List Mgmt. 2024 List Management discussion

[Nathan Barley]

Interesting to compare the situation between Lohmann and Robertson at the start of the year. Different players but arguments could be made for each to take up a defensive small forward role. Robertson was probably in front of Lohmann as he played in the grand final. Both recovering from injuries. Lohmann selected in front of Robertson as his recovery was furthe advanced. Posters questioned Lomann’s selection even as sub during the first three or four rounds.

Now Lohmann is one of the keys to our forward set up and Robertson should be traded (according to some/many). Players’ careers can be determined by many random factors.

Sliding doors…. Love what Keays has achieved at the Crows through hard work and determination….. Had he played defensive small forward for the
Lions it last years grand final no one knows what the result would have been.

Yes especially as Keays would have barely played in the last 4 years and probably would've been the same guy we delisted who couldn't handle the pressure at AFL level and fumbled all the time

 

[mpal6]

Interesting to compare the situation between Lohmann and Robertson at the start of the year. Different players but arguments could be made for each to take up a defensive small forward role. Robertson was probably in front of Lohmann as he played in the grand final. Both recovering from injuries. Lohmann selected in front of Robertson as his recovery was furthe advanced. Posters questioned Lomann’s selection even as sub during the first three or four rounds.

Now Lohmann is one of the keys to our forward set up and Robertson should be traded (according to some/many). Players’ careers can be determined by many random factors.

Sliding doors…. Love what Keays has achieved at the Crows through hard work and determination….. Had he played defensive small forward for the
Lions it last years grand final no one knows what the result would have been.

Agreed, as much as I loved flying the flag for Dev last year - I wasn't in agreement with him choosing to stay. Ashcroft was coming back from ACL, Levi/Marshall on their way - writing was on the wall and he should've received better advise if there was interest out there from other clubs.

Lohmann arriving was a total surprise in the middle of all this and it again shows how Dev was always on the edge in terms of first 22. Pressure high half forward + midfield rotation would've been his go, too bad Lohmann and Ah Chee have taken over these spots and playing very well so far.

 

[Sproj]

One thing I will say though is, good on Dev for backing himself to do what Kai has done. Unfortunately, his season has been cruelled by injuries at the wrong times.

 

[Dom PC]

One thing I will say though is, good on Dev for backing himself to do what Kai has done. Unfortunately, his season has been cruelled by injuries at the wrong times.

Yeah it was pretty amazing that he stayed - I hope he doesn't regret it and we stick fat with him over the next 3 to 4 years if there isn't a lot of interest from other clubs (there should be - he is an obvious Keays 2.0 IMO).

 

[mpal6]

Yeah it was pretty amazing that he stayed - I hope he doesn't regret it and we stick fat with him over the next 3 to 4 years if there isn't a lot of interest from other clubs (there should be - he is an obvious Keays 2.0 IMO).

Highly doubt we'll continue with him unless he's happy to stay as rookie down the track. This industry is so fickle, even father sons get punted quickly if they don't keep the improvement trajectory going.

Dev needs better advise or a different management team around him, someone who would've told him to take that 3 or 4 year deal from West Coast last year and run quickly.

 

[Pride of lions]

The problem for Dev is that he would also struggle to get a game in the West Coast or Freo midfield so would have to look elsewhere rather than heading back home. And I don’t think there would be too many teams out there where he could be assured of being in the starting 22.

 

[M Malice]

The problem for Dev is that he would also struggle to get a game in the West Coast or Freo midfield so would have to look elsewhere rather than heading back home. And I don’t think there would be too many teams out there where he could be assured of being in the starting 22.

Sadly for Dev he is just one of the latest of a long line of players who don't make it at AFL level, percentages tell us that far more players drop out of the system with a few years and minimal games than go on to forge 150+ game careers.

He has done well to get 5 years on a list(so far) and play 43 games... and of course have life long memories of playing in an all time great Grand Final in which I thought he was quite good... albeit I have never re watched the game.

 

[irel]

Over the next few years spots on the list will be at a premium. It appears our Academy is producing quality draftable midfielders. Good players on the fringes will have to make way for the new draftees. Dev unless he turns his career around (Lohmann style) is looking at being traded or delisted at conclusion of his contract. Unfortunately, sport has no sentiment for the fringe players.

 

[M Malice]

Over the next few years spots on the list will be at a premium. It appears our Academy is producing quality draftable midfielders. Good players on the fringes will have to make way for the new draftees. Dev unless he turns his career around (Lohmann style) is looking at being traded or delisted at conclusion of his contract. Unfortunately, sport has no sentiment for the fringe players.

Our Academy needs to get working on a quality key forward to take Joe's spot in a few years.

Ty Gallop come on down.

 

[irel]

Our Academy needs to get working on a quality key forward to take Joe's spot in a few years.

Ty Gallop come on down.

Only a few years ago the "Grass Is Greener" mob were complaining we were not producing midfielders like the Swans' academy. Now we are producing too many. Hahaha

 

[Cubs2Lions]

Ty Gallop come on down.

Only a few years ago the "Grass Is Greener" mob were complaining we were not producing midfielders like the Swans' academy. Now we are producing too many. Hahaha

Hopefully Ty gets the nickname by his players (when the time comes).

*Too early for my dad jokes is it, I probably should gallop my way back to work now.

 

[Berrygood]

We have a logjam at midfield with no injuries and players like Berry, Bailey, Rayner and Ashcroft who are all better midfielders in the first team anyway.

Yeah we do, with Levi n Marshall it's deeper. But looking at that list, how many would you describe as a defensive mid. We imported Dunkley to do it, Berry has been reborn into it, after that the cupboard is bare. We've seen how much better we've been in the midfield with a cpl of bulls in there and the stronger option to tag. On our list at the moment our best option to fill that role going fwd should Dunks or Berry both be out is Dev. (Assuming Lyons gone). We've seen this year how injuries can decimate one type of player in a season. He is contracted for next year, and unless he is asking to go, I'm keeping him. After that, who knows.

 

[p4p1]

Yeah we do, with Levi n Marshall it's deeper. But looking at that list, how many would you describe as a defensive mid. We imported Dunkley to do it, Berry has been reborn into it, after that the cupboard is bare. We've seen how much better we've been in the midfield with a cpl of bulls in there and the stronger option to tag. On our list at the moment our best option to fill that role going fwd should Dunks or Berry both be out is Dev. (Assuming Lyons gone). We've seen this year how injuries can decimate one type of player in a season. He is contracted for next year, and unless he is asking to go, I'm keeping him. After that, who knows.

Honestly, we have a player or two that could do a defensive mid/lockdown role if required due to injuries etc. I am confident Starce could do the role, as could Answorth, Prior could likely do it as well in a pinch. The problem is you can't keep 44 AFL level guys on a list and have great backups for every position in case the worst happens. But pushing someone who has or could lock down a spot in a HFF/wing/HBF to a mid role for a while and pushing lesser proven player up to take their spot is what I would imagine the coaching staff would do if we do lose Dev this year.

 

[Berrygood]

Honestly, we have a player or two that could do a defensive mid/lockdown role if required due to injuries etc. I am confident Starce could do the role, as could Answorth, Prior could likely do it as well in a pinch. The problem is you can't keep 44 AFL level guys on a list and have great backups for every position in case the worst happens. But pushing someone who has or could lock down a spot in a HFF/wing/HBF to a mid role for a while and pushing lesser proven player up to take their spot is what I would imagine the coaching staff would do if we do lose Dev this year.

The 3 you mentioned I'm sure could do it at a pinch. But they are half backs, that's their strengths. Ashcroft, Bailey or Clugg could fill in down back but you'd rather use Answerth wouldn't you? If Berry and Dunkley were both out for 6plus weeks I don't think you'd be selecting Prior over Dev. Not after the improvement he showed v Suns as a Hb. Why weaken a strength by moving Starce? No sense there. Answerth maybe, not convinced, I'd still pick Dev. Maybe Torrent, or Marshall could develop into hunt ball, make tackle, stop him footballers. Fletcher I think can when he grows into his man's body but that's a year or so away. Tunstill is not as good as Dev. For goodness sake it's just for one more year for Dev if he doesn't want to go. He is good depth in a tough role, he's been loyal, he's maturing, I'm more than happy to see his contract out.

 

[Harry Haller]

Prior to the carnage of the last couple of weeks I think our list lacks a back up Key defender and a backup Key forward. The last couple of weeks just has the point emboldened. Ideally we could pick up a player that covers both roles.

I respect the role Joyce has taken on but i am not sure he is it.

Z is very young, and while I am glad we took the chance, he will take time. He looks to be still learning the basics of positioning, which is fine for his age. I did like his ability to get his hands free and find a teammate in his draft video while playing ruck. Maybe we throw him inside and tell him to hunt it and dish it out.

On the front end I am not convinced Ryan can adequately cover should Eric or Joe be struck down for multiple weeks.

I like Khamis, back off contract and can slide to third tall or fill in Key posts at either end when required. Not a bad user and good hands.

Borlase from Adelaide is down the pecking order there and is a younger option. Not sure he satisfies the forward requirement at all.

Short term T Macdonald from Melbourne is a FA and could provide cover at both ends for maybe two seasons while Z or potentially Gallop, Gillett, Richardson or whoever is in development.

 

[Pns_blister]

Prior to the carnage of the last couple of weeks I think our list lacks a back up Key defender and a backup Key forward. The last couple of weeks just has the point emboldened. Ideally we could pick up a player that covers both roles.

I respect the role Joyce has taken on but i am not sure he is it.

Z is very young, and while I am glad we took the chance, he will take time. He looks to be still learning the basics of positioning, which is fine for his age. I did like his ability to get his hands free and find a teammate in his draft video while playing ruck. Maybe we throw him inside and tell him to hunt it and dish it out.

On the front end I am not convinced Ryan can adequately cover should Eric or Joe be struck down for multiple weeks.

I like Khamis, back off contract and can slide to third tall or fill in Key posts at either end when required. Not a bad user and good hands.

Borlase from Adelaide is down the pecking order there and is a younger option. Not sure he satisfies the forward requirement at all.

Short term T Macdonald from Melbourne is a FA and could provide cover at both ends for maybe two seasons while Z or potentially Gallop, Gillett, Richardson or whoever is in development.

Tomlison at Dees is an interesting one too. Not sure of contract status

 

[Harry Haller]

Tomlison at Dees is an interesting one too. Not sure of contract status

Agreed, I had thought about him and omitted him for reasons unknown to me. I believe McDonald, Tomlinson and Borlase are UFA. Khamis must be traded.

Unless we generate D capital through one of our own departing, I am not sure we will trade in anyone this year. In that case would draft a genuine tall once we have secured our two top academy boys. If that tall is also from the academy, grand.

 

[Royboy1961]

Agreed, I had thought about him and omitted him for reasons unknown to me. I believe McDonald, Tomlinson and Borlase are UFA. Khamis must be traded.

Unless we generate D capital through one of our own departing, I am not sure we will trade in anyone this year. In that case would draft a genuine tall once we have secured our two top academy boys. If that tall is also from the academy, grand.

To me Gillet is a player that we could draft as a project player can be developed to play as a ruckman/forward .

 

[p4p1]

The 3 you mentioned I'm sure could do it at a pinch. But they are half backs, that's their strengths. Ashcroft, Bailey or Clugg could fill in down back but you'd rather use Answerth wouldn't you? If Berry and Dunkley were both out for 6plus weeks I don't think you'd be selecting Prior over Dev. Not after the improvement he showed v Suns as a Hb. Why weaken a strength by moving Starce? No sense there. Answerth maybe, not convinced, I'd still pick Dev. Maybe Torrent, or Marshall could develop into hunt ball, make tackle, stop him footballers. Fletcher I think can when he grows into his man's body but that's a year or so away. Tunstill is not as good as Dev. For goodness sake it's just for one more year for Dev if he doesn't want to go. He is good depth in a tough role, he's been loyal, he's maturing, I'm more than happy to see his contract out.

The game is won in the middle of the ground, especially if we need a defensive mid to curtail the oppos dominant mids. I would play Dev over the others in a defensive mid role, my post was about what we could do if we lost Dev. We have more guys who can fill in and do a serviceable job on a HBF than we do as a defensive mid. No Dev, Bez or Dunks would mean IMO that we would need to look into our backline to find someone to do a job. You wouldn’t waste Clugg or Neale, I wouldn’t trust Bailey or Rayner, Kai is probably a bit to small but would have the tank and tenacity. So I would look at someone like a Prior or Starce or Answerth to do the job knowing that we can plug the hole left in the backline, if there is one.
I don’t think we should move Dev on. I think his best option is to try and move on. He is at best 3rd in line for a defensive mid role and unlikely to get many games at senior level with us.

 

[Gadzorks]

Yeah we do, with Levi n Marshall it's deeper. But looking at that list, how many would you describe as a defensive mid. We imported Dunkley to do it, Berry has been reborn into it, after that the cupboard is bare. We've seen how much better we've been in the midfield with a cpl of bulls in there and the stronger option to tag. On our list at the moment our best option to fill that role going fwd should Dunks or Berry both be out is Dev. (Assuming Lyons gone). We've seen this year how injuries can decimate one type of player in a season. He is contracted for next year, and unless he is asking to go, I'm keeping him. After that, who knows.

I trust our system to turn drafted players into the weapons we need aka eric the back -> forward -> back

Seriously though the whole coaching direction is players must play two positions so there will be mids drafted that end up being half forwards, half backs and wings.

 

[BrisVegasDru]

Prior to the carnage of the last couple of weeks I think our list lacks a back up Key defender and a backup Key forward. The last couple of weeks just has the point emboldened. Ideally we could pick up a player that covers both roles.

I respect the role Joyce has taken on but i am not sure he is it.

Z is very young, and while I am glad we took the chance, he will take time. He looks to be still learning the basics of positioning, which is fine for his age. I did like his ability to get his hands free and find a teammate in his draft video while playing ruck. Maybe we throw him inside and tell him to hunt it and dish it out.

On the front end I am not convinced Ryan can adequately cover should Eric or Joe be struck down for multiple weeks.

I like Khamis, back off contract and can slide to third tall or fill in Key posts at either end when required. Not a bad user and good hands.

Borlase from Adelaide is down the pecking order there and is a younger option. Not sure he satisfies the forward requirement at all.

Short term T Macdonald from Melbourne is a FA and could provide cover at both ends for maybe two seasons while Z or potentially Gallop, Gillett, Richardson or whoever is in development.

I too like Borlase and has played up forward a little and looked useful

 

[Dalions]

I suspect Cam's last six weeks has increased his worth considerably

Have a feeling they will all sign with their current clubs.
Maybe Noah Balta might get huge offers to move which could entice him to leave.

 

[M Malice]

I suspect Cam's last six weeks has increased his worth considerably

RESTRICTED FREE AGENTS 2025
Andrew Brayshaw (Fremantle)
Luke Davies-Uniacke (North Melbourne)
Cam Rayner (Brisbane Lions)
James Worpel (Hawthorn)
Oscar Allen (West Coast Eagles)
Ed Richards (Western Bulldogs)
Charlie Ballard (Gold Coast Suns)
Noah Balta (Richmond)
___________________
There will be some huge money coming for Cam if he continues his current form through the rest of the season, IMO if he tears up a finals series clubs coming for him could offer up to 900K-1 Million per season for circa 5-6 years.

Would we be able to match that?

 

[LoganMorrisFan]

RESTRICTED FREE AGENTS 2025
Andrew Brayshaw (Fremantle)
Luke Davies-Uniacke (North Melbourne)
Cam Rayner (Brisbane Lions)
James Worpel (Hawthorn)
Oscar Allen (West Coast Eagles)
Ed Richards (Western Bulldogs)
Charlie Ballard (Gold Coast Suns)
Noah Balta (Richmond)
___________________
There will be some huge money coming for Cam if he continues his current form through the rest of the season, IMO if he tears up a finals series clubs coming for him could offer up to 900K-1 Million per season for circa 5-6 years.

Would we be able to match that?

I was thinking today whether or not our players have agreed to take less for the betterment of the team, Carlton players made it public that they were taking less for example. I imagine Cam ultimately wants to be the top dog in the midfield so perhaps that could be a big deciding factor. St Kilda and Essendon will come hard I'm sure.

 

[dlanod]

Cam is the one player more than others that I'd be shocked if he left. His buy-in to the club and work on the culture as a first overall pick (as commented on by several players over the years) has been significant.