Roast Carlton beaten tactically (AGAIN)

[simpson6]

I believe that throughout the season we are time and time again beaten tactically, and lack of strategy. I'm not sure whether we even have a game plan, otherwise we are not following it.

I have a few points to base this on:

1. Leaving the most dangerous defender in the league Brian LAKE un attended (by O'Hailpin) the WHOLE GAME, when he should have been tagged out by Carrazzo from the OPENING BOUNCE. He went on to have 28 possessions, and 10 marks.

2. To select a player like O'Hailpin to start a match when he clearly cannot sprint.

3. The inability to instruct players to go short into the forward line, instead of merely bombing into Brian Lake's area. This was rectified at quarter time, resulting in numerous wasted opportunities

4. To allow at one time, 2 loose defenders in our forward line at a centre bounce, and the inability to instruct Carlton players to support defenders by getting back there and starting a counter attack, instead waiting for the rebound that would never result.

5. Players like Kane Lucas, Shaun Grigg, Richard Hadley that may not be the best players in the league, but are actually prepared to have a go. It's not about selecting the best team every week, its team balance, and today we did not have the players to win contested possessions. We need one of either McLean/ Hadley EVERY WEEK.

Where do we go from here? Right now we are merely making up the numbers of the EIGHT unless we find that form we had Vs Geelong and St Kilda. This form was based on gut running from our defenders and playing the game on our terms, fast and smart football, and intense tackling of the opposition, which i have not seen in months.

 

[Dennis]

I have a few points to base this on:

1. Leaving the most dangerous defender in the league Brian LAKE un attended (by O'Hailpin) the WHOLE GAME, when he should have been tagged out by Carrazzo from the OPENING BOUNCE.

Started so well.....until the Carazzo line

 

[hugebluesfan]

I believe that throughout the season we are time and time again beaten tactically, and lack of strategy. I'm not sure whether we even have a game plan, otherwise we are not following it.

I have a few points to base this on:

1. Leaving the most dangerous defender in the league Brian LAKE un attended (by O'Hailpin) the WHOLE GAME, when he should have been tagged out by Carrazzo from the OPENING BOUNCE. He went on to have 28 possessions, and 10 marks.

2. To select a player like O'Hailpin to start a match when he clearly cannot sprint.

3. The inability to instruct players to go short into the forward line, instead of merely bombing into Brian Lake's area. This was rectified at quarter time, resulting in numerous wasted opportunities

4. To allow at one time, 2 loose defenders in our forward line at a centre bounce, and the inability to instruct Carlton players to support defenders by getting back there and starting a counter attack, instead waiting for the rebound that would never result.

5. Players like Kane Lucas, Shaun Grigg, Richard Hadley that may not be the best players in the league, but are actually prepared to have a go. It's not about selecting the best team every week, its team balance, and today we did not have the players to win contested possessions. We need one of either McLean/ Hadley EVERY WEEK.

Where do we go from here? Right now we are merely making up the numbers of the EIGHT unless we find that form we had Vs Geelong and St Kilda. This form was based on gut running from our defenders and playing the game on our terms, fast and smart football, and intense tackling of the opposition, which i have not seen in months.

Look.....Ratten is a genius and the best coach in the AFL....
Just give him more time to settle in....maybe another 2-3 years and he will be great....
I wll be surprised if he survives his current contract...

 

[aflcliche]

Watching tonight's game was, and I quote Les Grossman:
"like someone took a dump in my eyes"

 

[gbatman]

yeah today was a tacticak disgrace. Remember Ratts is not the only person in that coacing box, there are plenty of other nuckle heads up there too watching over proceedings. Who is our forward coach? They need to be sacked before Ratten.

 

[simpson6]

Started so well.....until the Carazzo line

Well somebody had to sacrifice his game today

 

[Tanks_Alot]

Stop blaming the COACH!!!!!

FFS are you blind? The players put absolutely NO effort into todays match whatsoever bar the first 5 minutes. This place is a joke each and every loss is blamed on Ratten's tactics when it's blatantly obvious the players are lacking a lot of ticker and are quite frankly playing like a pack of t*rds.

Excuses galore! Sorry mate but Ratten isn't responsible for missed handballs, kicks that miss the target by 20 metres and players quitting half way through the match and laying 4 tackles for a whole quarter.

Come on! What do ya think Ratts tactic was "hey let's not tackle them for a quarter and see what happens!". If they had applied pressure to their opponents, they wouldn't have a disposal efficiency of 80% compared to our lousy 45% in the first 10 mins of the third quarter when we still could've won the game! If they had heart they would've fought like hell at the beginning of the second half to get themselves back in the game but they don't have any heart so they quit! Not Rattens fault, the players! You could've given them the best possible tactic after half time it wouldn't of even mattered because they weren't willing to fight back!

 

[KoutoufidesGhost]

O'hAilpin was on Lake almost all day, it was just the Lake didn't have to show him any respect and sagged off to take marks at will. Gilbee was left loose for a lot of the second half, which is even worse.

My favourite move was putting Henderson - the only forward who look capable of taking a mark - as a loose man just before half time and for a little bit after.

Tonight's game actually reminded me of the Round 22 game last year Vs Adelaide. Both just put loose men behind the ball and just killed Carlton with overlapping running.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

1. Leaving the most dangerous defender in the league Brian LAKE un attended (by O'Hailpin) the WHOLE GAME, when he should have been tagged out by Carrazzo from the OPENING BOUNCE. He went on to have 28 possessions, and 10 marks.

It's not the first time Lake has done this to a team. We needed someone to compete with him in the air and we do not have a lot of options in this regard.

2. To select a player like O'Hailpin to start a match when he clearly cannot sprint.

Setanta has been a good mover in the past. Whether he is injured or not applying himself I do not know. Options to replace him have been limited with Waite out.

3. The inability to instruct players to go short into the forward line, instead of merely bombing into Brian Lake's area. This was rectified at quarter time, resulting in numerous wasted opportunities

Did you make this up? It was rectified at quarter time because they did not follow his pre-game instructions in the first quarter.

4. To allow at one time, 2 loose defenders in our forward line at a centre bounce, and the inability to instruct Carlton players to support defenders by getting back there and starting a counter attack, instead waiting for the rebound that would never result.

WTF? You want the coaching staff to predict that a rebound would not come so they may as well flood the backline? What is this inability to do this or that notion you have? Did a player say that Ratts never told them to do these things? Do you believe that a player always does exactly as the coach would have them do?

The problem is that so many players did not stick to the game plan that you can not possibly drop them all.

5. Players like Kane Lucas, Shaun Grigg, Richard Hadley that may not be the best players in the league, but are actually prepared to have a go. It's not about selecting the best team every week, its team balance, and today we did not have the players to win contested possessions. We need one of either McLean/ Hadley EVERY WEEK.

Until they do come in and they stuff up and their heads are called for ... again. We have lost games with all of them in the team before you know.

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

Stop blaming the COACH!!!!!

FFS are you blind? The players put absolutely NO effort into todays match whatsoever bar the first 5 minutes. This place is a joke each and every loss is blamed on Ratten's tactics when it's blatantly obvious the players are lacking a lot of ticker and are quite frankly playing like a pack of t*rds.

Excuses galore! Sorry mate but Ratten isn't responsible for missed handballs, kicks that miss the target by 20 metres and players quitting half way through the match and laying 4 tackles for a whole quarter.

Come on! What do ya think Ratts tactic was "hey let's not tackle them for a quarter and see what happens!". If they had applied pressure to their opponents, they wouldn't have a disposal efficiency of 80% compared to our lousy 45% in the first 10 mins of the third quarter when we still could've won the game! If they had heart they would've fought like hell at the beginning of the second half to get themselves back in the game but they don't have any heart so they quit! Not Rattens fault, the players! You could've given them the best possible tactic after half time it wouldn't of even mattered because they weren't willing to fight back!

The job of the coach is to ready players for the competition.
If the coach is not responsible for what happens out on the field we shouldnt have a coach.
The players lack confidence in what the coach is directing.
They are playing accordingly.

 

[happydude]

I dont know who to b;ame really was pathetic from EVERYONE.
I said earlier when it looked like we had no heart against essendon that now we will really feel the sting of the cap penalties.
We dopnt have any of those senior leaders that good teams had around. players that went through the draft in 02-04 and high picks, goddard for example.

When you look at our leadership group of about that age you get judd (great player), simmo(i loike his style) and that fater that you start to get scottland and carrazzo. In only a few games this year scottland has never looked like a premiership player to me and this is meant to be his carreer best season, like i said though there have been a couple games he has prooven me wrong but if he is one of our core leaders its a problem.

Thornton taking out armfield instead of waiting for the spoil. What has happened to him this season last year he was ok and now he is crap, selfish and takes his frustrations out on his own team mates and umpires. He should spen the rest of the season in the ants, no if or buts season over for him.

It looked liek we where beaten tacticaly again but i dont knwo what the coach said to the players at any point, what i do know is if he keeps telling them a coaching plan and the players dont listen there is some issue with rekationship between the coach and playering group and its up to the coaching staff to demand the respect of its players and lead them tacticaly. Last night ratten and co failed at this.

Murphy had a quiet one and once again until the game was over gibbs didnt start showing very much. These are number 1 picks, how can they be so easily out played week in week out?

Someone needs to find the solution to our problems very soon or we will spend our "window" sittign around 6-4th place before sinking to the bottom again.

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

It's not the first time Lake has done this to a team. We needed someone to compete with him in the air and we do not have a lot of options in this regard.

QFT ODN.

When we start the drafting debates (later in the year) on a need to spending high draft picks for quality KPPs, please weigh in with this point. We really have a shortfall of quality talls despite Hendo/Bower coming through.

If we have pick 10 and there is a pick 14-16 rated KPP...we need to take the risk for structural reasons.

PS above is example only...i know this years draft is skewed for GC.

 

[happydude]

Oh i forgot to mention how crap walker had been the past month.
He was awesome against geelong but since then he has shown he is NOT a number 2 pick and we have merely wasted our time with him.

 

[Koutou43]

This form was based on gut running from our defenders and playing the game on our terms, fast and smart football, and intense tackling of the opposition, which i have not seen in months.[/QUOTE]


Correct weight. All the run has stopped since Thornton came back into the team. Worst 150+ game player in the history of football.

Sick of him pointing to the others, receiving cheap kicks out the back, 15m sideway kicks, turnovers, running under the ball........

Our defence should be ... Armfield, Jamison, Russell, Walker, Bower, Gibbs

 

[Sublime]

I don't really subscribe to the fact we're beaten tactically by that much.

I'm more worried by how we get beaten skills and intensity wise. Some of the skill errors last night were disgusting. Handballs to feet, 10m kicks directly to opposition, pointless bombing.

THAT is the main problem here, all issues that no amount of yelling by Ratts can fix. Worst part is the skills get worse as the players heads drop.

 

[DamianBis]

Oh i forgot to mention how crap walker had been the past month.
He was awesome against geelong but since then he has shown he is NOT a number 2 pick and we have merely wasted our time with him.

lol i hope you're trolling...

He hasn't exactly had the easiest of rides this season either, the injury would have derailed his year quite a bit, and he's shown a LOT throughout the year. not just in the geelong game.

 

[Robbo's my hero]

i suggest we do what has been so effective in bringing us down. clog the opposition's space and hope we score more goals on the counter. with nothing ahead of us our speed will become our strength again.

 

[Sin City]

i suggest we do what has been so effective in bringing us down. clog the opposition's space and hope we score more goals on the counter. with nothing ahead of us our speed will become our strength again.

It'll force the opposition to bring a few guys out of our forward 50 as well.

 

[Tanks_Alot]

The job of the coach is to ready players for the competition.
If the coach is not responsible for what happens out on the field we shouldnt have a coach.
The players lack confidence in what the coach is directing.
They are playing accordingly.

That doesn't make much sense. Why would they players lack confidence in what the coach is directing if it is a game style capable of smashing both of last years premiers?

Ratts would be telling them to tackle hard but they just put in another sloppy performance and this time it was against a good team which is why we got thumped. Why can't you accept that the players are playing shit. It's not just the coach that it boils down to. If we had Mark Thompson coaching us last night we still would've got thumped because the players were not up to it. It's more arrogance then lack of confidence. I'm sorry but since we beat St.Kilda, we've been playing shit and that's because the players have gotten too arrogant and havn't been respecting their opponents enough to realize they need to work hard to win those matches as well. They have the mindset that it'll just happen If we beat Geelong and St.Kilda we'll thump these guys. and then when they get belted, Oh yeah just a bad game we're better than that we'll bounce back don't worry about it. If we weren't playing Brisbane last week we would've lost unless it was West Coast. They are the only 2 teams I'm confident we can beat right now.

Ratten is a legend at our club and has proven he is a quality coach, he has the tactics to ruin the top teams including the dogs (we belted them the last 2 times we played and Ratten coached both of them) and you wanna have a go at him because Hasmpson is colourblind, Simmo handballs to Murphy's feet and bryce Gibbs misses a target by 20 meters? Not to mention Jamo taking a spectacular one handed mark against Hall only to handball while he's got a player standing right in front of him so he can intercept it easily, Russell missing the goals by 30 meters with no one near him in the first quarter, and Armfield cannot correctly dispose of the football. Sorry, but that's not Ratten's fault, that's the players lacking heart, determination and interest in winning. That effort was disgusting, they think they're just gonna turn up and win and are too lazy to put the hard work in each and every match.

 

[albyg]

I think there were numerous things that Ratts could have done and should be doing.

First and foremost have confidence in the players hes got, he seem adamant that we should be tagging others, so:

FFS, play Gibbs in the middle with a free reign, he is our most creative player let him concentrate on that;

Stop playing Carrazzo as a tagger as well, the game now (as per Geelong and other) about accumulating possesion which he is a natural at;

AJ should be our tagger in the middle, we need his pace and tackling pressure through the middle, the person tagged might get mode kick but they will be pressured kicks, his best games have been when he is tagging in THE MIDDLE, he is not a back pocket;

Change things when they are going bad, one obvious one that I was screaming for was to PLAY THORNTON AS A DEFENSIVE FORWARD ON LAKE, FFS HOW COULD HE NOT SEE THAT, he has played up forward before, reads the ball very well and is good in the air, Lake would have had a very different mind set if Thornton was up there;

Last but not least stop telling opposition teams what we are going to do let them second guess us.


p.s.

On another note the ground at Etihad sems to be very soft, I actually think our light weighted players are struggling on it as they like running on top of the ground....hence big bodied teams who plough through it will be tough, i.e. I am dreading Sydney this week.

 

[Stamos]

I
Stop playing Carrazzo as a tagger as well, the game now (as per Geelong and other) about accumulating possesion which he is a natural at;

Carrazzo's only value to our team is as a tagger. He played his best game ever against the Saints on Dal Santo, and his second best game this year was on Davey. When he starts chasing the ball and accumulating, he kills us. If the opposition don't have a player that we need Carrots to tag, he should be in the Bullants. Get games into Lucas instead.

 

[albyg]

Carrazzo's only value to our team is as a tagger. He played his best game ever against the Saints on Dal Santo, and his second best game this year was on Davey. When he starts chasing the ball and accumulating, he kills us. If the opposition don't have a player that we need Carrots to tag, he should be in the Bullants. Get games into Lucas instead.

Yes get Lucas into the team, but Carrots is a natural accumulator, he should be let to run free. I would have agreed with you last year, but his disposal is very good now that he only chips the ball around. So I would have him accumulating as well as a defensive type forward when required going through the middle as well.

 

[Blueboys7]

I'm not sure how Griffen was allowed to run through the middle unattended and either have a shot for goal or deliver inside 50.

 

[Bluebear]

I believe that throughout the season we are time and time again beaten tactically, and lack of strategy. I'm not sure whether we even have a game plan, otherwise we are not following it.

I have a few points to base this on:

1. Leaving the most dangerous defender in the league Brian LAKE un attended (by O'Hailpin) the WHOLE GAME, when he should have been tagged out by Carrazzo from the OPENING BOUNCE. He went on to have 28 possessions, and 10 marks.

Yes.......I'm sure Carrazzo would have been able to stop Lake from influencing contests down back.

2. To select a player like O'Hailpin to start a match when he clearly cannot sprint.

More a selection issue than a tactic, and yes, Setanta may go this week depending on the availability and form of Henderson, Waite and Fisher.

3. The inability to instruct players to go short into the forward line, instead of merely bombing into Brian Lake's area. This was rectified at quarter time, resulting in numerous wasted opportunities

Why is it these anti coach rants always make the assumption, that what we see on the field is what we have been instructed to do?
Yes, I'm sure Ratts told them to bomb it long having identified Lake as a major problem.
I'm sure Ratts told Gibbs to spray 10 of his 17 kicks.

4. To allow at one time, 2 loose defenders in our forward line at a centre bounce, and the inability to instruct Carlton players to support defenders by getting back there and starting a counter attack, instead waiting for the rebound that would never result.

So in your opinion the coach has immediate and complete control over one incident with these loose defenders roaming around, and if they weren't manned up it must be under instruction, and not just a lack of intelligence or workrate on the forwards behalf?

5. Players like Kane Lucas, Shaun Grigg, Richard Hadley that may not be the best players in the league, but are actually prepared to have a go. It's not about selecting the best team every week, its team balance, and today we did not have the players to win contested possessions. We need one of either McLean/ Hadley EVERY WEEK.

McLean is injured. Hadley came in a couple of weeks ago and we got SPANKED in conteseted footy.
Lucas I agree on more for his usage which was terrible, but again, not a tactic.

Where do we go from here? Right now we are merely making up the numbers of the EIGHT unless we find that form we had Vs Geelong and St Kilda. This form was based on gut running from our defenders and playing the game on our terms, fast and smart football, and intense tackling of the opposition, which i have not seen in months.

Wow, so you have identified 2 selection issues, 1 isolated incident with loose defenders, and poor kicking inside 50 from our midfield which has been apparent EVERY GAME THIS YEAR (a skill and decision error)...........and exactly NO coaching tactics that you have an issue with.

Well done.

Last but not least stop telling opposition teams what we are going to do let them second guess us.

If you are referring to Ratten talking about curbing Lake, surely the early points went to Ratts?
Did you note that for the first time this year Lake STARTED at FF? Had no influence? It was the only time during the game where we looked to be "in" the game.
Clearly the Dogs changed that concerned about us tagging him. Clearly we were NEVER going to tag him.
The media tactic worked as a bluff. Should have actually followed through though.

 

[albyg]

If you are referring to Ratten talking about curbing Lake, surely the early points went to Ratts?
Did you note that for the first time this year Lake STARTED at FF? Had no influence? It was the only time during the game where we looked to be "in" the game.
Clearly the Dogs changed that concerned about us tagging him. Clearly we were NEVER going to tag him.
The media tactic worked as a bluff. Should have actually followed through though.[/QUOTE]

Did it work?

I am sure Lake would have been thrown had he not known what was going on before and just had Thornton or someone follow him around instead of bluffing about it, and instead of playing these friggen mind games. FFS he should just stick to coaching he is relatively new at it our team is also relatively new to the top 8 we need to concentrate on that. Once we are experienced like Geelong, Dogs and Saints then you have more strings to your bow, for now I just want Carlton to concentrate on playing good footy!!!!

Further, Ratts was a no fuss footballer, its how he is naturally so he should stick to being a no fuss coach!