Past #1: Hamish McIntosh - drafted at pick 9 in '02 ND - traded to Geelong for #36 in '12 trade period

[Hard_to_Beat]

Rumour is they've offered H a 3 year contract. If true,thats a pretty serious commitment and a speculative pick around 40 shouldn't cut it.

They have to spread that $500K out some way.

 

[Mailman]

And you wonder why your club fails to get trade deals done...

Is manboob like a monoboob?

 

[TheKanga]

Geelong are trying to short change us. HMac could help them to a premiership next year.

 

[manboob]

Is manboob like a monoboob?

Almost

 

[Footy Karma]

Okay take McIntosh for pick 40 just don't post that sort of stuff..

 

[Ghostwriter]

If Hamish does end up at Geelong, how hard is it going to be watching him and Haley ruck against each other in a Grand Final?

 

[sarah.13]

In all seriousness, Geelong have no reason to not offer us pick 15 now. He passed their own medical. He will be their number one ruck for at least 2-3 years. He fulfills a direct hole in their list. He is contracted.

Explain to me again why it is that they apparently aren't offering pick 15?

Passed a medical test..really..He can't even run yet...lets see how he goes in a game then we'll know.

 

[giantroo]

Passed a medical test..really..He can't even run yet...lets see how he goes in a game then we'll know.

So you saw see him run without a PCL in the first 7 rounds and now with a PCL, he can't run.... Get rid of that PCL....

 

[sarah.13]

So you saw see him run without a PCL in the first 7 rounds and now with a PCL, he can't run.... Get rid of that PCL....

I do recall his manager saying on SEN that he would resume running by Christmas...
Is that not correct???

 

[giantroo]

I do recall his manager saying on SEN that he would resume running by Christmas...
Is that not correct???

Not sure what his manager said but maybe you missed my reference.

 

[Joshen]

We need to get Port involved...

We trade Hmac and a third rounder.
Geelong get HMac and a third round pick
Geelong do a trade with Port Adelaide.
We get Ben Jacobs.

HMac and a third rounder for Jacobs???? Would hope to do better than that.

 

[giantroo]

Just a reminder to Cats fans of what you are wanting:

Just one of H's game against Geelong this year: Our inform ruckman before he got injured.


Bonus also is that the thumbnail to the video is H kicking for goal...

 

[The Fact]

Could you guys look at doing a deal similar to the dogs and just trade him to clear cap space, by the sounds of it he might just leave next year

 

[Footy Smarts]

Just stepping back a bit, and looking at the Hamish trade...

Why does Hamish want to leave, and why are we looking at trading him. Well, the answer to both questions is that he is simply too good to be a second ruck.

But a key issue in understanding the value of this trade to us is considering how his position is replaced on our list. The fact is that we have no backup first ruck if Hamish goes. I think it's unfortunate that both Daw and Pedersen have been mentioned as relevant to replacing Hamish, but this is bigfooty, so what can you do? We have no one and would have to get someone. This person would be a worse option as a back up ruck than Hamish (the reason again that we are considering moving Hamish on is that he too good to be back up ruck).

So then, the value of trading Hamish can be seen by the surplice of what we get from Geelong for Hamish against what we pay for Hamish's replacement. This surplice would be compared to the downgrade in quality of our back-up ruck.

I know this is simple stuff, but I'm just trying to put it in simple terms why a 3rd round pick is simply absurd and a 2nd is unlikely to cut it. To understand why, lets consider the offer of a 3rd round pick (Geelong give us a 3rd round). Let's imagine we acquire a backup ruck for our 4th round pick (we give our 4th round for ???).

Well, the value to us is the upgrade of our 4th round pick to a (Geelong's) 3rd round pick. This value is miniscule, perhaps even zero, depending upon how many selections we intend to make in the draft. And yet any back-up ruck that we could acquire to replace Hamish with a 4th round pick would be a massive massive downgrade. So it simply cannot make sense.

I'm all for the club trying to find Hamish a way to get to a club where he can have the No. 1 role. But it simply won't make any sense if the compensation is anything like the rumoured offers. In my judgement, once the offer gets inside the value of a pick 20, it gets to the point where we can look for poorer quality replacements (that we might obtain for say our 2nd round pick), and still get some net value for downgrading Hamish. In other words, the benefit to us is the upgrading of pick 35 to (in the example) pick 20, and the cost to us is a poorer back up ruck, downgrading Hamish to whomever we could land with pick 35.

I seriously doubt you'll need to look for a replacement because you'll get a back-up ruckman as part of the deal. Unless Simpson or West leave Geelong there's no way Stephenson will still be on our list if we get McIntosh. He's the perfect back-up ruckman for you blokes. Dirt cheap, more than happy as back-up and can do a job if you need him to step up (see Geelong-Hawthorn near the end of the year).

If we can satisfy your replacement with Stephenson, the issue is then what is that downgrade worth? How much is the free salary cap space worth? Do you have a potential free agency or trade pick-up that relies on getting rid of his salary? If so then something as low as Stephenson + pick 55 could be acceptable since the compensation is more about freeing the cap space than about getting picks. If your cap is fine then that deal looks like complete garbage and you'd be looking more towards something around pick 30 + Stephenson as a minimum to consider a deal.

Honestly I don't see Geelong offering anything of particularly high value. Stephenson and maybe pick 36 (and I wouldn't be surprised if that wasn't even offered). You can have Gillies or Simpkin as well if you want... Basically Geelong's leverage is the ability to pay his wage easily within the cap and his expressed desire to go to Geelong. If you're not tight for cap space then it becomes a question of whether you want to keep McIntosh despite saying he wants to leave. It's a difficult situation and I've got no idea whether he'll end up staying or going. But if he goes I think there will be a lot of North supporters thinking they got bent over because there's simply no way Geelong will put anything on the table of real value.

 

[Hard_to_Beat]

I seriously doubt you'll need to look for a replacement because you'll get a back-up ruckman as part of the deal. Unless Simpson or West leave Geelong there's no way Stephenson will still be on our list if we get McIntosh. He's the perfect back-up ruckman for you blokes. Dirt cheap, more than happy as back-up and can do a job if you need him to step up (see Geelong-Hawthorn near the end of the year).

If we can satisfy your replacement with Stephenson, the issue is then what is that downgrade worth? How much is the free salary cap space worth? Do you have a potential free agency or trade pick-up that relies on getting rid of his salary? If so then something as low as Stephenson + pick 55 could be acceptable since the compensation is more about freeing the cap space than about getting picks. If your cap is fine then that deal looks like complete garbage and you'd be looking more towards something around pick 30 + Stephenson as a minimum to consider a deal.

Honestly I don't see Geelong offering anything of particularly high value. Stephenson and maybe pick 36 (and I wouldn't be surprised if that wasn't even offered). You can have Gillies or Simpkin as well if you want... Basically Geelong's leverage is the ability to pay his wage easily within the cap and his expressed desire to go to Geelong. If you're not tight for cap space then it becomes a question of whether you want to keep McIntosh despite saying he wants to leave. It's a difficult situation and I've got no idea whether he'll end up staying or going. But if he goes I think there will be a lot of North supporters thinking they got bent over because there's simply no way Geelong will put anything on the table of real value.

What the **** would we want Stephenson for?
What the **** would we want pick 55 for?
What the **** would we want pick 36 for?
What the **** would we want Gillies for?
What the **** would we want Simpkin for?
Why the **** would we want care about what suits Geelong?

Why don't you just put on a cheer leader outfit and be done with it?

You should change your username to "Footy Dumbs."

 

[mark73]

Almost

No Tony Mokbel photo's please

 

[mark73]

Could you guys look at doing a deal similar to the dogs and just trade him to clear cap space, by the sounds of it he might just leave next year

Blah Blah Essendon Blah

 

[The Fact]

Blah Blah Essendon Blah

Gee Wiz mate it was just a question i don't know what % you guys have used for your salary cap. It might mean you can front load a contract and land a player next year

 

[Hard_to_Beat]

Gee Wiz mate it was just a question i don't know what % you guys have used for your salary cap. It might mean you can front load a contract and land a player next year

We could afford Brendan Goddard if we wanted him.

No Hale & Urquart payments for 2013 = $600K for starters.

 

[The Fact]

We could afford Brendan Goddard if we wanted him.

No Hale & Urquart payments for 2013 = $600K for starters.

Thats pretty good then, imo with FA if you can really front load there contract your laughing thats all I didn't mean to push any buttons with the load a player comment either

 

[davo99]

a geelong posted on the drafts board that hamish to geelong for pick 36 and Gilles is a done deal... take that for whats it worth

 

[year of the roo]

a geelong posted on the drafts board that hamish to geelong for pick 36 and Gilles is a done deal... take that for whats it worth

Well why didn't you respond with "naaaaar its first rounder + Mitch Duncan done deal"?

For what its ****ing worth...

 

[Event Horizon]

Front loading contracts would be a good idea for us right now, but with no full time CEO, I am not sure if we have anyone proactive enough to set this up.

Given we don't need cap relief and he is contracted, I refuse to believe that we'll agree to a shit trade just to help Hamish fulfill his wishes. I'd be absolutely furious if that were to happen.

I'd ask for a good player in return, take it or leave it, assuming that a first rounder won't be available.

 

[roos_fanatic08]

**** off with gillies....the guy is a spud.

 

[Groucho]

**** off with gillies....the guy is a spud.

Yeah don't want Gillies but could live with 36 and someone else more suitable.