List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.2

[austinnn]

Smith for a future first and a 2nd coming back would be ideal if we were entering that conversation. Wouldn't want to part with this years firsts.

smith for 8 could be a nice move, i haven't followed him that closely but his age profile could help us in the mid range

still prefer to hit the draft just for funsies

Here's a twist:

Not really a fan of Bailey Sniff, but the Cats are, but won't have any picks around his range, so how about we give them our Battle compo to get Social Media Sensation BS, in return for their 1RDP, plus 2RDP or player (George Stevens s'il vous plait!)

We can then use their 1RDP on my boy Cooper Hynes.

 

[HeavenlySources]

Here's a twist:

Not really a fan of Bailey Sniff, but the Cats are, but won't have any picks around his range, so how about we give them our Battle compo to get Social Media Sensation BS, in return for their 1RDP, plus 2RDP or player (George Stevens s'il vous plait!)

We can then use their 1RDP on my boy Cooper Hynes.

Please no, Geelong don't deserve anymore one-sided deals in their favour. They can't keep getting away with this.

 

[austinnn]

I see your point Shlong.

Whoops, pardon. These damn slacks.

 

[Jesuswasacarpenter]

Heard on the radio today that the Melbourne Storm send all their players out to do some manual labour on job sites so that they harden up and don't whinge when they have to go to training. I might be less full of shit than I actually am.

If you are full of the good shit...I don't see there being any problem

 

[ThomasR]

No Finals 2 years in a row ... with all 3 playing maximum amount of games

Good midfields find a way to overcome setbacks and lead their teams to victory

As stated their impact in terms of hitting the scoreboard is substandard ... last 2 years 136 games between all 3 of them for 47 goals in total

I want my gun mids or at least a few of them kicking goals

Bontempelli .... last 2 years .... 47 games for 51 goals
Naicos - 45 games for 39 goals
Petracca - 38 games for 42 goals
Rozee - 46 games for 33 goals
McCluggage - 49 games 30 goals
Treloar - 42 games 29 goals
Butters - 49 games 26 goals
Anderson - 46 games 27 goals

Then you got Heeney ... this year alone playing as a mid - 22 games for 31 goals

And Warner - 22 games for 33 goals

My comparison with Essington mids stands given their mids don't kick goals either ... and yep they don't make finals as well

On the flipside .... top teams like Geelong & GWS who do make more Finals than not are very reliant on their forwardlines kicking goals .... hold their forwardlines and you more than likely win ... same with Freo & the Dopers

Goals are one thing, but maybe worth noting Brayshaw was 8th, Young 14th, and Serong 16th in the league for average score involvements this year. For perspective the only other club with 3 mids in the top 30 was Sydney (Heeney 2nd, Warner 4th, Gulden 5th !!).

Our top three overall were Sinclair (36th), Higgins (65th) and Steele (70th). Obviously doesn't help when you don't score much.

Young is also 6th for goal assists which is elite for someone playing mostly midfield and not the link up half forward role. Poster boy for the half back to mid transition... along with Dawson, Day, Richards, Rivers etc all beautiful penetrating kicks first and foremost.

Young/Serong started rotating forward more in the second half of the year, which is why Petracca/Bont etc are good for a goal a game ... Young kicked 13 goals from his last 17 games, and Serong 11 from his last 12. Decent numbers.

Missed the 8 by half a game, largely thanks to an inexplicable performance against West Coast and a shocking one point loss to the Bombers. Pushed a few top 4 teams in their last few games without Treacy, Darcy and Pearce. I'm very bullish on them next year, their mids are not the problem, Johnson is going to be a good player as well IMO.

Side note, GWS have the highest % of goals from their top 5 goalkickers (61%), Hogan Greene Riccardi Cadman Daniels, to say they aren't reliant on their forwards might be misleading. Geelong are 5th. Collingwood lowest at 40%. Don't know what it means, just found it interesting.

 

[gringo2011]

Who are the midfield engine of a team that ain't playing Finals .... a team that also includes other All Australian squad players

Great numbers ... but the impact?

That is the most unsophisticated assessment I've read in ages. Ladder position isn't based on your best three mids. Freo should have made finals over the Blues but shat the bed under pressure. Port Adelaide have one of the best midfields in footy and the AFL forgot to give the the premiership for some reason. Geelong have one of the thinnest midfields in the league and are in the hunt.

 

[sauce_head]

No Finals 2 years in a row ... with all 3 playing maximum amount of games

Good midfields find a way to overcome setbacks and lead their teams to victory

As stated their impact in terms of hitting the scoreboard is substandard ... last 2 years 136 games between all 3 of them for 47 goals in total

I want my gun mids or at least a few of them kicking goals

Bontempelli .... last 2 years .... 47 games for 51 goals
Naicos - 45 games for 39 goals
Petracca - 38 games for 42 goals
Rozee - 46 games for 33 goals
McCluggage - 49 games 30 goals
Treloar - 42 games 29 goals
Butters - 49 games 26 goals
Anderson - 46 games 27 goals

Then you got Heeney ... this year alone playing as a mid - 22 games for 31 goals

And Warner - 22 games for 33 goals

My comparison with Essington mids stands given their mids don't kick goals either ... and yep they don't make finals as well

On the flipside .... top teams like Geelong & GWS who do make more Finals than not are very reliant on their forwardlines kicking goals and not so much their mids .... hold their forwardlines and you more than likely win ... same with Freo & the Dopers

Heeney is playing more as a forward than a mid. He’d have to be the second or third most targeted within forward 50 of the entire Swans team.

 

[austinnn]

Please no, Geelong don't deserve anymore one-sided deals in their favour. They can't keep getting away with this.

Fair enough. How would you tip the balance towards us in a realistic way?

 

[jh38]

Heeney is playing more as a forward than a mid. He’d have to be the second or third most targeted within forward 50 of the entire Swans team.

Don't know about that, he has their second highest CBA rate at 74%, only behind Grundy. I'd say its more got to do with the Swans' system considering all of their mids are hitting the scoreboard big time. They love opening up the forwardline and letting their mids tee off from 50m out.

 

[SG34]

Who is the most impressive team rising up in 2024? It has to be Hawthorn. And what of their mid - forward set up? What can we glean from them?

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Who is the most impressive team rising up in 2024? It has to be Hawthorn. And what of their mid - forward set up? What can we glean from them?

Team, culture, love-in and maniac pressure.

 

[Sarcoidevo]

Heeney is playing more as a forward than a mid. He’d have to be the second or third most targeted within forward 50 of the entire Swans team.

2023 - 357 disposals 30 goals
2024 - 564 disposals 31 goals

Agree that in 2023 he played more forward but this year he has played mid ... 564 disposals .... every footy pundit agrees ... they have been saying it all year that he has transitioned to a mid

It's why I only included this year for him when I listed those goal kicking mids

 

[Sarcoidevo]

That is the most unsophisticated assessment I've read in ages. Ladder position isn't based on your best three mids. Freo should have made finals over the Blues but shat the bed under pressure. Port Adelaide have one of the best midfields in footy and the AFL forgot to give the the premiership for some reason. Geelong have one of the thinnest midfields in the league and are in the hunt.

Errrr.... its an argument about whether Brayshaw is worth paying a bucket load for in a trade

Personally I don't think he impacts games as some other mids do given the big numbers he puts up

Serong slightly better but this year both had a higher handball to kick ratio and their kicking efficencies were near 50%

Freo have missed Finals the past 2 years .... that is undeniable ... woulda coulda shoulda ... fk that

If I am going to cough up two 1st rounders for a gun mid I dont want to be missing Finals .... I want an absolute assurance that they are going to put us in contention

 

[pebblesofsand]

Who is the most impressive team rising up in 2024? It has to be Hawthorn. And what of their mid - forward set up? What can we glean from them?

That sometimes you just get lucky.

Why Hawks' father-son gun was drafted so late

Cal Twomey takes a look at why Hawks forward Calsher Dear ended up being taken so late in last year's draft

www.afl.com.au

 

[saintron]

What has happened to the war chest the saints were to have. Nil discussion in paper etc on who they are chasing

 

[botts]

What has happened to the war chest the saints were to have. Nil discussion in paper etc on who they are chasing

Can’t chase any free agents this year because it will affect the battle compo and we want to hit the draft. Next year we have a couple of targets we have already offered massive cash to.

 

[sauce_head]

2023 - 357 disposals 30 goals
2024 - 564 disposals 31 goals

Agree that in 2023 he played more forward but this year he has played mid ... 564 disposals .... every footy pundit agrees ... they have been saying it all year that he has transitioned to a mid

It's why I only included this year for him when I listed those goal kicking mids

I have been to probably 7 swans matches this year, including last week, (SCG membership) and he plays a lot as a forward still. Albeit probably not as much on Saturday. He’s is a great player, don’t get me wrong, but not all of those goals come as a mid. A lot come as a forward.

Semantics, perhaps!

 

[Saintbloke]

Team, culture, love-in and maniac pressure.

Sounds a tad like GT's time as coach

 

[sauce_head]

Don't know about that, he has their second highest CBA rate at 74%, only behind Grundy. I'd say its more got to do with the Swans' system considering all of their mids are hitting the scoreboard big time. They love opening up the forwardline and letting their mids tee off from 50m out.

I think he plays both roles, and very well.

Spent a lot of time at swans games this year and he still plays a lot as a lead up forward (think about the two goals he kicked in a minute vs is on Webster when Webster when off with a blood nose, for instance).

Where do you get CBA stats from? I was thinking about that.

Take your point though, he is more than a mere forward!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

2023 - 357 disposals 30 goals
2024 - 564 disposals 31 goals

Agree that in 2023 he played more forward but this year he has played mid ... 564 disposals .... every footy pundit agrees ... they have been saying it all year that he has transitioned to a mid

It's why I only included this year for him when I listed those goal kicking mids

He was thrown in the middle due to other injuries. Coach was intending on putting him back forward but he was too good.
Luke Parker struggled to make the 22.

The Heeney conundrum: 'Explosive' Swan adds to midfield squeeze

Isaac Heeney's starring role in the middle last week has given coach John Longmire even more to think about

www.afl.com.au

 

[HeavenlySources]

Fair enough. How would you tip the balance towards us in a realistic way?

I just wouldn’t get involved in Geelong deals fullstop, they have shown to be unreasonable like how they haggled with Port over two late draft picks. Sure they turned out to be great picks and they had a plan.

Lets get involved in Gold Coast deals there are stronger list management teams in the AFL and weaker ones (we used to be one of them) we have to be sharks.

 

[Yawkey way]

That sometimes you just get lucky.

Why Hawks' father-son gun was drafted so late

Cal Twomey takes a look at why Hawks forward Calsher Dear ended up being taken so late in last year's draft

www.afl.com.au

They’ve drafted well and had a bit of luck, Ginnivan fell into their lap but it was brave call on Watson so early. They clearly had a plan to go small up forward and it’s worked so far.

 

[HeavenlySources]

What has happened to the war chest the saints were to have. Nil discussion in paper etc on who they are chasing

All our FA targets are out of contract next year: LDU, Brayshaw, Weitering (i think) etc

We chased Mccluggage this year but he re-signed and you can see why.

We aren’t a destination club right now. The pressure is on next year to continue to show promise and move up the ladder.

FA want to come to exciting winning teams not 12th.

 

[Minga]

All our FA targets are out of contract next year: LDU, Brayshaw, Weitering (i think) etc

We chased Mccluggage this year but he re-signed and you can see why.

We aren’t a destination club right now. The pressure is on next year to continue to show promise and move up the ladder.

FA want to come to exciting winning teams not 12th.

Another reason why nailing the draft with multiple good picks is so important this year.

By the end of next year we could be set up with our young fleet and loaded up to buy some free agents to fill in that gap between our vets and our youngins - so hopefully we have a good, attractive year. PLUS take our first to the draft again (unless we trade it in this year).

Though, tbh, I don’t really care that much about free agents, ultimately I think any real push will come from drafted players we develop.

 

[Sully111]

Errrr.... its an argument about whether Brayshaw is worth paying a bucket load for in a trade

Personally I don't think he impacts games as some other mids do given the big numbers he puts up

Serong slightly better but this year both had a higher handball to kick ratio and their kicking efficencies were near 50%

Freo have missed Finals the past 2 years .... that is undeniable ... woulda coulda shoulda ... fk that

If I am going to cough up two 1st rounders for a gun mid I dont want to be missing Finals .... I want an absolute assurance that they are going to put us in contention

Carlton missed for finals for a lot of Cripps' time playing. I would have been happy for him to become a Saint.