Are Victorians holding football back?

[Durham Hawks]

now that north, melbourne and the bulldogs are all part of the AFL's long-term plan there's not much more victorians could be doing to forward the game. nothing victoria does stops port fans from attending home games, fremantle from not having the same waiting list as west coast or sydney and brisbane from selling out home matches.

if anything the non-vics obsession with building rivalries with victorian teams is the real killer. if they focused on rivalries with less marketable teams, fremantle and port in particular, they'd be able to take an untapped slice of the pie. as it is, the non-vics act like victorian teams that just happen to be in different states, lining up in the queue for collingwood and essendon like everyone else.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Interstate clubs have won 6 of the past 10 flags (including 4 in "non football states") and 10 of the past 20. And the sky didnt fall in.

Victorians are not holding football back. The game is as strong as ever.

 

[Papa G]

Not Victorians, just a couple of VFL legacy teams.

 

[Papa G]

now that north, melbourne and the bulldogs are all part of the AFL's long-term plan there's not much more victorians could be doing to forward the game. nothing victoria does stops port fans from attending home games, fremantle from not having the same waiting list as west coast or sydney and brisbane from selling out home matches.

if anything the non-vics obsession with building rivalries with victorian teams is the real killer. if they focused on rivalries with less marketable teams, fremantle and port in particular, they'd be able to take an untapped slice of the pie. as it is, the non-vics act like victorian teams that just happen to be in different states, lining up in the queue for collingwood and essendon like everyone else.

This is pretty idiotic.

 

[Butane]

I'm always amazed at how people can confuse money with football. What the hell do we care about how big the game is? Bragging rights against other codes? That's just childish. It would be hard to give a **** if my team finally won another flag against the Wall St Bulls or Microsoft Crashes. Give me Fitzroy anyday.

 

[BACCS]

Teams with no culture

West Coast
Fremantle
Adelaide
Brisbane (well not anymore after that monstrosity that they call a jumper was released)
Gold Coast
West Sydney

that is all

Teams no one gives a shit about besides their own pathetic supporters:
Melbourne
North
Bulldogs
Port

that is all

 

[BACCS]

Interstate clubs have won 6 of the past 10 flags (including 4 in "non football states") and 10 of the past 20. And the sky didnt fall in.

Victorians are not holding football back. The game is as strong as ever.

Exactly, however in the long run, I don't think 20 teams are sustainable, which is why I can see two Vic clubs folding. Also the North supporters can bitch all they like, but they shouldve relocated to the GC when they had the chance, will come back to bite them on the arse soon enough.

 

[ArachniX]

Not Victorians, just a couple of VFL legacy teams.

Without the weaker Victorian clubs, what do you think would happen to the dynamics of the power of football clubs in Victoria?

Killing the weaker clubs or relocating them will just make the stronger Victorian clubs even stronger. With Melbourne's exploding population, spreading the support between 10 clubs is better for the game than spreading it between 8 or 6.

Currently at least four of the Victorian clubs well and truly hold their own against West Coast and Adelaide. Imagine if they then got the future generations of the 100,000 or so members of Melbourne/Western Bulldogs and North Melbourne.

 

[Johnson#26]

Does the fact that the AFL is dominated by Victorian teams and comprise of most of footballers followers mean that they are holding the game back?

Ive heard some Victorians state that they wish that the AFL would revert back into the VFL!

I believe that the continual whinging from some Victorian Football fans has resulted in the game only expanding to Sydney on a national level in the 80's, and is currently holding the game back internationally.

Demitriou and his team are great in the fact he is trying to grow football outside of traditional areas, and are beginning to realise the benefits of growing football outside of Australian shores.
People on Bigfooty sometimes refer to non-Victorian clubs as interstate clubs.

Growing the game outside of traditional areas will only increase its appeal!!

Disrespectful post. You can't just come into a competition and try and spin things in a completely different direction.

 

[Johnson#26]

tbh I couldn't give a shit about Sydney or the game being played anywhere else.

All it means is money, and how much the players can pull in and how much the executives can make from football. Money does nothing for the game.

AFL would have been much better with the VFL, SANFL and WAFL leagues as they were. All the national competition has done is dilute the number of games available here in Melbourne and all there is for the future is the promise of more no-atmosphere games where there are only supporters from one side at games.

Nothing stirrs the blood like hearing a pin drop when your side scores a goal interstate. The atmosphere must be electric.

Exactly. Bring on a GC vs GWS grand final. Cannot wait. Excitement ensures.

Or even just a stock Pies vs GC match at the MCG. Fremantle/Port/Adelaide/WCE games are flat enough as it is. I feel for the Roos/Dees who'll have to ride some bumps with a grin in the first few years.

 

[Johnson#26]

I wouldnt say holding it back, mabee just trying to hold onto how it was when footy had a soul, the game started to die about this time but the franchise boomed, supporters from interstate leagues probably didnt want a national league either, thats what made state of origin so great, also alot of victorians dont want change coz it meens some will lose their clubs..

Can see what you mean, but where is the point of following a team - any team - if there is no meaning, or soul to it? How can it be possible? For instance, if Collingwood was, God forbid, booted from the AFL, I'd watch the AFL, but have no true interest or care factor - and it would slowly evaporate as the seasons go by. And I'm more tolerant than most others who'd switch off full stop.

And for meaning, I'd end up, most likely, following a VFL or suburban side. If you want corporate, soulless franchises (aka balance sheet football teams), continue down the path we're going and disrespect the original clubs.

Nor would there be without the other states. Victoria makes up the largest portion, but they are not the whole competition.

Without Victoria, we'd be playing balance sheet footy. Brisbane and Sydney aside, to a point, but then how deep to you want to cut?

See, I just do not understand how fans will suddenly leap onto the GC/GWS bandwagon with such gusto, and then hold onto it forever and a day. Especially when you know it's a plastic club created by the AFL - and in a far different fashion than the suburban sides in Vic/SA/WA were over 100-years ago.

 

[Slattery_20]

Not Victorians, just a couple of VFL legacy teams.

Say thank you for our VFL legacy money keeping your club going or we'll stop sending your cheques.

 

[Papa G]

Without the weaker Victorian clubs, what do you think would happen to the dynamics of the power of football clubs in Victoria?

Killing the weaker clubs or relocating them will just make the stronger Victorian clubs even stronger. With Melbourne's exploding population, spreading the support between 10 clubs is better for the game than spreading it between 8 or 6.

Currently at least four of the Victorian clubs well and truly hold their own against West Coast and Adelaide. Imagine if they then got the future generations of the 100,000 or so members of Melbourne/Western Bulldogs and North Melbourne.

So essentially your saying that if say North and Melboune were given the bullett, their supporters would automatically flock to Collingwood and Essendon, and for that reason they should remain in the competition?

This is wrong because North and Melbourne have between 10 and 15,000 hardcore supporters each. Hardcore supporters don't change clubs. The casual supporter may switch clubs, but they would simply remain a casual supporter of the new club.

 

[snrub]

I expect that most Victorians have no problem with the VFL's expansion into Perth and Adelaide and Sydney and Brisbane. However, the belief that the game should extend into non-traditional football territories at the expense of football heartland (ie Tasmania) is idiotic. We may just as well wind up Freo and Port Adelaide along with a bunch of Melbourne clubs so that we can establish teams in Newcastle, the Central Coast and north QLD.

 

[Papa G]

Say thank you for our VFL legacy money keeping your club going or we'll stop sending your cheques.

Please. We've had a couple of years of financial trouble mainly brought on by our own licence holder screwing us, but to say teams like North and Melbourne pay for our existence is ludicrous.

 

[snrub]

Teams no one gives a shit about besides their own pathetic supporters:
Melbourne
North
Bulldogs
Port

that is all

Anyone here give a shit about Adelaide besides Adelaide supporters? Anyone at all?

Your post is the low point in this thread. Didn't think it through did you?

 

[Sttew]

It was only three years ago that we were wondering when and if a Victorian side would win the premiership again.

We still have too many Melbourne based teams and this makes the competition lopsided. That Victorian teams are again truly dominating the competition is amazing when you consider in WA there is one team for every 8000,000 people, and roughly the same in SA, whereas in VIC there is one team for 500,000.

 

[skipper kelly]

It was only three years ago that we were wondering when and if a Victorian side would win the premiership again.

We still have too many Melbourne based teams and this makes the competition lopsided. That Victorian teams are again truly dominating the competition is amazing when you consider in WA there is one team for every 8000,000 people, and roughly the same in SA, whereas in VIC there is one team for 500,000.

The list numbers are the same and there is a national draft. A club could be based at Horsham (no disrespect) and the on field performance has every chance to be equal or better than any current club.

 

[Slattery_20]

It was only three years ago that we were wondering when and if a Victorian side would win the premiership again.

We still have too many Melbourne based teams and this makes the competition lopsided. That Victorian teams are again truly dominating the competition is amazing when you consider in WA there is one team for every 8000,000 people, and roughly the same in SA, whereas in VIC there is one team for 500,000.

The only thing about population that is at all relevant is the size of the crowds they can pull. And the AFL take the sting out of that for Melb, Carlton, Sydney, PA etc by propping them up.

 

[Slattery_20]

Please. We've had a couple of years of financial trouble mainly brought on by our own licence holder screwing us, but to say teams like North and Melbourne pay for our existence is ludicrous.

Mainly?
Between that and the 15,000 home crowds.

An AFL club which has to pay 92.5% of a $7M cap will struggle if they can only pull 20k a week.

 

[Johnson#26]

Does anyone honestly think Victoria can sustain 10 teams in the future?

I reckon they can. Look at the ones who most believe are perennial strugglers - Melbourne are struggling onfield, but the signs and framework are there. Off the field, they're getting the structure right after years of drifting aimlessly. Full credit to Stynes and his team. I reckon it wouldn't have been an easy club to support for a while there, as it seemed to be without direction. Now, it has purpose again.

The Dogs have made some major steps off field, and I reckon the label of 'struggler' is partially stigma from 01-04. But whereas Melb has the numbers re supporters in the woodwork (IMO), I sure hope the Dogs can manufacture a few more. Their team/club is going great guns.

Roos, they can too. Think they've also made some major steps to becoming a first class organisation off field - JB and Arocca have given them direction and a harder edge. No more nomadic seasons on the horizon, it seems. Again, hope for their sake they have some fans yet to sign on like the Dogs, but I ask the doubters this - GC/GWS are unlikely to attain the following WB and Nth Melb have, are they? Both in terms of attendances, membership (perhaps the GC can), and ability to get fans to stick.

 

[Johnson#26]

Teams no one gives a shit about besides their own pathetic supporters:
Melbourne
North
Bulldogs
Port

that is all

So you seriously reckon Freo and Adelaide have 'interest' value outside of their own supporter group?

 

[Subaru Impreza]

I believe relocation of Victorian teams (weak teams) is just a cop out to keep Victorian teams alive . I for one would be disgusted if a Kangaroos side relocated to Tasmania.

Every team should have their own identity. The day when the AFL has > 50% teams outside of Melbourne, is the day when this competition is national. As I see it, Victorian teams still have way too much of an advantage over non-Victorian teams, in terms of draw's, fixturing etc.

I mean you honestly cant tell me this draw is fair if Collingwood gets 18 games in Melbourne out of 22. Im sorry but that is just not fair.

 

[vonn]

The AFL has got to decide between what they'd rather - tradition or expansion.

 

[Johnson#26]

The AFL has got to decide between what they'd rather - tradition or expansion.

it's hardly that simplistic.