Opinion Chris Scott's coaching - PART III

[Spazz Cat]

Pre 06 yes.
Then in 06, there were extra-curricular causes for his burnout.
So in that regard, maybe CS has self preservation methods to prevent burnout.
He knows he can't be all things to all people.

That's one theory. Another is he saw Leigh Mathews do it.
Unfortunately unlike Mathews we dont have a massive salary cap advantage and didn't have the luxury of merging with/raping another team.
Delegating is great as long as you've got the right people to delegate to.

 

[Isaac Norm Smith]

I think the idea of comparing Thompson and Scott based on their respective abilities to develop a team as bordering on r...ardation

Thompson took 8 seasons to win a flag, developing the list that he did. That doesn't devalue it, or what followed, it's just a fact.

Scott hasn't proven he can develop a list into a premiership team. But he's really only had 4 seasons to try it. He's missed the mark on a few occasions - Guthrie and Murdoch as mentioned earlier are not great products of his system. But there were plenty of misses in Thompson's stint too, prior to the golden age. At the moment it is looking like a handful of current rookies and young guns will turn into quality players.

Valid points. The only thing I would add is success is very much determined by the quality of players at your disposal. Then it comes down to player development, coaching, strategies, player buy-in and of course a bit of luck. I don't believe Wells has done Scott any favours here. Many draft picks, particularly high picks have not come on and some are now out of the AFL system all together. Lang, Smedts, Thurlow, Kersten, Hamling, Jansen, Cockatoo (injuries).

All of those players were selected during Scott's tenure. Most of them high picks, others taken in the early thirties. Imagine if we'd picked Issac Smith over Smedts, Grundy over Thurlow etc, of course it's very easy in hindsight but it does catch up with you in the long-run. There are 4 first round draft picks selected there that haven't come on during Scott's tenure. That's quite significant in such a short period of time. If not for the recruitment of Danger, Hendo and Tuohy and a bit of luck with mature agers Menegola, Stewart and Kelly, we'd be in some strife.

 

[PhatBoy]

After West Coast's score for round 22 is added, we're actually all the way down to fifth.

Behind this year's top two (Tiges and Eagles) as well as the two teams most advantaged by finishing low last year and receiving a golden draw for 2018 as a result (Dees and Pies).

We're second for points against, though, which could explain Scott's reference to a 'defence first' mentality.

Although it probably makes more sense to smash him about how the club has abandoned a desire to play any attacking footy at all.

Particularly in the wash-up of a game where we only kicked 23 goals unanswered (an AFL record) and handed the ultra-defensive Ross the biggest shellacking of his entire coaching career.

Probably not the most opportune time to be posting a supposedly objective analysis of Scott's inability to embrace 'the Geelong way', I would have thought.

This.

The teams we play twice this year are ranked first, fourth, fifth, seventh, and the suns - who we've only played once as yet anyway.

 

[Max Milburn]

So why do the comparisons keep getting brought up?
Just human nature?
Happens in everything.
Danger v Dusty v Fyfe
Snr v Jnr
Stones v Beatles
Fleetwood Mac v Eagles
Fed v Nadal....

Danger
Snr
Beatles
Eagles (just)
Federer (boring but true)

 

[Goggin Our Best]

Scott is harshly judged by alot of big footy posters on this board

You need a touch of luck - or the breaks to go your way - 2013 -20pts up at 3 qtr time - Freo in the GF - a 2nd flag beckoned - and if it had of Scott would be a legendary Geel coach

Gary Ayres is hated and loathed by alot ( not me though ) in 97 - just a touch of luck or good fortune call it what you like - .006 off top spot - and a walk in the park 1st final against the Bears - instead Nth Melb ( reigning premier ) under lights at the MCG ( where Carey probably played his greatest game ever - in apalling conditions ) - and then shunted off to Adelaide for an away final - unbelievable .

 

[geelong_crazy26]

I hear your views. But the majority of the football community do not share that.
Only young Cats fans who dont remember what it's like to build a flag team and can't remember any of the 50 years before.
Unless he can make another GF he'll be remembered in the ilk of Joyce.
(Alan Joyce coached a Hawthorn team to a flag previously developed by Alan Jeans)

How did he inherit a premiership team when the team lost a preliminary final? That’s not a premiership team. Your theory of someone else’s list only applies if there already at the standard which we weren’t anymore, Scott has to fix quite a massive hole up to get us that 2011 flag.

 

[Landgraft]

Danger
Snr
Beatles
Eagles (just)
Federer (boring but true)

Finally, someone else telling Dubs how boring tennis is.

 

[Kenjo]

How did he inherit a premiership team when the team lost a preliminary final? That’s not a premiership team. Your theory of someone else’s list only applies if there already at the standard which we weren’t anymore, Scott has to fix quite a massive hole up to get us that 2011 flag.

Spot on

 

[Stocks_go_Up]

How did he inherit a premiership team when the team lost a preliminary final? That’s not a premiership team. Your theory of someone else’s list only applies if there already at the standard which we weren’t anymore, Scott has to fix quite a massive hole up to get us that 2011 flag.

Using your logic Scott has gotten worse as a coach and list developer. We must have a shit load of holes - why hasn't he fixed them like he did in 2011? He has had 8 years to develop his own list..... You claim Thompson was crap compared to Scott and the team was average going into 2011. What are we now then?

 

[Spazz Cat]

How did he inherit a premiership team when the team lost a preliminary final? That’s not a premiership team. Your theory of someone else’s list only applies if there already at the standard which we weren’t anymore, Scott has to fix quite a massive hole up to get us that 2011 flag.

Oh ok. Inherited a prelim final team then.
Joyce must've been amazing then. Inherited an Elimination Final team and won a flag.
I take it you and the entire football community consider him a greater coach than Alan Jeans then?
Or does that sound just a lttle bit silly?

 

[00VicWard001]

After West Coast's score for round 22 is added, we're actually all the way down to fifth.

Behind this year's top two (Tiges and Eagles) as well as the two teams most advantaged by finishing low last year and receiving a golden draw for 2018 as a result (Dees and Pies).

We're second for points against, though, which could explain Scott's reference to a 'defence first' mentality.

Although it probably makes more sense to smash him about how the club has abandoned a desire to play any attacking footy at all.

Particularly in the wash-up of a game where we only kicked 23 goals unanswered (an AFL record) and handed the ultra-defensive Ross the biggest shellacking of his entire coaching career.

Probably not the most opportune time to be posting a supposedly objective analysis of Scott's inability to embrace 'the Geelong way', I would have thought.

Yeah, but the trump card that was just brought up by ATSAM that surpasses that logic. Supposedly the players decided to abandon Scott’s game plan after quarter team. Yep, professional teams do that all the time. They train one way the entire year, then they decide to make it up on the fly during the game.

...

 

[you pick one]

I some times wonder if some of the game plans devised by football departments are beyond the comprehensions of the players, early on Aaron Black I think it was,was asked how he was fitting in working with a new game plan the answer basically was I have NFI what they are talking about if I get a game I'll just try and win the footy.

 

[Partridge]

So why do the comparisons keep getting brought up?
Just human nature?
Happens in everything.
Danger v Dusty v Fyfe
Snr v Jnr
Stones v Beatles
Fleetwood Mac v Eagles
Fed v Nadal....

1. I don't think there's too much difference between Dangerfield, Martin, and Fyfe. You'd be pretty happy with any, or you should be anyway.
2. Ablett senior easily.
3. Stones easily. and if it's just the Mick Taylor years it's daylight.
4. Fleetwood Mac - i.e. the original Fleetwood Mac with Peter Green, very, very easily.
5. Don't follow tennis enough.

 

[Max Milburn]

Yeah, but the trump card that was just brought up by ATSAM that surpasses that logic. Supposedly the players decided to abandon Scott’s game plan after quarter team. Yep, professional teams do that all the time. They train one way the entire year, then they decide to make it up on the fly during the game.

...

But they did decide to implement Billy's game plan.

 

[Spazz Cat]

Danger
Snr
Beatles
Eagles (just)
Federer (boring but true)

Coke vs Pepsi
Metallica vs Megadeth
LeBron vs Jordan
Beverley Hills 90210 vs Baywatch

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Coke vs Pepsi
Metallica vs Megadeth
LeBron vs Jordan
Beverley Hills 90210 vs Baywatch

Coke.
Metallica.
Jordon.
Baywatch.

 

[Spazz Cat]

Coke.
Metallica.
Jordon.
Baywatch.

I wouldve gone
Pepsi (max)
Megadeth
Jordan
Too close to call.

 

[Spazz Cat]

Roseanne vs Friends
Guns n' Roses vs Motley Crue
Bird vs Curry
Maccas vs Hungry Jacks
Capper vs Barry Hall

 

[dazbroncos]

AS much as it pains me..

please get back on the CS topic...

GO Catters

 

[Max Milburn]

AS much as it pains me..

please get back on the CS topic...

GO Catters

That's a shame. It's a fun game, and everyone is playing so nicely!

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Using your logic Scott has gotten worse as a coach and list developer. We must have a shit load of holes - why hasn't he fixed them like he did in 2011? He has had 8 years to develop his own list..... You claim Thompson was crap compared to Scott and the team was average going into 2011. What are we now then?

He has fixed massive list problems. We have spent the past 7 years leaking AA talent while competing for a premiership. You can’t do that unless your a top tier coach.

And there is no such thing as this “topping up” formula which many on here believe guarantees you a finals spot.

How did that go for Kenny Hinkley??

The difference is the coaching

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Oh ok. Inherited a prelim final team then.
Joyce must've been amazing then. Inherited an Elimination Final team and won a flag.
I take it you and the entire football community consider him a greater coach than Alan Jeans then?
Or does that sound just a lttle bit silly?

What was the age profile of the team Alan jeans inherited? All context it isn’t black and white.

Our list from 2010-2011 actually got significantly worse. We lost GAZ who you seem to conveniently ignore or never mention it like it was a significant impact and a huge thing for Scott to coach against, you know only the greatest midfielder to ever play the game.

That prelim smashes side was with gaz in it, losing gaz should have put us down the bottom half of the 8.

It was 100% coaching and development over the off season that got us the 11 premiership.

He had a big mess he fixed from day one

 

[Spazz Cat]

What was the age profile of the team Alan jeans inherited? All context it isn’t black and white.

Our list from 2010-2011 actually got significantly worse. We lost GAZ who you seem to conveniently ignore or never mention it like it was a significant impact and a huge thing for Scott to coach against, you know only the greatest midfielder to ever play the game.

That prelim smashes side was with gaz in it, losing gaz should have put us down the bottom half of the 8.

It was 100% coaching and development over the off season that got us the 11 premiership.

He had a big mess he fixed from day one

Was pretty old. At the start of the year they were called too old and slow etc.
I think before 1990 they made like 7 GF's in a row.
Yeah losing Gaz was bad but we seemed to get a more even contribution without him.
Luckily we had Tommy, Selwood, and Taylor still on the way up, the smart recruiting and development of Pods a year earlier who had a career best year and really hit his straps.
Gaz out had the benifet of Kelly getting more mid time resulting in an AA selection, along with Enright and Scarlett having AA years.
Remarkably SJ's best footy was actually yet to come.
A brownlow medalist in Bartel still in his prime.
The smart and brave choice the previous season to play Lonnegan at full back who would turn out to be a top defender for years to come.
Wasn't a huge mess at all. 1 player.
95% of the team was still intact, most still playing great footy and a couple of young players in Duncan and Menzel who'd already had development and games put into them by the best in the biz.
The benifet of 2 Gaz compo picks to come.
Free agency on the horizon.
What a mess!

 

[Mr Meow]

AS much as it pains me..

please get back on the CS topic...

GO Catters

Chris Scott vs Bomber Thompson.

You regret saying that already, don't you?

 

[Spazz Cat]

Chris Scott vs Bomber Thompson.

You regret saying that already, don't you?

Interesting one,
Kelly Bundy vs Buffy (both in their prime)