Analysis 2021 draft thread

[pulpdriver]

Conole mentioned trading up where possible but also seemed pretty happy with how our picks were, and unless it’s a top 10 pick I doubt we’d trade two first rounders. It looks like there could be a few melts if we pick up JVR with either of those first round picks and he’s someone who I’ve started coming around to. Whilst we’re not screaming out for a KPP, but he shows great versatility and aggression which is very refreshing and feel like he would’ve been a top 10 lock had the season gone on longer.

Ideally, we grab a tall mid like Knivett/Owens as I feel like they would make a great addition to our team long term. I’d be pretty happy with Sinn as a Richy replacement

I like him and would be happy if we picked him up. Like you said he has versatility, great aggression and he's also solid at ground level and has a knack for bringing others into the play. Plus it's not like we'd need him to be our number one forward if he take him with that intention. Projects as a solid number 2 forward in a few years beside Hippy or maybe the Dizzy replacement if we see him as a defender. There's a few prospects projected to be available at our first range that I would prefer but it seems like if he's there at our first pick and we don't take him he won't be available at our next pick. Could end up being a case of taking a development forward we like and being confident we'll have a player we rate and fits needs available at our next selection.

 

[mattsmob]

I like him and would be happy if we picked him up. Like you said he has versatility, great aggression and he's also solid at ground level and has a knack for bringing others into the play. Plus it's not like we'd need him to be our number one forward if he take him with that intention. Projects as a solid number 2 forward in a few years beside Hippy or maybe the Dizzy replacement if we see him as a defender. There's a few prospects projected to be available at our first range that I would prefer but it seems like if he's there at our first pick and we don't take him he won't be available at our next pick. Could end up being a case of taking a development forward we like and being confident we'll have a player we rate and fits needs available at our next selection.

With JVR do you expect him to get to about a McStay level as a forward? I don't think he has the size or athleticism that Dan has and even he had his struggles as a number 2 forward albeit he's a much improved player now. Also in defence he doesn't have the versatility of someone you'd want from a 3rd tall, probably can't go with smaller players and is too small for the monster key forwards/rucks, I'd also have some serious concerns with his field kicking if he's playing in the backline, looks a solid set shot but I've seen him nearly kick off his shin multiple times when having to kicking under pressure or on the run. Not saying he won't be a solid player but I wouldn't take him with 14 and would consider it a reach with 18.

 

[pulpdriver]

With JVR do you expect him to get to about a McStay level as a forward? I don't think he has the size or athleticism that Dan has and even he had his struggles as a number 2 forward albeit he's a much improved player now. Also in defence he doesn't have the versatility of someone you'd want from a 3rd tall, probably can't go with smaller players and is too small for the monster key forwards/rucks, I'd also have some serious concerns with his field kicking if he's playing in the backline, looks a solid set shot but I've seen him nearly kick off his shin multiple times when having to kicking under pressure or on the run. Not saying he won't be a solid player but I wouldn't take him with 14 and would consider it a reach with 18.

That would be nice if he reaches a McStay level. Size is hard to say at this point. His height isn't too much off McStay and he could easily become as physically developed. He certainly doesn't seem as athletic as McStay but it's not like he's slow or lacking athleticism. Maybe a taller Tim Membrey? Were the struggles as a 2nd when he was battling the return from glandular fever? I feel like that has to be taken into account this year and may have impeded his progression and would explain why he was so much more impressive in the games towards the end of the year.

I'm not sure if we could say he doesn't have the versatility to play on smaller types at this point. Most tall defenders don't play on smaller players in their u18 and younger games. He has traits that I could see translate to the role but absolutely no idea. Not worried about his kicking.

He may be a reach at those picks, I really don't know, although as I said there are some players projected to be available at our first that I'd take ahead of him, but I'll still be happy if we do end up taking him at either pick. It doesn't seem like he'll be available at our second pick but I guess it really is way too early to say at this point.

 

[mattsmob]

That would be nice if he reaches a McStay level. Size is hard to say at this point. His height isn't too much off McStay and he could easily become as physically developed. He certainly doesn't seem as athletic as McStay but it's not like he's slow or lacking athleticism. Maybe a taller Tim Membrey? Were the struggles as a 2nd when he was battling the return from glandular fever? I feel like that has to be taken into account this year and may have impeded his progression and would explain why he was so much more impressive in the games towards the end of the year.

I'm not sure if we could say he doesn't have the versatility to play on smaller types at this point. Most tall defenders don't play on smaller players in their u18 and younger games. He has traits that I could see translate to the role but absolutely no idea. Not worried about his kicking.

He may be a reach at those picks, I really don't know, although as I said there are some players projected to be available at our first that I'd take ahead of him, but I'll still be happy if we do end up taking him at either pick. It doesn't seem like he'll be available at our second pick but I guess it really is way too early to say at this point.

His athleticism is a hard one to gauge, the way he moves doesn't look fluid at all and just looks like he's putting in so much effort all the time, it's hard to tell how it'll translate against better athletes at the next level. I think there's quite a large group of players in 'tier' 3 from about 15 to 25 or so and he's in that for me but probably towards the backend of it.

 

[pulpdriver]

His athleticism is a hard one to gauge, the way he moves doesn't look fluid at all and just looks like he's putting in so much effort all the time, it's hard to tell how it'll translate against better athletes at the next level. I think there's quite a large group of players in 'tier' 3 from about 15 to 25 or so and he's in that for me but probably towards the backend of it.

Looks fine to me and I think his testing was okay.

eDPS do you have JVR's combine results?

 

[eDPS]

Looks fine to me and I think his testing was okay.

eDPS do you have JVR's combine results?

No I do not, but didn’t get top 10 in anything

 

[pulpdriver]

No I do not, but didn’t get top 10 in anything

Thanks mate. Do you personally have any concerns that his athleticism could hold him back at the next level?

 

[eDPS]

Thanks mate. Do you personally have any concerns that his athleticism could hold him back at the next level?

At 193cm athleticism is pretty important to play as a proper KPP, I wouldn’t take him with a pick in the top 15 but a safe pick in the 2nd round for me. I think he becomes a key defender/3rd tall long term

 

[mattsmob]

At 193cm athleticism is pretty important to play as a proper KPP, I wouldn’t take him with a pick in the top 15 but a safe pick in the 2nd round for me. I think he becomes a key defender/3rd tall long term

Yeah my worry is that he moves more like a genuine key forward without the size to match it and as a 3rd tall in defence he doesn't have the versatility or offensive game I'd like in a 3rd tall intercept/rebounder, can obviously intercept but I don't trust his ball use to rebound.

 

[briztoon]

Have come around on the idea of Sinn at our first pick. Any two of Johnson/Sinn/Goater/ Draper/Brown/Wilmot would be good.

Whilst highly unlikely, if Johnson, Goater and Sinn are available at 14(16) who do you reckon we would take? Hard to split. Johnson probably the safest. Other two have bigger upside.

Conole and Daly have repeatedly mentioned outside run for the midfield and off the back half.

That would put Sinn and Chesser at the top of the list. Goater next.

Going by what the club has said, Johnson is unlikely at our first pick.

Conole mentioned trading up where possible but also seemed pretty happy with how our picks were, and unless it’s a top 10 pick I doubt we’d trade two first rounders. It looks like there could be a few melts if we pick up JVR with either of those first round picks and he’s someone who I’ve started coming around to. Whilst we’re not screaming out for a KPP, but he shows great versatility and aggression which is very refreshing and feel like he would’ve been a top 10 lock had the season gone on longer.

Ideally, we grab a tall mid like Knivett/Owens as I feel like they would make a great addition to our team long term. I’d be pretty happy with Sinn as a Richy replacement

Just to clarify, Conole did not mention possibly trading up. He was asked would the Lions consider it, and gave the same answer every other club recruiter has to the same question.

One thing with the RttD recruiter interviews, they all really try not to give anything away where possible, while Twomey is looking for answers that allow him to write a puff piece on that club, that week for afl.com.

 

[briztoon]

At 193cm athleticism is pretty important to play as a proper KPP, I wouldn’t take him with a pick in the top 15 but a safe pick in the 2nd round for me. I think he becomes a key defender/3rd tall long term

Simple question, who do you believe has the higher scope as a defender, JVR or Bazzo?

 

[eDPS]

Simple question, who do you believe has the higher scope as a defender, JVR or Bazzo?

That’s a tough one, JVR but not by much at all.

 

[jackess]

Wonder if we'd consider drafting Joyce or Ballenden with our third pick (possibly after trading it back first and picking up points for next year)

 

[Section 5]

Wonder if we'd consider drafting Joyce or Ballenden with our third pick (possibly after trading it back first and picking up points for next year)

I think if the Club was considering getting either back they usually mention it at time of delisting.

 

[Quigley]

Conole and Daly have repeatedly mentioned outside run for the midfield and off the back half.

That would put Sinn and Chesser at the top of the list. Goater next.

Going by what the club has said, Johnson is unlikely at our first pick.


Just to clarify, Conole did not mention possibly trading up. He was asked would the Lions consider it, and gave the same answer every other club recruiter has to the same question.

One thing with the RttD recruiter interviews, they all really try not to give anything away where possible, while Twomey is looking for answers that allow him to write a puff piece on that club, that week for afl.com.

Johnson has played quite a bit outside and has looked good doing so. His skill level is up there with Sinn and ahead of Chesser (miles better than Goater by foot). He also has nice height which adds to his versatility defensively. Although he does not have experience at the back there is no reason why he could not make the move early in his career. That is a well worn path for skilled junior mids coming into the AFL.

On the tall defensive options I would not be shocked if we were considering Alleer at 20. He is a couple of years older and had a great finish to the year in the SANFL as an intercept marker. 196cm who broke the running jump record from memory. Given their needs I struggle to see him falling past Geelong in the early second round so it would not be a big stretch for us to grab him.

If we took a tall with one of our first two picks the two guys I really like at 41 are either Banks who has had a few injury issues this year on top of being from Tasmania which have served to keep him under the radar and Ronald Fejo from the NT who has shown some nice development in the SANFL this year. Banks is a hard nut running defender who has nice skills whilst Fejo is more of an outside in mid who also has good skills. Both would be excellent value in my opinion. If we go with small / mediums with out first two picks I would like us to take a tall here even if it is an experienced player.

 

[Dalions]

JVR kind of reminds me a little of Toby Wooller.

 

[jackess]

I think if the Club was considering getting either back they usually mention it at time of delisting.

So you think because they didn't publicly mention it 2 months before the draft that it isn't a possibility?

 

[Section 5]

So you think because they didn't publicly mention it 2 months before the draft that it isn't a possibility?

Anything is a possibility

 

[jackess]

I don't see a need for a key back. Especially with a top pick. Andrews, Gardiner and Payne are set for 5+ years and they're not hard to find at short notice.

 

[briztoon]

Johnson has played quite a bit outside and has looked good doing so. His skill level is up there with Sinn and ahead of Chesser (miles better than Goater by foot). He also has nice height which adds to his versatility defensively. Although he does not have experience at the back there is no reason why he could not make the move early in his career. That is a well worn path for skilled junior mids coming into the AFL.

On the tall defensive options I would not be shocked if we were considering Alleer at 20. He is a couple of years older and had a great finish to the year in the SANFL as an intercept marker. 196cm who broke the running jump record from memory. Given their needs I struggle to see him falling past Geelong in the early second round so it would not be a big stretch for us to grab him.

If we took a tall with one of our first two picks the two guys I really like at 41 are either Banks who has had a few injury issues this year on top of being from Tasmania which have served to keep him under the radar and Ronald Fejo from the NT who has shown some nice development in the SANFL this year. Banks is a hard nut running defender who has nice skills whilst Fejo is more of an outside in mid who also has good skills. Both would be excellent value in my opinion. If we go with small / mediums with out first two picks I would like us to take a tall here even if it is an experienced player.

So you would be considering Johnson at our first, and someone like Chesser or Wilmot at our second, or Banks or Fejo at our third, in such a scenario?

I guess the question should be asked, at 193cm would there be the scope for Johnson to play as a third tall defender?

 

[twhowler]

I am reminded by the folly of relying on highlight clips (i am guilty of this - not accusing the draft watchers) after stumbling upon Tom Joyce's highlight clips from his draft year. Looks a gun I reckon. One touch. Good skills. Decent pace even. Looks like a quality midfielder. Never even got to play 1 game!

Be interested to see if either of our first two picks are likely to play first year. Given 2 first rounders, albeit late, hope at least 1 plays a chunk of games. We haven't had a player burst onto the scene for a long time! Rayner probably the last one who showed signs straight away.

 

[pulpdriver]

How much would we need to give up to get the Saint's pick?
Getting NWM and Chesser would be fantastic.

 

[Quigley]

So you would be considering Johnson at our first, and someone like Chesser or Wilmot at our second, or Banks or Fejo at our third, in such a scenario?

I guess the question should be asked, at 193cm would there be the scope for Johnson to play as a third tall defender?

Yep I would love Johnson at our first. For me either he or Sinn would be my favourite options from the potentially available group.

Chesser or Wilmott would be very nice options at 20 and I would be really happy to have either. If we went Sinn and Sonsie is there at 20 I actually wouldn't mind him. He is not so much a needs pick but I think he could be great value if he was there. Knevitt is an interesting option at 20 as well. Very big bust potential imo given his poor skills but everything else about his package I like and if he could tidy up his skills he has big upside.

 

[pulpdriver]

Yep I would love Johnson at our first. For me either he or Sinn would be my favourite options from the potentially available group.

Chesser or Wilmott would be very nice options at 20 and I would be really happy to have either. If we went Sinn and Sonsie is there at 20 I actually wouldn't mind him. He is not so much a needs pick but I think he could be great value if he was there. Knevitt is an interesting option at 20 as well. Very big bust potential imo given his poor skills but everything else about his package I like and if he could tidy up his skills he has big upside.

Are Knevitt's skills really that poor? I reckon if we had a proper Vic year for the u18s he would be rated a lot higher. Kid is a ****ing monster and does a lot right.

 

[jackess]

In Knevitts highlights it only really showed decent marking. Could he be a better KPF/3rd tall prospect than JVR? Maybe similar to Darling?