List Mgmt. 2015 Draft Thread - Pre-Season & Rookie Draft Friday 11:00am AEDT

[Mr Magic]

I have a fair idea of who you will suggest instead of him.

We I am not sure who you are refering to but Chaplin on 400k is not worth it IMO. Take a pay cut or move on and will be superseded eventually. Maric is getting on. He might take a pay cut but it depends on how he is going. Lot of water to go under the bridge. We might not get Goldstein as its just a hypothetical. Hampson could also take a pay cut if on 300k also Astbury apparently on 300k or so.

The thing is getting the likes of Goldstein in helps Griffith's because they can pinch hit if need be like Griffith's to same with TV.

I think Conca someone said is on 300k plus. He is not worth that to any club ATM. So pay cut as well before think about trading. But if Conca is getting paid for services properly he should not be getting much anyway as he has hardly been on the park.

I do not think this is an exhaustive group of players either. I think someone was saying Yarran might be on 400k. Well 300k would be closer to the mark for me ATM on my valuations

 

[SumTingWong]

It's a "midfielders" draft next year and am not impressed with the mids that should be available at our picks. We have already traded for 2 inside mids this year. If we take another we must be convinced he can become an A grade or what's the point? None of those mids available to us look like A graders to me. It's either Ah Chee or Burton for me with our first pick. Both are risks but both have huge potential and are at least elite kicks and could become A graders. Take a mid next year, or trade for one.

 

[THE_GUN]

It's a "midfielders" draft next year and am not impressed with the mids that should be available at our picks. We have already traded for 2 inside mids this year. If we take another we must be convinced he can become an A grade or what's the point? None of those mids available to us look like A graders to me. It's either Ah Chee or Burton for me with our first pick. Both are risks but both have huge potential and are at least elite kicks and could become A graders. Take a mid next year, or trade for one.

Agree with STW on this.

Im a fan of Ah Chee because i believe his skill set is top class and will translate to AFL Level and can become more than just a 'small foward'

Burton i really dont know a great deal about and see him as a Jack Darling type but if his injuries are looking ok and has the ability to play midfield and can become a Dusty type then we should take him but if he is solely a Fwd then Ah Chee is my wish

 

[richoatthedisco]

Bishop got a sneaky feeling that Ryan Clarke could be in the frame for us at 15.

For those that don't know of him, he is a bigger bodied player(185cm 84kg) than Ah Chee, who looks to have both pace and endurance as well as an ability to win both inside and outside ball. Averaged 30 disposals 12 contested possessions 63.6%DE(acceptable for someone with high contested possessions) and 4.5 tackles per game at TAC level(12 games) also kicked 17 goals for the season. In the champs averaged 19 disposals 10.2 contested possessions 68.4% DE(again acceptable) and 3.2 tackles in 5 games.

With the new interchange cap coming in having midfielder types who can run all day and play multiple positions on the field will be important.

Clarke is not bigger-bodied, he's skinny.

When you're winning 1/3 to 1/2 your possessions in a contested situation you can accept a bit of hit and miss. No worse than what Cotchin produces most weeks efficiency wise. Starting to think that an inside/outside threat with elite endurance might be more valuable to us than someone like Ah Chee at 15.

Cotchin plays in the AFL and is the subject of every oppposition's main defensive attention. Clarke plays against kids who don't tag. Perspective.

Reckon the doggies will be all over Weidman...

Bad luck for them their first pick is 20, by when he'll be long gone.

 

[JAKLAUGHING]

We'll see then..

 

[bigstyletiger]

Clarke's kicking is apparently not great. Will be happy to let him go through. Brandon and mcintosh fill his role in the team so no need.

Sounds like the three we are considering are oliver, ah chee and burton. Id be happy with any of the three. Pretty sure Oliver will be gone so not getting my hopes up. Thinking we are going to take Ah Chee and id be really happu with this. 12 is the perfect spot to get a classy player who still needs to develop. He wont be under pressure to play straight up for us but when he does he will be a massive upgrade on some of the guys that have been hacking it up as small forwards. Pretty confident he will be able to pinch hit on the wing in time. Bring in ah chee, yarran and menadue and we have some guys who can make us quick.

Considering we chased motlop hard club obviusly feels the need for some pace and skill on the half forward line. Will help to decrease the dangerous reliance on deledio

 

[ohhhBigMalcho]

If Oliver is not available I would be ecstatic if we selected Burton. His highlights in the SANFL are really good. Of course this would be subject to medical advice. Reminds me a bit of Jack the way he plays.

dare i say it there is a bit of Nat Fyfe in him, the big body, aerial ability, maybe not the contested ball winner of Fyfe but he could develop into something similar, pretty much what the modern day footballer is all about

 

[THE_GUN]

Clarke's kicking is apparently not great. Will be happy to let him go through. Brandon and mcintosh fill his role in the team so no need.

Sounds like the three we are considering are oliver, ah chee and burton. Id be happy with any of the three. Pretty sure Oliver will be gone so not getting my hopes up. Thinking we are going to take Ah Chee and id be really happu with this. 12 is the perfect spot to get a classy player who still needs to develop. He wont be under pressure to play straight up for us but when he does he will be a massive upgrade on some of the guys that have been hacking it up as small forwards. Pretty confident he will be able to pinch hit on the wing in time. Bring in ah chee, yarran and menadue and we have some guys who can make us quick.

Considering we chased motlop hard club obviusly feels the need for some pace and skill on the half forward line. Will help to decrease the dangerous reliance on deledio

Thats a very very good point, We were going hard for both Motlop & Bennell even with Yarran already stitched up so the style/Type of player is certainly in our sights and must be a good chance.

Emma Quayle has Ah Chee rated at #14 with 4 Academy kids ahead of him so roughly #10 and she is usually pretty well informed. I wouldnt be suprised if she has Callum Ah Chee at #16 to Richmond in her Phantom Draft next week

Its starting to look like Ah Chee / Burton for the Tigers this year

 

[Charlie Pannam]

It's a "midfielders" draft next year and am not impressed with the mids that should be available at our picks. We have already traded for 2 inside mids this year. If we take another we must be convinced he can become an A grade or what's the point? None of those mids available to us look like A graders to me. It's either Ah Chee or Burton for me with our first pick. Both are risks but both have huge potential and are at least elite kicks and could become A graders. Take a mid next year, or trade for one.

Like both these kids.
I assume Ah Chee just had a bad day at the draft combine. His pace is one of his main assets but didn't show it in the testing. Still everyone can have an off day or maybe he was carrying an injury. Doesn't seem to have devalued him.
Its easy to get carried away with these kids but with Burton I just keep thinking Jake Stringer. Think he'd fit in well beside Jack and Tyrone.

 

[_RT_]

Clarke is not bigger-bodied, he's skinny.

An inch taller and 12 kg heavier is bigger than Ah Chee.

Cotchin plays in the AFL and is the subject of every oppposition's main defensive attention. Clarke plays against kids who don't tag. Perspective.

Nothing to do with being tagged, it has to do with how you win your disposals and when you win 1/3 to 1/2 your possessions in a contested situation your DE% isn't going to be great no matter who you are. Clarkes highlights video (granted they are highlights) shows a player who is still capable of hitting targets while winning contested possessions, they also show a player capable of using the ball effectively when out in space. As it is I'm not suggesting we'll get him with our pick, more that I reckon he might be one that is being considered depending on who is available.

 

[Tango67]

185cm 84kg for an 18Yo midfielder is not skinny?

 

[richoatthedisco]

An inch taller and 12 kg heavier is bigger than Ah Chee.

You believe what you read too much. He's skinny, have a look at him.

Nothing to do with being tagged, it has to do with how you win your disposals and when you win 1/3 to 1/2 your possessions in a contested situation your DE% isn't going to be great no matter who you are. Clarkes highlights video (granted they are highlights) shows a player who is still capable of hitting targets while winning contested possessions, they also show a player capable of using the ball effectively when out in space.

Nothing to do with being tagged? What a ridiculous statement. Not all contested possessions are created equal. A typical Cotchin contested possession is a hard ball get at a clearance, with at least one opponent doing nothing but trying to stop him, and every other opponent in the vicinity drilled to jump on him as soon as he does. Clarke is a link man, and his contested possessions are more of the loose ball get variety, in a comp with little defensive accountability from his opponents.

Absurd comparison.

 

[Tango67]

You believe what you read too much. He's skinny, have a look at him.


Nothing to do with being tagged? What a ridiculous statement. Not all contested possessions are created equal. A typical Cotchin contested possession is a hard ball get at a clearance, with at least one opponent doing nothing but trying to stop him, and every other opponent in the vicinity drilled to jump on him as soon as he does. Clarke is a link man, and his contested possessions are more of the loose ball get variety, in a comp with little defensive accountability from his opponents.

Absurd comparison.

How is a loose ball get a contested possesion

 

[richoatthedisco]

How is a loose ball get a contested possesion

Ask Champion Data. I assume it's because when the ball is bouncing free on the ground, it's considered 'in dispute'.

 

[Tango67]

Medium midfielder who has a thirst for the contest. A prolific ball-winner with elite endurance. Thrives with his contested ball winning ability and can find it out in space because of a terrific work rate. Impressive for Vic Metro and outstanding for Eastern Ranges this year.

Doesn't sound like a skinny outside mid relying on loose ball gets to me?
But this write up was on the draft profile so what would they know?.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Our List is at the stage where we can take abit of a gamble on either Ah Chee or Burton.

 

[Tango67]

Oliver, Dunkley, Hibberd all considered big bodied mids and all taller than Clarke yet only 1 kg heavier?
Fair to say the myth is busted he is a big bodied mid.

 

[Bishop]

Bishop got a sneaky feeling that Ryan Clarke could be in the frame for us at 15.

For those that don't know of him, he is a bigger bodied player(185cm 84kg) than Ah Chee, who looks to have both pace and endurance as well as an ability to win both inside and outside ball. Averaged 30 disposals 12 contested possessions 63.6%DE(acceptable for someone with high contested possessions) and 4.5 tackles per game at TAC level(12 games) also kicked 17 goals for the season. In the champs averaged 19 disposals 10.2 contested possessions 68.4% DE(again acceptable) and 3.2 tackles in 5 games.

With the new interchange cap coming in having midfielder types who can run all day and play multiple positions on the field will be important.

Is definitely being considered I'm sure. However I think you've contradicted yourself- He isn't a big bodied player as an inside midfield- considering 18 out of his 30 disposals (on average) are UN-Contested. For a bloke that kicks at 52% despite being a midfielder that's not great. I can understand someone like Dunkley who has more than 1/2 of his disposals being contested kicking at 50-60%.

52% for a bloke who isn't an inside mid, but can play on the outside & as a link player- Kicking efficiency of 52% isn't good enough.

You believe what you read too much. He's skinny, have a look at him.


Nothing to do with being tagged? What a ridiculous statement. Not all contested possessions are created equal. A typical Cotchin contested possession is a hard ball get at a clearance, with at least one opponent doing nothing but trying to stop him, and every other opponent in the vicinity drilled to jump on him as soon as he does. Clarke is a link man, and his contested possessions are more of the loose ball get variety, in a comp with little defensive accountability from his opponents.

Absurd comparison.

Continuing from the above- For example Ryan Clarke had 42 disposals against Bendigo (23 kicks, 19 handballs)
29 uncontested, 14 contested.

Champion Data defines a contested possession as a statistic that is "credited to a player who wins the ball from a disputed situation". A player's contested possession tally is the sum of his hard-ball gets, loose-ball gets, contested marks, free kicks for, gathers from hitouts & contested knock-ones.

 

[_RT_]

Is definitely being considered I'm sure. However I think you've contradicted yourself- He isn't a big bodied player as an inside midfield- considering 18 out of his 30 disposals (on average) are UN-Contested. For a bloke that kicks at 52% despite being a midfielder that's not great. I can understand someone like Dunkley who has more than 1/2 of his disposals being contested kicking at 50-60%.

52% for a bloke who isn't an inside mid, but can play on the outside & as a link player- Kicking efficiency of 52% isn't good enough.


Continuing from the above- For example Ryan Clarke had 42 disposals against Bendigo (23 kicks, 19 handballs)
29 uncontested, 14 contested.

Champion Data defines a contested possession as a statistic that is "credited to a player who wins the ball from a disputed situation". A player's contested possession tally is the sum of his hard-ball gets, loose-ball gets, contested marks, free kicks for, gathers from hitouts & contested knock-ones.

When I posted the suggestion this morning I hadn't had an in depth look at him, just reading through some more profiles about potential pick ups and he struck me as a very Richmond like pick up. Further reading this evening showed that his kicking isn't that good and without the ability to see how many clearances he averages a game it's hard to get a full picture on how he collects his contested possessions. Watching the 3-4min video highlight he does win quite a few of those contested possessions in packs and from stoppages and there are a few nice finishes on goal from those situations. Size wise he isn't that much different to the likes of Cotchin Thomas Dea Vlastuin Gordon Conca & Knights. In an AFL environment he could easily become a solidly built midfielder.

 

[_RT_]

You believe what you read too much. He's skinny, have a look at him.

I have looked at him, compared to Ah Chee who my comparison was initially about he is a bigger bodied player.

Nothing to do with being tagged? What a ridiculous statement. Not all contested possessions are created equal. A typical Cotchin contested possession is a hard ball get at a clearance, with at least one opponent doing nothing but trying to stop him, and every other opponent in the vicinity drilled to jump on him as soon as he does. Clarke is a link man, and his contested possessions are more of the loose ball get variety, in a comp with little defensive accountability from his opponents.

Absurd comparison.

Unless you're suggesting that every Cotchin possessions is as described above then it's a valid comparison. Cotchin averaged 12 contested possessions but only 5 were clearances. That means 7 contested possessions collected as Bishop describes above, yet he ran at 63% DE. In fact for the last 5 seasons the numbers are very similar between 9-12 contested possessions a game, 5-6 clearances a game yet averaged no better than 65%DE. We hail him as a great, yet dare suggest that a kid coming through the system shares similar traits and it's almost blasphemous.

For the record I never suggested that Clarke was a Cotchin clone or can be anything like Cotchin, just used Cotchins stats to show that just because a player has a low DE it doesn't mean that they are poor players.

 

[Bishop]

When I posted the suggestion this morning I hadn't had an in depth look at him, just reading through some more profiles about potential pick ups and he struck me as a very Richmond like pick up. Further reading this evening showed that his kicking isn't that good and without the ability to see how many clearances he averages a game it's hard to get a full picture on how he collects his contested possessions. Watching the 3-4min video highlight he does win quite a few of those contested possessions in packs and from stoppages and there are a few nice finishes on goal from those situations. Size wise he isn't that much different to the likes of Cotchin Thomas Dea Vlastuin Gordon Conca & Knights. In an AFL environment he could easily become a solidly built midfielder.

Always hard to gauge from watching highlights- usually they're 3-4 minutes of every player not missing a kick or handpass and kicking goals!

 

[UpTheGuts]

Like the look of Nash Holmes, who Bishop just selected for the Cats in the phantom draft.

Busy, earnest mid. Kicks seem to go a long way. 10.16 3km at combine.

Quayle:

Medium midfielder

AFL biography: Hard working medium midfielder whose contested ball winning ability as well as his tackling pressure are features of his game. Very smart around goals, generally being first to move using his footy smarts. Averaged 16 possessions and 3.8 inside 50s in six matches at the NAB AFL Under-18 Championships.

"With Nash, what you see is what you get. He's a really honest kid and a really honest player. If you ask him what his best attribute is he'll say hard work and that's exactly right."

Peter Francis, Gippsland Power talent manager

"He's really competitive, you never have to worry about that side of things with Nash. His contested ball stuff is really good and he's fit. He can keep running."

Leigh Brown, Gippsland Power coach

Will watch for his name on draft night

 

[Calcium Man]

not really sure whats going on here but Luke Williams has some uploded videos on vimeo that anyone can access

https://vimeo.com/user36560007/videos

 

[Toadvine]

not really sure whats going on here but Luke Williams has some uploded videos on vimeo that anyone can access

https://vimeo.com/user36560007/videos

RFC_Official

 

[nugget_12]

not really sure whats going on here but Luke Williams has some uploded videos on vimeo that anyone can access

https://vimeo.com/user36560007/videos

Pardon the ignorance but who is luke Williams and why does he matter?
Part of RFC official media team or something?