Analysis 2023 All Australian Team Awards Night

[JyeDye]

OK. If you think it is all metrics then thete is no point debating with you.

Ok, I'll stop being a knob. Why do you think Stewart should have been in the team over Sicily? And you can't use any team success as a reason, as it's largely irrelevant.

 

[Roby]

OK. If you think it is all metrics then thete is no point debating with you.

Ok, I'll stop being a knob. Why do you think Stewart should have been in the team over Sicily? And you can't use any team success as a reason, as it's largely irrelevant.

It's the vibe... The AA selections are a joke

 

[The 747]

Ok, I'll stop being a knob. Why do you think Stewart should have been in the team over Sicily? And you can't use any team success as a reason, as it's largely irrelevant.

Thank you, Sorry I don't agree team success is irrelevant. One player is the best player in a team that wins 16 and a row and the flag. That would suggest that this player played well to me. That is very different from being a standout player in a bottom 8 team.

I don't know why Stewart was picked and Sicily wasn't but if I had the choice I would pick them both in the team. If Stewart played for the Hawks do you think he would play VFL while Sicily is in the team?

What this is, and has always been, is just another thing for bitter tinfoil hat Hawks supporters to complain about for years. Because Geelong and the illumunati etc etc. And still nearly a year later they can't let it go.

 

[Shadow89]

Ok, I'll stop being a knob. Why do you think Stewart should have been in the team over Sicily? And you can't use any team success as a reason, as it's largely irrelevant.

Sicily is doing this year, what Stewart was doing last year. Leading a largely inexperienced backline (SDK and Zuthrie were definitely not Best 22 at the start of the year), and having one of the best defences in the comp - on the back of his leadership down there. He had multiple games of 40 disposals, and was an absolute beast at times.

Sicily is the same, if not better this year. When he plays, Hawthorn are a completely different team, and they have the structure and leadership to take down the Premiership favourite - with ease.

It's hard to deny him this year, whereas last year that was at least some semblance of doubt. If Stewart gets in and Sicily doesn't, I'll be incredibly surprised. If Sicily gets in and Stewart doesn't, I won't be that surprised at all. Both have had great years, but Moore and Sicily are the only two 'guarantees' for mine at this point. There's 10-15 others that could make up the other 4-5, but those two are as close to 'locks' as you can get, for mine.

 

[Lingsface]

I said I would leave it and I'm not because I missed this post (and I can't resist given the alternative is reviewing contracts - yuck!).

The bit highlighted above is part of the problem. Tom Stewart "actually defends". Umm, Sicily played CHB on some of the best key forwards in the comp last year whilst Stewart mostly played loose.

Stewart partcipated in 25 one on one contests for the entire season last year. That is less than one third of what Sicily did (89). Stewart also lost those few contests he particpated in more regularly that what Sicily did (despite Sicily taking the better forward and the entries coming in with less pressure).

"Stewart spoils" Stewart had 73 spoils in 2022, whilst Sicily had 146. Stewart spoils half as much as what Sicily does is what you should have said.

"as well as rebounds" Umm, Sicily had more rebounds than anyone in the competition in 2022. More than 50 more than Stewart (who was still 11th). That's how far in front Sicily was.

That's not counting the fact that Sicily was also #1 for marks in the comp by a mile, #2 for intercepts (as important, if not moreso than spoils), #1 for metres gained and #1 for Coaches votes amongst defenders and basically everything else.

The idea that Stewart actually defends more than Sicily is nonsense.

As for the team thing - no argument Geelong were good but as I've said in my other posts, not sure why so many inferences that Stewart was the reason Geelong were so dominant. Firstly, no single player has that level of influence in our game. Secondly, Stewart missed effectively 30% of the season and Geelong were UNDEFEATED when Stewart was NOT playing. Thirdly, he finished 9th in the Geelong B&F. He wasn't even in the top 2 defenders! Hell, Geelong won the flag in a canter and I don't think Stewart got any Gary Ayers or Norm Smith votes? In short, Geelong win even if Stewart isn't there at all so team performance (which should never be a factor for AA anyway) should hardly trump all objective individual comparison.

Duckett here.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Luke Jackson has 49 coaches votes. Gawn 42 and English 35. I have a sizeable bet he'll make an All-Australian team before the end of his career. Get him in this year!

Hopefully WC do their part this week with Jackson having Jamieson as opposition...

 

[Daka]

I don't get why fans still rate the AA, it's garbage look at the selectors most of them going to biased to their club.

 

[theasian]

The selection has got better and better in recent years.

You don't get players selected hopelessly out of positions nor rank howlers anymore.

 

[Mr Meow]

Should we also compare Charlie Curnow to Saad?

Not until Vossy moves him to full forward.

 

[amos]

I don't get why fans still rate the AA, it's garbage look at the selectors most of them going to biased to their club.

It's a good talking point. Most awards are geared towards the midfielders; it's been 30 years since somebody outside the engine room has won a Brownlow. A lot of club B&F have geared away to give votes per line; Sicily and Buddy are a couple of Hawks that come to mind that have won Hawthorn's B&F. I think players looking back on their careers would take great satisfaction that in a specific year(s), they were amongst the best in the league in their position. I rate it. As an aside, I would have loved to see Crowley win AA in 2013, such was his season when taggers were the rage, and he was a big reason to get Freo to the GF. Anyway, I love it.

 

[Gysberts2Bate]

If we finish on top of the ladder, Gawn absolutely gets picked as starting ruck

 

[Iceman!]

I don't get why fans still rate the AA, it's garbage look at the selectors most of them going to biased to their club.

I think it is less about rating it and more about liking to see recognition for deserving players.

 

[Daka]

I think it is less about rating it and more about liking to see recognition for deserving players.

Well doesn't happen a lot of more deserving players seem to to be the ones missing out most of the time.

 

[GWT6]

If we finish on top of the ladder, Gawn absolutely gets picked as starting ruck

Regardless of ladder position he probably should be if he continues his current form for the last three games - but AA is more about media narrative than actual form. I think they would have decided it's English at about round 10 and nothing will change that.

 

[Gysberts2Bate]

Regardless of ladder position he probably should be if he continues his current form for the last three games - but AA is more about media narrative than actual form. I think they would have decided it's English at about round 10 and nothing will change that.

The media narrative surely leans towards pumping teams up based on ladder position. Highly unlikely we win the minor premiership and only Petracca gets picked as AA

 

[Bushdid911]

Balta Ryan Sicily
Stewart Ballard McGrath
Merrett Dawson Gulden
Miers Hawkins Bolton
Langford Walker Martin
Witts Serong Anderson
Jackson Breust Taranto Laird

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Thank you, Sorry I don't agree team success is irrelevant. One player is the best player in a team that wins 16 and a row and the flag. That would suggest that this player played well to me. That is very different from being a standout player in a bottom 8 team.

I don't know why Stewart was picked and Sicily wasn't but if I had the choice I would pick them both in the team. If Stewart played for the Hawks do you think he would play VFL while Sicily is in the team?

What this is, and has always been, is just another thing for bitter tinfoil hat Hawks supporters to complain about for years. Because Geelong and the illumunati etc etc. And still nearly a year later they can't let it go.

By your logic anything GAJ did at GC should be eliminated because he was the standout player in a garbage team. Yet his achievements at Geelong stand up?

Can you not see the flaws in that argument?

James Sicily is the best all round defender in the AFL. He has been for about 5 years now (minus his 12 months out with the ACL) and it's not even close. Right now he is arguably the best player in football. Full stop.

I do agree that both Stewart and Sicily should have been in the AA team last year. Stewart is a wonderful footballer.

 

[eth-dog]

By your logic anything GAJ did at GC should be eliminated because he was the standout player in a garbage team. Yet his achievements at Geelong stand up?

Can you not see the flaws in that argument?

James Sicily is the best all round defender in the AFL. He has been for about 5 years now (minus his 12 months out with the ACL) and it's not even close. Right now he is arguably the best player in football. Full stop.

I do agree that both Stewart and Sicily should have been in the AA team last year. Stewart is a wonderful footballer.

Sicily is a gun but he's not even close to that. He'd be fringe top 10 at best.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Sicily is a gun but he's not even close to that. He'd be fringe top 10 at best.

Right now there are not 10 better players in the AFL. There probably isn't 5...hence "arguably."

 

[eth-dog]

Right now there are not 10 better players in the AFL. There probably isn't 5...hence "arguably."

Bont, Petracca, Daicos, Curnow, Butters, Rozee and Greene are all better right now for sure. He's in a similar position to the likes of Merrett, Walker, Neale, Gawn, Taranto and English. So fringe top 10.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Bont, Petracca, Daicos, Curnow, Butters, Rozee and Greene are all better right now for sure. He's in a similar position to the likes of Merrett, Walker, Neale, Gawn, Taranto and English. So fringe top 10.

Well I am not so sure he isn't in that first bracket.

No defender is doing what he does and defenders are every bit as important as other players. They get unfairly maligned and harshly judged.

 

[HairyO]

Also must remember that not only did Stewart miss quite a few games, he was tagged out of a couple, subbed off one as well. I actually don't think there is a single argument where Stewart was in last year over Sicily. I seriously mean it when I say it's the worse selection I can remember.

Buddy probably didnt deserve one of his, then they made him Captain. Selwood probably didnt deserve one of his, then they made him Captain as well.

Its like they double down on stupid.

 

[HairyO]

Sicily is a gun but he's not even close to that. He'd be fringe top 10 at best.

Him in the team we flog Collingwood. Him not in the team we lose. He is worth as many goals difference as Curnow.

He is easily the most influential player in the competition.

 

[eth-dog]

Well I am not so sure he isn't in that first bracket.

No defender is doing what he does and defenders are every bit as important as other players. They get unfairly maligned and harshly judged.

I am. He's a star but he isn't that level. Which is fine, that level is incredibly high,

Him in the team we flog Collingwood. Him not in the team we lose. He is worth as many goals difference as Curnow.

He is easily the most influential player in the competition.

Yeah, nah.

 

[Bushdid911]

Him in the team we flog Collingwood. Him not in the team we lose. He is worth as many goals difference as Curnow.

He is easily the most influential player in the competition.

Let's get a little perspective. He's having a very good year, but he not had a winning season since 2016 (his only winning season for his career).