Can Hawthorn succeed while ignoring the elite end of the draft? - Part 2

[Scotland]

Judging by the midfield's performance this season, probably not.

I also have reservation over his leadership style - I get the sense he wasn't the most popular captain we've had.

Still, the WC midfield liked him, so...

Our midfield benefited in part from him and Priddis not being in it. We went from Priddis and Mitchell as #2 and #3 for clearances to Jack Redden #2 and having a meaningful role again and Yeo at #3 who is explosive and long kicking. Different dynamic to two plodders in their 30s. We were disappointed to lose him but a a line coach what levers does he currently have to pull? Other than taking Wingard from the forward line and sacrificing a goal kicker or playing Burgoyne who is 87 he's working with similar inside players.

 

[stfan]

Meh. That's coz you chipped the ball around the whole 2nd quarter. Meaningless stat.

Well according to Clarko, that is why the Saints won the game.

Anyway, he's played the odd decent game and has now been shifted out of the midfield.

If you think Clark has been playing as a midfielder this year you clearly have no idea.

 

[WWSD]

Hollands is more your icing on the cake, rather than the cake. I think he will end up at North Melbourne anyway.

I would rather get Logan McDonald. Then build the forward-line around him. Key position players are so difficult to find.

If Hawthorn can get one key forward and one key defender with picks 3 and 21 that would be a great start.

 

[Pessimistic]

McDonald is a great name for a KPF "SuperMac"

No pressure:0

 

[Bulldog1954]

Surprised me to see Burgoyne going around again in 2021.

 

[Back Pocket Rocket]

Surprised me to see Burgoyne going around again in 2021.

So many others to delist before him.

 

[RUNVS]

Surprised me to see Burgoyne going around again in 2021.

With most teams needing to cut something like 10 players this year thanks to the new list limitations it seems like a very odd decision to keep Burgoyne as he looks pretty much cooked, and will need to be delisted a year later anyway.

 

[Pessimistic]

With most teams needing to cut something like 10 players this year thanks to the new list limitations it seems like a very odd decision to keep Burgoyne as he looks pretty much cooked, and will need to be delisted a year later anyway.

goodes and buddy say Hi.

 

[RUNVS]

goodes and buddy say Hi.

Goodes retired at the right time, and he did not retire at a time when list sizes were being reduced.

 

[Pessimistic]

Goodes retired at the right time, and he did not retire at a time when list sizes were being reduced.

‘many are taking this as a sign the hawks know what the list position will be. In some clubs cases, contracts will have to be broken. Taking rookies from 5 to 2 would suggest more than a few 2 year deals be voided?

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Just because Diesel thinks another Carlton player isn't as good as he was isn't reason to write off a career. Diesel doesn't think any player is as good as he was.

My own personal theory is that the 2005 draft in which the Hawks drafted:
Xavier Ellis (3)
Beau Dowler (6)
Birchall (14)
Max Bailey (18)
Beau Muston (22)

Clarkson was so scarred by these duds (despite the success of 2004, where he'd just taken the reins and snapped up Buddy, Roughy and Lewis) that Clarkson decided the whole thing was a lottery and never wanted to go back to the pointy end of the draft. And has pretty much stuck to that, besides the Mitch Thorp debacle.

Sorry dude but that is a pretty ****en stupid theory!

 

[PAFC_1870]

Surprised me to see Burgoyne going around again in 2021.

Selfish by him and stupid by the club.

He's done.

It'll be 2020 Adelaide levels of bad next season.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Selfish by him and stupid by the club.

He's done.

It'll be 2020 Adelaide levels of bad next season.

Not really. He will spend half the time in the reserves. Nothing surer

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Selfish by him and stupid by the club.

Crucial leader at a time when we are desperately short of them. Even if he spends half the year at box hill it will be great for them too.

Stupid comment really, shows you dont really understand the nuances of a footy club.

 

[Bulldog1954]

Not really. He will spend half the time in the reserves. Nothing surer

So why play on? Hawthorn aren’t a contender next year and have other veterans to provide leadership. With reduced list sizes not sure keeping a 37 year old who at best will be a bit part player is worthwhile.

 

[PAFC_1870]

Stupid comment really, shows you dont really understand the nuances of a footy club.

That was fine. A year ago.

He's finished.

You got smashed by the Crows, you'll be a laughing stock.

 

[Redalert]

Not that concerned by the decision to retain Burgoyne, but the focus will be on other players in the periphery.

In particular I suspect the decisions on players like Stratton, Henderson, Puopolo will be the better indicator of the way the club will go.

 

[Iceman!]

That was fine. A year ago.

He's finished.

You got smashed by the Crows, you'll be a laughing stock.

Very good chance we will be shedding a lot of elder players, he had played some good footy at times. We were never shedding them all at once and it is the right choice.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Spoke to a Hawthorn supporting mate the other day. He'll be astounded that Burgoyne is playing on. He also thought Tom Mitchell was more tradeable than the likes of Gunston and Breust, on the basis that he's not the most popular bloke at the club.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

So why play on? Hawthorn aren’t a contender next year and have other veterans to provide leadership. With reduced list sizes not sure keeping a 37 year old who at best will be a bit part player is worthwhile.

Have you watched hawthorn this year?
Burgoyne is a far better leader than the others.
He plays half a season in the reserves and helps development of the kids there

 

[Ron The Bear]

Surprised me to see Burgoyne going around again in 2021.

Maybe the feelgood factor in nursing him to 400 will help retain members in a year where the club is obviously taking a step back.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Spoke to a Hawthorn supporting mate the other day. He'll be astounded that Burgoyne is playing on. He also thought Tom Mitchell was more tradeable than the likes of Gunston and Breust, on the basis that he's not the most popular bloke at the club.

And how does said mate know this? Rumours...

 

[Ron The Bear]

And how does said mate know this? Rumours...

I was surprised. He reckons teammates are constantly bickering with him on the field.

 

[Bulldog1954]

Have you watched hawthorn this year?
Burgoyne is a far better leader than the others.
He plays half a season in the reserves and helps development of the kids there

Yes, I have seen Hawthorn play this year, thanks for asking. I’ve seen a 37 year old struggling to find the footy and impact games. With reduced list sizes, keeping a player on the list to provide leadership in the VFL seems a strange decision to me.

 

[Scotland]

Selfish if he is just sticking around to get to 400 games, but people were critical of punting Hodge, Mitchell and Lewis who had an impact elsewhere. I don't think Burgoyne staying or going will have that much of an impact on 2021 results either way. If I was rebuilding I would rather keep Burgoyne than one of the middling players that aren't good now and won't be in future.