Discussion 2023 General AFL Discussion

[Ephemeral Hope]

So, was watching with half an eye…

how did our new recruits TDK, JSOS and Dow go?

TDK well beaten by gawn. jsos off injured. Dow very little effort with his pressure or tackling.

 

[Diehard Saint]

TDK well beaten by gawn. jsos off injured. Dow very little effort with his pressure or tackling.

Perfect….just what we need

 

[Plugger35]

I was actually admiring the wheelchair rugby. Great use of tactics, and they probably go harder at the contest!

They don't call it murder ball for nothing, they go in hard the wheelchair rugby boys.

Not much rucking going on there though, back in my days playing rugby if you were on the bottom of a ruck you got a lot of sprig marks on your back.

War wounds we used to call them.

That’s why you don’t go “all in” after one game. He’s been poo for ages

You have to factor in he is playing for Carlton though, everyone looks worse playing for them, just look at Stocker for an example.

De Koning still played pretty well tonight, one of Carlton's better players and he was up against two of the best ruckmen in Grundy and Gawn.

I wouldn't give up the world for him but if we have the chance to get him for a reasonable price I hope we are at least in the sale market for him.

 

[SteeleSaints]

Carlton are the worst coached side in the competition ATM. I have never seen a group of players refuse to run and carry the ball to break lines. Their first option regardless of how much space they have is to give a dinky handball. Absolute rubbish with the talent they have.

Melbourne are the 'world champions' at scragging. Even their smalls are good at it and mostly get away with it becuase they use one hand then another to unbalance their opponents. May was behind Curnow running to a ball at one stage and completely turned him without tackling to get the front position. It is a skill the Saints should look at and work on.

The other thing Melbourne do well in marking contests, is one player is dedicated to forcing their opponents under the ball. Allowing space for their team mates to come over the top and take the marks. Its something our ruckman and tall forwards could learn a lot from.

TDK was ok against Gawn, but got dominated in the last. His hit outs are good and if he can learn to hold his positioning better he could be a decent ruckman.

 

[Plugger35]

Vossy talking a lot of corporate jargon nonsense in his after game presser again "in that space we just weren't good enough and we need to get better".

I would be calling for his head if I was a Carlton supporter, he just trots out the same old nonsense after every loss and he has no answers, he's clueless

 

[George]

So Shane Savage is the ‘Zac’ from the Hawthorn mess it seems

Where'd you see that? I'm just watching the replay of 360 and saw the statement about one of the families not being indigenous Australians but that could be anyone.

 

[bergholt]

Where'd you see that? I'm just watching the replay of 360 and saw the statement about one of the families not being indigenous Australians but that could be anyone.

I think the argument is that they were only talking about First Nations players so he's the only option who's First Nations but not indigenous Australian

 

[George]

I think the argument is that they were only talking about First Nations players so he's the only option who's First Nations but not indigenous Australian

The statement didn't say First Nations it said not indigenous Australians, unless I'm reading the wrong thing.

 

[Miha]

Last time we paid out on Carlton we got slapped by the Hawks. Sit down, be humble

 

[George]

Mowman did you see the champ, ledge, buster segment on 360 the other night LOL



Champ
Ledge
Buster
Sport
Kiddo
Cobber
Big Dog
Captain
Hot Shot
Maverick
Muscles
Buddy
Chief

LOL

 

[bergholt]

The statement didn't say First Nations it said not indigenous Australians, unless I'm reading the wrong thing.

Yeah but the original report was taking about First Nations players, so if they were included in that report but are not indigenous then who else could it be?

 

[phantom13]

The conjecture about who “Zac” is has all but been confirmed on the thread about the report based on Burt’s statement and the reports own ToRs but I’m not sure it’s in the best interest of anyone to name or discuss it personally.

Fwiw I thought Burt’s statement was pretty appalling as was Fages but I also couldn’t really fathom how stressful the last 8 months would have been for those guys either.

Just a total shitshow.

 

[Mowman]

Mowman did you see the champ, ledge, buster segment on 360 the other night LOL



Champ
Ledge
Buster
Sport
Kiddo
Cobber
Big Dog
Captain
Hot Shot
Maverick
Muscles
Buddy
Chief

LOL

Missed it
I do like hot shot and big dog

 

[Mowman]

TDK well beaten by gawn. jsos off injured. Dow very little effort with his pressure or tackling.

Going backwards if we bring any of them in

 

[gringo2011]

Sam Walsh is a bland footballer.

I said that in his draft year and got a few people thinking I was mental. I think he's just a bit of a beige character. He plays the game with no emotion or excitement. He does good stuff and makes it look boring. He's like an energy sponge dragging all the joy out of the game.

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

Going backwards if we bring any of them in

The players we want to delist. They’re Carlton’s version. Real grass is greener type scenario

 

[gringo2011]

If Richmond beat GWS this weekend the Blues will be half a game out of the bottom 4 hahaha.

Amazing considering the start they had and clowns like Damo carrying on about them being legitimate top 4.

Honestly the turn around from half way through last year is incredible. They were playing the best footy in the league early last year. It was actually attractive fast slick footy. They dropped off worse than us. They only missed finals by getting rolled by an inferior Collingwood in the last game of the year. Just beautiful. They really are the only thing that makes watching us shoot our own feet off at every opportunity palatable.

 

[hayes]

Walsh is a gun but like a lot of players at Carlton Voss is ruining him. Before he got there he was looking like the one of the best young mids in the game and what does Voss do, takes him out of the midfield.

 

[phantom13]

It’s staggering that a midfield with Cripps, Walsh, Cerra, Hewett and Kennedy looks so ****ing ineffective. They have all the types and tools to absolutely dominate. Big inside contested bull (Cripps) classy quick hard running clean ball user (Walsh) adaptable inside/outside ball user (Cerra) genuine two way defensive mid (Hewett) and back up bull (Kennedy).

How the **** you can have those tools and still be shit is beyond me.

 

[gringo2011]

It’s staggering that a midfield with Cripps, Walsh, Cerra, Hewett and Kennedy looks so ******* ineffective. They have all the types and tools to absolutely dominate. Big inside contested bull (Cripps) classy quick hard running clean ball user (Walsh) adaptable inside/outside ball user (Cerra) genuine two way defensive mid (Hewett) and back up bull (Kennedy).

How the * you can have those tools and still be s**t is beyond me.

They have changed what they were doing well and panicked. Playing catch up with a new game plan half way through a season is a good way to be shit.

 

[Diehard Saint]

I said that in his draft year and got a few people thinking I was mental. I think he's just a bit of a beige character. He plays the game with no emotion or excitement. He does good stuff and makes it look boring. He's like an energy sponge dragging all the joy out of the game.

Yep, I remember, that was in your “everything about our list is beige” days.
You did, indeed, say that about Walsh too.

 

[hayes]

It’s staggering that a midfield with Cripps, Walsh, Cerra, Hewett and Kennedy looks so ******* ineffective. They have all the types and tools to absolutely dominate. Big inside contested bull (Cripps) classy quick hard running clean ball user (Walsh) adaptable inside/outside ball user (Cerra) genuine two way defensive mid (Hewett) and back up bull (Kennedy).

How the * you can have those tools and still be s**t is beyond me.

I know I keep saying it but I do think it’s Voss. The “failed first time coach” doesn’t work which we found out. The longer Carlton keep him the further back they’ll go. 44 points with two Coleman medalists is a massive indictment on your system and it’s happening week after week.

 

[dudeintheswamp]

I read an article the other day (I'll see if I can find it) that was talking about how dangerous certain players are with ball in hand ie., how damaging their disposal is amongst other things. They quoted a bunch of stats from the last few years showing numbers for Walsh, this year he's ranked as 252nd for impact with ball use.

Edit... found it...

THE AREA OF WALSH’S GAME “THAT’S A MILE OFF”
BY HUGH FITZPATRICK 3 DAYS AGO


Champion Data’s Daniel Hoyne has revealed some alarming numbers around the form of Carlton star Sam Walsh

18

Sam Walsh

Age

24

Ht

184cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

25.1

5star

K

13.5

5star

HB

11.6

5star

M

5.1

5star

T

3.2

5star

CL

3.4

5star

No current season stats available

D

26.2

5star

K

15.4

5star

HB

10.8

5star

M

6.0

5star

T

3.2

5star

CL

4.8

5star

.

Albeit entering this year following back surgery, Walsh has struggled to fully re-capture the brand that saw him make the 2021 All-Australian team.

Returning from injury against Adelaide in Round 5, Walsh is still averaging 30 disposals, 6.6 score involvements and 326 metres gained, numbers that put you in the “elite” category of the competition’s midfielders.

But it’s what Walsh is doing with the ball in hand that is a concern for the Blues.

“Sitting back and watching Walsh this year, I understand that he’s coming off an injury-interrupted pre-season, but the impact that he’s having on matches from a ball use perspective, and we’ve spoken about this a fair bit this season, but this is actually a common theme with Walsh’s career so far,” Hoyne told SEN's Sportsday.

“So far this year, in terms of the impact he’s having from a bull use perspective, is 252nd in the competition, that’s a mile off.

“Last year he was 187th for impact with ball use, in 2019 he was 323rd, 2020 he was 172nd, the only season where he’s been relatively damaging with ball in hand was in 2021 where he was the 54th highest rated player for ball in hand.

“With that 2021 season, the damage was coming with hands, it wasn’t coming by foot, the impact he was having by hand in 2021 was the 14th best of any player in the competition, but this year it’s 322nd.”

Hoyne says the Carlton midfielders should be looking to get the ball in the hands of those that are strong by foot.

“I think they need to change him to be that handball and release player and actually get the ball to the outside and in the hands of Adam Saad

42

Adam Saad

Age

30

Ht

178cm

Wt

79kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.5

4star

K

10.0

4star

HB

7.5

5star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.7

4star

MG

349.1

5star

D

20.7

5star

K

12.0

5star

HB

8.7

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.4

3star

MG

388.3

5star

D

17.6

5star

K

10.4

4star

HB

7.2

5star

M

4.2

4star

T

1.2

3star

, Nic Newman

24

Nic Newman

Age

31

Ht

186cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.7

5star

K

13.7

5star

HB

5.9

4star

M

5.5

5star

T

3.3

5star

MG

400.8

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

6.5

3star

HB

1.0

1star

M

2.0

2star

T

1.0

2star

MG

157.0

3star

D

22.4

5star

K

12.8

5star

HB

9.6

5star

M

5.4

5star

T

3.6

5star

MG

387.8

5star

and the more damaging hands as appose to him,” he added.

“A lot of people think that he should be the outside ball user and creative type, but his career suggests that that’s not him.

“His field kicking, in terms of when he actually does try to take on a more damaging kick, he’s not getting the returns from it.

“When he actually does when it on the outside, when he is getting the returns it’s the safer, lateral and shorter options that are not really impacting the play, you’re not looking at it and going ‘Carlton are in a better position here to actually score’.

“Adam Cerra and Saad are the ones that you’ve got to get the ball to.”

Melbourne hosts Carlton at the MCG on Friday night, with the opening bounce at 7:50pm.

 

[phantom13]

I read an article the other day (I'll see if I can find it) that was talking about how dangerous certain players are with ball in hand ie., how damaging their disposal is amongst other things. They quoted a bunch of stats from the last few years showing numbers for Walsh, this year he's ranked as 252nd for impact with ball use.

Edit... found it...

THE AREA OF WALSH’S GAME “THAT’S A MILE OFF”
BY HUGH FITZPATRICK 3 DAYS AGO


Champion Data’s Daniel Hoyne has revealed some alarming numbers around the form of Carlton star Sam Walsh.

Albeit entering this year following back surgery, Walsh has struggled to fully re-capture the brand that saw him make the 2021 All-Australian team.

Returning from injury against Adelaide in Round 5, Walsh is still averaging 30 disposals, 6.6 score involvements and 326 metres gained, numbers that put you in the “elite” category of the competition’s midfielders.

But it’s what Walsh is doing with the ball in hand that is a concern for the Blues.

“Sitting back and watching Walsh this year, I understand that he’s coming off an injury-interrupted pre-season, but the impact that he’s having on matches from a ball use perspective, and we’ve spoken about this a fair bit this season, but this is actually a common theme with Walsh’s career so far,” Hoyne told SEN's Sportsday.

“So far this year, in terms of the impact he’s having from a bull use perspective, is 252nd in the competition, that’s a mile off.

“Last year he was 187th for impact with ball use, in 2019 he was 323rd, 2020 he was 172nd, the only season where he’s been relatively damaging with ball in hand was in 2021 where he was the 54th highest rated player for ball in hand.

“With that 2021 season, the damage was coming with hands, it wasn’t coming by foot, the impact he was having by hand in 2021 was the 14th best of any player in the competition, but this year it’s 322nd.”

Hoyne says the Carlton midfielders should be looking to get the ball in the hands of those that are strong by foot.

“I think they need to change him to be that handball and release player and actually get the ball to the outside and in the hands of Adam Saad, Nic Newman and the more damaging hands as appose to him,” he added.

“A lot of people think that he should be the outside ball user and creative type, but his career suggests that that’s not him.

“His field kicking, in terms of when he actually does try to take on a more damaging kick, he’s not getting the returns from it.

“When he actually does when it on the outside, when he is getting the returns it’s the safer, lateral and shorter options that are not really impacting the play, you’re not looking at it and going ‘Carlton are in a better position here to actually score’.

“Adam Cerra and Saad are the ones that you’ve got to get the ball to.”

Melbourne hosts Carlton at the MCG on Friday night, with the opening bounce at 7:50pm.

Funny cause he got a handball receive last night in the middle was under pressure immediately (almost to the point where he didn’t have time to think) and he bulleted a pass 45m into McKays hands with May hanging off him. It was ****ing sublime.

All the Carlton players, to a man, at the moment look utterly terrified of having the ball.

 

[Joffaboy]

Last time we paid out on Carlton we got slapped by the Hawks. Sit down, be humble

No, I don't believe that bullsh.it. I will always pay out on that horrible cheating irrelevant club and their arrogant, entitled knuckle dragging supporters.

You go off and be humble or mores to your form sooky.

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