Best midfield ever?

[Mr Meow]

This is the sort of s**t that makes people think you’re a joke mate.

They aren’t defenders and forwards in this context. They were all midfielders at some stage. Brad Scott wasn’t a midfielder. Even I have included him in my Brisbane midfield for the sake of this discussion.

Considering one of your key arguments is ‘blah blah blah three Brownlow medalists’ you should be very considerate of the fact that one of them could barely get his hands on the ball at a midfield level. Akermanis only had 3 seasons where he got 20+ disposals a game, the highest of them being 21.

He wasn’t a ‘midfielder’ mate but we all let you have that one because we know he went through there from time to time.

Steve Johnson had 6 seasons where he averaged 20+ touches, including seasons of 28, 25, 22 and 22.

Not only that, but across the course of their whole careers he got more ball AND kicked half a goal more per game. Ergo he was probably simply, wait for it, just as good a player player without the little shiny thing around his neck. So I think we can put the Johnson myth to bed, otherwise you can take your friend Jason out of the midfield too, can’t we.

Now onto Paul.

Now Paul sadly couldn’t manage to match Jason’s 3 seasons of 20+ disposals. He could only manage it 8 times. My understanding of maths is somewhat clouded after seeing some of your efforts in recent times on various subjects so I don’t know where this stands. Is 8 more than 3? Paul Chapman had seasons of 28, 26, 23 and 22 disposals per game, more than any Jason Akermanis ever managed.

He too has the distinction of having a career where he has a higher disposal count, and higher goal average, than Akermanis but no medal to show for it - but again I think we can safely say that if you can call the Brisbane player a midfielder, you can call the two Geelong players midfielders, wouldn’t you?

Career-wise it was 2.4 clearances per game for Aker, 2.0 for Chapman and Johnson.

All players who rotated freely between inside 50 and supporting midfield, going at about 20 touches a game in a lower disposal era.

Falcon has deemed just one of them a component of his sides deep midfield though. What a shock.

And today we learned a deep midfield means having 3 or more players in a merged top 7 of a composite team of the centuries best midfields. That one actually fried my brain, it was so stupid.

 

[STPer18]

Cameron Ling aka the fan voted sexiest man in football takes your best midfielder out of the game while racking up 20+ touches and good for almost a goal a game himself. Underrated.

 

[Mr Meow]

Cameron Ling aka the fan voted sexiest man in football takes your best midfielder out of the game while racking up 20+ touches and good for almost a goal a game himself. Underrated.

Falcon says "Gross. Stop naming All Australian midfielders from that Geelong side. It is making me physically ill."

Which sums up his furious mission in a nutshell.

 

[Cleansweep17]

Voss, Black, Lappin, Ashcroft, Hart, Copeland, Luke Power who was an incredibly underrated player, Akermanis of course and Keating. Brad Scott played through the middle a bit too and while not the most skillful he was as tough as nails. Throw Charman in there as well and their ruckmen weren’t amazing but in keeping with their entire team they were certainly tough.

I’ll make it easy for you.

Combined 7 would be in this order(ish):

GAJ, Voss, Black, Aker, Bartel, Lappin, Keating

Problem with the Geelong mids it’s that they actually drop off quick. The difference between GAJ and Bartel is massive, then after Bartel it goes straight into tier 3 players like Ling (who player an extinct position) and Young Selwood.

Now instead of laughing with your mate Mr. Meow then calling me crazy. Please let me know if you disagree and provide your 7. Thanks.

 

[Cleansweep17]

Brisbane's fab four/five would demolish most teams today including Geelong 07-11 outfits.

You never fail to disappoint Xteme, one of the most logical people on this forum.

Anybody with a brain knows Lions would demolish them. Especially with Lethal as coach, their main coach was doing lines mid game.

 

[PhatBoy]

I’ll make it easy for you.

Combined 7 would be in this order(ish):

GAJ, Voss, Black, Aker, Bartel, Lappin, Keating

Problem with the Geelong mids it’s that they actually drop off quick. The difference between GAJ and Bartel is massive, then after Bartel it goes straight into tier 3 players like Ling (who player an extinct position) and Young Selwood.

Now instead of laughing with your mate Mr. Meow then calling me crazy. Please let me know if you disagree and provide your 7. Thanks.

Would it?
Keating wouldn’t get picked above Ottens for starters and the pretense that you know enough about these guys despite having never watched them? Just drop it because everyone is past it mate. Keating was a decent, tough ruckman who was nice and complimentary to the guys he played with. Same as Charman when he came along. He wasn’t ’elite.’ Ottens was. So you can dispense with that straight away. You talk about Akermanis like he was God’s gift to the midfield of modern football. He WAS a great player, no doubting that. He was no more a midfielder than Steve Johnson was mate, and numerically he was probably the inferior player. As far as midfielders go? You’re probably not even ranking him properly within his own TEAM.

That’s not doing your team any favours.

 

[Cleansweep17]

This is the sort of s**t that makes people think you’re a joke mate.

They aren’t defenders and forwards in this context. They were all midfielders at some stage. Brad Scott wasn’t a midfielder. Even I have included him in my Brisbane midfield for the sake of this discussion.

Considering one of your key arguments is ‘blah blah blah three Brownlow medalists’ you should be very considerate of the fact that one of them could barely get his hands on the ball at a midfield level. Akermanis only had 3 seasons where he got 20+ disposals a game, the highest of them being 21.

He wasn’t a ‘midfielder’ mate but we all let you have that one because we know he went through there from time to time.

Steve Johnson had 6 seasons where he averaged 20+ touches, including seasons of 28, 25, 22 and 22.

Not only that, but across the course of their whole careers he got more ball AND kicked half a goal more per game. Ergo he was probably simply, wait for it, just as good a player player without the little shiny thing around his neck. So I think we can put the Johnson myth to bed, otherwise you can take your friend Jason out of the midfield too, can’t we.

Now onto Paul.

Now Paul sadly couldn’t manage to match Jason’s 3 seasons of 20+ disposals. He could only manage it 8 times. My understanding of maths is somewhat clouded after seeing some of your efforts in recent times on various subjects so I don’t know where this stands. Is 8 more than 3? Paul Chapman had seasons of 28, 26, 23 and 22 disposals per game, more than any Jason Akermanis ever managed.

He too has the distinction of having a career where he has a higher disposal count, and higher goal average, than Akermanis but no medal to show for it - but again I think we can safely say that if you can call the Brisbane player a midfielder, you can call the two Geelong players midfielders, wouldn’t you?

Mr. Meow: Names Scarlett, Enright and Johnson in a best midfield thread (which they wouldn’t even be considered in anyway)

Me: Points out they aren’t midfielders

Cats people: Omg you’re a lunatic (whilst frothing at the mouth)

 

[PhatBoy]

You never fail to disappoint Xteme, one of the most logical people on this forum.

Anybody with a brain knows Lions would demolish them. Especially with Lethal as coach, their main coach was doing lines mid game.

There you have it.

A Bigfooty collaboration tantamount to when Mick Jagger and David Bowie did ‘Dancin in the Street’ - with the caveat that Bowie and Jagger had a huge back-catalogue of quality critically acclaimed work behind them which Falcon and Xtreme do not.

 

[PhatBoy]

Mr. Meow: Names Scarlett, Enright and Johnson in a best midfield thread (which they wouldn’t even be considered in anyway)

Me: Points out they aren’t midfielders

Cats people: Omg you’re a lunatic (whilst frothing at the mouth)

I have no idea what you’re referring to but anyway.

Moving on.

You wanted to try and claim that this person and that person wasn’t part of the Geelong midfield, I’m simply pointing out that they were, and if those two players in particular CANT be considered part of Geelong’s, why do you consider Jason Akermanis part of Brisbane’s? He played essentially the same role except he got even less of the ball

And yes in 2007 and at times in 2008 Enright started in the midfield. He is obviously primarily and best remembered as a defender.

 

[Cleansweep17]

I have no idea what you’re referring to but anyway.

Moving on.

You wanted to try and claim that this person and that person wasn’t part of the Geelong midfield, I’m simply pointing out that they were, and if those two players in particular CANT be considered part of Geelong’s, why do you consider Jason Akermanis part of Brisbane’s? He played essentially the same role except he got even less of the ball

And yes in 2007 and at times in 2008 Enright started in the midfield. He is obviously primarily and best remembered as a defender.

Dusty just went in a ruck contest last week and I’m sure has done a kick in at least once in his career, and also captained a game. Can’t believe he’s a mid/fwd/ruck/def captain. Unbelievable.

Also google “Fab 4” and tell me what it considers Aker

 

[PhatBoy]

Dusty just went in a ruck contest last week and I’m sure has done a kick in at least once in his career, and also captained a game. Can’t believe he’s a mid/fwd/ruck/def captain. Unbelievable.

Also google “Fab 4” and tell me what it considers Aker

I’m pretty sure a band from Liverpool will come up first, and that the AFL media might have appropriated that term for themselves. It does scientifically mean what you think it means I’m sorry to break it to you. If it did, Ball Magnet Jase would have been gathering a lot more leather than he did. Now either he, Johnson and Chapman are all midfielders, or none of them are. Either way, the same rule applies to all of them.

 

[Cleansweep17]

I’m pretty sure a band from Liverpool will come up first, and that the AFL media might have appropriated that term for themselves. It does scientifically mean what you think it means I’m sorry to break it to you. If it did, Ball Magnet Jase would have been gathering a lot more leather than he did. Now either he, Johnson and Chapman are all midfielders, or none of them are. Either way, the same rule applies to all of them.

I got this from Nigel Lappins wiki page. Read the first paragraph about the Fab 4 then take a seat.

 

[Mr Meow]

Focussing on this century only you can essentially run through the best midfields in 3 year blocks (2016 awkwardly excluded). And sure people can disagree.

I kept it to each midfields best 3 years. I've excluded second ruckmen.

Sorting by intra-team clearances (40+ in the season(s) to qualify):

2001-2003 Brisbane
FOL: Keating Black Akermanis
C: Power Voss Headland
Rotations: B.Scott Pike

2004-2006 West Coast
FOL: Cox Kerr Judd
C: Embley Cousins Fletcher
Rotations: Stenglein

2007-2009 Geelong
FOL: Ottens Bartel Ablett
C: Selwood Corey Kelly
Rotations: Chapman Enright Ling

Collingwood 2010-2012
FOL: Jolly Ball Pendlebury
C: Thomas Swan Beams
Rotations: Didak Wellingham

2013-2015 Hawthorn
FOL: Hale Lewis Mitchell
C: Smith Hodge Burgoyne
Rotations: Langford Shiels Roughead Puopolo

2017-2019 Richmond
FOL: Nankervis Cotchin Martin
C: Edwards Prestia Lambert
Rotations: Caddy Graham

2020-2022 Melbourne
FOL: Gawn Oliver Petracca
C: Brayshaw Viney Harmes
Rotations: Neale-Bullen

2023-2025 to be determined.

 

[PhatBoy]

I got this from Nigel Lappins wiki page. Read the first paragraph about the Fab 4 then take a seat.

View attachment 1963838

You know that NASA don’t compile Wikipedia pages right?

Again, the fact that they were known as the Fab Four, a media knock off of the Beatles nickname, is not indicative of the fact that they spent games camped together in the middle of the field. If they did, as pointed out to you many many times, Jason Akermanis would have won more ball than your average half forward. He didn’t. He averaged 20+ possessions 3 times in his career, and in those 3 seasons, he only barely managed to do with it/

Deal with it. Write to the people who put together Nigel’s Wikipedia page, if you can track them down from their coffee shops with free wifi, and discuss the nuances of this with them.

 

[Mr Meow]

I have no idea what you’re referring to but anyway.

Moving on.

You wanted to try and claim that this person and that person wasn’t part of the Geelong midfield, I’m simply pointing out that they were, and if those two players in particular CANT be considered part of Geelong’s, why do you consider Jason Akermanis part of Brisbane’s? He played essentially the same role except he got even less of the ball

And yes in 2007 and at times in 2008 Enright started in the midfield. He is obviously primarily and best remembered as a defender.

Yep.

Enright was a wingman (surely we include the wings in our midfield discussion) who pushed back to cover the defence so well he ended up moving there permanently. His first two AA selections he was a hybrid half back/wingman. Houston and Sinclair are reasonable positional comparisons. It's really easy stuff to look up.

2010 onwards especially he morphed into a Stewart type rebounding back pocket.

 

[Mr Meow]

Mr. Meow: Names Scarlett, Enright and Johnson in a best midfield thread (which they wouldn’t even be considered in anyway)

Me: Points out they aren’t midfielders

Cats people: Omg you’re a lunatic (whilst frothing at the mouth)

Not sure what Scarlett is doing there. Enright and Chapman were heavily involved in Geelong's midfield 2007-2009. Then Chapman and Johnson 2011-2013 once Ablett was gone.

Calmly pointing out your lies and guesses = frothing at the mouth, apparently.

Spare me the histrionics.

 

[Mr Meow]

I’ll make it easy for you.

Combined 7 would be in this order(ish):

GAJ, Voss, Black, Aker, Bartel, Lappin, Keating

Problem with the Geelong mids it’s that they actually drop off quick. The difference between GAJ and Bartel is massive, then after Bartel it goes straight into tier 3 players like Ling (who player an extinct position) and Young Selwood.

Now instead of laughing with your mate Mr. Meow then calling me crazy. Please let me know if you disagree and provide your 7. Thanks.

I just ran through an ACTUAL analysis of this centuries best midfields and their important rotations. And yes, shock, that includes the wings. More commonly there are 8-9, not 7.

So send your best 9 from those Brisbane/Geelong/West Coast midfields and I'll happily do the same. And try not to just pick a ruckman and 8 inside midfielders. Pick an actual midfield with versatility.

It would still only show who had the best top 3-4 midfielders or so though. Not whose midfield batted the deepest. I know you get very angry when the rotations that make a midfield deep are mentioned.

 

[Cleansweep17]

You know that NASA don’t compile Wikipedia pages right?

Again, the fact that they were known as the Fab Four, a media knock off of the Beatles nickname, is not indicative of the fact that they spent games camped together in the middle of the field. If they did, as pointed out to you many many times, Jason Akermanis would have won more ball than your average half forward. He didn’t. He averaged 20+ possessions 3 times in his career, and in those 3 seasons, he only barely managed to do with it/

Deal with it. Write to the people who put together Nigel’s Wikipedia page, if you can track them down from their coffee shops with free wifi, and discuss the nuances of this with them.

Nobody remembers them as midfielders. Enright the winger

Surprised you haven’t mentioned Hawkins the great Ruckman

The irony is that you think you are a smart person.

 

[smasha]

Bourke Barrett Clay
End thread TY.

 

[FreddyTwoShoes]

You never fail to disappoint Xteme, one of the most logical people on this forum.

Anybody with a brain knows Lions would demolish them. Especially with Lethal as coach, their main coach was doing lines mid game.

“Never fail to disappoint”.

Falcon/tallandbald/carboot/cleany, YOU never fail to disappoint.

Do you ever read your posts before submitting?

 

[Cleansweep17]

I just ran through an ACTUAL analysis of this centuries best midfields and their important rotations. And yes, shock, that includes the wings. More commonly there are 8-9, not 7.

So send your best 9 from those Brisbane/Geelong/West Coast midfields and I'll happily do the same. And try not to just pick a ruckman and 8 inside midfielders. Pick an actual midfield with versatility.

It would still only show who had the best top 3-4 midfielders or so though. Not whose midfield batted the deepest. I know you get very angry when the rotations that make a midfield deep are mentioned.

You go first. Because honestly I don’t know what you are asking for. You want me to consider defenders and forwards and their time split in the midfield. Like what, you could make so many teams depending on what structure you want and who you play. Do you want 2 rucks? More height? Speed? Contest? Could make anything really.

This is not a normal way of debating a best of team. It’s not done by the AFL when they select the awards.

 

[Mr Meow]

You go first. Because honestly I don’t know what you are asking for. You want me to consider defenders and forwards and their time split in the midfield. Like what, you could make so many teams depending on what structure you want.

This is not a normal way of debating a best of team. It’s not done by the AFL when they select the awards.

First can I just ask you, what would be the point in you completing the exercise given you watched none of them play?

I would be similarly out of my depth if you asked me to select my best composite midfield of the 1920s.

 

[Cleansweep17]

First can I just ask you, what would be the point in you completing the exercise given you watched none of them play?

Awards, Replays, Stats form my opinions for those who I didn’t see play.

You make best of teams with players like Coleman and Polly farmer in it right? Did you watch them play. No, so stop with this agesim crap.

 

[Mr Meow]

Awards, Replays, Stats form my opinions for those who I didn’t see play.

You make best of teams with players like Coleman and Polly farmer in it right? Did you watch them play. No, so stop with this agesim crap.

Which replays have you seen of each midfield? Just lie and quickly look up 20 matches on YouTube, it'll be easier.

I've never made such teams consisting of only players I haven't seen, no.

 

[PhatBoy]

Awards, Replays, Stats form my opinions for those who I didn’t see play.

You make best of teams with players like Coleman and Polly farmer in it right? Did you watch them play. No, so stop with this agesim crap.

So when you’re shown stats why do you just ignore them