Past #25: Robbie Tarrant - traded to RFC for CCJ&picks - 2yr deal at RFC - 174 NM games/44 NM goals - retires 13/7/23 effective immediately

[Flawed Genius]

No, but he sues

That's a pretty poor joke, ol'son.

 

[Roobound]

What he needs to do for mine is improve his current output, to often over 38 games he is a non contributor. He really needs to start a game well because if he does nothing early in a game often he is a non contributor for the whole day & is looking at the red vest. The thing that's interesting is he sometimes kicks goals against good defensive teams.
His actual issue is he is not quick enough to get separation from his opponent & is not good at using his body to out mark people & only needs slight physical presence to be spoilt. It is the marks he drops where he has the obvious advantage that frustrate me if that improves everybody will be happy but he should be looking at 2 goals a game for the position he plays.I agree with others who believe the excuses for him are over & its time to deliver.
The way l see it is late last year the plan was for Drew to pinch hit in the ruck to give Goldy a rest. When Drew is absent from the forward line someone needs to be a focus & kick the goals in that time because if that does not happen the match committee will revert back to Drew staying at full forward & Maj will likely be given Tarrants spot & pinch hit in the ruck. l personally could see this happening because a lot of the fade outs last year were due to Goldys inability to do his thing in the ruck due to fatigue. That was the case certainly against Brisbane, Port & Geelong.

What do you lose playing Majak forward when measured against Tarrants output last year.
Tarrant needs a good year & l hope its this year he should/needs to kick 2 goals a game for mine.

 

[Jay-Z]

What do you lose playing Majak forward when measured against Tarrants output last year.
Tarrant needs a good year & l hope its this year he should/needs to kick 2 goals a game for mine.

Seriously?? Have people forgotten all of Daw's games other than the Bulldogs one? Tarrant's output up forward is so far ahead of Maj it's not funny.

Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of Maj being in the side and giving Goldy a chop out but to do that effectively he needs to be able to play a full game (or at least 3 quarters) with a 80/20 forward/ruck split. I think he was subbed out by half time or shortly after in 4 or 5 of his 6 games this year and with the knee surgery putting him out for 6 months, I can't see Daw making any significant contribution in 2014.

 

[Winter]

He's played 38 games and is playing CHF, worth keeping in mind when you're judging his game.

 

[Only Forwards]

Seriously?? Have people forgotten all of Daw's games other than the Bulldogs one? Tarrant's output up forward is so far ahead of Maj it's not funny.

Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of Maj being in the side and giving Goldy a chop out but to do that effectively he needs to be able to play a full game (or at least 3 quarters) with a 80/20 forward/ruck split. I think he was subbed out by half time or shortly after in 4 or 5 of his 6 games this year and with the knee surgery putting him out for 6 months, I can't see Daw making any significant contribution in 2014.

This is the difference in perception that I find interesting.

Vs a mature defensive unit Maj showed that he would persistently get played under the ball, yet he has not nickname to deride this. There is nothing as catchy as concrete hands for Maj to me there was still some clear deficiencies to his game.

I understand the desire to have a ruck/forward in the side. I understand it because as long as they can compete it will make Goldy more dominant. It has less to do with who that player is. My hope is that the midfield is mature enough to carry 3 forwards + 1 Fwd/Ruck. I expect Currie to debut in 2014.

On Tarrant and the role he plays;

Recalling the Hawthorn game (without watching the replay) when Tarrant went off we turned the ball over multiple times to a seemingly free Hodge. Prior to Tarrant going off Hodge did not have that same level of influence in the game. So the question I ask is where was he?

Was it perhaps that he was unable to play such an attacking role because he had to play a more defensive role to zone off onto our talls because between the three of them they formed a quite dynamic forward line?

That was my take. People are very ready and willing to understate the role he plays.

Yeah call him concrete hands but he's not mentioned differently to any of the other players. Yeah right you will excuse me if I chose not to believe that.

 

[Only Forwards]

As a side question at what point this year did he sustain the unreported injury?

 

[GarnerSmash]

As a side question at what point this year did he sustain the unreported injury?

Early on I believe. Nerve damage in the leg.

Was it perhaps that he was unable to play such an attacking role because he had to play a more defensive role to zone off onto our talls because between the three of them they formed a quite dynamic forward line?

That was my take. People are very ready and willing to understate the role he plays.

I'm sure most of the time Taz's role is to draw his opponent away from the corridor and at times out of the 50 to free up space for Drew and LT. This takes a great deal of work that goes unrewarded individually. Then when at a contest in the 50 it is to ensure that he either marks it or brings it to ground so that we have the opportunity to lock it in.

During the year he showed signs of getting it together with his marking, then his kicking went to shit, maybe as a legacy factor of the nerve issue in his leg. I reckon he has the tools to be a good AFL KPF, it's just a matter of trying to put it all together. I think it's fair to say that he hasn't had a really good, consistent run at it as of yet with his 4 shoulder reco's, a broken thumb and the 9 week layoff this year with the leg injury.

Funnily enough, even though concrete hands score less goals and played less games in 2013 than in 2012, he took more marks. I wonder what that means?

 

[KillaKanga]

With the quality of our midfielders and delivery of the ball inside 50 our forwards won't have an excuse.

I also predict Black to be so dangerous up forward that Tarrant will be given a looser defender enabling him to score well against lean defenses.

Tarrant will be a part of our premiership tilt and an important one. We know what we'll get from Wells, JZ and our top players but it's the Tarrants, Adams etc that will be the difference in winning one.

 

[Only Forwards]

Funnily enough, even though concrete hands score less goals and played less games in 2013 than in 2012, he took more marks. I wonder what that means?

That perception is often different to reality.

 

[UmpiringFooty]

He's played 38 games and is playing CHF, worth keeping in mind when you're judging his game.

This. I agree with you there.

 

[the big lebowski]

This is the difference in perception that I find interesting.

Vs a mature defensive unit Maj showed that he would persistently get played under the ball, yet he has not nickname to deride this. There is nothing as catchy as concrete hands for Maj to me there was still some clear deficiencies to his game.

I understand the desire to have a ruck/forward in the side. I understand it because as long as they can compete it will make Goldy more dominant. It has less to do with who that player is. My hope is that the midfield is mature enough to carry 3 forwards + 1 Fwd/Ruck. I expect Currie to debut in 2014.

On Tarrant and the role he plays;

Recalling the Hawthorn game (without watching the replay) when Tarrant went off we turned the ball over multiple times to a seemingly free Hodge. Prior to Tarrant going off Hodge did not have that same level of influence in the game. So the question I ask is where was he?

Was it perhaps that he was unable to play such an attacking role because he had to play a more defensive role to zone off onto our talls because between the three of them they formed a quite dynamic forward line?

That was my take. People are very ready and willing to understate the role he plays.

Yeah call him concrete hands but he's not mentioned differently to any of the other players. Yeah right you will excuse me if I chose not to believe that.

Clearly Maj has more that he needs to work on than most.

He required a knee reco towards the end of the season, for a condition that he played the entire year with, even going back to the NAB Cup.

He has played a total of 6 games, 5 of them as the sub.

However, for time on ground his stats are essentially the same as Tazz, with more goals. Plus he can effectively chop out Goldy in the ruck.

No issue with Tarrant's work rate and he has a much better football brain than Maj.

But a 25% improvement in Maj's game sense (you would have to say that he has improved this by 100% per annum since he's been in the system) will see him fly past Tazz, with old concrete hands but a speck in the rear vision mirror.

 

[UmpiringFooty]

That's a pretty poor joke, ol'son.

What you had said was pretty poor too. In fact it was unwarranted.
I remember getting Robbie's autograph last year at a christmas family day that was more of a signing session. He's a nice bloke but he was copping it from some school kids who didn't like him. He told them off. Just wondering if one of those school kids was you.

 

[Jay-Z]

But a 25% improvement in Maj's game sense (you would have to say that he has improved this by 100% per annum since he's been in the system) will see him fly past Tazz, with old concrete hands but a speck in the rear vision mirror.

No, just no. A 100% improvement in his fitness/work rate, a 300% improvement in his leading patterns, a 100% improvement in his ability to use his superior strength to his advantage, AND another 25-50% improvement in his game sense would see Maj compete with Taz. But I could apply the same leniency to Liam Anthony and say he's not that far off taking Boomer's spot.

 

[the big lebowski]

No, just no. A 100% improvement in his fitness/work rate, a 300% improvement in his leading patterns, a 100% improvement in his ability to use his superior strength to his advantage, AND another 25-50% improvement in his game sense would see Maj compete with Taz. But I could apply the same leniency to Liam Anthony and say he's not that far off taking Boomer's spot.

I won't dignify the Anthony analogy with a further response.

Interesting stat I found re old concrete hands vs Daw - Maj took 7 contested marks in 6 games (sub 5 times) this year vs Tarrant with 9 in 13.

15 tackles to Tazz vs 11 to Maj

Minutes played was 1,156 to Tazz VS 320 for Maj.

So essentially, to compare apples with apples we should multiply Maj stats X 4 to get an indication as to what he would get if he stayed on the park as much as Tazz (I know I know he doesn't have the fitness to do this). If that were the case Maj would exceed Tarrant's output in the following areas over the course of a season:

Kicks
Handballs (just)
Marks (just)
Goals (easily - Maj would kick 40 + for the year)
Tackles (but hey he almost did this off one leg in 1/4 of game time)
Hitouts (obviously)
Frees for and against
Clearances
One percenters
Bounces

So in summary Tazz leads up the ground and does very little and Maj has a moderate impact on the game that will only improve.

 

[Saintly31]

Comparing Anthony (VFL player lucky to get games when were a poor team) to Boomer (300+ club champ) is the same as comparing Tarrant (battler still to cement a spot) to Daw (project still to come good) is it?! Good grief!!!

The Big Lebowski, for reasons such as the ^^ your argument is futile. Weight of numbers is against you -lets just accept and admire whatever he serves up as he has been injured previously, we apparently have to play a 3rd tall, and he is a good bloke.

 

[Jay-Z]

I won't dignify the Anthony analogy with a further response.

Interesting stat I found re old concrete hands vs Daw - Maj took 7 contested marks in 6 games (sub 5 times) this year vs Tarrant with 9 in 13.

15 tackles to Tazz vs 11 to Maj

Minutes played was 1,156 to Tazz VS 320 for Maj.

So essentially, to compare apples with apples we should multiply Maj stats X 4 to get an indication as to what he would get if he stayed on the park as much as Tazz (I know I know he doesn't have the fitness to do this). If that were the case Maj would exceed Tarrant's output in the following areas over the course of a season:

Kicks
Handballs (just)
Marks (just)
Goals (easily - Maj would kick 40 + for the year)
Tackles (but hey he almost did this off one leg in 1/4 of game time)
Hitouts (obviously)
Frees for and against
Clearances
One percenters
Bounces

So in summary Tazz leads up the ground and does very little and Maj has a moderate impact on the game that will only improve.

I'm not gonna argue based on what stats Maj MIGHT be able to get if he ever gets fit enough to work like Taz does. The fact is, for 2014, Taz is superior in every way bar rucking and tackling.

 

[the big lebowski]

Comparing Anthony (VFL player lucky to get games when were a poor team) to Boomer (300+ club champ) is the same as comparing Tarrant (battler still to cement a spot) to Daw (project still to come good) is it?! Good grief!!!

The Big Lebowski, for reasons such as the ^^ your argument is futile. Weight of numbers is against you -lets just accept and admire whatever he serves up as he has been injured previously, we apparently have to play a 3rd tall, and he is a good bloke.

Yeah you're right ......... Four shoulder recos, drew petrie, decoy etc etc

 

[Saintly31]

Yeah you're right ......... Four shoulder recos, drew petrie, decoy etc etc

Your "etc" will include "played only X games", shouldn't have to tackle, he tries very hard, even when poor he still was great, and so on.

Fact is we all want Robbie to succeed, for him personally and for our success. The latter is my main priority, what players get us there is secondary. If he can't step up a level or two then structures will change - and I am confident our coaching staff will implement whatever gets us our best 22 now "development" games/years are in the past.

 

[Jay-Z]

Comparing Anthony (VFL player lucky to get games when were a poor team) to Boomer (300+ club champ) is the same as comparing Tarrant (battler still to cement a spot) to Daw (project still to come good) is it?! Good grief!!!

The Big Lebowski, for reasons such as the ^^ your argument is futile. Weight of numbers is against you -lets just accept and admire whatever he serves up as he has been injured previously, we apparently have to play a 3rd tall, and he is a good bloke.

Would you prefer I use Greenwood and Ziebell? It doesn't matter. The point is, Daw is not going to take Taz's spot in 2014

 

[Saintly31]

Would you prefer I use Greenwood and Ziebell? It doesn't matter. The point is, Daw is not going to take Taz's spot in 2014

I would prefer you not make analogy's that are completely irrelevant to Daw and Tarrant.

I agree though, I don't think Daw could ever play Robbie's role. They are very different - one is a talent limited but dedicated workhorse, the other a physical freak, but has no idea at times. Chalk and cheese

But that in itself doesn't mean Taz doesn't have to perform (same for Majak to get back his spot) - I think all our best 22 have to perform, no special favours and excuses for anyone. 2013 with Loose, Spud, Harper hard decisions suggests it will only get harder to keep a spot.

The structure will be changed if required to suit our best 22, three tall forwards is not a given. As ^^, I don't care who plays but as long as all contribute enough at AFL level then I think we are in with a real shot. If most of them can't, we won't take that next step (and that's not just Taz, it included our other players in the younger bracket)

 

[Jay-Z]

I would prefer you not make analogy's that are completely irrelevant to Daw and Tarrant.

It's about as relevant as doing a statistical comparison after multiplying one players numbers by 4

I agree though, I don't think Daw could ever play Robbie's role. They are very different - one is a talent limited but hard working workhorse, the other a physical freak, but has no idea at times. Chalk and cheese

But that in itself doesn't mean Taz doesn't have to perform (same for Majak to get back his spot) - I think all out best 22 have to perform, no special favours and excuses for anyone.

The structure will be changed if required to suit our best 22, three tall forwards is not a given. As ^^, I don't care who plays but as long as all contribute at AFL level then I think we are in with a real shot. If some of them can't,we won't take that next step (and that's not just Taz, it's your Harper, Jacobs, Atley and so on)

Absolutely, Taz still has to perform. But he's a bit like Gibson in that there is currently very little competition for that spot from those playing VFL (at least for the first half of 2014)


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[GarnerSmash]

Daw will only be a plonk in the goal square FF/second ruck. He simply does not nor will not have the footy aptitude nor possibly the tank to play a key forward role that requires adherence to structural play which requires him to run leading patters well away from goal and out of the forward fifty or to get involved in general play around the ground. Give him an opponent in the goal square, great. Give him a ball up against another ruck, fine. Give him the ball with space to run into, awesome.

Tarrant is and will always be a more natural footballer and better option for CHF, roaming tall marking target. Given Daw is at least 12 months from demanding a spot in the side I think Taz is safe for at least another 12 months. In reality Daw is more a long term replacement for Petrie.

 

[Twinkletoes]

In reality Daw is more a long term replacement for Petrie.

Exactly how he's viewed within (if his potential can ever be realised).

 

[the big lebowski]

Daw will only be a plonk in the goal square FF/second ruck. He simply does not nor will not have the footy aptitude nor possibly the tank to play a key forward role that requires adherence to structural play which requires him to run leading patters well away from goal and out of the forward fifty or to get involved in general play around the ground. Give him an opponent in the goal square, great. Give him a ball up against another ruck, fine. Give him the ball with space to run into, awesome.

Tarrant is and will always be a more natural footballer and better option for CHF, roaming tall marking target. Given Daw is at least 12 months from demanding a spot in the side I think Taz is safe for at least another 12 months. In reality Daw is more a long term replacement for Petrie.

I certainly agree with all of this. But both Petrie and Black are very good lead up forwards. So if Daw did replace Tarrant he would be anchored to the goal square as you point out with the other 2 playing higher up.

 

[GarnerSmash]

I certainly agree with all of this. But both Petrie and Black are very good lead up forwards. So if Daw did replace Tarrant he would be anchored to the goal square as you point out with the other 2 playing higher up.

Given that it is likely that Daw will not be ready for senior footy for most of 2014 I don't want Drew Petrie running km's that he does not need to be running in 2015. Not at his age and with his history of foot issues. And I don't see the logic in removing our best FF of the last 8 years away from that position late in his career, especially given that it is highly likely that Daw would not be able to match his level of output. Perhaps Dish will start to decline somewhat in 2015 and Daw can transition in over the course of that season.