List Mgmt. The 2024 Draft (Nov 20/21)

[Keys]

Quick links

• Player contract status
• Draft prospect video highlights (thanks to noobermensch)
• Provisional 2025 Draft order

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Drafted

• Bo Allan - Pick 16
• Jobe Shanahan - Pick 30
• Tom Gross - Pick 46
• Lucca Grego - Pick 48
• Hamish Davis - Pick 65
• Malakai Champion - Cat B

List Spots Available

• One on either main OR rookie list to be filled as a SSP selection following train on assessments

Trade and draft period

In: F1, F2, F3, Baker, Owies, Graham, Allan, Shanahan, Gross, Grego, Davis, Champion
Out: 3, 63, F3, F4, Barrass, Darling

 

[Spooky17]

Geelong are BODEs, but we already knew that.

 

[ROYAL EAGLE]

In regards to Burgiel, Saad in the backline.

In regards to who I think we should take in the SSP I would be looking very strongly at Michael Sellwood. Purely from the perspective that he could be best 22 next year, he is developed and his kicking is very, very good. Also provides plenty of run and carry. His kicking from defence is something I think we lack and he's still quite young. I think he is an AFL level talent. He's a very good mark at WAFL level but I think that would just translate to average at AFL level. It's the combination of his overall athletic package, intercept, kicking and to a lesser extent run and carry that I think is worth a shot.

Van Es I would love to get in, have an MRI & CT done of his ankle & back as well as a full medical with a focus on flexibility and if that turns up alright have him out there training. I have a sneaking suspicion however that he was cut on the basis of a couple of things. His ankle is ****ed, he's lost flexibility due to his back injury and those things combined have also meant he's lost a lot of speed resulting in him being delisted. From my running memory and it's getting worse he had a fair bit of development to do as well and wasn't seen as the hardest player at the ball.

Of the overlooked 18 year olds I'd prefer to wait till MSD draft time before having a look. The chances are highly likely by then there will be someone to put on the LTI list.

Burgiel has to show 100% intent, 100% intensity and not to get an injury to get a shot at being picked back up.

Outside of those already mentioned there's a few who have already been mentioned I'd give Oli Eastland a 2 week train on period. If he performs better than our current rucks I'd sign him.

SSP train on payments and medicals come out of the soft cap so people know.

Yea iam a fan of Selwood damaging elite kick strong body hard at it
There maybe interest in Kalin Lane
WE should be giving Izy Winder a second chance

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

Without having the full board in front of me anymore and being a fair few san migs in i'd probably forget a few or get a few placements wrong.

Our future second & Hawks F3 for 28+31, Then after the bid on Kako their future second for 26. I'm not unhappy the trade didn't happen but it did mean we had no interest in talking to Essendon come the second day of the draft particularly with who was still on the board. We rated Shanahan at 12 so for it to even be considered it would have had to be Melbourne's F1 with nothing going back and I don't think that would have been the offer. I didn't take that call, I was just getting off the phone to Mackie telling him no for Geelongs F1.

It all ended up well and I am glad it went the way it did. Head scratcher why Essendon ignored a trade up to 26 when they effectively trade down. Shanahan would be perfect for Essendon and much better that Gerryene. They would have had great currency to trade back in if they wanted. As you know, I had been clear very early on the deal to hide their picks and it had so much merit for all concerned. Not an ideal start for Matty Rosa

 

[KERRPOW]

WCE_phil Surely Geelong wouldn’t be able to fit Harley into their salary cap?!

Also, do have a view as to whether Harley is likely to stay?

He'll probably snag a cotton on sponsorship and shoot ads with bailey smith.

 

[southcoast]

He'll probably snag a cotton on sponsorship and shoot ads with bailey smith.

And taking calls from Danger?


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[Ruben Grubarb]

This is my final drat order (in which order I would pick):

01 - Smith
02 - Ashcroft
03 - FOS
04 - Lalor
05 - Draper
06 - Langford
07 - Smillie
08 - Lombard
09 - Lindsay
10 - Tauru

 

[ghostbat12]

WCE_phil Surely Geelong wouldn’t be able to fit Harley into their salary cap?!

Also, do have a view as to whether Harley is likely to stay?

Geelong have many retirees to come and for Harley, a club will go brutal on salary they dump.

It’s not just Geelong, let’s not be naive.

However Geelong is country town but it’s on opposite side of Melbourne to where he is from. I can’t see how Geelong is closer to “seeing family” than Essendon with Tullamarine.

FYI I don’t think he is leaving. If we show enough improvement he won’t leave.

If he does, then so be it. He is entitled to do that.

 

[chaddy22]

WCE_phil Surely Geelong wouldn’t be able to fit Harley into their salary cap?!

Also, do have a view as to whether Harley is likely to stay?

I am surprised that Richmond didn't try a cheeky bid for Harley .They are never going to have a better hand to do it with.
They could try next year having their first and The Kangas first.
You would think Essendon with two firsts next year would have a go.
I can't think of anything worse than Harley seeing out his contract and then requesting a trade to the Cats.
You know we are going to be dudded

 

[archiemoses]

You just can't make some people happy can you. How often does a club nail EVERY trade and every pick in an off season to perfection?

Yes, it appears like WCE over paid for Baker. But considering the overall result, it appears to be a fantastic off season and getting Baker and Graham seems so important in the overall scheme of things.

And as WCE_Phil has noted, WC appear to have a great relationship and reputation with other clubs and this may prove valuable in future dealings with other clubs.

I would absolutely share your sentiment about the cost of Baker if the draft wasn't so successful (eg. Tim Kelly), but as a WC nuffy I am stoked with the overall net result regardless of any of the trades or picks in isolation.

Of course we have a good reputation. We are the weakest negotiators in the league. Every team would be chomping at the bit to deal with us and take us to the cleaners.

 

[archiemoses]

Let's hope we can extract a first rounder from Tassie for Bailey Williams

 

[Elite Pete]

I am surprised that Richmond didn't try a cheeky bid for Harley .They are never going to have a better hand to do it with.
They could try next year having their first and The Kangas first.
You would think Essendon with two firsts next year would have a go.
I can't think of anything worse than Harley seeing out his contract and then requesting a trade to the Cats.
You know we are going to be dudded

Next years could be pretty good. Two top 5 picks. Dons will be sniffing too now

 

[archiemoses]

It was an in principle deal before the draft. They obviously liked the options they got elsewhere and didn't even bother to give us a call before we found out their trades just as the draft started. Honestly after having to deal with Dave Barham and Kevin Sheedy last year, combined with Woosh's experience at Essendon and particularly knowing I was done with dealing with them I would have given them an earful and I think Woosha would have as well.

It's little things like not even bothering to call and say thank you but we've decided to go down a different path that make a big difference. Not even making a 30s call is just ****ing disrespectful and why Rosa coped a polite but firm no thank you before any real offer was made.

Also I had just gotten a rise out of the team with my discussion with Mackie which is why there is a photo with lots of smiles floating around with live draftees on it. It was quite amusing and I can't repeat what was said but it related not only to Mackie but also to one of their current players. BTW **** Geelong, they are the ones who are already going hard at Harley.

Geelong would have a three year plan to land harley. No doubt they are in his ear. If they stay up the ladder they'll have no picks for him.

 

[WCE_phil]

Of course we have a good reputation. We are the weakest negotiators in the league. Every team would be chomping at the bit to deal with us and take us to the cleaners.

We got the first of Brisbane's picks offloaded picks on the second night. You think our great trade relationship had nothing to do with that?
I worked with Port in securing a free pick because I and the club had sown enough doubts that we might either take Berry or trade with either Freo or GWS.
Also were you not happy with the final result of the Barrass trade?

Now I won't be involved next year but a lot of the team will and im sure the club has learnt a lot. They will bring in either someone directly into the position or contract out to someone else but im certain a close leash will be kept when it comes to Clarke and player trades.

Clarke has done a great job in regards to sewing up the deals we needed and also in getting the club to cut most of the dead wood. I don't even like the man but even I can admit this.

Also do not underestimate the combination of Woosha & Mini at the club. I can read almost anyone but Woosh can deadpan me, probably the only person in footy I've ever been involved with that I wouldn't want to play poker against. Mini brings a huge amount of positive energy and is a very hard, focussed man whilst being very good with the players. He's also a lot more intuitive with what he wants and how he reads the direction of the game than any other coaches i've worked with, even if was only working with him briefly, I was very impressed.

 

[WCE_phil]

Yea iam a fan of Selwood damaging elite kick strong body hard at it
There maybe interest in Kalin Lane
WE should be giving Izy Winder a second chance

I think someone should give Izzy another chance likely at the end of another good season at WAFL level, however I highly doubt it's the WCE. He definitely has the talent but bridges were burnt and a lot of it wasn't Izzy's fault.

 

[chaddy22]

We got the first of Brisbane's picks offloaded picks on the second night. You think our great trade relationship had nothing to do with that?
I worked with Port in securing a free pick because I and the club had sown enough doubts that we might either take Berry or trade with either Freo or GWS.
Also were you not happy with the final result of the Barrass trade?

Now I won't be involved next year but a lot of the team will and im sure the club has learnt a lot. They will bring in either someone directly into the position or contract out to someone else but im certain a close leash will be kept when it comes to Clarke and player trades.

Clarke has done a great job in regards to sewing up the deals we needed and also in getting the club to cut most of the dead wood. I don't even like the man but even I can admit this.

Also do not underestimate the combination of Woosha & Mini at the club. I can read almost anyone but Woosh can deadpan me, probably the only person in footy I've ever been involved with that I wouldn't want to play poker against. Mini brings a huge amount of positive energy and is a very hard, focussed man whilst being very good with the players. He's also a lot more intuitive with what he wants and how he reads the direction of the game than any other coaches i've worked with, even if was only working with him briefly, I was very impressed.

A lot of bedwetters are not happy with Clarke but the final result for Barrass is not as bad as some would like to think.
We got a good haul of picks next year. Also in the past we would have hung onto Barrass like grim death and after what happened with Nicnat i am happy we didn't cave in.
Also happy we cut deep. My only reservation was could we get some decent replacements.
With such a deep and even draft he has done the right thing.
I do agree i would keep him away from player trades especially if we are going after Warner,

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

He'll probably snag a cotton on sponsorship and shoot ads with bailey smith.

Harley is staying put

 

[Goroyals22]

Let's hope we can extract a first rounder from Tassie for Bailey Williams

Hell no. That means another couple of years from that spud clogging our list


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[Yeahnahmate]

Good quick little wrap from 30:24 here

 

[Patron]

Could've, would've, should've but didn't for a reason. What you're overlooking is - the club and coach wanted Baker (Graham+Owies) for specific reasons going forward. The coach has inside working knowledge of these players and how they'll assist his plan and the team going forward. Those players also know how the coach works and can help embed his plan across the lines. What we want, or know,(or think we know) in a sense is irrelevant. It doesn't matter what we could've got, this is what they wanted!

Those 3 players might seem a short term fix, but they help fill a gap, act as a bridge to the future, and their work ethic and hardness will be instilled in the playing group for the future. There'll be more good players coming in next trade/draft period.
I just don't get why so many are still hung up over Clarke and those picks, who cares, it's not a perfect science. It worked out really well (as if they knew what they were doing?) and if some begrudgingly think it was mainly luck, well luck is part of the game right through to an oval football and how it bounces. Every club had some good and bad luck during the trade/draft.

The problem is the baker trade appears to be more than just short term thinking - it’s patronage. That doesn’t really change whether you include graham or not as part of a broader baker package, and if anything it makes it worse. We paid more than we should have for these guys because of relationships formed outside of our football club.

I would argue if a coach needs to bring in middling senior players (using serious draft capital) just to help them “teach the new game style”, then they aren’t really very confident in their ability to coach, and they’ve sold a part of our long term future for their own short term gain. Getting people in cheap is fine, but using serious draft capital is risky and not good for our long term future.

Nobody really knows how this off season will turn out long term, especially the draft part. We are almost all unanimously happy with our drafting this year, so we can all be hopeful we’ve got that bit right, but we shouldn’t let that paper over the cracks of what was pretty clearly a weak trade period (not draft) with some particularly weak negotiating in terms of price.




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[BartBart]

If this is the order, bit worrying to think that we would've chosen Langford ahead of Draper had we kept pick 3.
I'm guessing
1 Rich Lalor
2 Norf FOS
3 WC Langford
4 Adel Draper
5 Bris Ashcroft
6 Melb Smith

I would've preferred
1 Rich Lalor
2 Norf FOS
3 WC Draper
4 Adel Smith
5 Bris Ashcroft
6 Melb Langford

Assuming we wouldn't have bid for Ashcroft.

 

[nameless]

I would argue if a coach needs to bring in middling senior players

How is Baker a middling player?

His b&f finishes:

2019: 13th
2020: 6th
2021: 2nd
2022: 4th
2023: 6th
2024: 5th

2 of those in premiership years and others when the club was near the bottom, yet his form remained consistent, neither a downhill skier nor someone who gives up when things are tough.
A premiership player in his 2nd season and from there a consistent player - something we sorely lack!

Feel a lot of people are massively undervaluing Baker and looking for conspiracy theories on why we got him and Graham in.

 

[Patron]

How is Baker a middling player?

His b&f finishes:

2019: 13th
2020: 6th
2021: 2nd
2022: 4th
2023: 6th
2024: 5th

2 of those in premiership years and others when the club was near the bottom, yet his form remained consistent, neither a downhill skier nor someone who gives up when things are tough.
A premiership player in his 2nd season and from there a consistent player - something we sorely lack!

Feel a lot of people are massively undervaluing Baker and looking for conspiracy theories on why we got him and Graham in.

You think he's an elite player? 5th in the spoon winning team would indicate a pretty middling, maybe above average player. Graham and Owies are unquestionably middling players.

I would rank baker as about the 11th best player at WCE next year (assuming player fitness). We are not a good team either. Would you rate him different relative to the below?

1​	Gov
2​	Waterman
3​	Reid
4​	Yeo
5​	Allen
6​	Kelly
7​	Hough
8​	Duggan
9​	Ginbey
10​	Ryan
11​	Baker

 

[nameless]

You think he's an elite player? 5th in the spoon winning team would indicate a pretty middling, maybe above average player. Graham and Owies are unquestionably middling players.

I would rank baker as about the 11th best player at WCE next year (assuming player fitness). We are not a good team either. Would you rate him different relative to the below?

1​	Gov
2​	Waterman
3​	Reid
4​	Yeo
5​	Allen
6​	Kelly
7​	Hough
8​	Duggan
9​	Ginbey
10​	Ryan
11​	Baker

Yeah 5th in a spoon year, but you just conveniently leave out every other year? Haha

He also finished 6th in a premiership year.

From your list above Ryan, Allen, Yeo and Gov can't get through a whole season without serious injury, yes higher skilled players but on the park less and less. At least Baker's playing 20+ games and providing that experience on field.

I would rate Baker well above Ginbey currently, but hope that changes soon, Hough a little closer, but Baker has more runs on the board and is more flexible, again hopefully Hough elevates.

Duggan probably fits a similar profile to Baker I'd have them as reasonable comparable. Both good leaders, tough players who don't take a backwards step.

I feel your list just highlights even more the need to have a strong leader present each week given how unreliable a lot of senior players are now with injury.

 

[new breed]

Hell no. That means another couple of years from that spud clogging our list


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Gee that's harsh ....
The guy competes against the best ruckman in the country and has been pretty decent considering the opposition ruckman he is up against.

 

[Schtinker]

He'll probably snag a cotton on sponsorship and shoot ads with bailey smith.

Is "ads" a metaphor?