Training 2024 Pre-Season

[akaifu]

Interesting Goddard made a comment about him , something like he was impressed in his continued improvement / highly impressed with him and from a guy that doesn't give out to many plaudits -( is is above Owens , Phillipou and Windhager) Byrne still only 22 and one of the best gut runners in the squad could overtake a few of the more fantasy players who where drafted way higher.
A lot of the time this kids don't hit there straps until they crack 24 and the way Byrne has improved every year he could be a very good player - the work he is putting in on the track could well pay off.

 

[gringo2011]

So dropping players playing well throughout the season for kids with average VFL form is what you want to happen?

Regardless of age, the players with the best form should play every week. If that means 3 draftees make the best 22 or none, that's fine. Give the games to those who warrant it rather than gifting for the sake of being able to say we are playing more kids. We've drafted good enough players over the past 3 years that they will play games on merit.

You don't want that but if you have competition for the bottom 4 spots and favour kids development over anything else I think you can manage both. Ideally the Port Adelaide model of always having players coming through from the draft is kept up. Lyon was very much a best 22 with very little change last time. To our detriment.

 

[BrutThough]

You don't want that but if you have competition for the bottom 4 spots and favour kids development over anything else I think you can manage both. Ideally the Port Adelaide model of always having players coming through from the draft is kept up. Lyon was very much a best 22 with very little change last time. To our detriment.

We dont really need to manage both given we already have a decent amount of under 23s who are best 22 in their own right.

Playing our best side means kids are already playing.

 

[gringo2011]

We dont really need to manage both given we already have a decent amount of under 23s who are best 22 in their own right.

Playing our best side means kids are already playing.

We could have said that last year and left a whole lot out too. If we aren't in premiership mode the investment in the future is probably worth more than a couple of wins. If we are 5 and 0 maybe we start playing a very settled line up and start trying to finish top 4 but if we can manage the youth quota at the same time as being competitive I think that's the best model.

 

[The Punter]

In the Richo and Ratten eras, I think the criticism was kids were not playing at the expense of underperforming senior players.

In the first Ross era, it was more players with underappreciated value getting games ahead of kids.

Having said that, Owens, NWM and Phillipou make it hard to drop them on merit.

 

[Saint believer]

back in 2009. ross played the same 24 -28 players for 20 games.

And look how that ended!!!!!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

And look how that ended!!!!!

Yeah should have got more games into Colm Belgley.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Some flighty post-rationalising amongst some salient points. IMO.. I liked Simpson more haha and I think he will be a powerful little mid-half forward for a long time. I think he's closest to hotton rather than Garcia or Wilson. Hopefully not though and Hastie kills it

Probably like you l was surprised slash disappointed when we didn't select Simpson, but in recent times I've come to understand that l know absolutely SFA about it, and like everyone just get sucked in by highlights videos.

We've got Hotton, Wilson and Garcia. Then Windy, Chito and Pou.
Then Clark and Dow
Then Steele, Crouch, Ross and cameos from Sinclair.

I can see the Hastie argument just fine. He'll be a gun.

 

[Premium]

In the Richo and Ratten eras, I think the criticism was kids were not playing at the expense of underperforming senior players.

In the first Ross era, it was more players with underappreciated value getting games ahead of kids.

Having said that, Owens, NWM and Phillipou make it hard to drop them on merit.

We have been lucky the last few years picking up the likes of Owens, Windhager , Milera , Phillipou making it easy to slot them into the team , injuries also helping blood kids like Camanitti.

The 4 I have mentioned to me should be locks in the team going forward , with the inclusion of Henry a few of the players who have picked up injuries like Dow , Clark and Butler might find it hard to get back into the side.

I don't know how the side will line up but just putting a rough 22 together you can see there is going to be a few missing out.

Webster / Howard / Wilkie
Sinclair / Battle / Milera
Hill / Owens / Wood
Sharman / Hayes / Henry
Higgins / King / Phillipou

Marshall / Steele / Crouch

Byrne - Stocker - Windhager - Ross

out due to injury - Clark , Dow , Butler , Paton

 

[sunny3193]

Man Garcia is gonna be super pissed, the stare will be off the charts blank.

Blue Steel levels.

 

[Otiman]

So dropping players playing well throughout the season for kids with average VFL form is what you want to happen?

Regardless of age, the players with the best form should play every week. If that means 3 draftees make the best 22 or none, that's fine. Give the games to those who warrant it rather than gifting for the sake of being able to say we are playing more kids. We've drafted good enough players over the past 3 years that they will play games on merit.

Fast tracking player development with a combination of VFL and AFL level is key. It's not about "being able to say we are playing more kids", it's about fast tracking development, letting players see their deficiencies at AFL level and work on them.

If you develop kids entirely at VFL level, you will end up with VFL level players. Then you have to develop them again from VFL level to AFL level. This shortcuts that step and gets you a core group of young players much quicker.

The goal is to win a premiership, not to languish mid-table. This is the path we need to take, even if 'deserving' players have to play VFL for a while.

 

[BrutThough]

We could have said that last year and left a whole lot out too. If we aren't in premiership mode the investment in the future is probably worth more than a couple of wins. If we are 5 and 0 maybe we start playing a very settled line up and start trying to finish top 4 but if we can manage the youth quota at the same time as being competitive I think that's the best model.

The kids who didn't get a game last year didn't deserve one. They were barely putting up average performances in the VFL let alone playing well enough to warrant being promoted to the AFL side. The ones who did perform got promoted and played a significant amount in the seniors.

The experience they got playing finals and playing in those must win games late in the season will be invaluable to any future success we have. Winning and playing in big games is what we need as a club.

 

[Leap of Faith]

Jones would be a big loss.

Yes and no. I don't really count him anyway. If he's injured again with another soft tissue leg injury it's not looking good. Has played less than half the possible games in his time at the Saints. Only 4 last year. He's just not reliable enough.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Blue Steel levels.

He might be able to get a job in an Australian soap drama.

 

[MordySaint]

Yes and no. I don't really count him anyway. If he's injured again with another soft tissue leg injury it's not looking good. Has played less than half the possible games in his time at the Saints. Only 4 last year. He's just not reliable enough.

I thought the club made a calculated gamble giving him an extension to his contract, if it came off and he went injury free then great its a bonus... if not we expected it and have backup now.

Not too concerned.

 

[BrutThough]

Fast tracking player development with a combination of VFL and AFL level is key. It's not about "being able to say we are playing more kids", it's about fast tracking development, letting players see their deficiencies at AFL level and work on them.

If you develop kids entirely at VFL level, you will end up with VFL level players. Then you have to develop them again from VFL level to AFL level. This shortcuts that step and gets you a core group of young players much quicker.

The goal is to win a premiership, not to languish mid-table. This is the path we need to take, even if 'deserving' players have to play VFL for a while.

If a player is dominating the VFL, then they should be promoted. If they aren't, they don't need to play a senior game to tell us what we already know they are struggling with at a lower level.

 

[Saintbloke]

Could be interesting for Lyon this season re team selection. To go another step, we need to keep the best team on the field for the best part of the season- as much as possible, and that's how you get deep into September finals. Any senior player with an injury history may struggle to get a regular gig in the seniors- especially the running ball carriers. I still see the midfield as our big problem, more the lack of class than lack of workrate, and Lyon may need get creative in that area.

 

[StFly]

Probably like you l was surprised slash disappointed when we didn't select Simpson, but in recent times I've come to understand that l know absolutely SFA about it, and like everyone just get sucked in by highlights videos.

We've got Hotton, Wilson and Garcia. Then Windy, Chito and Pou.
Then Clark and Dow
Then Steele, Crouch, Ross and cameos from Sinclair.

I can see the Hastie argument just fine. He'll be a gun.

As you indicate, it's a balance thing.

Wasn't worried at all about Simpson, obviously a talent but he's not Pou or Wilson and by that stage we've got both already and Windy and Owens to rotate in there with maybe Hotton. Webster can only go on so long, same with Paton as his leg break kinda sunted him, NWM is nice, Sincs is well, Sincs, but outside of Wilkie do you have that puire defender that can read the play ahead of time?

Coff spent most of his time either "I'm a slow moving mid" early doors, or "I had one good season and the rest injured" in later years for people to still rate high as his currency fell by the years, Clark who has spent most of his time being a crash test dummy who kinda proved he had no business being around that D50 at all, and you trialled Windy there for a season to some sucess after Paton broke his leg. Webster also isn't getting any younger.

So we went;

Wilson - mid/fwd as Pou + Wilson coming through together both as mid/fwd, yes please.
Collard - look, I like Butler but prefer Higgins as Higgo can provide body as well, Collard shits on both in skill, if you need a small forward he's that guy for the above two.
You're then basd on a choice thing, Simpson or Hastie if you rate both as similar.
You go Hastie as you lost Coff as that interceptor, you have rebound in NWM and Sincs, Windy can also rotate back as could Paton for general, do you just bank on Mclennan? Do you ad a third mid/fwd in same grouping when you already also have Owens there as a utility spec ala Wood? Say you pick Simpson, do you then pick Shoenmaker? As what's a booming boot in general defense if you can't defend the ball all that well?

 

[stavro#4]

Fast tracking player development with a combination of VFL and AFL level is key. It's not about "being able to say we are playing more kids", it's about fast tracking development, letting players see their deficiencies at AFL level and work on them.

If you develop kids entirely at VFL level, you will end up with VFL level players. Then you have to develop them again from VFL level to AFL level. This shortcuts that step and gets you a core group of young players much quicker.

The goal is to win a premiership, not to languish mid-table. This is the path we need to take, even if 'deserving' players have to play VFL for a while.

Club thinks it has a group of 10 kids who can and most probably will play some AFL footy at some point.

List is not ready to contend (doesn’t mean we can’t win it) still developing what we have and getting a clearer picture of what we need.

You are right in saying it’s a balancing act as that was probably what I poorly explained. But if we are flying - we will blood kids and feed them games along the way.

Ross learnt a lot from Scott in this regard and openly tells people he probably got it wrong when we were challenging last

 

[akaifu]

What do we think of this team by foxsports, lads?

Personally, would rather see Collard over Byrnes because that forward line lacks a lot of speed, and Dow over Ross but doubt Ross gets dropped by RTB. Dougs for Cordy as well.

 

[LuckyBounce!]

Anyone know what time training starts Friday? Might go for a look

 

[PoppedCorn]

Think Zac went off sore today. Being consoled by a trainer as he headed inside. Fingers crossed

 

[saintmike65]

Friday will be a major match sim day for those that can make it.
I’ll do a match report for those unable to get down to RSEA park.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Friday will be a major match sim day for those that can make it.
I’ll do a match report for those unable to get down to RSEA park.

Dare I ask: The old 9.30 slot?

 

[Joffaboy]

Friday will be a major match sim day for those that can make it.
I’ll do a match report for those unable to get down to RSEA park.

I'll try to get there as well.

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