and rebuild on the run while we still have a few years of Cripps, Curnow, Mckay and Weiters playing well.

Build around this core of players

------------ Jacob Weitering - Jack Silvagni
Adam Saad ------------ -------------
Blake Acres - Patrick Cripps -----------
------------ Harry Mckay -----------
------------ Charlie Curnow -----------
Tom de Koning - Jagga Smith - Sam Walsh

Adam Cerra ---------- ---------- -----------


Option 3 - Nuke the joint and start again (2025 ends in disaster, it all goes to s*** and we finish bottom 6)
- Trade out some big names and start looking to the future built around Cody, Jagga and others. - Trade out some of our stars like Walsh and Mckay. Keep Weiters and Charlie as pillars at either end but start focusing all attention on building around our most promising youngsters via the draft. Maybe get in the race for Harley Reid (Keep Cripps too obviously but don't plan on him being there long term)

Build around this core of players

Lachie Cowan - Jacob Weitering -----------
----------- Harry O'Farrell -----------
Ollie Hollands - Adam Cerra - Lucas Camporeale
----------- ------------ -------------
----------- Charlie Curnow - Ashton Moir
Tom De Koning - Jagga Smith - Cody Walker

Ben Camporeale - Cooper Lord ---------- ----------



Obviously some names not included in any of those 3 options, they're just non critical players imo. If they were moved on for other alternatives we'd be largely unaffected. Thats just a matter of personal opinion though. Elijah is a critical piece in all 3 for me but who knows what the future holds for him at this stage.

 

[Dramoth]

The 66 game rebuild started in 2016.

I think we all have been very patient awaiting the arrival of a trustworthy, reliable, predictable, cohesive football team with a gameplan that can at least take us to top4.

We havent finished a regular season in the top4 since 2001. History says, baring an exception here and there, the benchmark you need to contest for a flag.

Questions being asked are very valid.
The supporter base has made an investment of goodwill, good faith and good money in the clubs narrative since the rebuild announcement...





Sent from my SM-N981B using Tapatalk

Every time we change up the staff at the club, it’s basically a reset of the rebuild. Especially if we bring in a new head coach. He’s gonna take time to get up to speed at the club. Our players need to learn the new coaches systems.

Either we put some faith into the coach or we’re going to get stuck into a rebuild cycle.

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

Not even sure why I'm posting this cos I reckon Austin has done a fair job since coming in, BUT I can't help to think he may have ****ed up big time last year.

We know he traded us up to pick 3 last year after giving up a fair bit of currency to get there. We also appreciate that with Tassie looming on the horizon, it's pretty crucial to get as much top end draft talent to set yourself up.....BUT I think he got caught out, cos if you're trading up at the pointy end, it's not just to see who may be available at that pick.

I'm calling bullshit that we rated Jagga as the best in the draft - and the clip of the war room on draft nite was choreographed to appease the masses that we supposedly achieved what we always wanted. Case in point below from an genuine ITK during the trade period.

Blues and Eagles have agreed on Pick 12 & 14 for 3, 63,68 and a mid range pick that eagles will get in as part of player movement to cover F&S points. Expect announcement Tuesday.

Draft Target is currently Lalor over O’Sullivan but is close and strong debate internally - either way club extremely happy !

Believe 1 of those 2 players will go pick #1#1.

Lloyd wont be at club at end of 2025. Both parties agree time for change in that role.
Timing with wright being managed.

Rob Inness has reviewed Blues fitness program from last year - significant change coming in both weights room and core strength work …….. Players fit but bodies not match hard and some key list indicators well off Swans levels as a collective !

Enjoy 2025 - Internally very confident !


#Bluemour

Even the media had us linked to FOS all the way leading u to the draft - but magically, we got the player were were targeting all the way along we rated the best in the draft. Don't think so Austin, I reckon you took the chance and was caught out....the clip from the war room was choreographed to save face from 100,000 members.

Not saying that Jagga won't become a champion player for us, but I'm calling bullshit on the spin.

And it could have compounded even further if the Kennedy trade pick got swallowed up by a bid on Ben, meaning we traded him foir nothing...but we were just lucky that no bid came and we could use that pick to grab HO'F.

Anyway, come at me....but I don't think Jagga was our target, and the trades 'backfired' on Austin.

 

[Arr0w]

Not even sure why I'm posting this cos I reckon Austin has done a fair job since coming in, BUT I can't help to think he may have ****ed up big time last year.

We know he traded us up to pick 3 last year after giving up a fair bit of currency to get there. We also appreciate that with Tassie looming on the horizon, it's pretty crucial to get as much top end draft talent to set yourself up.....BUT I think he got caught out, cos if you're trading up at the pointy end, it's not just to see who may be available at that pick.

I'm calling bullshit that we rated Jagga as the best in the draft - and the clip of the war room on draft nite was choreographed to appease the masses that we supposedly achieved what we always wanted. Case in point below from an genuine ITK during the trade period.

Even the media had us linked to FOS all the way leading u to the draft - but magically, we got the player were were targeting all the way along we rated the best in the draft. Don't think so Austin, I reckon you took the chance and was caught out....the clip from the war room was choreographed to save face from 100,000 members.

Not saying that Jagga won't become a champion player for us, but I'm calling bullshit on the spin.

And it could have compounded even further if the Kennedy trade pick got swallowed up by a bid on Ben, meaning we traded him foir nothing...but we were just lucky that no bid came and we could use that pick to grab HO'F.

Anyway, come at me....but I don't think Jagga was our target, and the trades 'backfired' on Austin.

It's all very interesting

I've never been keen on giving up 2 x mid-late 1st rounders (+ some), to move up the order unless you are in a range to gain a standout

I believe there was some great value in the likes of Hannaford and Hynes in that range

2018, no issue with that, but even then I wanted SOS to trade down from pick 1, 2 of B King, Smith or even Rozee, Butters, Caldwell

Now, no 1st rounder and the Lions 2nd, but we can trade 2 years of futures I guess