News 2023 St Kilda Media Thread

[MordySaint]

You have completely misread what is going on.

It's wonderful that RTB is sticking up for St Kilda in the media.

I love his pressers and media banter, he has been a breath of fresh air for the club.

 

[The Cobra]

On the balcony outside the “Animal Enclosure” lunch room at Moorabbin, where the “Angels” coterie ladies help make lunches for St Kilda’s players and staff, Ross Lyon fires back the questions.
It’s his new fave coffee spot, as he watches training.

The environment is still “Cuddly Ross” despite the outside perception it’s the “Cult of Lyon”, but there’s no denying he’ll always be the “Curious Ross Lyon”.

So, when asked what’s changed in him from 10 years ago to now as a coach, he says: “Do you reckon I’d be sitting here having a coffee with you when training (was on)?’’, his arm sweeping across the swish Saints home ground.

“It’s good up here,’’ he says. “The Angels are great except I call them the assassins when we lose.’’

He laughed hard with that little zinger.

For a club that seemingly has the season’s walls closing in, and perhaps on the verge of crushing it, it is zinger central this day.

Ross Lyon sits down with Mark Robinson at Saints training. Picture: Jake Nowakowski
Undoubtedly, at 10 wins and eight losses and in sixth position, and having never been out of top eight all season, the assassins – friendly or not – are taking aim at the Saints.

On the outside, the popular opinion is the team is under-skilled, over-performed, the list is average, the game plan is boring, the coach and CEO are disaffected and the general morale is wavering.


“Morale? I said you mentioned that and I spoke to the coaches and they giggled,’’ Lyon said. “Corey Enright giggled.’’

Among the players?

“They’re better than OK,’’ he said. “Last week there was formal feedback given to all staff and they just said we’ve been unwavering on process, it’s been level, no wild swings, players who haven’t played all year said, ‘I know I’m not getting a game but I’ve never been happier’,

“I would think you can’t give the effort we’re giving if there’s a morale problem. It’s quite funny, really. Has anyone seen a lack of effort with us? You know, (Callum) Wilkie came to me after the Melbourne game or the Gold Coast game, and said you need to be harder on us.

“You know, the ladder never lies.’’

Briefly, Saints chief executive Simon Lethlean joins Lyon on the balcony.

Recent media speculation had the pair at loggerheads. They denied it. But the allegation remained despite the denial.

Truth is there was something there, but it was overhyped. Outgoing AFL boss Gillon McLachlan, who is mates with Lethlean and a fan of Lyon, described it as the pair “feeling each other out’’ in their new roles.

The fact is Lethlean is a footy CEO. He played 40-odd games for Hawthorn reserves. He played and coached in the Ammos, won flags as a player and coach in the Ammos, was head of footy at the AFL, was head of footy St Kilda and is now CEO.

Simon Lethlean as an Old Xaverian footballer in 2000 – front row, fourth from the right. On his right is new AFL CEO, Andrew Dillon.
Lyon is not a first-timer, however. In the past, the reality was it was his way or the highway. He’s more collaborative now, but at the same time he’d still prefer not to carpool.

The unease surfaced when plans and personnel Lethlean put in place as the footy boss were, in part, superseded by Lyon’s own wants and changes.

Two significant departures this year have been senior football analyst David Rath, head of high performance Nick Walsh and head of football Geoff Walsh.

The key signing was Lyon’s great mate Stephen Silvagni in recruiting and list management.

“Simon and I are in as good a space as we’ve been in,’’ Lyon said.

“There’s been some transition.

“It was a volatile change … for Brett (Ratten) and for the club. But it was based on a review and what came out of the review, and they decided to act. So, that’s not me.

“It wasn’t unlike the Thomas one (Grant Thomas sacking) but a bit different, but volatile. And the playing group has been incredibly embracing. But back to the original point. Simon was always going to be CEO, but he really constructed the football department structure and plan and he’s a great football person. His passion is footy. I came in as an experienced coach and clearly changed a bit of the program and there were some personnel changes and that’s going to happen.

“And Simon is very loyal which is a great attribute and I think it challenged him that some of his people went. I would acknowledge that and Simon would acknowledge that. In saying that, we haven’t had a raised word nor a heated meeting.

“It’s probably understanding that I’m not a junior coach and I probably require a little bit more space than when he (Lethlean) was GM of footy.

“It’s just been that transition.

“He’s committed to success and so am I.’’

Senior football analyst David Rath has departed the Saints. Picture: Michael Klein

Head of football Geoff Walsh departed the Saints earlier this year. He previously held a similar role at Collingwood. Picture: Michael Klein
Lethlean agreed and, this day, they were thoroughly at ease. More to the point, Lethlean said he was not going to Hawthorn to be its chief executive, as was also speculated.

“I’ve been waiting to be CEO for a while, so I’m here for the long haul,’’ Lethlean said.

“We’ve got plenty to do. No, I’ll be here for a long while.’’

Lyon wants to win this week (Hawthorn) and next (Carlton) and pave the way to play finals.

At the same time, he says he’s playing the “long game”, exploring the list and staff.

“In the past, if you try to make things happen too quickly you can burn people out,’’ Lyon said.

More evidence of a changed, matured coach?

“That’s all part of it, that’s why I feel I’m a better coach. Even on game day, I could get unhinged with the best of them. I haven’t been unhinged yet I wouldn’t have thought,” he said.

“I’m very respectful of what my role is and my role is to collaborate with my coaches.’’

They are current Australian Football Hall of Famers – Robert Harvey, Corey Enright and Lenny Hayes.

“I don’t think I’ve taken a session all year. I do this a lot (watch training). We plan out the session, we met yesterday, we check in, we lean in. I’ve not taken an X and O all year (offensive and defensive review). I ask, ‘What you’ve got?’ I say, ‘Yeah’. And then I might help shape it a little bit. I used to love getting up and doing all that and I don’t do any of that now.’’

First touted maybe 10-12 years ago that football programs were transforming from being led by a senior coach to a manager of coaches, it would seem it has been adopted at the Saints.

“We collaborate, co-ordinate and because the assistant coaches are so knowledgeable and experienced, and sometimes they are so respectful of each other, sometimes you have to pry out the other’s thoughts to help the other rather than just stay in your lane. That’s the collaboration piece,” Lyon said.

It’s apparent on game day.

At three-quarter-time last week against North Melbourne, down by 16 points and the walls closing in, collaboration was at the fore.

“All the coaches had input,’’ Lyon said. “(Rowan) Marshall forward, (Mitch) Owens into the ruck. Marshall was yeah, what does that mean for him? Who does that push where? I liked it.’’

Mitch Owens and Rowan Marshall compete for the ball against North Melbourne on the weekend. Picture: Darrian Traynor/Getty Images
Last-quarter rotations are automatic and sports science can pull apart any plan, but Lyon’s role is still the sheriff in that regard.

“I said, no, everything’s through me and Marshall is not coming off. Owens ain’t coming off. Sharman, who went to (Ben) McKay and that was a discussion with ‘Harves’, and sports science had him rotated and I said, no, he’s not coming off. That’s my bit, where I can exert over the top,” Lyon said.

The Saints are living desperate times. Starting with a 7-3 win-loss record, they have returned 3-5 since. Injuries have hurt them: Max King, Jack Steele, Zak Jones, Hunter Clark, Tim Membrey, Nick Coffield and Daniel McKenzie have missed large chunks of and in McKenzie’s case the whole season.

After the Gold Coast loss in round 18, Lyon lamented the team’s lack of performance. In a typically honest press conference, it was interpreted that Lyon said there was a talent depth issue at the club, which prompted media dissection of the Saints’ list.

“I didn’t say depth,’’ Lyon said.

“What I said was when our elite players are a little bit off, because there was no (Brad) Hill against Gold Coast and (Jack) Sinclair was down, that everyone needs to step up. And we weren’t able to do it.

“We were doing it earlier in the year because we were doing it without them (injured players).’’

So, it’s not a death issue?

“I didn’t say a depth issue,’’ he said, a fraction more spiritedly than the first time. “What I said was when we needed others to step up we haven’t quite been able to do that when it’s been required over the past few weeks. And on the weekend we did it. When it needed to get desperate, we got desperate, and we dominated the last quarter.

“Look, we’re finding out about our list. We want to build a great team. We think over a period of time, if it’s one year, two years, four years … I think we have the coaches, and the conditioners and facilities and the wherewithal off field … we’re thrilled.’’

Amid predictions from afar of a gloomy final five weeks, cuddly Ross still has splashes of street-fighter Ross.

Street-fighter Ross Lyon splashed out when talking about the depth on St Kilda’s list. Picture: Michael Klein.
“People at the start of the year who criticised us had us 15th,’’ he said.

“We’re sixth … the ladder never lies. And guess what? We’ve got five games to go.

“All I know is our season is alive. We’re in control. We know against perceived better teams our performances have been strong. We’re quite excited. And we’re getting our availability back. They might take a while to come to hand, but Jones has been important, Coffield has played one game, Membrey is back this week in the VFL, and we’re hoping King versus Carlton. We lose (Dougal) Howard. (Jack) Hayes, who everyone really rates, might play this week to help our kids in the front half.’’

It’s kids city in the Saints’ forward 50. Anthony Caminiti and Owens are both 19, Mattaes Phillipou is 18 and Sharman is 23. In the defensive 50, Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera and Marcus Windhager are both 20. There’s a snapshot of the “long game’’ play.

Wanganeen-Milera was homesick last year and is flourishing this season and Lyon thinks they’ve found a spot for Windhager on a back flank.

“Nasiah’s been a revelation,” Lyon said.

“Corey Enright said, ‘He’s not a winger, Ross, halfback is his spot’. I said, ‘Well, you’re the halfback whisperer, no worries. Of course I listened.’’

So, what’s attainable this year?

“That’s the $64,000 question,’’ Lyon said.

“When the season was on the line, we were very brave. You don’t fluke 5-1 coming off a pre-season when everyone is fit and available, that’s all I know.

“I think anyone who takes us for granted (over the coming weeks), well, good luck to them, that’s fine. We are backing ourselves in.’’

When I read the article in the Hun this morning, I had to tip my lid to the Club.
Rule #1 in public relations is to tell your story and control the narrative.
What better way to address a prior story full of inference and insinuation from our good friend Caro, than to have a double page spread in the big readership Saturday Hun from her primary media “rival”. One that gives opportunity to rebut her unattributed and unmerited claims. Make no mistake, apart from the football angle, this story was clearly a shot at her.

Spot on - however now she will make it her mission (if it wasn’t already?!) to prove she was right and/or see what else she can dig up/make up that damages the Saints.

Thats the way she and the industry operates. They don’t cop it on the chin, they have long memories, hold grudges & know they ultimately have the power at the end of the day.

 

[sunny3193]

Spot on - however now she will make it her mission (if it wasn’t already?!) to prove she was right and/or see what else she can dig up/make up that damages the Saints.

Thats the way she and the industry operates. They don’t cop it on the chin, they have long memories, hold grudges & know they ultimately have the power at the end of the day.

Of course she will.
But that doesn’t mean the Club was wrong to send her a message.

 

[George]

When I read the article in the Hun this morning, I had to tip my lid to the Club.
Rule #1 in public relations is to tell your story and control the narrative.
What better way to address a prior story full of inference and insinuation from our good friend Caro, than to have a double page spread in the big readership Saturday Hun from her primary media “rival”. One that gives opportunity to rebut her unattributed and unmerited claims. Make no mistake, apart from the football angle, this story was clearly a shot at her.

Exactly how I read it

 

[Diehard Saint]

Of course she will.
But that doesn’t mean the Club was wrong to send her a message.

No smoke without fire I believe.

We are talking about two very large egos and by systematically getting rid of all Lethlean’s hires, Ross has made it quite clear he didn’t rate what he’s done over the past few years. He doesn't appear to rate much of the list either.

I can quite believe there’s been a little friction between the two.
Which of course they will deny.

 

[gringo2011]

No smoke without fire I believe.

We are talking about two very large egos and by systematically getting rid of all Lethlean’s hires, Ross has made it quite clear he didn’t rate what he’s done over the past few years. He doesn't appear to rate much of the list either.

I can quite believe there’s been a little friction between the two.
Which of course they will deny.

Not only that, Lethlean was pretty much responsible for the list build. The club got rid of Ratts because they believed that the list was underperforming, or at least they'd be able to see if it was coaching or players.

That's a massive mark against everything Lethlean has done in his time at the Saints. List is no good, footy department appointments no good and sacking the coach and backing his list.

Lyon has come in and shat on everything he's done so far. Lethlean was like a little tinpot dictator at the Saints before Lyon. Now all of his decisions have been questioned it must feel pretty deflating.

 

[MordySaint]

Not only that, Lethlean was pretty much responsible for the list build. The club got rid of Ratts because they believed that the list was underperforming, or at least they'd be able to see if it was coaching or players.

That's a massive mark against everything Lethlean has done in his time at the Saints. List is no good, footy department appointments no good and sacking the coach and backing his list.

Lyon has come in and shat on everything he's done so far. Lethlean was like a little tinpot dictator at the Saints before Lyon. Now all of his decisions have been questioned it must feel pretty deflating.

it's good people are reading between the lines and not always taking things at face value.

Leathlean however has done alot of good things for the club, recruitment isn't his strong point though. He needs to stay in his lane now and leave the recruitment to people more qualified.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Not only that, Lethlean was pretty much responsible for the list build. The club got rid of Ratts because they believed that the list was underperforming, or at least they'd be able to see if it was coaching or players.

That's a massive mark against everything Lethlean has done in his time at the Saints. List is no good, footy department appointments no good and sacking the coach and backing his list.

Lyon has come in and shat on everything he's done so far. Lethlean was like a little tinpot dictator at the Saints before Lyon. Now all of his decisions have been questioned it must feel pretty deflating.

Exactly - so I’m not believing the apparent “no cross words between us”.

Who was it that said “lying is the first language of the afl”?

 

[gringo2011]

it's good people are reading between the lines and not always taking things at face value.

Leathlean however has done alot of good things for the club, recruitment isn't his strong point though. He needs to stay in his lane now and leave the recruitment to people more qualified.

I think being outside of the footy department is definitely a better way to use him. He's obviously a competent operator even in the boys club. It's on us that we thought we could use him to do something he's not qualified to do. You don't pay your optometrist to build you a kitchen because you assume that if they are good at one thing they'll be good at everything.

 

[gringo2011]

Exactly - so I’m not believing the apparent “no cross words between us”.

Who was it that said “lying is the first language of the afl”?

It might be that it's not even raised words but you imagine there is some palpable tension. Like when you've done some home handyman shit and get a professional in who walks around raising their eyebrows at the low standards.

 

[Diehard Saint]

It might be that it's not even raised words but you imagine there is some palpable tension. Like when you've done some home handyman s**t and get a professional in who walks around raising their eyebrows at the low standards.

I would imagine it’s exactly that.
I can just imagine it.

 

[sunny3193]

No smoke without fire I believe.

We are talking about two very large egos and by systematically getting rid of all Lethlean’s hires, Ross has made it quite clear he didn’t rate what he’s done over the past few years. He doesn't appear to rate much of the list either.

I can quite believe there’s been a little friction between the two.
Which of course they will deny.

I am afraid that I have quite a divergence of views with you re Wilson.
There’s no such thing as “quality” journalism in the AFL world, particularly in the mainstream media.
She is the avatar for that lack of quality.
Though if Patrick Smythe was still around, he would rival her.
Her pitch, brand if you will, is to represent that “quality” niche in the AFL world.
Yet her journalism consists of unattributed innuendo and moralistic pontification.
Personality driven, Hollywood gossip.
Which is exactly what she delivered in that article.
She is worse than the Kane Cornes of this world.
At least Cornes is unashamedly tabloid click bait.
Wilson clothes her journalism in broadsheet faux high morality and outrage.

If you want good football journalism, read The Mongrel Punt.

 

[The Cobra]

I am afraid that I have quite a divergence of views with you re Wilson.
There’s no such thing as “quality” journalism in the AFL world, particularly in the mainstream media.
She is the avatar for that lack of quality.
Though if Patrick Smythe was still around, he would rival her.
Her pitch, brand if you will, is to represent that “quality” niche in the AFL world.
Yet her journalism consists of unattributed innuendo and moralistic pontification.
Personality driven, Hollywood gossip.
Which is exactly what she delivered in that article.
She is worse than the Kane Cornes of this world.
At least Cornes is unashamedly tabloid click bait.
Wilson clothes her journalism in broadsheet faux high morality and outrage.

If you want good football journalism, read The Mongrel Punt.

Spot on - plus the most tortured syntax ever produced - needs an editor with access to a grammar checker run by a supercomputer!

 

[Diehard Saint]

I am afraid that I have quite a divergence of views with you re Wilson.
There’s no such thing as “quality” journalism in the AFL world, particularly in the mainstream media.
She is the avatar for that lack of quality.
Though if Patrick Smythe was still around, he would rival her.
Her pitch, brand if you will, is to represent that “quality” niche in the AFL world.
Yet her journalism consists of unattributed innuendo and moralistic pontification.
Personality driven, Hollywood gossip.
Which is exactly what she delivered in that article.
She is worse than the Kane Cornes of this world.
At least Cornes is unashamedly tabloid click bait.
Wilson clothes her journalism in broadsheet faux high morality and outrage.

If you want good football journalism, read The Mongrel Punt.

I read the Mongrel Punt and Code Sports.
They talk purely football.
She reports around other issues in the afl world. Like it not, she most often gets things correct.

I don’t really mind if we have divergent views about her - doesn’t really matter one way or the other. Like most things around football, or life actually, it’s mostly opinion, depending on which way you lean.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Spot on - plus the most tortured syntax ever produced - needs an editor with access to a grammar checker run by a supercomputer!

Hope you don’t read Robbo then.

 

[The Cobra]

Hope you don’t read Robbo then.

No I don’t fortunately - but having the misfortune to see him on AFL 360 is enough- blithering idiot who can’t put a coherent sentence together - who then decided journalism is the career for me!

 

[gringo2011]

I read the Mongrel Punt and Code Sports.
They talk purely football.
She reports around other issues in the afl world. Like it not, she most often gets things correct.

I don’t really mind if we have divergent views about her - doesn’t really matter one way or the other. Like most things around football, or life actually, it’s mostly opinion, depending on which way you lean.

Yeah, I don't mind her or Cornes. Both have a niche that they have worked their way into. Caro has this strange one where she has a bit of Hollywood gossip but also does serious stuff and has changed the attitudes of the ultra blokey ex-player fraternity.

I think women like her style more and it's helped spread the gospel of AFL. I can see why she rubs people the wrong way but you listen to other male journos and she has the respect of most of them. You don't survive in any industry for as long as she has without something to back it up.

 

[The Cobra]

Yeah, I don't mind her or Cornes. Both have a niche that they have worked their way into. Caro has this strange one where she has a bit of Hollywood gossip but also does serious stuff and has changed the attitudes of the ultra blokey ex-player fraternity.

I think women like her style more and it's helped spread the gospel of AFL. I can see why she rubs people the wrong way but you listen to other male journos and she has the respect of most of them. You don't survive in any industry for as long as she has without something to back it up.

Fair call and she certainly has her sources and yes we shouldn’t underestimate how hard it was for her to break into the Boys Club.

My issue is with the whole lot of them - no ethics and bottom feeding gossip spreaders with their favourites and those they are out to destroy - but instead they claim to be an unbiased source of truth!

 

[George]

Caro is a grub like the rest of them

 

[tomjoad]

It might be that it's not even raised words but you imagine there is some palpable tension. Like when you've done some home handyman s**t and get a professional in who walks around raising their eyebrows at the low standards.

Yeah, I feckin' hate that. Walking around with their fancy levels and s*it.

 

[Jade Buddha]

Yeah, I don't mind her or Cornes. Both have a niche that they have worked their way into. Caro has this strange one where she has a bit of Hollywood gossip but also does serious stuff and has changed the attitudes of the ultra blokey ex-player fraternity.

I think women like her style more and it's helped spread the gospel of AFL. I can see why she rubs people the wrong way but you listen to other male journos and she has the respect of most of them. You don't survive in any industry for as long as she has without something to back it up.

Lloyd is the one that deserves the derision. Absolute peanut. Could we’ll be a throw back.

 

[gringo2011]

Fair call and she certainly has her sources and yes we shouldn’t underestimate how hard it was for her to break into the Boys Club.

My issue is with the whole lot of them - no ethics and bottom feeding gossip spreaders with their favourites and those they are out to destroy - but instead they claim to be an unbiased source of truth!

And the AFL love it because while it's taking up airtime and articles in the paper, it's on everyone's minds. The Footy Show made footballers more celebrity figures..... when I was a kid when you'd get a footy card and might meet them at a footy clinic. Journos like Caro worked a different angle that made them more human even if it was warts and all. Like celebrities hate the paparazzi, if they didn't help create the buzz, they wouldn't get the wages they do.


Like all media, you have absolute control over what you watch, read, listen to or absorb. If you don't like her she probably isn't for you. Same as Cornes. I love Cornes, he gets me engaged even if he gives me the shits sometimes. He doesn't really say much that's wrong either. He is just working off what a lot are thinking without saying it. He's like the little devil on your shoulder and he sets off the nuffies.

 

[gringo2011]

Yeah, I feckin' hate that. Walking around with their fancy levels and s*it.

Damn straight, doors that open and close are so 19th century.

 

[SteeleSaints]

No I don’t fortunately - but having the misfortune to see him on AFL 360 is enough- blithering idiot who can’t put a coherent sentence together - who then decided journalism is the career for me!

He looked jaundiced the other night - I wonder if he has liver problems?

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Not only that, Lethlean was pretty much responsible for the list build. The club got rid of Ratts because they believed that the list was underperforming, or at least they'd be able to see if it was coaching or players.

That's a massive mark against everything Lethlean has done in his time at the Saints. List is no good, footy department appointments no good and sacking the coach and backing his list.

Lyon has come in and shat on everything he's done so far. Lethlean was like a little tinpot dictator at the Saints before Lyon. Now all of his decisions have been questioned it must feel pretty deflating.

Garbage, it was Elshaug. Lethlean sacked Elshaug. Thank god.