Draft Review 2003 - Redo the Draft

[Enforcer25]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

I accept your reason.

But you will never convince enforcer25

I'm willing to admit that its certainly possible, but far from a certainty.

I'd actually accept that it is correct on the condition that you concede many other teams have been guilty of exactly the same actions that you term tanking.

 

[yaco55]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

I'm willing to admit that its certainly possible, but far from a certainty.

I'd actually accept that it is correct on the condition that you concede many other teams have been guilty of exactly the same actions that you term tanking.

Sylvia was fined $5000 during the 2009 pre season for breaking team rules.

 

[Enforcer25]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

and..?

what is your point??

 

[jayceebee]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Yes-Syvia was fined for going out late and not making it at training on time. For the same fine Houlihan and Walker fight security at Crown and get fined the same. Also sone senior player at Carlton is handcuffed to a rookie for a sculling contest and does not get any fine. We are still waiting on how this was. Carlton and the AFL have gone so quiet on this matter it sounds like corruption is taking place

 

[Flashhh]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

I cant believe some Melbourne fans would only consider taking Cooney over Sylvia. it's a no brainer, the proven star versus the potential star.

Sylvia has 20+ touches 15 times in his career, Cooney has done it 21 matches in a row. You can talk about the 3 or 4 nassive games Sylvia has had all you want, the fact is Cooney is consistently better and has also had far more massive games

This.

Have read the thread and still don't get what we are rating the Sylvia, Cooney battle on. Their career? Best game? Their Future?

Anyway, Cooney is still ahead in all three. Sylvia played probably four standout games in 2009 and while he was solid for the rest of the year he wasn't a total standout.

It is laughable to rate players on 'their best'. I remember Brent Grgic tearing it up against Collingwood in '98, but I still view him as sh*thouse, I wouldnt take him over a Brownlow Medalist just because 'his best' his awesome.

Cooney every day of the week, Sylvia's lack of consistency and tendency to go missing in patches (Round 4 against the Tigers was seen as a good game by him when reallyonly his second qtr was great) means he isnt in the same league.

 

[Trav 20]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Also sone senior player at Carlton is handcuffed to a rookie for a sculling contest and does not get any fine.

They went rowing ?

 

[jayceebee]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Another major factor incomparing Cooney and Sylvia is games played,goals kicked,Sylvia has played 87 games for a 64 goal reward giving him an average of .736 goals per game whilst Cooney has played 135 games kicked 127 for an av. of .941 - not that significant when Sylvia has played many games as a half back flanker. Also Sylvia has only had one full pre season before this one.Therefore, in my opinion Sylvia has more upside.However, both are outstanding with Cooney got the Brownlow and scores on the board.

 

[yaco55]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

and..?

what is your point??

Another poster stated that Sylvia broke a team rule around the time that he was suspended for 3 weeks, and this was why he returned via Casey Scorpions.

I was trying to help find the team rule that Sylvia broke - I thought possibly that it could be related to his Pre-Season trangression.

I am none the wiser

 

[Enforcer25]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Another poster stated that Sylvia broke a team rule around the time that he was suspended for 3 weeks, and this was why he returned via Casey Scorpions.

I was trying to help find the team rule that Sylvia broke - I thought possibly that it could be related to his Pre-Season trangression.

I am none the wiser

You got that right.

Do you claim to know all of the team rules of Essendon and the related penalties for breaking each one?
I'd love to know.
Either way, I don't pretend to know all of Melbourne's team rules and which one he broke, and I'd be a fool to do so. Suffice to say, the club has said he did break a team rule and you are in no position to say otherwise.

Re: his penalty, it is reasonable to expect that the leadership group felt Sylvia had broken team rules previously and in the past the penalties incurred were either insufficient, or just of the type to not get through to him.
Missing games worked with Steve Johnson and has been used in many other cases - why not here?

Oh... that's right, it doesn't serve your tanking witch-hunt.
It seems only teams without something to gain by losing are given a free pass to experiment, favour development and hold team rules as sacrosanct.

Its quite possible that if Melb were in a position to make finals he would have played.
But they weren't.
Instead, a message was sent that adherence to team rules is a must and no matter how important you are to the team you will be punished. That is the attitude I'd want from my coach and players - what about you??

 

[Vader]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

There's no shortage of clubs which have banned players for a specified time, due to the player having broken club rules. It's by no means limited to Sylvia & Melbourne.

Collingwood booted Shaw & Didak last year.
Adelaide banned Hudson (and Vince & Pfeiffer) for one week, after he (they) were out after curfew - this decision played a large part in Hudson walking out on the Crows at the end of the year.
Carlton have banned several players already this pre-season, after their drunken antics got them into trouble.

It's probably fair to say that this wasn't Sylvia's first offence and people with poor track records are generally accorded less leniency. It's probably a bit harsh to link Sylvia's punishment with Melbourne's (alleged) tanking. Then again, he might have received more leniency if they were actually concerned about winning games of football - there's no shortage of precedents for superstars being forgiven (or receiving little more than a slap on the wrists) because his team needed him.

 

[Slattery_20]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

By no means am I standing up for yaco, but we've banned quite a few guys under Knights (at least). Lovett once or twice, McVeigh I think got a week once, and a couple of guys got banned from the 2s - Hislop a couple of times, maybe Jetta once.

Point being, most guys cop it and come back with a better attitude to team rules. Some guys don't, Hislop and Lovett being the obvious examples.

 

[Enforcer25]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Exactly - so again, what is yaco's point??

 

[Slattery_20]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Exactly - so again, what is yaco's point??

I've never known.

 

[yaco55]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Exactly - so again, what is yaco's point??

I will make it simple.

You and other Melbourne supporters have been pumping up the tyres of Sylvia ( with some justification ) and some have been deluded enough to say that he has shown more talent than Adam Cooney.

My point is that Sylvia was suspended for 3 weeks around Round 13 and 14 ( in a game in which he performed excellently ) and then resumed for Casey Scorpions which happened to be, when Melbourne played Richmond and at the time ( according to posters ) MFC was injury ravaged.

I consider that under those circumstances that Sylvia would be a lock in to resume in the seniors considering the aforementioned circumstances. I couldn't imagine Cooney resuming in the reserves after a suspension.

I then suggested that Sylvia broke a team rule - which no-one is the wiser.

And we may never no the answer.

 

[Enforcer25]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

I will make it simple.

You and other Melbourne supporters have been pumping up the tyres of Sylvia ( with some justification ) and some have been deluded enough to say that he has shown more talent than Adam Cooney.

My point is that Sylvia was suspended for 3 weeks around Round 13 and 14 ( in a game in which he performed excellently ) and then resumed for Casey Scorpions which happened to be, when Melbourne played Richmond and at the time ( according to posters ) MFC was injury ravaged.

I consider that under those circumstances that Sylvia would be a lock in to resume in the seniors considering the aforementioned circumstances. I couldn't imagine Cooney resuming in the reserves after a suspension.

I then suggested that Sylvia broke a team rule - which no-one is the wiser.

And we may never no the answer.

Considering the club said at the time that Sylvia was handed down an extra week holiday by the leadership group, I would say you are talking sh**

Also, I don't see anywhere where anyone has claimed Sylvia is BETTER than Cooney. Hasn't happened.

Seems that, once again, you hear what you want to hear for the purposes of your own agenda.

 

[cannons]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

On a side note, numerous reports are suggesting that Colin is training hard and with great intensity, as well as looking very good on the track.

Set for a big year, and hopefully one in which he will finally reach his potential.

 

[yaco55]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Considering the club said at the time that Sylvia was handed down an extra week holiday by the leadership group, I would say you are talking sh**

Also, I don't see anywhere where anyone has claimed Sylvia is BETTER than Cooney. Hasn't happened.

Seems that, once again, you hear what you want to hear for the purposes of your own agenda.

Two things

- It is clear that Sylvia resumed with Casey Scorpions after a 3 match suspension because the Leadership Group punished him for ill-discipline on the field - Fine.

- Read the whole thread again - There has been suggestions from Melbourne posters that Sylvia has displayed more talent than Cooney.

 

[yaco55]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

On a side note, numerous reports are suggesting that Colin is training hard and with great intensity, as well as looking very good on the track.

Set for a big year, and hopefully one in which he will finally reach his potential.

I am expecting a big year from Sylvia and he is a possibility to win Melbourne's B and F.

One word of caution - It appears that Sylvia realises how much hard work is needed to be a very good AFL player,, but he will have some poor games ( all players do ), and he needs to make sure that he can bounce back from poor games and continue to work hard.

 

[Enforcer25]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

I am expecting a big year from Sylvia and he is a possibility to win Melbourne's B and F.

One word of caution - It appears that Sylvia realises how much hard work is needed to be a very good AFL player,, but he will have some poor games ( all players do ), and he needs to make sure that he can bounce back from poor games and continue to work hard.

Once again, what is your point??

Your word of caution applies to all players. There is absolutely no need for it here.

Scrambling to make it look like you had point in the beginning, are we?

 

[BuntonRules]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Pick 18 Brisbane Lions. LLane Spaanderman. Anyone but LLane Spaanderman!!

Got Adcock at 33 - IMO worth a first rounder.
Got Drummond as a rookie. If not for injury another first rounder that now is finally putting it together.

Drafting is swings & roundabouts, & reading rabbit's entrails.

 

[ROYAL EAGLE]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Pick 18 Brisbane Lions. LLane Spaanderman. Anyone but LLane Spaanderman!!

Got Adcock at 33 - IMO worth a first rounder.
Got Drummond as a rookie. If not for injury another first rounder that now is finally putting it together.

Drafting is swings & roundabouts, & reading rabbit's entrails.

Spaanderman very talented player just a absolute head case, watching him play for the royals was alway wondering when he was going to lose it a snot someone again.

He loved being ill disciplined and getting reported.

 

[Dazb86]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

Also Sylvia has only had one full pre season before this one.Therefore, in my opinion Sylvia has more upside.However, both are outstanding with Cooney got the Brownlow and scores on the board.

You'd make a valid point about the pre seasons but facts are that Cooney has only had the one full pre season as well. Happened to be the year he won the brownlow.

 

[Barry_Badrinath]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

1. Cooney
2. Stanton
3. Rischitelli
4. Mundy
5. Walker
6. Fisher
7. Waters
8. Adcock
9. Tuck
10. Sylvia


Heath Shaw would come in at number 3 if he wasn't a F/S. I'd expect Stanton to take over at number 1 but pre injury Cooney still gets him the nod for now.

 

[yaco55]

Got Walker a bit high - Waters has played better footy.

Gee - It was a weak draft.

 

[tesseract]

Re: redo the 2003 draft now that we have seen them

WC scored well from the shite drafts of 2003 and 2004. 2 from each of these years make up a valuable part of WC's best 22 today.

2003: Waters & Butler
2004: Rosa & LeCras

With so many failures from this period, the results were very good for WC.