Preview Changes: R5 vs Richmond - Saturday April 16, 4.05pm ACST @ Adelaide Oval

[Scorpus]

IN:
McAdam, Cook, Berry

OUT:
Hinge, Rowe, Schoenberg

Hinge dropped and named as an emergency, not injured

 

[Southerntakeover]

Well that solves that then

The blokes a little bit unhinged, and has plainly had a few too many. He has a weird Fogarty obsession that led him to lie about having inside information about his contract, despite not knowing it even existed, and he's doubling down.

It's best not to engage too seriously.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

I can hear the benny hill theme right, but still need more of those pure pure football takes. Come on, just one more opinion pls.

Facts override your p1ssy over emotional opinions

Laird is a AA 40 mid member last year

And you’re still a hack supporter like last year

 

[Southerntakeover]

Fog is no good

Laird goes ok

You’re a bed wetting crows supporter that thinks the world is against him and his right to barrack for a successful footy side

There’s my opinion

No no, that's not the pure stuff. Stop holding out on us.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Facts override your p1ssy over emotional opinions

Laird is a AA 40 mid member last year

And you’re still a hack supporter like last year

Come on, you can do better than this. We need that pure clueless football take, not your three shiraz droolings.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

No no, that's not the pure stuff. Stop holding out on us.

Im just imagining you at the footy getting angry at lairds kicking in your little fog duffle coat thinking he just needs some good delivery

Then blaming the ghost of Neil Craig and Don Pyke when we lose

And if we win …… being just as upset which is even worse

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Come on, you can do better than this. We need that pure clueless football take, not your three shiraz droolings.

Look I know you and sanders have it over me with your high rating of McGovern and Fogarty who are taking the competition by storm again

Hahahahaha

 

[Southerntakeover]

Im just imagining you at the footy getting angry at lairds kicking in your little fog duffle coat thinking he just needs some good delivery

Then blaming the ghost of Neil Craig and Don Pyke when we lose

And if we win …… being just as upset which is even worse

Bloke who responded to win by running to the Adelaide Board to hate post on not-playing young forward reckons everyone else not happy enough?

 

[Southerntakeover]

Look I know you and sanders have it over me with your high rating of McGovern and Fogarty who are taking the competition by storm again

Hahahahaha

You've got better, come on, stop being a miser- share.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

You've got better, come on, stop being a miser- share.

Looking forward to your next dummy spit next weekend bed wetter

‘The unlucky one ‘

 

[Miss Vanessa]

Your argument is that he is one of those guys, why would he get moved out for them?

No. My argument is that he isn’t nearly as far away from them as you think he is. If I could swap Laird for Bontempelli or Petracca I would do it. But he isn’t nearly so plodding and ordinary as many believe him to be. The hard data support my claims. All his detractors seem to cling to is the “vibe” of the thing. We are all subject to biases and self delusions, myself included. Occasionally it’s a good thing to step back and look at things objectively. The objective facts point to Laird being among the better midfielders in the comp. That’s my argument.

 

[Southerntakeover]

No. My argument is that he isn’t nearly as far away from them as you think he is. If I could swap Laird for Bontempelli or Petracca I would do it. But he isn’t nearly so plodding and ordinary as many believe him to be. The hard data support my claims. All his detractors seem to cling to is the “vibe” of the thing. We are all subject to biases and self delusions, myself included. Occasionally it’s a good thing to step back and look at things objectively. The objective facts point to Laird being among the better midfielders in the comp. That’s my argument.

The 'hard data' didnt support your claims at all. Which of the players in the list you posted do you say he'll survive a head to head comparison with?

If your view is he's a comparable player, why are you now saying you'd replace him with them?

 

[Jeffcrowe]

No. My argument is that he isn’t nearly as far away from them as you think he is. If I could swap Laird for Bontempelli or Petracca I would do it. But he isn’t nearly so plodding and ordinary as many believe him to be. The hard data support my claims. All his detractors seem to cling to is the “vibe” of the thing. We are all subject to biases and self delusions, myself included. Occasionally it’s a good thing to step back and look at things objectively. The objective facts point to Laird being among the better midfielders in the comp. That’s my argument.

That’s pretty much all southern takeover has - an emotional vibe of how unlucky he is as a supporter and that it’s someone like lairds fault

He will prob blame it on VB because Laird played with VB before he retired

 

[Southerntakeover]

Looking forward to your next dummy spit next weekend bed wetter

‘The unlucky one ‘

You're tipping against us? Such disloyalty.

 

[Southerntakeover]

That’s pretty much all southern takeover has - an emotional vibe of how unlucky he is as a supporter and that it’s someone like lairds fault

He will prob blame it on VB because Laird played with VB before he retired

Yes! There it is! The insanely stupid take i've been asking for.

I'm anti van Berlo. So good. Nailed me.

Thanks bro.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

The 'hard data' didnt support your claims at all. Which of the players in the list you posted do you say he'll survive a head to head comparison with?

If your view is he's a comparable player, why are you now saying you'd replace him with them?

Give it up bed wetter

Laird is an AA 40 squad midfielder the last time the squad was picked and nothing has changed in 3 games he’s played since , stats do nothing to support your argument

You’re definitely not a better judge than the AA panel , your footy judgement belongs at Campbelltown oval at best . Prob the early game or the 3rds

 

[Southerntakeover]

Give it up bed wetter

Laird is an AA 40 squad midfielder the last time the squad was picked and nothing has changed in 3 games he’s played since , stats do nothing to support your argument

You’re definitely not a better judge than the AA panel , your footy judgement belongs at Campbelltown oval at best . Prob the early game or the 3rds

My favourite part of this is that you had no idea about the AA squad till someone else posted it and now you're spam posting it like linus's blanket.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

My favourite part of this is that you had no idea about the AA squad till someone else posted it and now you're spam posting it like linus's blanket.

Hahaha yep I completely forgot but it doesn’t surprise me that he did make it

You must have been in shock horror that such a terrible kick hack player could make the top 40 in the comp as judged by ACTUAL football experts with knowledge and experience etc

My favourite part is you go to the actual games !!!!!

with your glum face on Easter Saturday !

You’d be a joy to sit next to , do you have any player badges ? I know which one you would have

 

[Miss Vanessa]

The 'hard data' didnt support your claims at all. Which of the players in the list you posted do you say he'll survive a head to head comparison with?

If your view is he's a comparable player, why are you now saying you'd replace him with them?

The data really does provide a decent overview of the player Laird is. His meters gained isn’t great and his kicking efficiency is average - better than some but not nearly as clean as some of the others on the list. However, despite this, he is still a player that is involved in a lot of score involvements, score launches and provides goal assists at a rate greater than most of the players listed. That is, despite his lack of polish by foot, he is nonetheless a damaging player compared to other very good midfielders.

Is he as good as all of the players I listed. Probably not. Is he the equal or even better than some of the players listed. Probably. My own personal bias is towards big bodied midfielders who can swing forward and kick multiple goals when required. I’d therefore happily swap him for Petracca or Bontempelli. Would I swap him for Parish or Macrae. Meh. Probably not. Much of a muchness.

 

[Southerntakeover]

The data really does provide a decent overview of the player Laird is. His meters gained isn’t great and his kicking efficiency is average - better than some but not nearly as clean as some of the others on the list. However, despite this, he is still a player that is involved in a lot of score involvements, score launches and provides goal assists at a rate greater than most of the players listed. That is, despite his lack of polish by foot, he is nonetheless a damaging player compared to other very good midfielders.

Is he as good as all of the players I listed. Probably not. Is he the equal or even better than some of the players listed. Probably. My own personal bias is towards big bodied midfielders who can swing forward and kick multiple goals when required. I’d therefore happily swap him for Petracca or Bontempelli. Would I swap him for Parish or Macrae. Meh. Probably not. Much of a muchness.

The 'data' relies upon relatively small sample size to suggest an impact drastically improved over levels achieved at any other point in his career, all to suggest that he might be kind of like the players you think are the lower end of the list. A deeper look at the statistics doesn't support the claims- when the sample size is extended beyond his limited games this season he falls behind those players- as you well know.

Macrae is a significantly better player than him, this is crazy. There is no one of any sense that would ever select Laird above him.

Rory Laird and Jackson Macrae AFL Stats Comparison

Rory Laird and Jackson Macrae AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

 

[Miss Vanessa]

The 'data' relies upon relatively small sample size to suggest an impact drastically improved over levels achieved at any other point in his career, all to suggest that he might be kind of like the players you think are the lower end of the list. A deeper look at the statistics doesn't support the claims- when the sample size is extended beyond his limited games this season he falls behind those players- as you well know.

Macrae is a significantly better player than him, this is crazy. There is no one of any sense that would ever select Laird above him.

Rory Laird and Jackson Macrae AFL Stats Comparison

Rory Laird and Jackson Macrae AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

Sigh. Ok then. One last time. Let’s compare apples with apples and look at last year, when both were playing the same position.

Macrae:

33.8 disposals
64.8 kicking efficiency
465 meters gained

0.2 goals
1 goal assist
7 score involvements
1.8 score launches

6.8 clearances
9.8 ground ball gets
4.9 tackles
18.7 pressure acts

Laird:

32 disposals
56.4 kicking efficiency
349 meters gained

0.1 goals
0.7 goal assist
6.3 score involvements
1.8 score launches

6.8 clearances
10.9 ground ball gets
5.9 tackles
20.6 pressure acts

If you think those numbers scream one player being better than the other, then fine. Again, to me they suggest that Laird is a very good player who isn’t quite as polished by foot as some other top mids. But he is nonetheless a damaging player who also works well defensively. Macrae was working within a system that enabled his team to make a GF. Laird was toiling away in a team that finished bottom four. Yet their outputs were similar. This year, Laird actually shades Macrae in most of these stats. Personally, I hope he continues in that vein.

While I’m not going to do it, I’m sure you could do this for Laird vs the other players on the initial list for last season and he would compare favourably to them all. He’s a good player who would rotate through the middle in any team in the comp… and I’m done.

 

[ABAB]

The 'data' relies upon relatively small sample size to suggest an impact drastically improved over levels achieved at any other point in his career, all to suggest that he might be kind of like the players you think are the lower end of the list. A deeper look at the statistics doesn't support the claims- when the sample size is extended beyond his limited games this season he falls behind those players- as you well know.

Macrae is a significantly better player than him, this is crazy. There is no one of any sense that would ever select Laird above him.

Rory Laird and Jackson Macrae AFL Stats Comparison

Rory Laird and Jackson Macrae AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

Both are solid B+ grade players who are closer to A grade than B grade, you clearly have problem quantifying talent by initially saying Laird is a B grade player.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Sigh. Ok then. One last time. Let’s compare apples with apples and look at last year, when both were playing the same position.

Macrae:

33.8 disposals
64.8 kicking efficiency
465 meters gained

0.2 goals
1 goal assist
7 score involvements
1.8 score launches

6.8 clearances
9.8 ground ball gets
4.9 tackles
18.7 pressure acts

Laird:

32 disposals
56.4 kicking efficiency
349 meters gained

0.1 goals
0.7 goal assist
6.3 score involvements
1.8 score launches

6.8 clearances
10.9 ground ball gets
5.9 tackles
20.6 pressure acts

If you think those numbers scream one player being better than the other, then fine. Again, to me they suggest that Laird is a very good player who isn’t quite as polished by foot as some other top mids. But he is nonetheless a damaging player who also works well defensively. Macrae was working within a system that enabled his team to make a GF. Laird was toiling away in a team that finished bottom four. Yet their outputs were similar. This year, Laird actually shades Macrae in most of these stats. Personally, I hope he continues in that vein.

While I’m not going to do it, I’m sure you could do this for Laird vs the other players on the initial list for last season and he would compare favourably to them all. He’s a good player who would rotate through the middle in any team in the comp… and I’m done.

Oh cut out the dramatic sighing and eye rolling. If you were half as capable at making a compelling argument as you are at posturing as if you have we'd be getting somewhere.

Your 'analysis' demonstrates that Macrae gets more of the ball, uses it better, and has more impact.

They plainly do demonstrate one is better than the other, and that's consistent with how they're viewed by pretty much every observer of football of any note. One is a three time all australian midfielder, and picked up the best finals player award last year. The other isn't.

Our team is no where near, and the Bulldogs are grand finalists because of the comparative performances of our midfields.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Both are solid B+ grade players who are closer to A grade than B grade, you clearly have problem quantifying talent by initially saying Laird is a B grade player.

Leave the grades discussions to people that finished school champ.

 

[Miss Vanessa]

Oh cut out the dramatic sighing and eye rolling. If you were half as capable at making a compelling argument as you are at posturing as if you have we'd be getting somewhere.

Your 'analysis' demonstrates that Macrae gets more of the ball, uses it better, and has more impact.

They plainly do demonstrate one is better than the other, and that's consistent with how they're viewed by pretty much every observer of football of any note. One is a three time all australian midfielder, and picked up the best finals player award last year. The other isn't.

Our team is no where near, and the Bulldogs are grand finalists because of the comparative performances of our midfields.

I’ll agree with you that the Bulldogs midfield is much better than ours. Laird as an individual midfielder is comparable to all Bullies mids with the exception of The Bont. The stats show that Macrae is a more polished footballer by foot than Laird, but they do not show that he is clearly better than Laird.

Again, while it’s true that Macrae made AA last year, Laird finished ahead of him in the AFLCA Award last year, having finished 10th. That’s pretty handy. Also remember that Charlie Dixon has been AA and yet Tex hasn’t. AA is not the be all and end all.

Apologies for being dramatic. It’s just getting a bit tedious going back and forward like this. We’re clearly not going to convince one another of our respective positions… even though I’m pretty sure I’m right

 

[Southerntakeover]

I’ll agree with you that the Bulldogs midfield is much better than ours. Laird as an individual midfielder is comparable to all Bullies mids with the exception of The Bont. The stats show that Macrae is a more polished footballer by foot than Laird, but they do not show that he is clearly better than Laird.

Again, while it’s true that Macrae made AA last year, Laird finished ahead of him in the AFLCA Award last year, having finished 10th. That’s pretty handy. Also remember that Charlie Dixon has been AA and yet Tex hasn’t. AA is not the be all and end all.

Apologies for being dramatic. It’s just getting a bit tedious going back and forward like this. We’re clearly not going to convince one another of our respective positions… even though I’m pretty sure I’m right

Nah, look- fair enough. My apologies for getting shirty in response- you've conducted the discussion decently and at least supported your view, we just don't agree on what to make of the data.

I do think our actual positions aren't actually that far apart in terms of where we rate him. I wasn't particularly setting out to throw shit at Laird, and like him- and I agree he's been more damaging this year by foot so far, we'll just see if it continues. His goal yesterday was a ripper.