2012 Post Season - Retirements and delistings (list changes) thread

[albyplus]

Salts is ok trust me.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Another list reconciliation.

This year we had 39 on the main list and Kornes qualifies for the veterans list upgrade/elevation meaning we could have 40.

39 -8 (Chaplin, Pearce, Salopek Surjan, Rodan, Phillips, Banner, McCarthy) = 31

31 + Monfries + Homebush and Neade + Stevenson + Heath + 7 + 30 + 31 = 39

39 + Jonas elevation today new 2yr contract = 40 so our list is effectively finalised except for Jacobs unknown

Pfeiffer not elevated

We wont see contracted players delisted.
Salter, contracted to Oct 2013
Hitchcock re-signed today 1yr
Logan re-signed today 1 yr
Daniel Stewart re-signed today 1 yr
Brett Ebert re-signed today 1yr

5 contracts signed today
http://www.portadelaidefc.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/6038/newsid/150302/default.aspx
Jonas elevated today
http://www.portadelaidefc.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/6038/newsid/150301/default.aspx

We have picks 7, 30, 31 and depending on what happens with Jacobs, ie leaves then we have either pick 85 or 1 pick in the PSD.

Rookie list
Prieffer
Danny Butcher
+ 2 others
+ if we sign an international rookie
+ if we sign a Daniel Bass type 3 year unregistered player- we have no NSW scholarhip rookie.

 

[PJ Power]

I'm realistic about Port Adelaide's situation and not easily impressed because we brought in a couple of fringe players and a KPD with potential. It seems people are readily forgetting the last 9 years under Rohde because they're getting the change they've so desperately called for

I've mentioned that I'll be pleased in 3 year's time if 25% of these moves work out. Right now, it's just change

I agree that we need some caution in assessing the list changes. As a general principle, I like the way we've played moneyball through this process and not paid over the top for the "fringe" players we've brought in. We've addressed a clear deficient area of our list and freshened it up with players who although unknown, offer more hope and excitement than Slattery or Russell would have. The age profile of the guys coming in is terrific.

The downer in all of this, is that the players who have been nudged out the door are not the ones we should have let go. Surjan out, Logan stays - incredibly poor decision. The loss of Pearce also is particularly disappointing, although the extra compensation pick did enable us to bring in two exciting young players.

 

[Phhht]

The downer in all of this, is that the players who have been nudged out the door are not the ones we should have let go. Surjan out, Logan stays - incredibly poor decision. The loss of Pearce also is particularly disappointing, although the extra compensation pick did enable us to bring in two exciting young players.

Yeah I disagree.

Salopek....thx for the memories but time is well past due. Primus should have packed his bags in 2010 and we may have received something reasonable for him
Chaplin....I am happy not to invest a 4 year deal on the text book definition of "looks like Tarzan plays like Jane"
Pearce....if Pearce had not demanded a 4 year deal maybe worth keeping. But to be honest, as much as I 'want' the energetic, enthusiastic young Danyle, I reckon all we have seen is a mentally weak jaded outside player that has proven he needs motivation to produce a performance that should be his bread & butter.
Banner....unfortunately for Mitch, just didn't produce enough when he needed to most. Some promising performances as a resting small fwd at AFL level but showed little to no defensive pressure especially when in the mid rotation. His SANFL form hasn't screamed pick me either
Surjan...as much as I like his endeavor and character, over the last 3 years he hasn't produced what would be expected of a senior leader. Injury is more than likely a factor.
Webb.....promising but just doesn't get involved enough. Compare Webb to Stewart at SANFL level, worlds apart
Phillips...fast...that's it. Not Afl level.
Rodan...will miss his sidestep and run and carry. Well the 7 min worth he produces each game. Won't miss his lazy jog/walk chasing his man or getting to the next contest. Won't miss trying to find where he is when we are struggling.
Irons....not afl standard.

You don't think these guys shouldn't have been nudged out? My gripe would be that we didn't nudge more out, Logan, Thomas, Ebert should have joined them. If it wasn't for a contract Dom should be joining them, capt or not.

 

[BIG MATTY T]

Yeah I disagree.

Salopek....thx for the memories but time is well past due. Primus should have packed his bags in 2010 and we may have received something reasonable for him
Chaplin....I am happy not to invest a 4 year deal on the text book definition of "looks like Tarzan plays like Jane"
Pearce....if Pearce had not demanded a 4 year deal maybe worth keeping. But to be honest, as much as I 'want' the energetic, enthusiastic young Danyle, I reckon all we have seen is a mentally weak jaded outside player that has proven he needs motivation to produce a performance that should be his bread & butter.
Banner....unfortunately for Mitch, just didn't produce enough when he needed to most. Some promising performances as a resting small fwd at AFL level but showed little to no defensive pressure especially when in the mid rotation. His SANFL form hasn't screamed pick me either
Surjan...as much as I like his endeavor and character, over the last 3 years he hasn't produced what would be expected of a senior leader. Injury is more than likely a factor.
Webb.....promising but just doesn't get involved enough. Compare Webb to Stewart at SANFL level, worlds apart
Phillips...fast...that's it. Not Afl level.
Rodan...will miss his sidestep and run and carry. Well the 7 min worth he produces each game. Won't miss his lazy jog/walk chasing his man or getting to the next contest. Won't miss trying to find where he is when we are struggling.
Irons....not afl standard.

You don't think these guys shouldn't have been nudged out? My gripe would be that we didn't nudge more out, Logan, Thomas, Ebert should have joined them. If it wasn't for a contract Dom should be joining them, capt or not.

Spot on couldn't agree more

 

[FishingRick04]

Phht I do think Banner deserved a call up in the 2nd half of the year but obviously a line was put through his name.

 

[PatientMental]

Phht I do think Banner deserved a call up in the 2nd half of the year but obviously a line was put through his name.

Before or after the surgery on his knee.

 

[Phhht]

Phht I do think Banner deserved a call up in the 2nd half of the year but obviously a line was put through his name.

On the back of what Rick? Were his performances at SANFL level that good? Compare his performances to what the Cow youngsters had to show before they got a look in.

The fact that he deserved an AFL game over some of the spuds we had playing for us doesn't mean that he had attained a level that said....here I am, I am playing at an AFL level. I liked Mitch, wanted him to make it but after 3 or 4 mostly injury free years, he needed to have produced more.

 

[Oliver King]

Seems like the guys given 1 year deals are players who perform well in the SANFL and have good injury records (besides Hitchcock, whos probably given one last shot). They seem more likely to be depth players for the year, as a two year process of cutting the deadwood.

If thats the case, im happy with that. And would probably pick up Banner on the rookie list.

 

[Natman]

He was getting 30 touches and a couple of goals week in week out. We only had one player who performed well at SANFL level all year, it was Mitch Banner. Combine that with his finish to last year as clearly our best crumbing forward, and what happened to him this year is all the more baffling.

I'm sure that you realise that these games were SNAFL seconds.

The proof will be whether he gets picked up by another club.

He has about a 5% chance of that happening.
Is it fair to say that if he isn't good enough for 17 other clubs, that he isn't good enough for us?

 

[Schulzenfest]

I'm sure that you realise that these games were SNAFL seconds.

Not all of them. But that proves my point even more. The guy is dominating week in week out and he can't even get an SANFL seniors game?

People shouldn't use selection decisions as evidence of a player's ability, especially since both of the coaches who didn't give Banner the chances he deserved have now both been sacked.

Is it fair to say that if he isn't good enough for 17 other clubs, that he isn't good enough for us?

If we'd delisted him last year, he definitely would've been picked up somewhere. Now other clubs will probably be put off by the selection decisions of his idiot coaches.

 

[simba_]

maybe we will pick mitch up with one of the later picks..

 

[Phhht]

He was getting 30 touches and a couple of goals week in week out. We only had one player who performed well at SANFL level all year, it was Mitch Banner. Combine that with his finish to last year as clearly our best crumbing forward, and what happened to him this year is all the more baffling.

That's spin doctoring at it's best GP, Rucci would be proud. At SANFL he averaged 15 disp and 1.5 goals per game.

Mitch struggled at SANFL level to the point he was dropped to ressies level. Yeah sure, eventually he got to ave 30 dips a game at SANFL RESERVES level but that hardly screams pick me for AFL, I am worthy of playing with the big boys. He needed to perform consistently at SANFL league level. Compare him to someone like knights at SANFL level.

You might argue that Mitch was harshly dealt with by the lower level coaches but it has happened at 2 clubs, one of them our own maggies

People shouldn't use stats from SANFL reserves level as a guide to whether they should have been picked for AFL games.

It is a pity that he didn't back up his promising late season form from last year. Fact is however he couldn't. Time to move on unfortunately.

 

[tribey]

The proof will be whether he gets picked up by another club.

He has about a 5% chance of that happening.
Is it fair to say that if he isn't good enough for 17 other clubs, that he isn't good enough for us?

He won't get picked up because Port Adelaide has been developmental poison for 5 years and we've actively destroyed more promising careers than even Freo did at their lowest ebb.

There was nothing wrong with Banner, but we couldn't get him fit enough under Fernwood Falloon nor have any idea how to extract nor apply his ability. This is the same club that managed to take Kane Cornes from a starting point of elite midfielder to delistable spud without a single knee or achilles injury in sight.

I'm sure a vocal minority will sneer when he ends up playing for Casey or Peel next year though. SEE?! LOL NO ONE PACKED HEM UPP!!!!1111

 

[tribey]

It is a pity that he didn't back up his promising late season form from last year. Fact is however he couldn't. Time to move on unfortunately.

And yet Tom Logan and Brett Ebert get another year despite last showing 'promise' some time before our club was incinerated more than half a decade ago.

BOO-ANNER though.

 

[Macca19]

He was getting 30 touches and a couple of goals week in week out.

In the SANFL reserves. He picked up over 20 disposals once in his six SANFL senior games.

I liked Banner. I wanted to keep him. But, I dont think we are going to rue the decision to get rid of him. I'd love for us to rookie him though.

 

[robbo1981]

one thing about logan he has a real crack and is loved around the club , does have some bad moments but happy he got a contract.

 

[tribey]

one thing about logan he has a real crack and is loved around the club , does have some bad moments but happy he got a contract.

If having a crack and being a good club man was as valuable a commodity as people think it is we'd be a perennial contender and the Gowans twins would've been first round picks who played 300 games.

 

[robbo1981]

not saying he is a super star but i think he still has a spot at the minute , any way think stevenson is a good pick up up at the price

 

[Forzaport]

If having a crack and being a good club man was as valuable a commodity as people think it is we'd be a perennial contender and the Gowans twins would've been first round picks who played 300 games.

Certainly has currency for extending your AFL career tho.

 

[Phhht]

And yet Tom Logan and Brett Ebert get another year despite last showing 'promise' some time before our club was incinerated more than half a decade ago.

BOO-ANNER though.

Absolutely agree, Logan and Ebert should have been shown the door. Because they weren't doesn't mean We should have hung onto Mitch.

I like Mitch but facts are he didn't show much in his 3-4 years at the club. Our piss poor footy development has to take responsibility to a degree but ultimately Mitch is the one that couldn't get himself to a level at SANFL that demanded he get picked.

I mean how much 'development' is req'd to make a tackle? Even in his good form in the SANFL reserves where he averaged over 30, he made a whopping 11 tackles over 6 games....and 4 of them came in 1 game. He knew he needed to work on his defensive side, surely at that level he should be tackling opponents until his arms fell off but to average 1 or 2 tackles over an entire game? Says a lot IMO.

 

[Schulzenfest]

I like Mitch but facts are he didn't show much in his 3-4 years at the club. Our piss poor footy development has to take responsibility to a degree but ultimately Mitch is the one that couldn't get himself to a level at SANFL that demanded he get picked.

Yes he did. They just chose not to pick him anyway.

 

[Phhht]

What was he supposed to do? His first half of the year was a write off because of injury. His second half of the year he dominated pretty much every game he played. Sure, a lot of them were SANFL reserves games, but it's not his fault that selectors were ignoring his excellent form.

If we decided to put a line through Chad Wingard's name for no particular reason next year and Sturt started playing him in their reserves side even though he was getting 30+ touches and a couple of goals every week, that wouldn't mean Chad was failing to back up his form, it would mean that our coaches and their coaches are idiots. Same with Banner. He can't back up his form at SANFL/AFL level if he's not being given a chance to do so despite dominating at lower levels.

And when he came in to the SANFL senior side late in the year, he had 36 touches and 3 goals. Just sayin'.

His injury came after the start of the season. From memory it was about round 4. And what did he produce before injury? 16, 18, 13 dips games. And how many tackles? A whopping 1, 0, 2 tackles. FFS surely he knew he needed to do better than that.

Banner only 'dominated' the lower levels the last 4-5 rounds of the year. And even in those games, defensively he sucked. Got a heap of the ball but it's fairly obvious he was asked to work on his defensive actions. I would imagine the coaches were more interested in Mitch having a much better defensive action include tackles rather than racking up heaps of the ball against kids and scrubbers.

 

[Phhht]

Yes he did. They just chose not to pick him anyway.

No he didn't

 

[Phhht]

If five 30+ disposals and a goal or two games in a row isn't demanding to be picked, then what is?

See, here's the thing. You're writing off his games at SANFL reserves level because they were at SANFL reserves level, but that's a pointless exercise when he was denied from getting a shot at SANFL seniors level no matter what he did. When he finally did get that shot, he had 36 disposals and 3 goals in one game. And if their problem was with his tackling, then I'd love to know how Brett Ebert, Ben Jacobs and Darren Pfeiffer stayed in the side for most of the year despite averaging less than 2 per game (Banner averaged 2.4 tackles per game at AFL level last year, BTW).

Okay, you need to stop referring to his SANFL reserves performances as a performance that demands him to be picked at AFL level. His 30 plus games were all against kids and scrubbers and even against then he couldn't tackle or chase. After 5 games he got a call up. Sounds like he may have been trying to save his career, too little too late comes to mind.

He was given a shot at SANFL level early in the year. And he struggled badly. Not only defensively but even getting the ball. As a comparison Pfeiffer at SANFL level ave 20 dips, nearly 4 tackles a game and managed 1 goal per game ave. Even Ebert at SANFL level managed just as many touches, goals and a 2.6 tackle ave.

I hope Mitch gets picked up and makes a real go of it.

I'd love to debate further but we look to have taken this thread of topic. Maybe if these posts get moved.