Preview Round 10, 2023: GWS v St.Kilda - GIANTS Stadium, Sunday 21st May, 4:40PM AEST

Who Wins?

  • Giants

    Votes: 21 40.4%
  • Saints

    Votes: 31 59.6%

  • Total voters
    52

Remove this Banner Ad

Status
Not open for further replies.
Just a couple of points to address some things that have been raised:

  • Windy has performed and changed a game as a sub - Round 9 v Geelong last year. I think he needs to come in this week into the 22, but he has performed in the position.
  • We don't have a crumbing forward, but Higgins and Butler play different roles which we both need. Higgins is more of the Milne-type leading small forward. Milne could also crumb at an elite level, which made him top-5 all time at his position. Butler is a pressure forward. We need both those roles and a crumbing forward.
Higgins works his butt off for the team. big fan.
 
We need a few changes after that effort
In
Windy, Bytel, King, Webster,
Out
Byrnes, Steele, Membrey, Sharman,

Billings/Gresham/Jones for Paton if they're fit.

Stocker and Hill were pretty ordinary but have some more runs on the board.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Pretty keen to see how the King/Caminiti set up looks.

I’ll admit that I thought as good as Caminiti looked early he would just eventually fade away a bit but he seems to be getting better.

He’s performing as well as Max was at his age which is very exciting.

Giants may struggle to contain them, with just Buckley back there over 192cm

The midfield worries me a bit though. I watched the Giants live a few weeks back and Tom Green is a star.
 
How was Stockers game overall?

Thankfully I only caught patches, but he looked a bit overwhelmed and panicky a few times from what I saw… but not on his own obviously.

Wouldn't mind seeing Highmore in the 1's again soon.
 
Give him the next 3 off. Give him time to recover. If we keep rolling him out and he isn't fit enough will end up doing to him what Carlton did to Cripps for a number of years.
Give him 3 weeks off and please let the man eat. The weight loss appears to have compromised Steele’s point of difference, being a well built flipping bull that thrives on the contest.

Also reminds me of Cripps a few years back:
A984BDA7-5788-4D10-A8C2-117622A3626E.png
 
Selection this week promises to be interesting. Seems like just the one forced out through injury, Membrey to be replaced by King. With Windy having a big game in the VFL and presumably Gresh available once again, it's a little tricky to guess who may go out. Probably Seb in the firing line after a pretty terrible game, Byrnes maybe another who could make way. His missed tackle on Rankine resulting in the first goal of the game was horrific and almost as damning as the first quarter clangers of bloody Seb Ross. And I get the impression the boss likes what Jimmy Webster brings so I reckon he comes in for Paton this week.

Sounds like they'll let Billings build in the VFL for a few weeks and I think they might give Bytel a full game for Sandy as well. Maybe Paton as the sub.
People already calling for Seb to be dropped after 1 poor game. Yes he was poor by foot but he was hardly alone in that regard. Most couldn't hit a target. He led the team in tackles with 8 and had the 2nd most pressure acts so you can't say he wasn't trying defensively.

There are others in the gun before Seb at this point in time. If it becomes a consistent theme then yes. But he's been one of our better players this year
 
This same midfield with a skinny Steele has been average for a month, change it up coach
 
That's one of the reason why we need to get some of the younger mids - Windy/Pou/Owens - into the midfield rotation as soon as possible. They all bring something different to our older mids without us losing the creativity and class Sinclair brings at half back.
Yep. Sinclair is like daicos. If we use him right he could be the architect of 3-4 goals a game from back there
 
Just a couple of points to address some things that have been raised:

  • Windy has performed and changed a game as a sub - Round 9 v Geelong last year. I think he needs to come in this week into the 22, but he has performed in the position.
  • We don't have a crumbing forward, but Higgins and Butler play different roles which we both need. Higgins is more of the Milne-type leading small forward. Milne could also crumb at an elite level, which made him top-5 all time at his position. Butler is a pressure forward. We need both those roles and a crumbing forward.
Its worked once with Windy , every other time it hasn't so one game in 5 , I'm going out on a limb and saying it doesn't work, the kid needs more time on the ground .
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

At this stage of the season I’m curious to hear people thoughts on our current BNF

My guess
1. Sinclair
2. Wilkie
3. Wood
4.Owens
4. Higgins
5. Marshall
6. Clark
7. Battle
 
I've voiced my concern about our shift, from about when Membrey came back, to just dumping it i50 instead of our creative entries earlier in the year.
I am very excited to get King back don't get me wrong, but I am even more concerned that whether consciously or sub consciously, the midfielders are going to think 'hey I've got two big players there' and just bomb on their heads. Even more so than currently.

This may work some of the time as they're tall targets who can actually take a contested mark, and yeah sometimes it's necessary or even a good option (1 on 1), but it lends itself more to our lazy, low footy IQ entries.
I really hope Hammer and King work well together.

Also, with how one-paced and susceptible to bullish clearance oppo players our mids have looked, Tom Green is going to carve us a new one.
Change it up, Owens is built for the mid, Windy has done easily enough in the VFL, roll Pou through there.
Use Sincs off half back where he sets up so many brilliant plays and clears lines like nobody else, and fk Paton off for JWeb, who is accountable and has a brilliant kick (something we distinctly lacked last week).
 
People already calling for Seb to be dropped after 1 poor game. Yes he was poor by foot but he was hardly alone in that regard. Most couldn't hit a target. He led the team in tackles with 8 and had the 2nd most pressure acts so you can't say he wasn't trying defensively.

There are others in the gun before Seb at this point in time. If it becomes a consistent theme then yes. But he's been one of our better players this year

It’s prob more 2 poor games in a row (12 disposals v North) but I agree with you, he has runs on the board and so should stay in the side.
 
I have a theory:

Summary:
I reckon Ross has made a grey area out of when to give maximum effort in the last month and it's caused our system to crack.

I reckon if he goes back to demanding players throw everything they've got at every minute of every game (regardless of opponent quality and scoreboard)... we'll be back to playing like we were in the first month.


Long winded bit:
I reckon Ross 2.0 has overcorrected this year in the way that Ross 1.0 (2009 etc) used to demand the players "keep the foot to the floor" no matter the score- whether the game was close or we were up by 10 goals etc.

Ross has spoken about that several times this year- where he has said that his new approach is to not be so demanding of maximum everything, all the time.

It was most obvious a few weeks ago v the blues where he admitted telling them to take the foot off the gas in q4.

I reckon the players spent the first month throwing 100% of themselves into every second of every game- pushing themselves to their endurance limits in order to 'break' the opposition.

Then, with a bunch of wins on the board and the coach actively encouraging them to dial back the intensity at times (eg just doing 'enough' to squeeze past the roos etc)- they have lost their edge.

My hope is that my theory is right- because surely last week will be a massive jolt for the players (and Ross 2.0) that 'the system' only works when everyone is committed to going 100% no matter the scoreboard or the quality of opposition.
 
I have a theory:

Summary:
I reckon Ross has made a grey area out of when to give maximum effort in the last month and it's caused our system to crack.

I reckon if he goes back to demanding players throw everything they've got at every minute of every game (regardless of opponent quality and scoreboard)... we'll be back to playing like we were in the first month.


Long winded bit:
I reckon Ross 2.0 has overcorrected this year in the way that Ross 1.0 (2009 etc) used to demand the players "keep the foot to the floor" no matter the score- whether the game was close or we were up by 10 goals etc.

Ross has spoken about that several times this year- where he has said that his new approach is to not be so demanding of maximum everything, all the time.

It was most obvious a few weeks ago v the blues where he admitted telling them to take the foot off the gas in q4.

I reckon the players spent the first month throwing 100% of themselves into every second of every game- pushing themselves to their endurance limits in order to 'break' the opposition.

Then, with a bunch of wins on the board and the coach actively encouraging them to dial back the intensity at times (eg just doing 'enough' to squeeze past the roos etc)- they have lost their edge.

My hope is that my theory is right- because surely last week will be a massive jolt for the players (and Ross 2.0) that 'the system' only works when everyone is committed to going 100% no matter the scoreboard or the quality of opposition.
It is a theory. Question is if the 100% manic effort is realistically sustainable across a season now in terms of injury and mental burn out ?
 
It is a theory. Question is if the 100% manic effort is realistically sustainable across a season now in terms of injury and mental burn out ?

Of course that remains to be seen.

Ideally yeah- we could pick and choose when to go 'foot to the floor' (in order to save energy and lower injury risks)... so we don't just limp into september- we are at or near our peak then.

But I reckon getting 22+ footballers to all be on the same page in terms of effort and motivation is virtually impossible unless the instructions are very black and white.

All it takes is a few of our 22 not giving quite 100% manic effort- and the whole system can be split open very quickly.

It's an all or nothing game style I believe.

As such, I think we need to try and keep the players physically and mentally fresh outside of gametime- ie, dropping down training loads etc if they start fatiguing etc.
Or outright resting/managing guys.

During games the instruction needs to be- 'foot to the floor, all game, every game'.
 
It is a theory. Question is if the 100% manic effort is realistically sustainable across a season now in terms of injury and mental burn out ?
It’s another question I bring up a lot. Often in our recent history I find we have a burst of manic 110% effort games where we look a million bucks and out run every team for all four quarters. We win and look like millionaires then in the following weeks drop off and then look average. Did it under richo did it under ratts.

We’re always enamoured with it “this is saints footy! 100% effort we’ll pressure them and make them fumble”

Never seems sustainable to base your success around having your boys bust their guts at max effort all the time because when they’re too tired you have no advantage. I like when we base our success around a foundation of repeatable systems and plans and simply supplement that with the addition of extreme pressure in big games.

Dunno just seems like a pattern we follow and repeat so often.
 
We win and look like millionaires then in the following weeks drop off and then look average. Did it under richo did it under ratts.

Has been an issue for probably 6-7 years unfortunately. And for some reason those issues still exist under Ross.

Maybe just maybe we've overrated our team just a fraction. We might not have the group that want to continually put in the effort. We don't seem to have players that have a drive to continually improve. I could be wrong but from the outside looking in it appears that way.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top