Current Abduction of 4yo Blowholes Shacks WA *Terence Kelly Convicted

[Kurve]

MEDIA
Current - The Bunker Part 2

 

[broken paradigm]

It’s mainly the fact that this is supposedly the first time police have examined the house. Surely they’d be doing something like that from the outset, regardless of their working theory.

The 1st time the media know about it. Not the 1st time media don't know about every part of a police investigation.

 

[Kurve]

West Aussies seem particularly good at keeping quiet when asked to by the Police- just look at the CSK - still no interviews or stories

It's a cheap campsite, for some who know the routine it looks like they might even get away without registering and paying. As was mentioned in here before, predators who generally take cheap overseas holidays and stuck through covid travel restrictions might be drawn to a campsite like the Blowholes.

I imagine though out of all the people who were staying there at the time, some of them will probably have history with the law and may have high tailed it out of there as soon as they heard a child was missing and the police were on their way.

The chopper pilots did well to get pictures of all the vehicles they saw on the roads.

 

[jason_recliner]

Security shutters would make it difficult for a breakin.

Everything I've read indicates that the police are investigating a stalker / peeping tom, not a break-in.

 

[BFew]

I can't see him getting to the site and then not fishing if the conditions allow for it to happen.

On fishing holidays (had many many of these in days gone by), preparing the rods/lines ready at night for an early morning fish, or preparing the rods/lines at dawn ready to bait/burley up (unless a lure or plastic straw was being used) before getting to the early morning fishing spot, was the norm.

Maybe the rods and tackle box were locked in the car overnight, and as soon as he got up that morning after dawn, he got them from the car and put them on/by the table ready to set up for a morning fish, before it was noticed that Cleo was missing.

 

[ep2018]

Ok my thoughts.
The caretaker scooped her up and gave her sleeping bag and all to another person who sped off. ********************************. Caretaker is in two minds about whether to report or not as $1m is good but being shot dead is not.
And abduction was originally going to occur from family home but something changed that.

Red flags galore with the caretaker's video interview. His re-enactment of her possible kidnap is weird. "I was the first to look for her" inserting himself into the narrative? He kept using terms like 'they' and 'the girl' too. and the specific reference to her being taken at 4am.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

Something that bugs me with this is why you'd waste a night away by going to bed early.
I can understand Mum hanging around the campsite with the baby at night but i struggle to believe why Step Dad wouldnt be out wetting a line on the first night.
There appears to be a tackle box on the table so fishing was obviously a planned activity.

I have a theory which fits the known facts..
Step Dad decides to go fishing and Cleo wants to go or perhaps step dad offers to take her to give Mum some one on one time with bubs. Mum suggests they take the sleeping bag to keep her warm down by the beach.
Something happens down the beach and Cleo is killed, perhaps she's laying on the sand and a big wave crashes in filling the sleeping bag and dragging her out to sea etc.
Plenty of people have drown wearing waders in surf in similar fashion.
Step Dad returns to the tent and explains it to Mum and between them they come up with a story to say she went missing from the tent, perhaps as a way of protecting themselves from losing the baby due to being considered neglectful over what happened to Cleo.
Would also explain the reaction mum gave when step dad touched her during the interview, she might not be complicit in what happened apart from going along with the story but she blames him for whats happened and doesnt want him touching her.
That reaction to me was telling, you cant script that response.

I watched their interview and then showed it to my Wife expecting her to suggest a lack of emotion and pick up on the facial twitches from Step dad as possible substance abuse but of all the moments in it she pointed to that moment when he touched her and said she felt that was the reaction of a Woman who doesnt want to be touched by him.
Im sure an event like this would bring out some emotions you've never expressed before if you've never been through it, but despite that, surely it would be a time when the relationship between partners would be at its most unified, yet her reaction to his touch was not to reach out to him or look at him, she turned to where he touched her and closed her eyes.

 

[ms finch]

On the Coleman Instant uP Silver 8P Side Entry Tent, when the outer waterproof fly is on, it can be set in a number of positions.
Including positions that close off both side door entrances.

What we don't know is what configuration the outer waterproof fly was set to at various times from when the family first set it up on Friday night, through to how it appears in the media articles of the tent at the crime scene.

Might Cleo's parents have adjusted the outer waterproof fly before they went looking for Chloe to better secure the tent. (Or could Police have adjusted it to better secure the crime scene)
Were both side entrances accessible from the outside during the whole of the night without adjusting the outer waterproof fly?

The various settings for this outer waterproof fly can be seen in the 14 marketing pictures and 2 videos in the link below.

Instant Up Silver 8P Side Entry Tent

Free Delivery on the New Coleman Instant Up Silver 8P Side Entry Tent - Huge Range of Family and Touring Tents from Australia's Best Online Camping Store

www.snowys.com.au

Really glad you raised this about the fly (and thanks for all the info you have gathered on the tent). It has been on my mind since I first saw the photos that it’s not obvious which entrances were accessible due to the fly. Based on everything that has come out my guess is that the fly was up/open at that entrance. Otherwise I think we would have heard about how that makes it even more unlikely for her to have simply wandered off.

 

[Awakening]

Can't find any matching beer bottles.

Surely there's some wino's in here that are besties with that bottle and can ID it!

In my expert opinion, it's a white wine (lindemans, houghtons?) but possibly a sparkling? Not a cider drinker but could be cider.

 

[RICHOLEGEND12]

they shouldn’t give them nicknames. same reason shooters shouldn’t be named IMO. Too much notoriety, which is probably part of what they desire.
I didn’t know about this “mr cruel” and on that note, I’m taking a break from true crime. And thinking of poor little Chloe and praying for her

Agreed.

Something that bugs me with this is why you'd waste a night away by going to bed early.
I can understand Mum hanging around the campsite with the baby at night but i struggle to believe why Step Dad wouldnt be out wetting a line on the first night.
There appears to be a tackle box on the table so fishing was obviously a planned activity.

I have a theory which fits the known facts..
Step Dad decides to go fishing and Cleo wants to go or perhaps step dad offers to take her to give Mum some one on one time with bubs. Mum suggests they take the sleeping bag to keep her warm down by the beach.
Something happens down the beach and Cleo is killed, perhaps she's laying on the sand and a big wave crashes in filling the sleeping bag and dragging her out to sea etc.
Plenty of people have drown wearing waders in surf in similar fashion.
Step Dad returns to the tent and explains it to Mum and between them they come up with a story to say she went missing from the tent, perhaps as a way of protecting themselves from losing the baby due to being considered neglectful over what happened to Cleo.
Would also explain the reaction mum gave when step dad touched her during the interview, she might not be complicit in what happened apart from going along with the story but she blames him for whats happened and doesnt want him touching her.
That reaction to me was telling, you cant script that response.

I watched their interview and then showed it to my Wife expecting her to suggest a lack of emotion and pick up on the facial twitches from Step dad as possible substance abuse but of all the moments in it she pointed to that moment when he touched her and said she felt that was the reaction of a Woman who doesnt want to be touched by him.
Im sure an event like this would bring out some emotions you've never expressed before if you've never been through it, but despite that, surely it would be a time when the relationship between partners would be at its most unified, yet her reaction to his touch was not to reach out to him or look at him, she turned to where he touched her and closed her eyes.

Anything is possible. But surely the mother would crack at some point. This isnt going to be something that goes away. There will be focus on them for the rest of their lives.

 

[ms finch]

Something that bugs me with this is why you'd waste a night away by going to bed early.
I can understand Mum hanging around the campsite with the baby at night but i struggle to believe why Step Dad wouldnt be out wetting a line on the first night.
There appears to be a tackle box on the table so fishing was obviously a planned activity.

I have a theory which fits the known facts..
Step Dad decides to go fishing and Cleo wants to go or perhaps step dad offers to take her to give Mum some one on one time with bubs. Mum suggests they take the sleeping bag to keep her warm down by the beach.
Something happens down the beach and Cleo is killed, perhaps she's laying on the sand and a big wave crashes in filling the sleeping bag and dragging her out to sea etc.
Plenty of people have drown wearing waders in surf in similar fashion.
Step Dad returns to the tent and explains it to Mum and between them they come up with a story to say she went missing from the tent, perhaps as a way of protecting themselves from losing the baby due to being considered neglectful over what happened to Cleo.
Would also explain the reaction mum gave when step dad touched her during the interview, she might not be complicit in what happened apart from going along with the story but she blames him for whats happened and doesnt want him touching her.
That reaction to me was telling, you cant script that response.

I watched their interview and then showed it to my Wife expecting her to suggest a lack of emotion and pick up on the facial twitches from Step dad as possible substance abuse but of all the moments in it she pointed to that moment when he touched her and said she felt that was the reaction of a Woman who doesnt want to be touched by him.
Im sure an event like this would bring out some emotions you've never expressed before if you've never been through it, but despite that, surely it would be a time when the relationship between partners would be at its most unified, yet her reaction to his touch was not to reach out to him or look at him, she turned to where he touched her and closed her eyes.

I do not like anyone touching me when I’m upset, husband included regardless of whether he’s involved in causing the upset. He tries to do so and I involuntarily jerk away just like in the video. I am not the only person I know like this. I agree it’s less common than the alternative but I wouldn’t read too much into that.

 

[ms finch]

That's definitely not a bottle of sprite on the camping table.
(extracted from p7 of today's Perth Sunday Times)

View attachment 1266773

I’m guessing that is a bottle of sparkling of some sort based on the remnants of something around the neck of the bottle. I wouldn’t expect a screw cap (which most wines are now) or cork to look like that.

 

[DropBearess]

This is what thought was in the photo. The step dad is an avid fisherman. I can't see him getting to the site and then not fishing if the conditions allow for it to happen.

I think it's a rod and tackle box too. These things are expensive. Why would you leave them out overnight if you weren't planning to fish until next day? Best to leave them in your vehicle until needed. Seasoned campers know that fishing gear is the most commonly stolen stuff at camp grounds. I never leave mine out.

Maybe the parents did go fishing, even for a little while and we're not aware? A missing puzzle piece maybe?

 

[BFew]

I have a theory which fits the known facts..
Step Dad decides to go fishing and Cleo wants to go or perhaps step dad offers to take her to give Mum some one on one time with bubs. Mum suggests they take the sleeping bag to keep her warm down by the beach.
Something happens down the beach and Cleo is killed, perhaps she's laying on the sand and a big wave crashes in filling the sleeping bag and dragging her out to sea etc.

In this scenario, what's the chance that no-one and no CCTC saw/filmed them going to and from the fishing spot?

And what's the chance that if anybody did see them, that they would either keep quiet about until now, or forever.
Possibly being one of the people onsite that night that left the location in the morning before Police could interview them, or was someone just visiting the site that night (to visit friends or fish) and not actually sleeping there overnight?

Has anyone heard/seen reports of that location being a regular night fishing spot (lagoon or beach) after sundown and before first light?

Might have to hit the fishing forums/sights for the answer to this one.

 

[BFew]

I think it's a rod and tackle box too. These things are expensive. Why would you leave them out overnight if you weren't planning to fish until next day? Best to leave them in your vehicle until needed. Seasoned campers know that fishing gear is the most commonly stolen stuff at camp grounds. I never leave mine out.

I think I answered that not long ago today in here with

Maybe the rods and tackle box were locked in the car overnight, and as soon as he got up that morning after dawn, he got them from the car and put them on/by the table ready to set up for a morning fish, before it was noticed that Cleo was missing.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

I do not like anyone touching me when I’m upset, husband included regardless of whether he’s involved in causing the upset. He tries to do so and I involuntarily jerk away just like in the video. I am not the only person I know like this. I agree it’s less common than the alternative but I wouldn’t read too much into that.

Yeah i think theres a difference between being 'upset' and distraught at losing your child, id be clinging to whatever familiarity i had left personally, especially in that environment and circumstance.

 

[Longmembrey]

Still struggling to get my head around why the parents went looking for Cleo by driving in their car:

a) they said she hates the beach and wouldn't wander off, but then go and drive off in search?

b) trying to put myself in their shoes (fraught with danger, I know) I reckon I would definitely tell my wife "you stay here and keep looking / in case she comes back", I will take the car and look elsewhere". Just can't see why they both needed to jump in the car.....

c) the main thing that struck me as weird in their interview was how they said, we grew up near here so we went to the places that we would have gone as kids. Being cynical, that can be viewed as a consciousness of having acted strangely and trying to justify it.

Just my opinion

 

[Catdogbirdman]

Something that bugs me with this is why you'd waste a night away by going to bed early.
I can understand Mum hanging around the campsite with the baby at night but i struggle to believe why Step Dad wouldnt be out wetting a line on the first night.
There appears to be a tackle box on the table so fishing was obviously a planned activity.

I have a theory which fits the known facts..
Step Dad decides to go fishing and Cleo wants to go or perhaps step dad offers to take her to give Mum some one on one time with bubs. Mum suggests they take the sleeping bag to keep her warm down by the beach.
Something happens down the beach and Cleo is killed, perhaps she's laying on the sand and a big wave crashes in filling the sleeping bag and dragging her out to sea etc.
Plenty of people have drown wearing waders in surf in similar fashion.
Step Dad returns to the tent and explains it to Mum and between them they come up with a story to say she went missing from the tent, perhaps as a way of protecting themselves from losing the baby due to being considered neglectful over what happened to Cleo.
Would also explain the reaction mum gave when step dad touched her during the interview, she might not be complicit in what happened apart from going along with the story but she blames him for whats happened and doesnt want him touching her.
That reaction to me was telling, you cant script that response.

I watched their interview and then showed it to my Wife expecting her to suggest a lack of emotion and pick up on the facial twitches from Step dad as possible substance abuse but of all the moments in it she pointed to that moment when he touched her and said she felt that was the reaction of a Woman who doesnt want to be touched by him.
Im sure an event like this would bring out some emotions you've never expressed before if you've never been through it, but despite that, surely it would be a time when the relationship between partners would be at its most unified, yet her reaction to his touch was not to reach out to him or look at him, she turned to where he touched her and closed her eyes.

After several days of no sleep and no Cleo these parents are super tired and stressed. They probably argued about something small either on the night she disappearedor before the interview or both.. Both probably feel guilty and blame each other for not waking up. I think it's pretty normal for them to be kind of closed off from each other at that point in time. Especially given the stepfamily dynamics. Mum has said she's previously felt like it's her and Cleo against the world...she's upset that he didn't wake up and protect Cleo....she also knows that's not reasonable because she didn't wake up. It's grief.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

In this scenario, what's the chance that no-one and no CCTC saw/filmed them going to and from the fishing spot?

And what's the chance that if anybody did see them, that they would either keep quiet about until now, or forever.

The same chance of no vision of an abductor, which there appears to be none of either.
If they put the kids to bed and Cleo wouldnt settle it could have been after dark and just not able to be picked up or noticed, id imagine people coming and going from the beach with fishing gear wouldnt raise an eyebrow.
Go to any seaside caravan park or camp ground and you'll find some people tucked away in their accommodation at sunset, some sitting around in their own groups having a drink oblivious to anyone around them and a few stragglers taking off for a fish or evening walk or even just to the amenities.

Lots of people keep to themselves believe it or not, especially recently as theres many 'new campers' out there due to lack of interstate/overseas travel who havent been in the game long enough to realise that their fancy van isnt the envy of everyone else and that those around them arent planning to rob them.

Me personally, i like to wander around the campgrounds in the evening and often just say gday or get talking to people about their setups as you can learn a lot from what others do, if i we're there i'd probably be a suspect simply for doing the opposite of what many do.

 

[ms finch]

Yeah i think theres a difference between being 'upset' and distraught at losing your child, id be clinging to whatever familiarity i had left personally, especially in that environment and circumstance.

There is not a one size fits all in these situations. It’s one of the dangers of micro analysing every movement of someone in a press conference. There’s a very high chance I would react exactly the same way, for no reason other than I don’t like being touched. My point was to highlight the fact that assuming someone will react a particular way on things like that without knowing them or any context is pointless.

Maybe she was annoyed about something trivial or they had an argument just before the press conference. Maybe she blames him for not putting the fly down. Maybe she’s just angry at the whole world because her child is missing, which wouldn’t be unusual.

 

[DropBearess]

I wonder if the caretaker (or anyone else camping there) has access to a boat? Just a thought.
Little Jaidyn Leske was thrown in a dam in his sleeping bag. His killer attached a crow bar to weigh it down. A few buckets of soft sand would work even better. Plenty of room in Cleo's adult sleeping bag.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

Agreed.


Anything is possible. But surely the mother would crack at some point. This isnt going to be something that goes away. There will be focus on them for the rest of their lives.

Agreed, at some point she may well crack if this is what happened but its only early and right now the focus would be on protecting the relationship with the remaining child, especially if its been drummed into her that she'll lose both if she doesnt stick to the script.

 

[craigos]

Wonder if someone was trying to sneak into the house to get something of comfort for Cleo. A teddy or blanket etc.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

There is not a one size fits all in these situations. It’s one of the dangers of micro analysing every movement of someone in a press conference. There’s a very high chance I would react exactly the same way, for no reason other than I don’t like being touched. My point was to highlight the fact that assuming someone will react a particular way on things like that without knowing them or any context is pointless.

Maybe she was annoyed about something trivial or they had an argument just before the press conference. Maybe she blames him for not putting the fly down. Maybe she’s just angry at the whole world because her child is missing, which wouldn’t be unusual.

Or, maybe its what i suggested but you havent said thats at all possible i notice.

 

[imho]

i often remember a warning issued to me by my father figure regarding risk to personal security, and not knowing who you can trust when innocently revealing the simplest of information.
i'm unable to recall where the incident took place, and although unrelated to this case, i'll throw it in as food for thought...
a family, preparing for a short holiday, made some adjustments to routine services for the term of their absence, one of which was to suspend the daily delivery of fresh milk to their doorstep ... during the first few hours of their road trip, suddenly realising they'd forgotten something crucial, it was necessary to 180° and head straight back home where, upon arrival, they were shocked to see their home contents being loaded into a small truck parked in the driveway. deciding not to intervene they instead called the police who attended and promptly arrested one very opportunist milkman.


imho

 

[ms finch]

Or, maybe its what i suggested but you havent said thats at all possible i notice.

So what? My point is that I don’t think anything of substance can be gleaned from analysing the dynamic in a press conference either way. You’re the one trying to make out it can, and that it falls a particular way.