Brownlow 2024 Brownlow Medal Count - Congrats Patrick Cripps!

[Art Vandelay_]

I'm sorry if a player is breaking the record for the most votes by 9 (3 BoG performances) in the premier BnF award for the sport and averaging 2 votes a game (with 10 of those games being losses), I'd expect that player to have had one of the best individual seasons in AFL history.

Someone tell me how it was better than both of these seasons.





Ablett 2010. 31 touches and 2 goals H&A. Franklin 2008 4.5 goals a game which is 1990s levels.
Neither even won it in those two years. Lost to inferior seasons from Judd and Cooney respectively. Oh and were 19 and 23 votes lower than Cripps in 2024.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Doubt it. Franklin kicked 113 goals in '08 and got 20 votes.
Fevola kicked 99 and got only 11 votes.
Even Hogan was brilliant this year (easily best KPF) and couldn't even get close to his midfield teammate (24 votes to 15) in Tom Green (who deservedly missed the 44 man AA squad), let alone actually challenge for the Brownlow.

It's purely a midfielders medal these days with the same few players attracting votes every game.

To be fair every award is a midfielders medal. All the media awards, the players award, the coaches award… they’re all dominated by midfielders.

 

[T2B_]

Everyone saying "no one's there to take votes off Cripps...."

In two of last couple of Cripps 3 vote games, Carlton lost both games and Nic Newman had 34 disposals and 12 marks, and 35 disposals and 16 marks and got zero votes...

That guy is criminally underrated by everyone, not just umpires.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

Someone tell me how it was better than both of these seasons.

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Ablett 2010. 31 touches and 2 goals H&A. Franklin 2008 4.5 goals a game which is 1990s levels.
Neither even won it in those two years. Lost to inferior seasons from Judd and Cooney respectively. Oh and were 19 and 23 votes lower than Cripps in 2024.

Only just pipped him combined

 

[docko911]

Strongly disagree. there’s a reason they both finished 110+ in coaches votes - strongly consistent mids in mediocre (in 2024) teams.

But 45 & 38 is excessive. As is Butters etc

R1 - rated 2nd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R3 - rated 3rd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R4 - no coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R7 - rated 4th best on ground by coaches, 2 Brownlow votes
R9 - rated 4th best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R12 - rated 2nd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R13 - not in coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R18 - rated 3rd in coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R19 - rated 2nd in coaches votes, 3 Brownlow votes
R24 - rated equal 1st in a three way tie in the coaches votes, lost but got the 3 Brownlow votes

He got about 15 votes more than he would’ve got based on the coaches voting and that doesn’t even count his favouritism in round 24. 30 should have been his max.

 

[RCAB]

I think there will never be a perfect system and regardless of who you get to cast the votes, there will always be some form of bias. Umpires have no idea at the best of times. The players MVP is flawed as the average player won't watch more games than your typical BigFooty poster. Coaches are also subject to bias and will have their favourite players.

Ultimately, it is up to us fans to not put that much stock in these awards and use them as criterion to elevate or put down player's careers.

If you look at soccer and basketball they usually get it right, and their best players are voted by journalists.

 

[brutus76]

IDEA
Change the votes to 2,1 and 0.5 to keep the scores low please
Will also lessen the amount of ties in lower positions

 

[zyzzbruh]

If they are less flawed than you should hold them in higher prestige than the Brownlow. These awards can be weighted however you want when evaluating players - it's not like the AFL publish an objective ranking of players. It's just up to the individual

They do though, hence putting it on a whole prime time event for it and calling it the 'best & fairest'. Why don't they do the same for the other awards? Lock the coaches votes in an armaguard briefcase too, with cinematics of it being delivered onto the desk at the end of a multi million dollar red carpet event... It essentially is the AFLs objective ranking of players, and hence why they should consider adjusting the voting system to maintain its integrity.

 

[carlton_99]

R1 - rated 2nd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R3 - rated 3rd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R4 - no coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R7 - rated 4th best on ground by coaches, 2 Brownlow votes
R9 - rated 4th best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R12 - rated 2nd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R13 - not in coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R18 - rated 3rd in coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R19 - rated 2nd in coaches votes, 3 Brownlow votes
R24 - rated equal 1st in a three way tie in the coaches votes, lost but got the 3 Brownlow votes

He got about 15 votes more than he would’ve got based on the coaches voting and that doesn’t even count his favouritism in round 24. 30 should have been his max.

If only there was an award voted on by the coaches...

 

[Cleansweep17]

Why are Richmond supporters so weird on this site?

Nothing wrong with pointing out the fact 45 votes is really strange. I wanted him to win btw.

But if he was that dominant as the votes suggest he would’ve cleaned up in the MVP, coaches award and been AA captain too.

So yeah seems a lil dodgy ngl, as another poster said if he won with 35-36 votes it would look more legitimate.

 

[zyzzbruh]

Brownlow Medal. FAIREST and best. Note which comes first - which is why it’s awarded by the umpires, and why it doesn’t always accord with other awards that emphasise “best”.

Try to remember that before you melt over what you think the high vote tally tonight might indicate.

So how to judge fairest then? Disposals? I would say the worst rated player in the AFL was just as fair as Cripps.

 

[Gammalite]

Very influential player for his team and deserving winner. well done Crippa.
Perhaps the votes would work better if the 3 - 2 -1 were allocated to Just the winning team Only by the umps?
They just throw in a BIG name needlessly from the losing side so often, it is effecting the count?
random votes in the event of a drawn match.
West Coast would of got 30 votes for their 5 wins , as they did tonight. But sadly Richmond would only of got 12 votes total instead of 19. (for 2 season wins) BUT importantly
Cripps and Daicos total number of votes wouldn't be so rediculously high, and teams higher up the ladder would feature well in the count.

 

[matty lloyd the champ]

If you look at soccer and basketball they usually get it right, and their best players are voted by journalists.

You can't compare the NBA to us.

The MVP award gets handed out by journalists who give their top 5 players at the end of the season and don't hand out votes on a game by game basis like we do.

Maybe that is a better system as it takes out irregularities like receiving votes in a game when a player is clearly undeserving.

 

[carlton_99]

They do though, hence putting it on a whole prime time event for it and calling it the 'best & fairest'. Why don't they do the same for the other awards? Lock the coaches votes in an armaguard briefcase too, with cinematics of it being delivered onto the desk at the end of a multi million dollar red carpet event... It essentially is the AFLs objective ranking of players, and hence why they should consider adjusting the voting system to maintain its integrity.

There is no objective ranking of players. Who from the AFL has come out and said the best player in history is the player with the most Brownlows?

Individual accolades are nice but they should never be the sole reason used for one player being better than another. It's the same with AAs.

 

[Feerits Elf]

Yep, legitimately cooked and you could see him come to the realisation of what she said.

Still, well done to Andrew in marrying for looks.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

If you look at soccer and basketball they usually get it right, and their best players are voted by journalists.

Its the system as much as anything. With the 3-2-1 count, a clear BOG can't get more than 3 votes, a game where its a raffle where several players where equally decent, someone has to get the 3. Its not weighted evenly. Happens with the coaches votes too, plus bias is definitely involved in that one as well.

Easier with the Awards you just pick at the end of the season, that guy was the best. Probably why the Players Award seems to get the right decision more than the Brownlow and Coaches Votes. If journalists were giving 3-2-1 counts I imagine it would look fairly similar so what we saw tonight

 

[Noidnadroj]

not as many randoms polling a vote or two here and there

It’s because 2 years ago they stopped allowing umpires to have stats / phones post game. I think since that controversy with the umpire who got suspended.

So if a random no-name in 2022 or before had 25 and kicked 3, umpires would see this in the stats and go ‘oh, I didn’t realise ‘no-name’ was that effective. 25 and 3 is a big game, he deserves 2 votes’

But without stats ….good old random no-name gets nothing.

And by the same token, umpires are trying to
work out votes in an even game … ‘well, Cripps was in and under and was really willing his team over the line. I didn’t notice many others, so he deserves 3’ (meanwhile he’s had 19 touches at 47% and 15 players were statistically superior).

So his 2 votes turns into a more deserved zero.

Cripps was a deserved winner and Daicos a deserved second. But I guarantee umpires will have their stats and phones back in 2025. 45 votes and 38 for guys whose teams finished 8th and 9th, polling in 17 and 18 games, clearly shows the umpires need a bit of a helping hand.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Blue1980]

You can't seriously think that whoever has the highest Brownlow vote total in a season had the best season in history. The numbers are meaningless and just reflect a whole heap of factors that have nothing to do with individual performance like how good your teammates are, how good your team is, what position you play etc etc. Comparing totals across seasons means nothing

It’s a pretty dumb argument, Kouta has almost the best season I’ve seen anyone play in 2000 and got less than half the votes of Crippa.

Crippa had in my view his best season, but it’s a perfect storm of us winning enough games yet not having our other top players playing well enough to take votes off him which led to this freak total.

Nick Daicos in a similar boat, stand out player in a mediocre side who still won enough games to poll a lot of votes.

 

[Worm4]

I don't care who won the Brownlow, Diacos a far better player than Cripps. Nobody really cares if Cripps racks up 30 possies.

Blokes like Diacos, Bont etc can just rip the game away from you with batches of brilliance. All the best players Ablett jnr, Dusty have this ability. I would throw Heeney, Warner into that mix also.

As good as Cripps is he just isn't that type of player. Not damaging enough.

Clearly you didn't watch the stat paddling between Nick and Josh in collingwoods last game. Its was borderline embarrassing to watch.

 

[RCAB]

R1 - rated 2nd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R3 - rated 3rd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R4 - no coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R7 - rated 4th best on ground by coaches, 2 Brownlow votes
R9 - rated 4th best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R12 - rated 2nd best on ground by coaches, 3 Brownlow votes
R13 - not in coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R18 - rated 3rd in coaches votes, 2 Brownlow votes
R19 - rated 2nd in coaches votes, 3 Brownlow votes
R24 - rated equal 1st in a three way tie in the coaches votes, lost but got the 3 Brownlow votes

He got about 15 votes more than he would’ve got based on the coaches voting and that doesn’t even count his favouritism in round 24. 30 should have been his max.

Do Daicos now

 

[carlton_99]

It’s a pretty dumb argument, Kouta has almost the best season I’ve seen anyone play in 2000 and got less than half the votes of Crippa.

Crippa had in my view his best season, but it’s a perfect storm of us winning enough games yet not having our other top players playing well enough to take votes off him which led to this freak total.

Nick Daicos in a similar boat, stand out player in a mediocre side who still won enough games to poll a lot of votes.

Ollie Wines and Dustin Martin also had equally good seasons in their Brownlow years apparently

 

[PhatBoy]

If you look at soccer and basketball they usually get it right, and their best players are voted by journalists.

Dally M is done the same way and even allowing for the Ruan Sims debacle a few years ago where she admitted she didn’t end up watching the entire game when she gave out her votes, it invariably gives a fair result and also doesn’t make it impossible for players in various positions to win; players from fullback, 5-8, halfback, lock/second row and hooker have won in the last decade.

Centres and wingers will never ever win: if you’re a gun on either of those positions you will invariably end up at fullback anyway and win it there. Prop is the only position where you probably haven’t really been able to win it from and Payne Haas is going to change that at some stage.

 

[Blue1980]

Different players in different times. I rate Cripps better in terms of contribution to the club. Moving up on Nichols, Jezza and Doull as our clubs greatest.

Diesel was a freak and the best player I’ve seen in a Carlton jumper.

Thing is he only did it for 6 seasons with us, but Cripps isnt a million miles away from diesel. Cripps our best leader since Kernahan as well.

In terms of Carlton players I’ve seen since around 1988 or so, Cripps up with Diesel, SOS, Sticks and Judd as the best I’ve seen in a Carlton jumper.

Kouta didn’t do it for long enough at a high level to be in that league.

 

[TENACIOUS]

You guys down at Carlton really care about the Brownlow?

Of course… Crippa earned his, unlike some…

 

[RCAB]

IDEA
Change the votes to 2,1 and 0.5 to keep the scores low please
Will also lessen the amount of ties in lower positions

This reminds me of Spinal Tap