AFL 2014 Ladder Predictions

[Handyandy]

Maybe so but at least we have experienced it. 14 or 15 finals appearances out of the last 17, 2 premierships and a 1 point loss in another Grand Final is nothing that would have most other clubs laughing at, just begrudging. Franklin as your key forward in your premiership endeavours is not a desperate roll of the dice when in comparison some have to face the reality that Shitman Schultz is a key in their misguided premiership aspirations. Oh well if Sydney do salute in 2014 with their old man salary cap cheating team at least you will be able to say you beat them twice in 2013.

i would take shultz any day of the week over tippet. buddy is a glorified non finals performer. its no accident that hawthorn won a flag and looked like a much better team without him. the changing of the guard is always a difficult thing for the entrenched powers, but it is coming, the fact that you even mentioned sydneys previous glories and port as a contender shows just how quickly things change.

 

[Hawkas1988]

oh and where did the hawks game plan come from champ? who is hawthorns coach?. oh thats right the midget who was an assistant at port until late in 2004. oh derrr, some people are seriously thick. "our coaching box looks like a port adelaide 2004 premiership re union, but we didnt copy anything from port, we copied it from hawthorn, the team that copied port before us" great logic mr genius thanks for enlightening us

You do realise game plans change and evolve all the time and if hawks were using a model based on port of 04 now then I doubt we would get far.

Clarkos cluster as they call it which he created over a few years leading to the 08 flag had nothing to do with port adelaides model. Just because someone is an assistant coach somewhere doesn't mean he will copy that gameplan lol you have such a simplistic view of things.

As for richmond, hardwick did obviously use some of out gameplan but he has moulded it into the way he wants his team to play

 

[Hawkas1988]

i would take shultz any day of the week over tippet. buddy is a glorified non finals performer. its no accident that hawthorn won a flag and looked like a much better team without him. the changing of the guard is always a difficult thing for the entrenched powers, but it is coming, the fact that you even mentioned sydneys previous glories and port as a contender shows just how quickly things change.

Buddy would have to be one of the best KPF finals performers of the last decade. He actually is a big game player. 07 EF, 08 QF, 11 PF, 12 PF & 12 GF.

Most key forwards output in finals is reduced compard to the home and away season, but buddy has stepped up in finals many times. Name other key forwards with a better resume in finals atm. Obviously not every game he has dominated (as most key forwards dont in finals) but those games above he was huge

 

[juss]

So you haven't had a capable list for 30+ years? That's the last time you played in a grand final. Plenty of coaches in that time. Funny thing is that Tigger supporters have been saying year after year that your list is capable of going all the way. Now your saying that hasn't been the case?

Hardwick in 4 years has taken you to one unsuccessful final compared to Lyon who in three years as coach has taken Freo to three finals campaigns, including a Grand Final. Pretty obvious who has the better gameplan.

Hardwick came to a rebuilding side, you find me one supporter who said in the of his first four years that we had a list capable of going all the way for a flag. Don't just make stuff up.

You also can't seem to understand that Lyon didn't have to rebuild Freo. Lyon inherited a list that was widely tipped to be top 4 material. Hardwick when he arrived got an absolute rabble of a list that needed a massive turnover.

We haven't yet seen Hardwicks gameplan with a quality list, the jury will be out in the next 2-3 years on that. We have seen Lyons though, and time and again it has failed.

 

[Donakebab]

i would take shultz any day of the week over tippet. buddy is a glorified non finals performer. its no accident that hawthorn won a flag and looked like a much better team without him. the changing of the guard is always a difficult thing for the entrenched powers, but it is coming, the fact that you even mentioned sydneys previous glories and port as a contender shows just how quickly things change.

Franklin is a non finals performer? He was just about best on in the 2012 GF and averages more goals in finals than he does in the home and away season.

You have zero clues.

 

[Spoken4]

Hardwick came to a rebuilding side, you find me one supporter who said in the of his first four years that we had a list capable of going all the way for a flag. Don't just make stuff up.

You also can't seem to understand that Lyon didn't have to rebuild Freo. Lyon inherited a list that was widely tipped to be top 4 material. Hardwick when he arrived got an absolute rabble of a list that needed a massive turnover.

We haven't yet seen Hardwicks gameplan with a quality list, the jury will be out in the next 2-3 years on that. We have seen Lyons though, and time and again it has failed.

Are you really that naive? You are speaking to the bigfooty audience. We have all heard and seen pre-season prancing by Richmond supporters every year about their list being ready to take them to a premiership. You aren't seriously denying that are you?

Lyon inherited a team that the previous year finished 11th. Players like Walters, Crowley, Pearce, Suban, Clarke, Mayne and Johnson were on their way out the door. Lyon rejuvenated that group with a quality game plan and strong discipline. He turned players like Walters, Crowley, Mayne and Johnson into A graders. All that in two years.

We have seen Hardwick's gameplan with a quality list. On paper, in comparison to other teams Richmond has had a quality list for at least the past three seasons. IMO, what your team has lacked is improvement from the middle and lower tier players and a decent game plan.

 

[The Dice Man]

Are you really that naive? You are speaking to the bigfooty audience. We have all heard and seen pre-season prancing by Richmond supporters every year about their list being ready to take them to a premiership. You aren't seriously denying that are you?

Lyon inherited a team that the previous year finished 11th. Players like Walters, Crowley, Pearce, Suban, Clarke, Mayne and Johnson were on their way out the door. Lyon rejuvenated that group with a quality game plan and strong discipline. He turned players like Walters, Crowley, Mayne and Johnson into A graders. All that in two years.

We have seen Hardwick's gameplan with a quality list. On paper, in comparison to other teams Richmond has had a quality list for at least the past three seasons. IMO, what your team has lacked is improvement from the middle and lower tier players and a decent game plan.

You're just making shit up. 4 seasons ago we were worse than Fiztroy. There might have been 2 seasons in the past 10 where tiger fans might have been confident of making a finals series in the pre season.

Never over that time have any of us thought we could go all the way. Each season under Hardwick has been about consistent improvement, and every year he has delivered that. I'd hazard a guess and say most fans expectations are for a top 4 finish and winning a final. I have seen no one say we can go all the way, so please take your hand of your own chain.

Btw, everyone knows that Lyon's gameplan can take a team deep into finals, but everyone also knows that it has failed when it mattered, 4 times out of 4.

 

[Spoken4]

You're just making shit up. 4 seasons ago we were worse than Fiztroy. There might have been 2 seasons in the past 10 where tiger fans might have been confident of making a finals series in the pre season.

Never over that time have any of us thought we could go all the way. Each season under Hardwick has been about consistent improvement, and every year he has delivered that. I'd hazard a guess and say most fans expectations are for a top 4 finish and winning a final. I have seen no one say we can go all the way, so please take your hand of your own chain.

Btw, everyone knows that Lyon's gameplan can take a team deep into finals, but everyone also knows that it has failed when it mattered, 4 times out of 4.

Sorry buddy you can't handle the facts. Richmond supporters are the most delusional on BF. Happens year after year.

So Lyon's game plan cause the ball to bounce against its normal trajectory for Stephen Milne? That's what cost St Kilda a flag. And Lyon's game plan caused Fyfe, Ballantyne, Pavlich and Crowley to miss shots on goal that 19 times out of 20 they would have nailed? Interesting that you put responsibility for obvious player failures and just plain bad luck at the feet of Lyon.

BTW, I wouldn't rate a coach taking my team to one unsuccessful finals series in four years as "making consistent improvement". 2008 you finished 9th. With Hardwick taking over in 2010, you've finished 15th, 12th, 12th and finally 5th. Aside from 2013, I'd say you've been spinning your tyres.

 

[The Dice Man]

Sorry buddy you can't handle the facts. Richmond supporters are the most delusional on BF. Happens year after year.

So Lyon's game plan cause the ball to bounce against its normal trajectory for Stephen Milne? That's what cost St Kilda a flag. And Lyon's game plan caused Fyfe, Ballantyne, Pavlich and Crowley to miss shots on goal that 19 times out of 20 they would have nailed? Interesting that you put responsibility for obvious player failures and just plain bad luck at the feet of Lyon.

BTW, I wouldn't rate a coach taking my team to one unsuccessful finals series in four years as "making consistent improvement". 2008 you finished 9th. With Hardwick taking over in 2010, you've finished 15th, 12th, 12th and finally 5th. Aside from 2013, I'd say you've been spinning your tyres.

Lot of excuses there, but facts remain 4 grand finals and no silverware. Maybe we should talk about how he left st.kildas list. Hmmm something for you to look forward too.

What happened to 2009 in your argument? Was it convenient for you to leave out? Results speak for themselves. Hardwick has improved in % and win loss ratio every season he has been at the helm.

 

[Spoken4]

Lot of excuses there, but facts remain 4 grand finals and no silverware. Maybe we should talk about how he left st.kildas list. Hmmm something for you to look forward too.

What happened to 2009 in your argument? Was it convenient for you to leave out? Results speak for themselves. Hardwick has improved in % and win loss ratio every season he has been at the helm.

Excuses? How is stating that a ball bouncing off line and bad kicking on goal not being the coaches fault is an excuse? You blaming him for these things, which had absolutely nothing to do with his coaching or game plan, is nonsense at best and vexatious at worst.

Ah, the only St Kilda list troll again. Don't worry about Freo's list. The development of young players like Walters, Suban, Fyfe, Sheridan, Clarke, Crozier, Sutcliffe, Neale, Taberner, Hannath and Smith has been first rate under Lyon. If Lyon happens to leave Freo in two more years (which would be the same time he spent at the Saints), he will leave a very strong and balanced list that is still contending.

BTW, you finished 15th in 2009. Just like 2010. Going from 15th in 2009 to 12th in 2012 is hardly progress.

 

[The Dice Man]

Excuses? How is stating that a ball bouncing off line and bad kicking on goal not being the coaches fault is an excuse? You blaming him for these things, which had absolutely nothing to do with his coaching or game plan, is nonsense at best and vexatious at worst.

Ah, the only St Kilda list troll again. Don't worry about Freo's list. The development of young players like Walters, Suban, Fyfe, Sheridan, Clarke, Crozier, Sutcliffe, Neale, Taberner, Hannath and Smith has been first rate under Lyon. If Lyon happens to leave Freo in two more years (which would be the same time he spent at the Saints), he will leave a very strong and balanced list that is still contending.

BTW, you finished 15th in 2009. Just like 2010. Going from 15th in 2009 to 12th in 2012 is hardly progress.

It certainly is progress when you were a team rated worse than Fiztroy at the time of their execution. Hardwick along with Gale and co have completely rebuilt the club, literally from the ground up. And for the first time in our history can say we are a professionally ran football club, with the finances and structures to battle it out with the big boys.

Hardwick has done what no one else has been able too for a long time. The jury is out whether he can successfully take us all the way, but is think we are on the right track, for the first time in generations.

 

[Tiger71]

So you haven't had a capable list for 30+ years? That's the last time you played in a grand final. Plenty of coaches in that time. Funny thing is that Tigger supporters have been saying year after year that your list is capable of going all the way. Now your saying that hasn't been the case?

Hardwick in 4 years has taken you to one unsuccessful final compared to Lyon who in three years as coach has taken Freo to three finals campaigns, including a Grand Final. Pretty obvious who has the better gameplan.

/laugh

Thanks for that mate, I needed a good laugh. Firstly Hardwick rebuilt our list, now we have finally a list that is the right age bracket that should be competitive ie finals for the next five years or so. Lyon on the other hand, took a list from Thomas, topped up to try to win the big one, failed and then jumped shiped when he knew he had no young depth comming through. Lyon at least was man enough to admit he accepted the role at your club for the cash due to him losing a shit load but Lyone does not build anything, he just is hops on the back of the hard work prior and trys to get the glory.

Look at your mob now, your previous coach in his last two years brought in a ton of young kids who are now your stars, Lyon has just come in on the back of that and now that your younger kids have matured and your aging stars are still around you have made finals. Good for you! Like 17 other sides though it means shit as you dont have a flag as yet .

IMO your window is small, when Pav and co leave, Lyon does not have the recruiting runs on the board to BUILD anything. He just try's to throw cash at another clubs stars in his way to keep the window open. Let see what happens in the next 3 years

 

[Dan12]

Isn't it great to see dull posters tell others how delusional they are, without realising their own bit of delusional-ness? No, not really? Yeah I think the same.
Anyway Freo have a great shot at a premiership this year and Richmond do in around 2015-2018. There's no doubt about that. Great to see so many promising teams in the comp, especially teams that looked so weak a few years ago like Richmond and Fremantle. Both clubs are in a really good situation now.

 

[Spoken4]

/laugh

Thanks for that mate, I needed a good laugh. Firstly Hardwick rebuilt our list, now we have finally a list that is the right age bracket that should be competitive ie finals for the next five years or so. Lyon on the other hand, took a list from Thomas, topped up to try to win the big one, failed and then jumped shiped when he knew he had no young depth comming through. Lyon at least was man enough to admit he accepted the role at your club for the cash due to him losing a shit load but Lyone does not build anything, he just is hops on the back of the hard work prior and trys to get the glory.

Look at your mob now, your previous coach in his last two years brought in a ton of young kids who are now your stars, Lyon has just come in on the back of that and now that your younger kids have matured and your aging stars are still around you have made finals. Good for you! Like 17 other sides though it means shit as you dont have a flag as yet .

IMO your window is small, when Pav and co leave, Lyon does not have the recruiting runs on the board to BUILD anything. He just try's to throw cash at another clubs stars in his way to keep the window open. Let see what happens in the next 3 years

Funny, I thought Lyon left because Freo offered him an excellent contract and St Kilda's board stuffed around? Pretty sure if the Saints had got their act together, Lyon would still be there.

Again, you seem to have failed to grasp that Freo played most of 2013 without Pavlich and Sandilands. McPharlin also missed lots of games. And yet they still won enough games to finish top 4. So evidence would support that when Pav and co do eventually leave, Freo will be just fine.

 

[greatgatsby]

/laugh

Thanks for that mate, I needed a good laugh. Firstly Hardwick rebuilt our list, now we have finally a list that is the right age bracket that should be competitive ie finals for the next five years or so. Lyon on the other hand, took a list from Thomas, topped up to try to win the big one, failed and then jumped shiped when he knew he had no young depth comming through. Lyon at least was man enough to admit he accepted the role at your club for the cash due to him losing a shit load but Lyone does not build anything, he just is hops on the back of the hard work prior and trys to get the glory.

Look at your mob now, your previous coach in his last two years brought in a ton of young kids who are now your stars, Lyon has just come in on the back of that and now that your younger kids have matured and your aging stars are still around you have made finals. Good for you! Like 17 other sides though it means shit as you dont have a flag as yet .

IMO your window is small, when Pav and co leave, Lyon does not have the recruiting runs on the board to BUILD anything. He just try's to throw cash at another clubs stars in his way to keep the window open. Let see what happens in the next 3 years

Mate, happy to take your word for it on Richmond's list and what a great job Hardwick's done to rebuild it, apparently from nothing. But you clearly know absolutely nothing about Freo and its players, so the rest of it is getting a bit tired. The obsession with Ross Lyon is kind of amusing though, as is the spelling. Keep it up!

 

[bomberlegend2007]

Thought I would give it a crack.

1. Hawthorn
2. Fremantle
3. Sydney
4. Essendon
5. Geelong
6. North Melbourne
7. Richmond
8. Collingwood
--------------------------------
9. Port Adelaide
10. Adelaide
11. Carlton
12. West Coast
13. Western Bulldogs
14. Gold Coast
15. Brisbane
16. GWS Giants
17. Melbourne
18. St. Kilda

 

[theflea]

So you haven't had a capable list for 30+ years? That's the last time you played in a grand final. Plenty of coaches in that time. Funny thing is that Tigger supporters have been saying year after year that your list is capable of going all the way. Now your saying that hasn't been the case?

Hardwick in 4 years has taken you to one unsuccessful final compared to Lyon who in three years as coach has taken Freo to three finals campaigns, including a Grand Final. Pretty obvious who has the better gameplan.

What a load of bollocks. Such a generic statement and I invite you to prove it.

 

[Spoken4]

What a load of bollocks. Such a generic statement and I invite you to prove it.

Nice to see the hoards of Richmond supporters coming into defend their honour.

 

[theflea]

oh and where did the hawks game plan come from champ? who is hawthorns coach?. oh thats right the midget who was an assistant at port until late in 2004. oh derrr, some people are seriously thick. "our coaching box looks like a port adelaide 2004 premiership re union, but we didnt copy anything from port, we copied it from hawthorn, the team that copied port before us" great logic mr genius thanks for enlightening us

Actually, chump, we had the new improved 'hawks' game plan of which we have tweaked to suit ourselves and nothing like the 04 port model. Remember the hawks were running with the cluster at the time. God people are thick.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Free agency has come along at an incredibly perfect time for Freo. Whereas we gave up draft picks to top up for a flag tilt (like giving up a first rounder for Andrew Lovett), Freo have been able to top up for theirs through free agency, giving them Pearce and now Sylvia without having to give up anything but money and cap space for them and being able to keep their early picks for the likes of Josh Simpson and Apeness. Free agency is going to make it much easier for teams to stay near the top of the ladder. They will need to find a suitable replacement for Pav though. Gumby could be good value, but they'll probably need more.

 

[Bobby_]

giving them Pearce and now Sylvia without having to give up anything but money and cap space for them

those 2 are really something special aren't they

 

[aussierulesrules]

Should be a great season.

If GWS and Melbourne can pull their finger out and be competitive too it will be fun to watch.

Yep, hopefully last year will be last we see of sides being pretty much uncompetitive for a long time.

 

[aussierulesrules]

those 2 are really something special aren't they

If we'd had someone like them instead of the likes of Robert Eddy and Raph Clarke in 2009 and 2010 we probably win both those premierships. They are more than handy additions to teams contending for a flag. Sylvia in particular has played a bunch of damn good games of footy.

 

[Spoken4]

those 2 are really something special aren't they

Yep, the addition of those have helped give us a better midfield than Geelong, that's for sure!!!

 

[theflea]

Are you really that naive? You are speaking to the bigfooty audience. We have all heard and seen pre-season prancing by Richmond supporters every year about their list being ready to take them to a premiership. You aren't seriously denying that are you?

Lyon inherited a team that the previous year finished 11th. Players like Walters, Crowley, Pearce, Suban, Clarke, Mayne and Johnson were on their way out the door. Lyon rejuvenated that group with a quality game plan and strong discipline. He turned players like Walters, Crowley, Mayne and Johnson into A graders. All that in two years.

We have seen Hardwick's gameplan with a quality list. On paper, in comparison to other teams Richmond has had a quality list for at least the past three seasons. IMO, what your team has lacked is improvement from the middle and lower tier players and a decent game plan.

I am denying it. So since your making the statement I want evidence of 'every year'......