List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.2

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I will never understand trying to make Sinclair a midfielder over and over again. Maybe we want to rotate Houston and Sinclair between half back and midfield, but it's not my cup of tea.

Paying stupid money for a part time mid who plays mainly down back doesn't feel like a wise investment.

Sinclair and NWM are elite half backs, can we not just leave them where they thrive?
Completely agree that Sinclair is better behind the ball but I think there is room for all three of them.

Houston's not a pressing need, but I think there's little doubt he would make us better in the role that was occupied by Bonner for most of the year. If you go by these ratings (I don't know much about their worth or how they are calculated) he is ranked the 10th best player in the AFL and number one defender. He's relatively durable and you'd hope to get 6-7 years out of him at a minimum.

So much of our game style revolves around uncontested marks, continuous ball movement and changing angles. I think it's why Bonner got such an extended run, why we drafted Arie and why someone like Dougal is perpetually on the nose. And why a player like Houston would be such a valuable commodity, not just for us but most clubs.

The game style is aligned with competition trends - 2024 was the lowest contested mark year since the stat was recorded. Sydney have something like the 7th-lowest average of any team in 25 years. The elimination final was a good example, the Bulldogs are the highest contested mark side in the comp but they got chopped up by the Hawks who kept the ball in motion, kept shifting the defence and were rarely hemmed into going long down the line to a contest, unlike the Dogs. Good kicks who have the ability to keep their composure and make good decisions under pressure are worth their weight in gold, and Houston is one of the best IMO.

He's the same age as Mason Wood when he came across, Jeremy Cameron to Geelong etc... plenty of football left in him. Like everyone I wouldn't want to give up too much draft capital but we'd be silly not to ask the question.
 
For how high they were picked both Clark and Coffield are abject fails. However the club chose the absolute worst draft in history to attempt to find two possible midfielders. I distinctly recall Elshaugh stating that he thought both had midfield potential following the draft. It just shows how bad the club were at list management and projecting talent ahead of time back then. Stacking early picks is one thing, timing and making the right selections is another.

The errors back then are not the reason to trade out of this years draft, unless we can find an A grade midfielder that wants to joins us eg Brayshaw.
Both were/are super talented and neither were 'reaches'. As I've said many times, Trout was very conservative in his choices outside of going off on his own in taking Dmac over Touk.

Both did have midfield potential... one was a mid & the other had played a bit of mid with some success.

Sadly both C & C were wrecked by injuries just when they were looking like be high quality players for us.

Hunts is going ok now that he's having a reasonable run at it.
 
Talking of tall backs, injuries throw up strange possibilities. There's a very good chance in these cutthroat semi finals Ethan Phillips plays for Hawthorn and old mate Darragh Joyce comes in for Brisbane.
 

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Both were/are super talented and neither were 'reaches'. As I've said many times, Trout was very conservative in his choices outside of going off on his own in taking Dmac over Touk.

Both did have midfield potential... one was a mid & the other had played a bit of mid with some success.

Sadly both C & C were wrecked by injuries just when they were looking like be high quality players for us.

Hunts is going ok now that he's having a reasonable run at it.

You can dance around the decisions any way you like in reality both were shockers. Injuries is just an excuse for these two - neither have the drive or the attributes to be above average players and both were waisted selections. Clark gets injured because he has zero endurance and is constantly fatigued hence the 55% TOG we now use him. Coffield was never anything other than a battling medium sized defender, both were shocking decisions in a very poor draft year.
 
In hindsight how much different is Hill's output to Acres since that time? Given that we threw Blake in as a steak knives and everything else we gave we definitely over paid for Hill. Of the 3 others we got in the brokered deal, 1 has retired and the other two still dont have contracts for next year. Plus we stilll dont have another AFL standard ruckman if Marshall goes down. To suggest the Hill trade was reasonable is the exact reason our list remained in the state it was was for decades. Oh and how is Caleb Serong going at Freo BTW?

Sugar hits and quick fixes have never worked unless you already have the core of a very good side.
Freo wanted to Blacres.

We didn't think paying him $500k to run around at Sandy was a great idea... he was pretty ordinary at Freo (behind Hill IMO). He's not the 1st bloke to come good when it's his last chance to do so (see Freo Jesse Hogan v Giants Jesse Hogan).

Hill, Butler, Jones, Howard were all in our best 22 this year. I didn't say anything about next year. Hilly has been fantastic since Ross took over (will probably be top 5 B&F this year IMO).

We've been over this a million times but there's no guarantee that we even take Serong.

What has Roma got to do with it?

Our list is where it is now for a wide variety of reasons... many of which are the exact opposite of sugar hits and quick fixes.
 
You can dance around the decisions any way you like in reality both were shockers. Injuries is just an excuse for these two - neither have the drive or the attributes to be above average players and both were waisted selections. Clark gets injured because he has zero endurance and is constantly fatigued hence the 55% TOG we now use him. Coffield was never anything other than a battling medium sized defender, both were shocking decisions in a very poor draft year.

Ok mate.

It's funny how you accuse others of posting in an arrogant manner yet bag factual info. I bet you never saw either of them before they put on RWB.

Zero endurance resulting in Hunter's broken jaw, smashed cheekbone and splattered nose is a funny one though.
 
Completely agree that Sinclair is better behind the ball but I think there is room for all three of them.

Houston's not a pressing need, but I think there's little doubt he would make us better in the role that was occupied by Bonner for most of the year. If you go by these ratings (I don't know much about their worth or how they are calculated) he is ranked the 10th best player in the AFL and number one defender. He's relatively durable and you'd hope to get 6-7 years out of him at a minimum.

So much of our game style revolves around uncontested marks, continuous ball movement and changing angles. I think it's why Bonner got such an extended run, why we drafted Arie and why someone like Dougal is perpetually on the nose. And why a player like Houston would be such a valuable commodity, not just for us but most clubs.

The game style is aligned with competition trends - 2024 was the lowest contested mark year since the stat was recorded. Sydney have something like the 7th-lowest average of any team in 25 years. The elimination final was a good example, the Bulldogs are the highest contested mark side in the comp but they got chopped up by the Hawks who kept the ball in motion, kept shifting the defence and were rarely hemmed into going long down the line to a contest, unlike the Dogs. Good kicks who have the ability to keep their composure and make good decisions under pressure are worth their weight in gold, and Houston is one of the best IMO.

He's the same age as Mason Wood when he came across, Jeremy Cameron to Geelong etc... plenty of football left in him. Like everyone I wouldn't want to give up too much draft capital but we'd be silly not to ask the question.
There are definite positives with Houston

He has a beautiful kick that breaks lines and can take a contested grab ... is a good decision maker and knows how to position himself and find the ball

He would also be a great mentor for Arie given they have similar traits and that he may eventually play a similar role given his kicking abilities .... it could give Arie more time to develop

Agree also that he is durable and could easily play another 5-6 years

It is just the price to pay for him as we need to get some gun midfield youth thru the door .... if we get 8 for Battle ..... we need to use that and 7 and hit the draft

Maybe we could dangle our future 1st .... it could be anywhere between 4 to 14 .... would Port go for that?

Probably not ... as reckon they would want more
 
Ok mate.

It's funny how you accuse others of posting in an arrogant manner yet bag factual info. I bet you never saw either of them before they put on RWB.

Zero endurance resulting in Hunter's broken jaw, smashed cheekbone and splattered nose is a funny one though.

Are you Elshaugh or Gallagher? How do you know what went on at the club at that time? HTF can you quantify as what you say as factual, thats just folly and yes arrogant.

Clark's lack of endurance and slow reaction times have a 100% contributed to his injuries. He is courageous, but never looks alert and moves like a glacier and puts his head where he shouldnt because of that. If he had quicker reflexes and movement he would turn his body into the contests rather than leading with his scon.

I have had a broken jaw in a very similiar fashion to Hunter It occurred because I was slow fumbled the ball went back to collect it and got cleaned up by a hip and shoulder. I dont blame the opponent I would have done the exact same thing.

In any event the discussions was about drafting Clark & Coffield. Go and have a look at the All Australian side from there draft year. 2017 was a shocking year and a very poor year to be banking two early picks.
 
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Are you Elshaugh or Gallagher? How do you know what went on at the club at that time? HTF can you quantify as what you say as factual, thats just folly and yes arrogant.
Coffield was trending beautifully as a gun 3rd tall ... had a great 2020 .... then injury gods hit ... hamstrings/calves/acl/shoulder

Horrific collision injuries curtailed Clark's development .... you don't just magically recover from car crash like head injuries

So easy hindsight to say they were crap selections as there was a definite period of time when St Kilda fans were salivating over the future prospects of these 2 .... the St Kilda curse can get fkd
 

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With Battle gone, hopefully there is an opportunity to take as much of Macrae's contract as possible so we can minimise the draft capital we would need to acquire him. Our third rounder sits right in front of theirs. Then maybe some late future pick swaps.

John Donahue from SEN thinks we are the most likely Macrae destination.
 
I'd give future first for Houston.

We just have to take 7 & 8 this year - 2 x 10 year mids (hopefully)

Play finals 2025

Brayshaw or LDU as FA 2025.

That's how we become a contender for a flag 2026-2028
And how do you make this happen because it wont , you know it , i know it
 
No it would be idiotic to give up pick #8 for a flanker, who is not a midfielder. Just like we sold the farm to get Brad Hill, who has been good but he is not an elite midfielder or a match winner.
I think you may want to assess the market rate at the moment.

Pick 8 would likely be unders for Dan Houston.

He’s an elite player in the competition, irrespective of position.

Not sure if you’ve noticed but there’s a half back flanker that plays at Richmond that’s requested a trade.. has never made an AA side, likely to go for pick 6 and change.

It would be more idiotic to ignore opportunities to improve the talent on your list.
 
Coffield was trending beautifully as a gun 3rd tall ... had a great 2020 .... then injury gods hit ... hamstrings/calves/acl/shoulder

Horrific collision injuries curtailed Clark's development .... you don't just magically recover from car crash like head injuries

So easy hindsight to say they were crap selections as there was a definite period of time when St Kilda fans were salivating over the future prospects of these 2 .... the St Kilda curse can get fkd
I'm not so sure about that but its possible as Saints fans Salivate over players like DMac and Byrnes who are and were just battlers,
Being called a battler is not that bad either for all you sensitive chaps , both have at least played AFL
 
Coffield was trending beautifully as a gun 3rd tall ... had a great 2020 .... then injury gods hit ... hamstrings/calves/acl/shoulder

Horrific collision injuries curtailed Clark's development .... you don't just magically recover from car crash like head injuries

So easy hindsight to say they were crap selections as there was a definite period of time when St Kilda fans were salivating over the future prospects of these 2 .... the St Kilda curse can get fkd

Its 2017, its draft time, its apparent to everyone that Coffield and Clark are spuds.
We should get Naughton, hell no, we've drafted enough talls, we have Carlisle and Goddard, we need mids.
How about Lachie O'Brian? He's a highly rated mid. Surely we would be stupid not to get him.
All us BF experts want Bonar. He oozes X-factor. How could we go wrong with O'Brian and Bonar?
Fogarty.... We have Paddy, Paddy is a bit on the short side but so is Fogarty...we want mids MIDS I TELL YOU.
Jarrod Brandar...is he a mid...Yeah we can make him a mid.
Mathew Ling?

Hate to mess it up and draft someone like Hunter Clark who is surely least likely to make it as a mid.
 
What's the knock on Macrae?

Stopped reading when I saw his name was Jack, come on down mate

In all seriousness tho, if we can swallow the cap space and he costs bugger all (I doubt the dogs get in the way of a trade), then sure why not - when he’s on, he’s as good a ball pig as I’ve ever seen. But I doubt anyone has high expectations for him.

An apt Crouch replacement.
 
You can dance around the decisions any way you like in reality both were shockers. Injuries is just an excuse for these two - neither have the drive or the attributes to be above average players and both were waisted selections. Clark gets injured because he has zero endurance and is constantly fatigued hence the 55% TOG we now use him. Coffield was never anything other than a battling medium sized defender, both were shocking decisions in a very poor draft year.
Don't agree at all that they were shockers. Both are still in AFL teams 7 years after being drafted.
Coffield's acl was a huge blow, and has stifled his career.
Clark started to show his quality in the back end when he got a block.of consecutive games. No coincidence our midfield looked significantly better with him Jones and Dow getting multiple repeat games.
To say they were abject failures is overegging the pudding by a mile. Go back and watch how important Clark was in and under in the last month of football.1

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
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What's the knock on Macrae?

We should be all over this, his value would have plummeted this year and he can step in where we missed Crouch this year. I don't think the Dogs could realistically ask for much more than a third rounder and his full salary paid.

Hopefully we can sell him on game time and role, no doubt he'd prefer to go somewhere closer to a flag but I don't think he'd get much mid time in any of the current top 6 sides either. Maybe Geelong, although hopefully they're busy with Bailey Sniff.
 
Clark's lack of endurance and slow reaction times have a 100% contributed to his injuries. He is courageous, but never looks alert and moves like a glacier and puts his head where he shouldnt because of that. If he had quicker reflexes and movement he would turn his body into the contests rather than leading with his scon.

I have had a broken jaw in a very similiar fashion to Hunter It occurred because I was slow fumbled the ball went back to collect it and got cleaned up by a hip and shoulder. I dont blame the opponent I would have done the exact same thithing
Sorry is this a joke??

Clark didn't even fumble the ball when McKay blindsided him at top speed .... are you saying he should have been more alert and squibbed the contest?



Hey here is another vid showing Clark's terrible reflexes and movement .... seriously what a spud

 
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