Are St Kilda really that good?

[davywap]

Ah you've gotta love the 90% of the Collingwood supporting faction that are dead set nuffies and get on here and start threads such as this and leave the other 10% to pick up the pieces with common sense and sound footy knowledge.

Good win today by Collingwood but in the overall scheme of things it means nothing, just as St Kilda's Round 3 win meant nothing. Do it in September when it counts and then it is something to crow about.

Bring on the finals!

Yes bring them on, I predict us Collingwood 'nuffies' will be starting similiar threads then too and the Saints 'nuffies' will not be in a position to be posting similiar threads about Collingwood, as they have been all year, and then some.

Thanks for the generalising insult.

 

[LJ Garner]

I thought it was us Pies supporters who were supposed to make ridiculous excuses.

Pies seriously as dumb as it's stereotyped?

Read what he wrote again, and realise it was plain old sarcasm. Riewoldt wasn't playing 4 weeks ago, Dal Santo didn't play today. You sir need glasses.

 

[Plugger35]

And the excuses keep coming.

You don't rate Dal Santo as a player?

Nathan Buckley would crawl over broken glass to get a photo next to Nick Dal Santo.

 

[Nardz]

You don't rate Dal Santo as a player?

Nathan Buckley would crawl over broken glass to get a photo next to Nick Dal Santo.

please..

dal santo isnt and never will be half the player buckley was.. in fact being in close proximity to the great man would probably result in some sort of improvement to his game..

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

The Saints are an interesting team. Their top flight talent is as good as anyone's in the league. They have game breakers and goal sneaks up forward, they have a defensive structure that is sound, built mainly on supporting one another more than any particular outstanding one on one players. Fisher and Gilbert are both top class, but are more rebounding and third man up defenders, but they do it so well and the effects have been seen in the results over the past two seasons.

Witnessing them first hand yesterday gave me the impression that they are light on for talented midfielders, after those outstanding four or five. For every Selwood, Ablett, Bartel, Corey, Chapman, Kelly and Ling there is a Montagna, Hayes, Dal Santo, Goddard and.... well not much more.

My point is better illustrated in going through the midfields of the top four or five teams.
(how they're playing now)

Saints. A) Goddard, Hayes, Dal Santo, Montagna
B) Ray, Gram, Jones
C) Schneider (as a mid), Armitage, Peake

Cats. A) Ablett, Selwood, Bartel, Kelly, Chapman
B) Corey, Ling, Varcoe, Stokes

Hawks. A) Hodge, Mitchell, Rioli, Burgoyne
B) Sewell, X Ellis, Lewis, Bateman
C) Young

Dogs. A) Cooney, Griffen, Boyd, Cross
B) Giansiracusa, Eagleton, Higgins, Picken, Ward

Pies. A) Swan, Didak, Pendlebury
B) Ball, Beams, Thomas, Wellingham, Sidebottom, B Johnson

The interesting thing in looking at these squads is that Collingwood's big ace is there second tier evenness and the improvement that can come from this brigade. Geelong simply has the most A graders, no suprise there, but their depth after their cream is the best place to attack them, as it is with the Saints. I would hate to rely on Gram (because of injury) and Ray? Schneider/Peake (because of shitness) to carry me through.
This isn't to say that they can't, because they have proven before that they can. Quite simply Collingwood needs to stretch the game and the rotations to take advantage of the second tier, because once they can see off that first initial class that all other aspirants have, their B-graders have a big talent advantage over the rest. If one of the A-graders goes down ie Dal Santo, then the Saints are in big trouble. I would go so far as to say their top four mids are as important as Riewoldt to the side, because of the lack of class backing them up.
The Hawks and Dogs are quite similar to Collingwood in that way, they have mid range depth and improvement in their B-graders. They need to stay in the game with the Saints and Cats while their class onballers are firing, and then counter when they're resting (that is on and off the ground, some champs don't know when to take a breather).
If any of these sides lose an A-grader for the finals, you would think they can not win the flag, but especially so for the Saints.

They are good, they just lack classy midfield depth. The only question is, will they need it? Are their classy four enough?

 

[davywap]

Pies seriously as dumb as it's stereotyped?

Read what he wrote again, and realise it was plain old sarcasm. Riewoldt wasn't playing 4 weeks ago, Dal Santo didn't play today. You sir need glasses.

I knew exactly what it was 'Sir', I think its you who doesn't understand what he was getting at. i.e. Using sarcasm to make the excuses. Try and focus dude.

 

[davywap]

You don't rate Dal Santo as a player?

Yes, but I don't rate him as hard, that's what I was 'ing at.

Speaking of 'ing:

Nathan Buckley would crawl over broken glass to get a photo next to Nick Dal Santo.

You're a riot!!!!

 

[pacemaker]

How come none of these teams have one premierships this century?

 

[Amber Guzzler]

You don't rate Dal Santo as a player?

Nathan Buckley would crawl over broken glass to get a photo next to Nick Dal Santo.

Nathan Buckley would crawl over broken glass for a chance to play for top spot, even if he had a sore back. Dal Santo is soft.

 

[Nathan Q Brown]

You don't rate Dal Santo as a player?

Nathan Buckley would crawl over broken glass to get a photo next to Nick Dal Santo.

you aren't serious??? are you????

NDS better than the elite Buckley?????? settle down..


by the way we had a couple out too ----- and thanks for playing that clown Kosi!

 

[FuManchu]

St Kilda looked overly big, body wise yesterday and as a result very slow by foot. And they persisted is going backwards all the time which allowed Collingwood to corral them in and pressure the vball carrier who had diminished option to move it on, which is exactly what St Kilda did to us in Rd3. When they did move the ball on quickly thru the middle they had it all over us, but they just refused to resort to this very often. Couldnt understand why.

 

[Nathan Q Brown]

Saints. A) Goddard, Hayes, Dal Santo, Montagna
B) Ray, Gram, Jones
C) Schneider (as a mid), Armitage, Peake


Pies. A) Swan, Didak, Pendlebury
B) Ball, Beams, Thomas, Wellingham, Sidebottom, B Johnson

?

intersting to reflect again on the movement of a B player (Ball) from Saints to Pies. Has clearly strengthened one and weakened the other. The much heralded replacement (Armitage) is lucky to be rated C

Ball has given us the bonus of contributing to the growth of our 2nd teirs - Beams, Sidebottom, Thomas, etc and replacing a C -n O'Bree. Inspired recruiting on one side and poor list management on the other

 

[FuManchu]

intersting to reflect again on the movement of a B player (Ball) from Saints to Pies. Has clearly strengthened one and weakened the other. The much heralded replacement (Armitage) is lucky to be rated C

Ball has given us the bonus of contributing to the growth of our 2nd teirs - Beams, Sidebottom, Thomas, etc and replacing a C -n O'Bree. Inspired recruiting on one side and poor list management on the other

If you listen to great luminaries like the Fireman, If Lyon had played Armitage in last years GF, St Kilda would have won. But in his great wisdom, Firey says Lyon didnt play him because he wanted to protect Armitage from the bigger bodied Geelong players, saving him for subsequent years.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.

I put it to you, if you knew the baby jesus would win you a flag this year, but wouldn't be around to save the world because of this fact, you'd still play him. The world can save itself.

 

[Swans120]

The Saints have been very good, one of the best 2 teams in the comp for the last 3 months and all of a sudden they lose to a desperate Pies who needed to win as much for their own sense of self belief (to topple one of the Saints or Cats) and now they are finished? In fact, they're not finished but they are just not a good side. Come off it.

They beat the Cats a few weeks ago, they are a very good side and with Riewoldt getting back to full fitness very slowly they will improve.

 

[Elite]

They werent that "desperate", they played the way collingwood usually plays when they're up. Infact, we can play a lot better than that.

Saints basically got done in every area.



And why do people keep saying Ball is an average mid, or "just" gets to be a "B" grader?
Do people actually watch him play!

He has been outstanding, his work is very noticable.
For the job he was employed to do, he is an A grader, no doubt in my mind.
His inside skills are amazing, he is a good kick, and a smart player, but again, he is A grade at what he is known for.

 

[LiterallyNobody]

Glorified H&A match, just like the one in round 3 that your mob didn't shut up about until yesterday, after which your mob had written off any premiership chances the Pies had?

*sigh*

Thank you. Yes that may be true however it wasn't my point was it? My point was that Ross Lyon won't be sacked for that game.

 

[Rohan25]

Can't remember the exact stat, but there was something in the HS the other day about the number of goals we've scored after Luke Ball wins first possession. He was like 6th overall in the league. Put simply, he has created a hell of a lot of goals for us this year.

 

[mongrel_punt]

This post gives no credit to your own team.

Let me tell you something, St Kilda didn't lose today because they played badly. They lost today because Collingwood played very bloody well, put a LOT of pressure on St Kilda and made them make a lot of mistakes. St Kilda, like Geelong last night played like a deer in headlights.

We won at the MCG against the best team in the league about five weeks ago so your first sentence is a myth. We kicked fifty points in the game today because your defence was OUTSTANDING. You won the game not because your forwards played well or your mids got the ball there or you got all that space - you won today because of your backline. Absolutely smashed us. Put too much pressure on us and caused us to kick 16 behinds, kind of like what we did to you in round 3, remember?

It is not the fault of the coach that we kicked fifty points today because we clearly were aiming for 16.6.102 not 6.16.52.


And ther knives are not going to come out for him because we lose a glorified home and away match to your mob, let me tell you that.

Geez Louise.

*shakes head in disbelief*

Geez it took me two pages to find a sensible post, congrats OES.

Next time we square off, the Saints will be far more prepared and will look to reverse our physical domination. I guarantee you it will not be a 50 point win in the finals.

Saints are still a very good side, they just got caught on the back foot yesterday and probably thought they could get by on talent rather than hard work.

For me Saints and Geelong are still the sides to beat, with the Pies and Hawks making a real challenge.

 

[Stoddy]

The question was asked whether Collingwood was good enough when St Kilda beat us. We must now pose whether St Kilda are really that good. 6 goals on a perfect day, another failure in front of a big crowd and Milne failing again when it counts. Are St Kilda really that good?

was a stupid question when we beat you guys and its a stupid question now

 

[Xtreme]

Every team has their good and bad days on the ground.

We'll see what happens at the conclusion of round 22 (in terms of ladder position) and throughout September as to who may go out in consecutive losses (after securing the double chance), and who is the team left standing on the last day in September and who will then become the sole survivor /Jeff Probst

 

[johncitizen]

A friend of mine sent me this..Saints supporter with his opinion on how they're travelling. IMO Saints are really good and have as much chance as Geelong and the Pies of a flag this year. 3 best teams so far.

Far too good on the day. Great team performance. Everyone played a role.

A number of our players were exposed. Kosi: Not sure where he is at; Pattison (Ricmond reject): Not up to it; Fisher & Gilbert: No opposite side of their body. A couple of our boys do not keep their eye on the ball and are a little soft: Ray, McQualter, Pattison & Peake.

We have the Hawks next week and their only blemish in the past two months was a 2 point loss to Geelong, so we have a real challenge on our hands.

Positives: Reiwoldt 2nd game back, appears to have got through unscathed; Gram 2nd game back from 6 weeks off and he is still quite rusty; Dal Santo who has been in super form missed. We had won 7 straight, so have been up for a while.

 

[Sttew]

Rare loss against a desperate Pies team, yes Saints are that good, and for me, the team to beat. But Pies and Dogs are that good too.

Comes down to which team in September is at their peak, not rd 11 or rd 16. Could well be Hawks vs Pies GF, but IMO, Saints will be there

The ever optimistic Cat supporter, Veedubs, has again written his team off. For the 37th time in 3 years.

 

[Last Line Hero]

How does that make him different to most of the other coaches on the circuit, Bomber Thomspon and perhaps Clarkson excluded?

And what teams have won the past 3 GF's? And in addition, what team flogged you yesterday?

 

[ishka29]

No we're not good at all, expect it to be all down hill skiing from here. We are just an average side and are lucky to be where we are after 16 games.

COLLLINGWOOD for the premiership

 

[demondavey]

The question was asked whether Collingwood was good enough when St Kilda beat us. We must now pose whether St Kilda are really that good. 6 goals on a perfect day, another failure in front of a big crowd and Milne failing again when it counts. Are St Kilda really that good?

Yes they are, they are a proven side. Based on last years performance and a place in last years GF to which they lost by two goals. They had their chances. Yes they are really that good. Look at their form this year. Collingwood have beaten them in RD 16, so fuc*ing what? Beat them in a prelim or GF and then come back and ask 'are st kilda really that good?' dont get ahead of yourself, collingwood have more to prove than anyone in the top four