6 Day Breaks...

[manicmagpie]

Saw this from Leo (good job Leo) on another board found it interesting seeing its FACT.


Interesting that Collingwoods last 7 games are against sides coming off a six day break. Collingwood having the extra day on every team other than the floating round. More than chance you'd think...what a very "fair and even" competition we have.....

Gotta love Saints fans and their excuses and conspiracy theories.

Here's another FACT for you - given that there are 17 other teams in the league from which to choose just 5 to play twice, there are 6188 possible combinations. Based on the final ladder positions last year, Collingwood's draw is the 3rd hardest possible out of these 6188 combinations.

Now I don't give a flying fornication who we play twice, but I do object to people from teams with substantially easier draws (e.g. St Kilda) making out that the AFL rigs things in our favour.

An open question to Saints fans - whatever happened to the theory that it was a huge and unfair advantage to have a run of games in your home state at the end of the year? Only it was supposedly a massive issue in 2010, but in the last couple of years none of you have seemed to mention it. What could possibly have happened to remove this as an issue?

 

[Ron The Bear]

Not this again. It was debunked here - http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/6-day-breaks.948243/

 

[Plugger35]

Gotta love Saints fans and their excuses and conspiracy theories.

Here's another FACT for you - given that there are 17 other teams in the league from which to choose just 5 to play twice, there are 6188 possible combinations. Based on the final ladder positions last year, Collingwood's draw is the 3rd hardest possible out of these 6188 combinations.

Now I don't give a flying fornication who we play twice, but I do object to people from teams with substantially easier draws (e.g. St Kilda) making out that the AFL rigs things in our favour.

An open question to Saints fans - whatever happened to the theory that it was a huge and unfair advantage to have a run of games in your home state at the end of the year? Only it was supposedly a massive issue in 2010, but in the last couple of years none of you have seemed to mention it. What could possibly have happened to remove this as an issue?

This thread isn't about which opponents each team plays, every year that changes with some teams getting it easier than others but what never changes from year to year is Collingwood having less interstate travel than every other Victorian team and less 6 day breaks then every other team and that gives your club an advantage every year which the stats back up. That is an indisputable FACT but somehow you Collingwood supporters still try to deny it.

So far this year St Kilda has had 3 consecutive 6 day breaks including a trip to Perth prior to playing Richmond where we had a narrow loss and had back to back interstate trips with another 6 day break prior to playing Adelaide coming off a bye where again we had a narrow loss, I'm not saying that was the only reason for losing those games but it didn't help and that is something other teams like Collingwood haven't had to cope with this season.

Even Leigh Matthews commented last Friday night during the game that St Kilda's tough schedule was going to make it difficult for them to win the game against a team that was fresh after having a bye. I respect the opinion of a man that has played and coached around 800 games at VFL/AFL level a lot more than the opinions of a bunch of keyboard heroes posting on an internet forum.

 

[The Finger]

Anyone who tries to argue there is no advantage to an extra days break is taking the piss. Of course there's an advantage and even if it's only worth a couple of goals that's enough to win a game. That stat in regard to Collingwoods last 7 games this season is revealing wouldn't you say?

 

[manicmagpie]

This thread isn't about which opponents each team plays,

I know it isn't, because in recent years Collingwood has had very tough draws in this regard. The minute we get one that isn't crazy hard, there will be countless threads about it, with St Kilda fans leading the whinging.

Every year we see the same process, there are people who pore over the draw to see what Collingwood has got and then come up with the idea that that particular aspect is the important one. Like I said, there's been a notable absence of the "games at home at the end of the year are vital" talk these last couple of seasons.

what never changes from year to year is Collingwood having less interstate travel than every other Victorian team and less 6 day breaks then every other team and that gives your club an advantage every year which the stats back up. That is an indisputable FACT but somehow you Collingwood supporters still try to deny it.

Another "FACT" from St Kilda. In the last 11 seasons Collingwood has had the least away interstate games just 4 times. The 4 times we did have the least, we shared that honour with at least 7 other Vic sides on each occasion.

Only once in 11 seasons has the number of Vic teams with more travel outweighed the number of teams with equal or less than us. That was last year when 5 had more and 4 had less or the same. Usually the average is 6 of the other 9 Vic teams get the same or less travel as us. Wow, imagine the advantage that entails.

So far this year St Kilda has had 3 consecutive 6 day breaks including a trip to Perth prior to playing Richmond where we had a narrow loss and had back to back interstate trips with another 6 day break prior to playing Adelaide coming off a bye where again we had a narrow loss, I'm not saying that was the only reason for losing those games but it didn't help and that is something other teams like Collingwood haven't had to cope with this season.

Nah, you'd probably have to go back to last year for that. Consecutive 6 day breaks and coming back from travel to play... St Kilda. I can only guess we must have lost that match by a heap. Bloody AFL.

Even Leigh Matthews commented last Friday night during the game that St Kilda's tough schedule was going to make it difficult for them to win the game against a team that was fresh after having a bye. I respect the opinion of a man that has played and coached around 800 games at VFL/AFL level a lot more than the opinions of a bunch of keyboard heroes posting on an internet forum.

So do I.

I agree with Leigh that teams shouldn't have the bye and face opposition coming off a short cycle. But I also think (and I don't have Leigh Matthews' opinion on this to hand) that professional sporting teams shouldn't whinge about 6 day breaks.

 

[jonbe54]

Lol Plug and Finger the tweedle dee and tweedle dum of Collihaters looking for more excuses to can the Pies.

You pair of princesses need to suck it up and accept that your fairies are not up to it and start worrying about that rather than trying to blame successful clubs for your team's failures.

 

[The Finger]

Lol Plug and Finger the tweedle dee and tweedle dum of Collihaters looking for more excuses to can the Pies.

You pair of princesses need to suck it up and accept that your fairies are not up to it and start worrying about that rather than trying to blame successful clubs for your team's failures.

So your saying it is an excuse the amount of six day breaks? Guess that means Collingwood has and never has any excuse.

 

[Tbone McGraw]

[quote="manicmagpie, post: 24585182,]
Another "FACT" from St Kilda. In the last 11 seasons Collingwood has had the least away interstate games just 4 times. The 4 times we did have the least, we shared that honour with at least 7 other Vic sides on each occasion.

Only once in 11 seasons has the number of Vic teams with more travel outweighed the number of teams with equal or less than us. That was last year when 5 had more and 4 had less or the same. Usually the average is 6 of the other 9 Vic teams get the same or less travel as us. [/quote]


It is amazing how some posters can continue to post false accusations as fact. Surely they should start getting cards for continually doing this.

It is generally the same posters.

 

[Plugger35]

It is amazing how some posters can continue to post false accusations as fact. Surely they should start getting cards for continually doing this.

It is generally the same posters.

How is it false accusations or trolling to say Collingwood gets advantages every year with the fixture, they are facts. Other teams like Essendon or Melbourne may occasionally travel the same amount as Collingwood or have the same amount of 6 day breaks but no other club gets these advantages as consistently as Collingwood does and for as long as I can remember St Kilda has always traveled more interstate than Collingwood and always has more 6 day breaks, even during the years we weren't playing home games in Tassie.

It's not just the amount of interstate trips either it's when and where you travel to. Collingwood has had significantly less interstate trips to Perth, which is the toughest road trip, than any other non WA team. St Kilda has regularly played twice in Perth during H&A seasons and Collingwood would be lucky to play in Perth once every two seasons, they have never had two interstate trips to Perth during a H&A season like St Kilda and most other clubs have.

As for 2010 Collingwood did have a big advantage from playing at the MCG every week for about 2 months prior to the finals which were also played at the MCG. How the hell can you say that isn't an advantage over teams that had been travelling interstate during that time and weren't playing all their games at the MCG?

 

[jonbe54]

So your saying it is an excuse the amount of six day breaks? Guess that means Collingwood has and never has any excuse.

Settle down finger you use any excuse to put shit on the Pies - no matter what the tread is about. It's an unhealthy obsession you really should see a shrink about.

Or grow up.

 

[ipswichpies]

Anyone who tries to argue there is no advantage to an extra days break is taking the piss. Of course there's an advantage and even if it's only worth a couple of goals that's enough to win a game. That stat in regard to Collingwoods last 7 games this season is revealing wouldn't you say?

Look are Collingwood,s fan,s supposed to take anything you say about the club seriously when all they need to do is check your posting history.

For people like you nothing the Afl does in the way of fixtures for Collingwood would suit you because you hate us and you do not have an impartial bone in your body as re Magpies.

I would say that the Pies draw is at least as hard as any of the other victorian clubs including your,s and what club is that this month Melbourne or St Kilda,can have very little respect for a person who does not even acknowledge what team he supports.

 

[manicmagpie]

How is it false accusations or trolling to say Collingwood gets advantages every year with the fixture, they are facts. Other teams like Essendon or Melbourne may occasionally travel the same amount as Collingwood or have the same amount of 6 day breaks but no other club gets these advantages as consistently as Collingwood does and for as long as I can remember St Kilda has always traveled more interstate than Collingwood and always has more 6 day breaks, even during the years we weren't playing home games in Tassie.

It's false accusations because you say things like "Collingwood travel less than all other Vic teams every year" when this is wholly inaccurate.

Total 6 days or less breaks over the period 2008-2011:

Essendon: 32
Bulldogs: 29
Collingwood, St Kilda, Geelong, Hawthorn: 27
Carlton, North: 25
Melbourne: 19

Essendon unlucky and Melbourne quite lucky if you go by this measurement. Everyone else almost identical.

As for interstate games, over an 11 year period we've travelled the same as Hawthorn and less than half a game a year less than nearly all other teams. The 'worst affected' teams have a massive rolleyes 0.8 games a year more than us. If you're hanging your hat on that, you've got problems. Look at this year, the only interstate teams we don't play away are Gold Coast, Port Adelaide and Freo. Are you honestly telling me that our draw would be tougher if we had to play one or more of those teams away?

It's not just the amount of interstate trips either it's when and where you travel to. Collingwood has had significantly less interstate trips to Perth, which is the toughest road trip, than any other non WA team. St Kilda has regularly played twice in Perth during H&A seasons and Collingwood would be lucky to play in Perth once every two seasons, they have never had two interstate trips to Perth during a H&A season like St Kilda and most other clubs have.

We don't give a **** who we play or where. We've won 4 out of the last 5 in Perth, 8 in a row in Adelaide, 6 in a row in Sydney and have never lost at Cararra. The closest we have to a bogey ground is the Gabba, where we've still won 3 out of the last 5 (pretty poor record before that, though). I bet if we had more games scheduled there this would still be seen as 'not real travel' by supporters of other clubs.

As for 2010 Collingwood did have a big advantage from playing at the MCG every week for about 2 months prior to the finals which were also played at the MCG. How the hell can you say that isn't an advantage over teams that had been travelling interstate during that time and weren't playing all their games at the MCG?

So this year and last where we travel every second week in the lead up to the finals means the AFL must have it in for us then, I suppose? Have you looked at St Kilda's run into the finals (if you make it)? Why, it's 6 games in a row in Melbourne! Transparant cheating by the AFL. I hope you've complained to them.

Here's how easy it is to pick things out of the fixture and claim conspiracy:

According to you travelling to Perth is a massive negative for a team, as is travelling in the lead up to the finals. So if say, a team had to travel to Perth in the final two rounds of the season 3 times in the last 5 years, I bet you'd consider that suspicious. This is no more silly than the rest of the conspiracy theories.

 

[Sidebottom2Beams]

It's false accusations because you say things like "Collingwood travel less than all other Vic teams every year" when this is wholly inaccurate.

Total 6 days or less breaks over the period 2008-2011:

Essendon: 32
Bulldogs: 29
Collingwood, St Kilda, Geelong, Hawthorn: 27
Carlton, North: 25
Melbourne: 19

Essendon unlucky and Melbourne quite lucky if you go by this measurement. Everyone else almost identical..

AND end thread lol.

 

[romeoh]

Am preet sure that consecutive three 6 day turn arounds affects teams' ability to perform to their optimum.

 

[Plugger35]

AND end thread lol.

Yeah selective quoting of stats suddenly means that Collingwood's fixtures are just as tough as St Kilda's fixtures in terms of 6 day breaks and travel.

You Collingwood supporters can all agree with each other as much as you like but everyone else knows you get an armchair ride with the fixturing every year.

Am preet sure that consecutive three 6 day turn arounds affects teams' ability to perform to their optimum.

Yes it's the consecutive 6 day breaks that are the problem, one or two 6 day breaks aren't too bad but three in a row like we had earlier in the season is where it starts to really have an effect especially if you have interstate travel amongst that as well.

 

[im_a_lazy_sod]

I looked up some stats in another thread about 6 day breaks vs 8+ day breaks. So far it's happened about 15 times this season

I think only twice has a team won from a 6 day break when their opponents have had an 8+ day break (I've also included 5 v 7+, as it is essentially the same as 6 v 8 imo)

Oh, heres the post btw (actually there is two)

Look at it in terms of differenials

Round 1 doesn't matter, as it's all equal

But here is Round 2 onwards. I have taken the liberty of bolding when there is a +2 advantage for any team and noting who wins the game based on that advantage

Round 2:

Thursday:
Brisbane +5 v Carlton +7 (+2 advantage to Carlton) - Carlton WIN

Saturday:
Essendon +7 v Port Adelaide +6 (+1 advantage to Essedon)
Sydney +14 v Fremantle +7 (+7 advantage to Sydney) - Sydney WIN
West Coast +6 v Melbourne +7 (+1 advantage to Melbourne)
Collingwood +8 v Richmond +9 (+1 advantage to Richmond)
Adelaide +7 v Bulldogs +6 (+1 advantage to Adelaide)

Sunday:
North +8 v GWS +15 (+8 advantage to GWS) - GWS LOSE
Saints +7 v GC +8 (+1 advantage to GC)

Monday:
Geelong +8 v Hawthorn +9 (+1 advantage to Geelong)

Round 3:

Friday:
Carlton +8 v Collingwood +6 (+2 advantage to Carlton) Carlton WIN

Saturday:
Richmond +7 v Melbourne +7 (=)
Port Adelaide +7 v Sydney +7 (=)
Fremantle +7 v Brisbane +9 (+2 advantage to Brisbane) Brisbane LOSE
GC +6 v Essendon +7 (+1 advantage to Essendon)
Bulldogs +7 v St Kilda +6 (+1 advantage to Bulldogs)

Sunday:
GWS +7 v West Coast +8 (+1 advantage to West Coast)
Hawthorn +6 v Adelaide +8 (+2 advantage to Adelaide) Adelaide LOSE
North +8 v Geelong +6 (+2 advantage to North) North WIN

Round 4

Friday:
Saints +6 v Fremantle +6 (=)

Saturday:
Carlton +8 v Essendon +7 (+1 advantage to Carlton)
Collingwood +8 v Port Adelaide +7 (+1 advantage to Collingwood)
Adelaide +6 v GWS +6 (=)
West Coast +6 v Hawthorn +6 (=)
Brisbane +7 v GC +8 (+1 advantage to GC)

Sunday:
Geelong +7 v Richmond +8 (+1 advantage to Richmond)
Sydney +8 v North +6 (+2 advantage to Sydney) Sydney WIN
Melbourne +8 v Bulldogs +8 (=)

Round 5:

Wednesday
Collingwood +4 v Essendon +4 (=)

Friday
Fremantle +7 v Carlton +6 (+1 advantage to Fremantle)

Saturday
GwS +7 v Bulldogs +6 (+1 advantage to GWS)
North +6 v GC +7 (+1 advantage to GC)
Melbourne +6 v St Kilda +8 (+2 advantage to St Kilda) St Kilda WIN
Brisbane +7 v Geelong +6 (+1 advantage to Brisbane)

Sunday
Hawthorn +8 v Sydney +7 (+1 advantage to Hawthorn)
Richmond +7 v West Coast +8 (+1 advantage to West Coast)
Adelaide +8 v Port +9 (+1 advantage to Port)

Round 6

Friday
Bulldogs +6 v Collingwood +8 (+2 advantage to Collingwood) Collingwood WIN

Saturday:
Essendon +9 v Brisbane +7 (+2 advantage to Essendon) Essendon WIN
Geelong +7 v Melbourne +7 (=)
GC +7 v Fremantle +8 (+1 advantage to Fremantle)
St Kilda +7 v Hawthorn +6 (+1 advantage to St Kilda)
Sydney +6 v Adelaide +6 (=)

Sunday
Carlton +9 v GWS +8 (+1 advantage to Carlton)
Port Adelaide +7 v Richmond +7 (=)
West Coast +7 v North +8 (+1 advantage to North)

Round 7

Friday
Melbourne +6 v Hawthorn +6 (=)

Saturday
GWS +6 v GC +7 (+1 advantage to GC)
Adelaide +7 v Geelong +7 (=)
Richmond +6 v Sydney +7 (+1 advantage to Sydney)
Essendon +7 v West Coast +6 (+1 advantage to Essendon)
Brisbane +7 v Collingwood +8 (+1 advantage to Collingwood)

Sunday
North +7 v Bulldogs +9 (+2 advantage to Bulldogs) Bulldogs WIN
Fremantle +8 v Port +7 (+1 advantage to Fremantle)

Monday
St Kilda +9 v Carlton +8 (+1 advantage to St Kilda)

Round 8

Friday
Collingwood +6 v Geelong +6 (=)

Saturday
Port +6 v North +6 (=)
Hawthorn +8 v Fremantle +6 (+2 advantage to Hawthorn) Hawthorn WIN
Sydney +7 v Melbourne +8 (+1 advantage to Melbourne)
Essendon +7 v Richmond +7 (=)
Bulldogs +6 v GC +7 (+1 advantage to GC)

Sunday
Brisbane +8 v GWS +8 (=)
Carlton +6 v Adelaide +8 (+2 advantage Adelaide) Adelaide WIN
West Coast +8 v St Kilda +6 (+2 advantage West Coast) West Coast WIN

On 9/10 occasions so far this season where team a has had an 8 or 7 day break and team b has had a 6 or 5 day break, team a has won

And all 10 of those +2 advantages (8 v 6 or 7 v 5) have happened to 7 different teams - Carlton and Adelaide have both had 2 games where they have had +2 when their opponents have had 5 or 6 day breaks

Of the 10 opponents who have been disadvantaged, all 10 have been different teams

Here is Round 9:

Friday
Bulldogs +6 v Geelong +7 (+1 advantage to Geelong)

Saturday
Richmond +7 v Hawthorn +7 (=)
GC +7 v Port +7 (=)
St Kilda +6 v Sydney +7 (+1 advantage to Sydney)
GWS +6 v Essendon +7 (+1 advantage to Essendon)
Adelaide +6 v Collingwood +8 (+2 advantage to Collingwood)

Sunday
North Melbourne +8 v Brisbane +7 (+1 advantage to North Melbourne)
Carlton +7 v Melbourne +8 (+1 advantage to Melbourne)
West Coast +7 v Fremantle +8 (+1 advantage to Fremantle)

As you can see, Collingwood will join Adelaide and Carlton on 2 occasions each where they have had 2+ days extra preperation than their opponents when their opponents have had 5 or 6 days preperations

Adelaide will also be facing their second occasion of having -2 days preperation off a 5 or 6 day break than their opponents

With that, I am tipping Collingwood - on this years statistics I am a 90% chance of getting that tip right

 

[Tbone McGraw]

Yeah selective quoting of stats suddenly means that Collingwood's fixtures are just as tough as St Kilda's fixtures in terms of 6 day breaks and travel.

You Collingwood supporters can all agree with each other as much as you like but everyone else knows you get an armchair ride with the fixturing every year.



Yes it's the consecutive 6 day breaks that are the problem, one or two 6 day breaks aren't too bad but three in a row like we had earlier in the season is where it starts to really have an effect especially if you have interstate travel amongst that as well.

At least we have stats to back up our points. You just make up complete lies and can't back them up at all. You should be carded. or banished to bay 13 where your made up rubbish is right at home.

Mods, if this gets read, are posters like this ever held accountable for the truth

 

[cfx_1]

In unrelated news, collingwood win 8 in a row after 4 season ending ACL's and a slew of injuries to key players.

It must be the draw that Champion Data say is the hardest of any club this season.





Orrrrrrr, could it possibly be that they are just that good?

I know which is actually true and which is a junk skew of facts that only A Current Affair could rival in its presentation.

 

[Plugger35]

At least we have stats to back up our points. You just make up complete lies and can't back them up at all. You should be carded. or banished to bay 13 where your made up rubbish is right at home.

Mods, if this gets read, are posters like this ever held accountable for the truth

What complete lies have I made up Einstein? That Collingwood consistently travel less interstate than other clubs and that you never travel twice to Perth in a season like every other club does? They aren't lies buddy they are facts.

Maybe you should stick to the Collingwood board if you don't like these facts being pointed out.

 

[PieBeast]

What complete lies have I made up Einstein? That Collingwood consistently travel less interstate than other clubs and that you never travel twice to Perth in a season like every other club does? They aren't lies buddy they are facts.

Maybe you should stick to the Collingwood board if you don't like these facts being pointed out.

Your statement about us traveling less than any Vic team every year has been exposed as a lie, same goes for your accusation about us getting less six days break than anyone else.
Stick to crying about umpiring.

 

[Tbone McGraw]

What complete lies have I made up Einstein? That Collingwood consistently travel less interstate than other clubs and that you never travel twice to Perth in a season like every other club does? They aren't lies buddy they are facts.

Maybe you should stick to the Collingwood board if you don't like these facts being pointed out.

You have proved you can read so you must be ignorant or intellectually challenged. The facts have been pointed out to you twice. Just to help you, they are in reply to your posts and both on the same page.

Good luck with whatever issues you are going through.

 

[Plugger35]

Your statement about us traveling less than any Vic team every year has been exposed as a lie, same goes for your accusation about us getting less six days break than anyone else.
Stick to crying about umpiring.

Well Collingwood have traveled interstate less than St Kilda every year and have traveled less in total than every other Victorian club over the past decade or so and traveled about half as many times to Perth as every other club so there is still a lot of truth to my arguments too.

 

[jonbe54]

Well Collingwood have traveled interstate less than St Kilda every year and have traveled less in total than every other Victorian club over the past decade or so and traveled about half as many times to Perth as every other club so there is still a lot of truth to my arguments too.

backpeddling furiously

 

[Plugger35]

backpeddling furiously

Not really, my main argument is that Collingwood gets favoured with the fixtures more consistently than any other club and pointing out some minor mistakes in my argument doesn't change that.

 

[jonbe54]

Not really, my main argument is that Collingwood gets favoured with the fixtures more consistently than any other club and pointing out some minor mistakes in my argument doesn't change that.

Look Plug everyone knows Pies get lots of games at the G and everyone knows why - other clubs beg for them. Whilst the league retains its policies in this regards no amount of whingeing is going to change it.

Quite apart from any other argument if you would only check our interstate record you would be begging us NEVER to travel