List Mgmt. The 2024 Draft (Nov 20/21)

[Keys]

Quick links

• Player contract status
• Draft prospect video highlights (thanks to noobermensch)
• Provisional 2025 Draft order

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Drafted

• Bo Allan - Pick 16
• Jobe Shanahan - Pick 30
• Tom Gross - Pick 46
• Lucca Grego - Pick 48
• Hamish Davis - Pick 65
• Malakai Champion - Cat B

List Spots Available

• One on either main OR rookie list to be filled as a SSP selection following train on assessments

Trade and draft period

In: F1, F2, F3, Baker, Owies, Graham, Allan, Shanahan, Gross, Grego, Davis, Champion
Out: 3, 63, F3, F4, Barrass, Darling

 

[Elite Pete]

You think he's an elite player? 5th in the spoon winning team would indicate a pretty middling, maybe above average player. Graham and Owies are unquestionably middling players.

I would rank baker as about the 11th best player at WCE next year (assuming player fitness). We are not a good team either. Would you rate him different relative to the below?

1​	Gov
2​	Waterman
3​	Reid
4​	Yeo
5​	Allen
6​	Kelly
7​	Hough
8​	Duggan
9​	Ginbey
10​	Ryan
11​	Baker

Baker for mine would be 6th on that list without question.

Pick 14 value in this draft, as we have seen on was too high for him though imo.

 

[Obeanie1]

The problem is the baker trade appears to be more than just short term thinking - it’s patronage. That doesn’t really change whether you include graham or not as part of a broader baker package, and if anything it makes it worse. We paid more than we should have for these guys because of relationships formed outside of our football club.

I would argue if a coach needs to bring in middling senior players (using serious draft capital) just to help them “teach the new game style”, then they aren’t really very confident in their ability to coach, and they’ve sold a part of our long term future for their own short term gain. Getting people in cheap is fine, but using serious draft capital is risky and not good for our long term future.

Nobody really knows how this off season will turn out long term, especially the draft part. We are almost all unanimously happy with our drafting this year, so we can all be hopeful we’ve got that bit right, but we shouldn’t let that paper over the cracks of what was pretty clearly a weak trade period (not draft) with some particularly weak negotiating in terms of price.




Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Do you think a trade like that will happen again?

 

[Obeanie1]

You think he's an elite player? 5th in the spoon winning team would indicate a pretty middling, maybe above average player. Graham and Owies are unquestionably middling players.

I would rank baker as about the 11th best player at WCE next year (assuming player fitness). We are not a good team either. Would you rate him different relative to the below?

1​	Gov
2​	Waterman
3​	Reid
4​	Yeo
5​	Allen
6​	Kelly
7​	Hough
8​	Duggan
9​	Ginbey
10​	Ryan
11​	Baker

Ryan looks shot.

Hough and Ginbey are under Baker.

Gov wont be around in 3 years.

Kelly could also be done.

 

[Bleedblueandgold]

Assuming we wouldn't have bid for Ashcroft.

We still would've ended up with the same player lol.

 

[Bleedblueandgold]

Did a Google search on Sellwood since we've been reported as interested in him as an SSP, and this is one of the first results that came up.

Two state league players banned, one for entire year, over lewd incidents at pre-season camp

Two state league players banned, one for entire year, over lewd incidents at pre-season camp

www.foxsports.com.au

His teammate, 20-year-old Michael Sellwood, was given a one-game ban for a separate “crude incident” involving a teammate.

 

[Yeahnahmate]

You think he's an elite player? 5th in the spoon winning team would indicate a pretty middling, maybe above average player. Graham and Owies are unquestionably middling players.

I would rank baker as about the 11th best player at WCE next year (assuming player fitness). We are not a good team either. Would you rate him different relative to the below?

1​	Gov
2​	Waterman
3​	Reid
4​	Yeo
5​	Allen
6​	Kelly
7​	Hough
8​	Duggan
9​	Ginbey
10​	Ryan
11​	Baker

You’ve literally just proven you underrate him. He’s not top 6 at the Tiges for that long then slips to 11 upon joining our list, gtfo

 

[eaglevision]

You’ve literally just proven you underrate him. He’s not top 6 at the Tiges for that long then slips to 11 upon joining our list, gtfo

In the past 5 years (excluding 2021 when he only played 14 games due to injury) Liam Duggan has finished 5th, 5th, 3rd, 4th in the B&F. Is he in our top 5 players?

 

[beagles]

Houston we have a Baker problem. Again...

 

[Patron]

You’ve literally just proven you underrate him. He’s not top 6 at the Tiges for that long then slips to 11 upon joining our list, gtfo

B+F's are not the be all and end all of footballing ability. I may underate him, but perhaps it would be more constructive to tell me who he should be above in the list?

 

[Patron]

Ryan looks shot.

Hough and Ginbey are under Baker.

Gov wont be around in 3 years.

Kelly could also be done.

Ryan does look a bit cooked, but these rankings are on the proviso of fitness. I think it's probably more likely than not baker is better than Ryan next year, but I still believe Ryan is a better football player, which could be supported by being a previous AA.

Hough's year last year was better than bakers imo and you expect him to progress further. Ginbeys back half I think in defence was as good as hough's and you expect him to progress further.
Baker is very close in ability currently to these three players and this was where I found it hard to split.

Gov is a generational defender, was AA last year, I doubt he's playing in 3 years either and he's on the decline, but I don't think that's relevant to the context of my post - he's unquestionably a better player than Baker.

Kelly could also be on the decline but it would be a brave man to suggest Baker is a better player than Kelly. Kelly was our B+F only last year, is a previous AA and averaged 24 touches whilst battling injury issues last year and playing underdone. Bakers never averaged more than 20 touches in his career. They are different players and Kelly's best is behind him now but I am very comfortable with that ranking.

 

[Patron]

Yeah 5th in a spoon year, but you just conveniently leave out every other year? Haha

He also finished 6th in a premiership year.

From your list above Ryan, Allen, Yeo and Gov can't get through a whole season without serious injury, yes higher skilled players but on the park less and less. At least Baker's playing 20+ games and providing that experience on field.

I would rate Baker well above Ginbey currently, but hope that changes soon, Hough a little closer, but Baker has more runs on the board and is more flexible, again hopefully Hough elevates.

Duggan probably fits a similar profile to Baker I'd have them as reasonable comparable. Both good leaders, tough players who don't take a backwards step.

I feel your list just highlights even more the need to have a strong leader present each week given how unreliable a lot of senior players are now with injury.

I'm not saying bakers useless, he's certainly durable, crafty and hard at it. I just think he's a bit of a middling player and not the type you should be spending first rounders on (particularly in a year where first rounders are worth so much).

What your saying is not unreasonable at all, Ginbey, Hough, duggan, baker etc. can all be compared for current footballing ability.

 

[ziad]

In the past 5 years (excluding 2021 when he only played 14 games due to injury) Liam Duggan has finished 5th, 5th, 3rd, 4th in the B&F. Is he in our top 5 players?

Precisely, thats our problem

 

[eaglevision]

The West Coast Eagles, meanwhile, will assess former Gold Coast-listed defender Sandy Brock, as well as delisted backman Coby Burgiel.

Brock joined the Suns as a pre-listed rookie in late 2021 but didn’t manage a senior appearance across three years, while Burgiel was the No. 29 draft pick in 2022 but was cut by West Coast in October

AFL 2024: Who will sign during Supplemental Selection Period, when does the SSP start, delisted and VFL players, latest news

The players linked to new AFL homes ahead of pre-season supplemental selection period

www.foxsports.com.au

Fox sports, not sure if it’s comprehensive but could be a straight shoot out. Bags Burgiel vs Brock.

Van Es looks great on paper but his ankle injury and complications are significant. St Kilda cutting a pick 31 KPD after his first contract after losing Battle then taking two more 18 year olds tells the tale.

 

[daddy_4_eyes]

So what's the appeal of giving Brock a train on spot?

Coming off a rookie list, never cracked an AFL game, delisted after only 3 years when KPP are usually given more time to develop. Doesn't exactly scream "AFL quality" does it?

 

[Dark Sharks]

Lel, can't wait to add Selwood via SSP just so he can help strengthen the shit show that is the Beagles for 1 season before we cut him from our list and he quits and goes back to Peel.

 

[Happy Mastenator]

Can we put a ban on discussing Baker in this thread? Relitigating something that has happened, without adding anything new that hasn't been said multiple times over the various trade/draft threads should see a card issued!

 

[plays tall 1]

Don’t want Van Es. Didn’t rate him in his draft year despite his undoubted athletic prowess…it just didn’t seem to translate into performance. And he’s had what 3 or surgeries on his ankle now. Surely there’s s better prospect in the VFL, WAFL or SANFL.

 

[chaddy22]

You think he's an elite player? 5th in the spoon winning team would indicate a pretty middling, maybe above average player. Graham and Owies are unquestionably middling players.

I would rank baker as about the 11th best player at WCE next year (assuming player fitness). We are not a good team either. Would you rate him different relative to the below?

1​	Gov
2​	Waterman
3​	Reid
4​	Yeo
5​	Allen
6​	Kelly
7​	Hough
8​	Duggan
9​	Ginbey
10​	Ryan
11​	Baker

To be fair richmond had a injury list to rival our 2023 horror.
Not really a good year to pick with very few players playing many games.
They wouldn't have been wooden spooners if they had a fit list.

 

[bzparkes]

To be fair richmond had a injury list to rival our 2023 horror.
Not really a good year to pick with very few players playing many games.
They wouldn't have been wooden spooners if they had a fit list.

Questionable.

This was their injury list at the end of the season. Not exactly stacked with quality. Lynch is cooked and Gibcus, whilst showing promise, has been injury-riddled his entire career.

The rest don't exactly scream 'quality' right now. At least not quality enough to win a game with, let alone avoid the spoon.

 

[Yeahnahmate]

B+F's are not the be all and end all of footballing ability. I may underate him, but perhaps it would be more constructive to tell me who he should be above in the list?

He will likely be above Duggan and Hough (for now) with the latter continuing to gain on him. The fact you have Ryan even on that list tells me all I need to know & that you unfairly underrate Baker

 

[Ghossein]

So what's the appeal of giving Brock a train on spot?

Coming off a rookie list, never cracked an AFL game, delisted after only 3 years when KPP are usually given more time to develop. Doesn't exactly scream "AFL quality" does it?

I can see it being purely for depth in the key back department, also fills the spot in the Beagles with HEdwards inevitably being in the 22

 

[Grahame]

Can we put a ban on discussing Baker in this thread? Relitigating something that has happened, without adding anything new that hasn't been said multiple times over the various trade/draft threads should see a card issued!

Yep I’m happy to hold my tongue. I’ve made my points about Baker (and Graham).

Whatever the rights and wrongs we aren’t able to untrade or undraft people.

They’re here now. They’re Eagles players.

 

[Yeahnahmate]

In the past 5 years (excluding 2021 when he only played 14 games due to injury) Liam Duggan has finished 5th, 5th, 3rd, 4th in the B&F. Is he in our top 5 players?

Probably, and Baker is better than him too

 

[TY24]

So what's the appeal of giving Brock a train on spot?

Coming off a rookie list, never cracked an AFL game, delisted after only 3 years when KPP are usually given more time to develop. Doesn't exactly scream "AFL quality" does it?

….that’s why it’s just a train on spot and not a commitment to signing him…. so we can…. see if he’s any good?

 

[Astro7]

Can we put a ban on discussing Baker in this thread? Relitigating something that has happened, without adding anything new that hasn't been said multiple times over the various trade/draft threads should see a card issued!

Fair call...maybe include #3, #14 and the Clarke topic also? (yawn)