Christians are easily startled, but they'll soon be back. And in greater numbers 36:11

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Welcome to the Ask an Atheist thread II.

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So?

The cult "believed" that what they were doing was correct, definately using the examples of the biblical precedent

Who hold the Church and their believers (either a sect of mainstrean) to account?

God doesn't seem to be doing it, it's left up to the secular authorities

You believe that Christ was rose from the dead and this is God's actions, you believe that God can heal the sick through the intercession of prayer

What of their actions unbiblical or at least have a basis in the Bible that you believe is the "Word of God"?
This is a cult, have you never experienced the sequelae of any extremist group before?
As an atheist, why are you so indignant about anything that goes wrong in the world?
 
Rubbish. You people believe in authoritarianism from a higher power. That's what ends up making so many of them shitty people. They think they always hold the moral high ground and are very judgemental of others.


“Love thy neighbor” is preached from many a pulpit. But new research from the University of California, Berkeley, suggests that the highly religious are less motivated by compassion when helping a stranger than are atheists, agnostics and less religious people.


You people tend to embrace the 'us vs them' mentality and dehumanize the people in the out group. When you view people who are different from you (like other religions or other belief systems) as lesser humans or simply , you become capable of atrocities. Have you not the OT? How did God treat those who worshipped other deities?

The very wealthy and powerful are guilty of the exact same thing. When the very religious also become wealthy and powerful...that's where genocide comes from.
Extrapolation as always.
Many Christians find God because their innate natures are deficient, and without God, they can not be "good", kind, benevolent people.
Not surprising then that stat of yours.
Even with God in their lives, it can still be a struggle to be compassionate.
Many Christians are broken, hurt people, never claiming to be perfect- just because Jesus, who they worship, was a perfect man that they can only aspire to emulate, they know they can never attain that standard.
 

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Extrapolation as always.
Many Christians find God because their innate natures are deficient, and without God, they can not be "good", kind, benevolent people.
How am i and millions (and if not billions of people) are good without God? It doesn't take God to be kind and benevolent. Look at the CC, the Islamic Sharia etc etc, they are literally multi billion dollar organisations who abuses their privilege.

On the contrary, you can justify ANYTHING with your holy book. All atrocities, all murder/rape (simply cause we are sinners apparently) everything, cause you know salvation is waiting for you as long as you accept Christ.


Not surprising then that stat of yours.
It's not my stat, religious people have less empathy. When you do good, it's cause 'God made me good' when you do bad 'it's call i am a sinner'.

Note: God's curse made you a sinner as well, so you must blame all sins to the deity too.

Logic, funny how it works hey?

Even with God in their lives, it can still be a struggle to be compassionate.
God is not necessary to be compassionate. You are either compassionate or you aren't.


Many Christians are broken, hurt people, never claiming to be perfect- just because Jesus, who they worship, was a perfect man that they can only aspire to emulate, they know they can never attain that standard.
What standard? Jesus did many horrible things, from anger management issues to calling a Canaanite woman a dog and refusing to help her. He also helped his disciples steal donkies.

Remember when Jesus got pissed off at a fig tree and cursed it to bear fruit no more?
That was because he was too ****ing stupid to realize it wasn't the right season. That's not perfect

If Jeezis existed, he was just some dude.
 
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This is a cult, have you never experienced the sequelae of any extremist group before?
As an atheist, why are you so indignant about anything that goes wrong in the world?
Christianity is a sect (or cult) that grew out from Bronze Age Middle Eastern religious beliefs that formed itself as Judaism.

Christianity managed to remore some of the Laws of the Torah

Like your bacon and eggs for brekkie and aren't circumcised?

Without the Old Testament, Christ is not the Messiah, he's only an Iron Age Mystic in a occupied country

So, what is the elements of this "cults's" beliefs that do not have their basis in the Bible?

Evangelists like to promote the powers of prayer.

Many years ago a Christian "reached out" to me and invited me to a "Healing" service. A number of people went for healing from Migraines. lower back pain etc fronted up. I knew one the people going to be healed; a Primary teacher who was 23 when she suffered significant brain injuries in a car accident who could still remember her previous life

Saddest thing I've ever seen, hoping for a cure

Prayer did bugger all to restore her intelligence, motor skills or remove her from supported accommodation.

I have an image of a group of crows hovering over the dying child's bed as she lapsed in and out conciousness and watching her slowly decaying body for signs of life.

Are cults sects that you don't agree with even they have the same beliefs?

I'm not an athiest, I don't give a flying farnackle about what happens to me when I die. I'm not so conceited that i believe that my conscienceness is any way important the the planet, let alone the galaxy or universe and will exist after electrical activity in my brain ceases

I'd suggest rather than read the fantasy or SciFi novels of C.S Lewis, give the novels of Terry Pratchett, the noted humanist and secularist a burl

PS: Is Earth the only place in the Universe which has life with self awareness? Do these self aware beings have a Christ like figure and where is that mentioned in the works of a omniscient and a omnipotent being that created the Universe?
 
Christianity is a sect (or cult) that grew out from Bronze Age Middle Eastern religious beliefs that formed itself as Judaism.

Christianity managed to remore some of the Laws of the Torah

Like your bacon and eggs for brekkie and aren't circumcised?

Without the Old Testament, Christ is not the Messiah, he's only an Iron Age Mystic in a occupied country

So, what is the elements of this "cults's" beliefs that do not have their basis in the Bible?

Evangelists like to promote the powers of prayer.

Many years ago a Christian "reached out" to me and invited me to a "Healing" service. A number of people went for healing from Migraines. lower back pain etc fronted up. I knew one the people going to be healed; a Primary teacher who was 23 when she suffered significant brain injuries in a car accident who could still remember her previous life

Saddest thing I've ever seen, hoping for a cure

Prayer did bugger all to restore her intelligence, motor skills or remove her from supported accommodation.

I have an image of a group of crows hovering over the dying child's bed as she lapsed in and out conciousness and watching her slowly decaying body for signs of life.

Are cults sects that you don't agree with even they have the same beliefs?

I'm not an athiest, I don't give a flying farnackle about what happens to me when I die. I'm not so conceited that i believe that my conscienceness is any way important the the planet, let alone the galaxy or universe and will exist after electrical activity in my brain ceases

I'd suggest rather than read the fantasy or SciFi novels of C.S Lewis, give the novels of Terry Pratchett, the noted humanist and secularist a burl

PS: Is Earth the only place in the Universe which has life with self awareness? Do these self aware beings have a Christ like figure and where is that mentioned in the works of a omniscient and a omnipotent being that created the Universe?

It’s still one universe and it’s just distance that separates . They don’t get a mention but lots of earthlings don’t get a mention in the Christian story either. I’d say aliens would have a god. The universe cries out to God.

“Dr. Thigpen concludes that the Catholic faith would not be undermined by the discovery of extraterrestrial intelligence.
To give an example of a puzzling question addressed in Dr. Thigpen’s work, he treats whether God could have become incarnate in an alien species in addition to his human incarnation (ch. 13). To answer that question, he draws from and extends an argument made by St. Thomas Aquinas in Summa theologiae 3.3.7. In that article, Aquinas asks “whether one divine Person can assume two human natures?” and his answer is: yes! Aquinas is insistent: “It has to be said that the Divine Person, over and beyond the human nature which He has assumed, can assume another distinct human nature.” Well, if the Second Person of the Trinity could become incarnate in two human natures, then surely he could become incarnate in a second, nonhuman rational nature, such as an alien extraterrestrial intelligence. In the prior chapter (ch. 12), Dr. Thigpen responds to other questions related to ways aliens could be redeemed, if they even fell. St. Pio of Pietrelcina apparently thought that there were alien species and that some of them did not fall into sin (see ch. 8).
The well-respected Catholic Answers apologist Jimmy Akin has also treated this topic; it is an area of particular interest to him. Like Dr. Thigpen, Jimmy Akin thinks the existence of extraterrestrial, nonhuman intelligence is compatible with the Catholic faith, as he argues in an interview and on an episode of his Jimmy Akin’s Mysterious World podcast. In the interview, he discusses why he does not think the existence of ETIs would be contrary to the faith. Against those who claim they could not exist because they are not mentioned in the Bible, he points to a historical analogue where some people made similar arguments but were proven wrong: medieval debates (prior to the discovery of the New World) over whether there could be humans living on the other side of the globe. In the latter episode, he speculates intelligently (from a Catholic perspective) about a wide variety of interesting—and perhaps even “off-the-wall”—questions. For example, he discusses whether NHIs could receive sacraments and, if so, which ones.”
 
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“It has to be said that the Divine Person, over and beyond the human nature which He has assumed, can assume another distinct human nature.” Well, if the Second Person of the Trinity could become incarnate in two human natures, then surely he could become incarnate in a second, nonhuman rational nature, such as an alien extraterrestrial intelligence.
I literally have no words..

:tearsofjoy::tearsofjoy:


Imagine trying to solve complex matters in regards to science with Trinity which itself is a made up concept.

I mean yeah CC can speak about this matter, they are evil incarnate in this world. They would really hope there's no other CC in other planet anywhere else in the universe damaging the lives of heathens there.

FFS. lol
 
It’s still one universe and it’s just distance that separates . They don’t get a mention but lots of earthlings don’t get a mention in the Christian story either. I’d say aliens would have a god. The universe cries out for one

“Dr. Thigpen concludes that the Catholic faith would not be undermined by the discovery of extraterrestrial intelligence.
To give an example of a puzzling question addressed in Dr. Thigpen’s work, he treats whether God could have become incarnate in an alien species in addition to his human incarnation (ch. 13). To answer that question, he draws from and extends an argument made by St. Thomas Aquinas in Summa theologiae 3.3.7. In that article, Aquinas asks “whether one divine Person can assume two human natures?” and his answer is: yes! Aquinas is insistent: “It has to be said that the Divine Person, over and beyond the human nature which He has assumed, can assume another distinct human nature.” Well, if the Second Person of the Trinity could become incarnate in two human natures, then surely he could become incarnate in a second, nonhuman rational nature, such as an alien extraterrestrial intelligence. In the prior chapter (ch. 12), Dr. Thigpen responds to other questions related to ways aliens could be redeemed, if they even fell. St. Pio of Pietrelcina apparently thought that there were alien species and that some of them did not fall into sin (see ch. 8).
The well-respected Catholic Answers apologist Jimmy Akin has also treated this topic; it is an area of particular interest to him. Like Dr. Thigpen, Jimmy Akin thinks the existence of extraterrestrial, nonhuman intelligence is compatible with the Catholic faith, as he argues in an interview and on an episode of his Jimmy Akin’s Mysterious World podcast. In the interview, he discusses why he does not think the existence of ETIs would be contrary to the faith. Against those who claim they could not exist because they are not mentioned in the Bible, he points to a historical analogue where some people made similar arguments but were proven wrong: medieval debates (prior to the discovery of the New World) over whether there could be humans living on the other side of the globe. In the latter episode, he speculates intelligently (from a Catholic perspective) about a wide variety of interesting—and perhaps even “off-the-wall”—questions. For example, he discusses whether NHIs could receive sacraments and, if so, which ones.”
Direct cut and past from https://www.wordonfire.org/articles/would-extraterrestrial-intelligence-disprove-christianity/

Definate case of Plagiarism and you don't even have the comprehension of the topic to convert it to your own words

Could not even attempt to format it to make it readable.

I would fail it, but you did actually show some vague competence in using Google. D-

Let's get to the basic premise of my post, how did these convicted killers believe that by putting faith in Bronze and Iron Age mythologies let this innocent child die from a readily controllable illness

They had the faith, the theology and the prayers and acted in accordance with their biblical beliefs but they didn't have the basic decency to ensure that the body was buried in a time frame in accordance with the Old Testament

Can you justify the death of a young child according to your religious beleifs?
 
Direct cut and past from https://www.wordonfire.org/articles/would-extraterrestrial-intelligence-disprove-christianity/

Definate case of Plagiarism and you don't even have the comprehension of the topic to convert it to your own words

Could not even attempt to format it to make it readable.

I would fail it, but you did actually show some vague competence in using Google. D-

Let's get to the basic premise of my post, how did these convicted killers believe that by putting faith in Bronze and Iron Age mythologies let this innocent child die from a readily controllable illness

They had the faith, the theology and the prayers and acted in accordance with their biblical beliefs but they didn't have the basic decency to ensure that the body was buried in a time frame in accordance with the Old Testament

Can you justify the death of a young child according to your religious beleifs?

Why would anyone want to even try . You sick prick .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
How am i and millions (and if not billions of people) are good without God? It doesn't take God to be kind and benevolent. Look at the CC, the Islamic Sharia etc etc, they are literally multi billion dollar organisations who abuses their privilege.

On the contrary, you can justify ANYTHING with your holy book. All atrocities, all murder/rape (simply cause we are sinners apparently) everything, cause you know salvation is waiting for you as long as you accept Christ.



It's not my stat, religious people have less empathy. When you do good, it's cause 'God made me good' when you do bad 'it's call i am a sinner'.

Note: God's curse made you a sinner as well, so you must blame all sins to the deity too.

Logic, funny how it works hey?


God is not necessary to be compassionate. You are either compassionate or you aren't.



What standard? Jesus did many horrible things, from anger management issues to calling a Canaanite woman a dog and refusing to help her. He also helped his disciples steal donkies.

Remember when Jesus got pissed off at a fig tree and cursed it to bear fruit no more?
That was because he was too ****ing stupid to realize it wasn't the right season. That's not perfect

If Jeezis existed, he was just some dude.
Provocative garbage again.
Heard of Lucifer?
He is the reason we are part of the Fall.
God allowed him his free will, but as has been the case over the lifetime of human existence, there are repercussions for going against God's way, for sinning, and for not acknowledging God.
You can curse, disagree, rebel , and capitalise letters all you like, but it all makes sense, and nothing you read from science, Dawkins, Ehrman, or any other recent day guru can alter what is likely to be the truth.
 
Christianity is a sect (or cult) that grew out from Bronze Age Middle Eastern religious beliefs that formed itself as Judaism.

Christianity managed to remore some of the Laws of the Torah

Like your bacon and eggs for brekkie and aren't circumcised?

Without the Old Testament, Christ is not the Messiah, he's only an Iron Age Mystic in a occupied country

So, what is the elements of this "cults's" beliefs that do not have their basis in the Bible?

Evangelists like to promote the powers of prayer.

Many years ago a Christian "reached out" to me and invited me to a "Healing" service. A number of people went for healing from Migraines. lower back pain etc fronted up. I knew one the people going to be healed; a Primary teacher who was 23 when she suffered significant brain injuries in a car accident who could still remember her previous life

Saddest thing I've ever seen, hoping for a cure

Prayer did bugger all to restore her intelligence, motor skills or remove her from supported accommodation.

I have an image of a group of crows hovering over the dying child's bed as she lapsed in and out conciousness and watching her slowly decaying body for signs of life.

Are cults sects that you don't agree with even they have the same beliefs?

I'm not an athiest, I don't give a flying farnackle about what happens to me when I die. I'm not so conceited that i believe that my conscienceness is any way important the the planet, let alone the galaxy or universe and will exist after electrical activity in my brain ceases

I'd suggest rather than read the fantasy or SciFi novels of C.S Lewis, give the novels of Terry Pratchett, the noted humanist and secularist a burl

PS: Is Earth the only place in the Universe which has life with self awareness? Do these self aware beings have a Christ like figure and where is that mentioned in the works of a omniscient and a omnipotent being that created the Universe?
You give the impression you're not a believer in Christianity.
 
Heard of Lucifer?

'Lucifer' is a figment of the human imagination. In Roman folklore Lucifer ("light-bringer" in Latin) was the name of the planet Venus. The motif of a heavenly being striving for the highest seat of heaven only to be cast down to the underworld has its origins in the motions of the planet Venus. Isaiah 14:12 applied to a king of Babylon gave rise to the general use of the Latin word for "morning star", as the original name of the devil before his fall from grace, linking Isaiah 14:12 with Luke 10. ("I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven"),

Even so the history of conflating Lucifer with Satan is long and complicated.

The figure of Satan effectively has its origins in the older Persian religion of Zoroastrianism, which is centralised on Ahura Mazda vs. Angra Mainyu (Ahriman). Zoroaster taught that Ahura Mazda and Ahriman would continually battle each other until the God of Evil (Ahriman) is finally defeated. At this time, the dead will be resurrected, a Last Judgement will divide all the people that have ever lived into two groups; the evil go to Hell for all eternity; the good go to Paradise.

He is the reason we are part of the Fall.

What Fall?
God allowed him his free will, but as has been the case over the lifetime of human existence, there are repercussions for going against God's way, for sinning, and for not acknowledging God.

I am sinless of course.
You can curse, disagree, rebel , and capitalise letters all you like, but it all makes sense, and nothing you read from science, Dawkins, Ehrman, or any other recent day guru can alter what is likely to be the truth.

There is absolutely no supporting evidence it is truth. Once again your claim to truth is - like all the other claims to truth you have made so far - is totally unsupported by evidence.
 

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Why would anyone want to even try . You sick prick .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Your the one waxing eloquent on this thread about the Christian Theology. the benefits that you receive due your personal relationship with Christ and promoting a belief in the intercessory power of prayer.

These killers gave their life to Christ, believed in the promises of both the Old and New Testaments practised the intercessory power of prayer,

Ticked all the boxes as devout Christians but still left a child to die

Does either the OT or the NT forbid the use of medicines?

Not that I'm aware of, but still they did it

What Chapter and verse did they ignore in their quest to have a more perfect relationship with God?

You may accuse me of being a sick prick, but as a Devout Christian I would believe that you would be fully across Mathew 25:36 and visit Prisons regularly to provide succour the the prisoners. I would suggest that you go to the Hopkins Correctional Centre and meet some real sick pricks like Risdale
 
'Lucifer' is a figment of the human imagination. In Roman folklore Lucifer ("light-bringer" in Latin) was the name of the planet Venus. The motif of a heavenly being striving for the highest seat of heaven only to be cast down to the underworld has its origins in the motions of the planet Venus. Isaiah 14:12 applied to a king of Babylon gave rise to the general use of the Latin word for "morning star", as the original name of the devil before his fall from grace, linking Isaiah 14:12 with Luke 10. ("I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven"),

Even so the history of conflating Lucifer with Satan is long and complicated.

The figure of Satan effectively has its origins in the older Persian religion of Zoroastrianism, which is centralised on Ahura Mazda vs. Angra Mainyu (Ahriman). Zoroaster taught that Ahura Mazda and Ahriman would continually battle each other until the God of Evil (Ahriman) is finally defeated. At this time, the dead will be resurrected, a Last Judgement will divide all the people that have ever lived into two groups; the evil go to Hell for all eternity; the good go to Paradise.



What Fall?


I am sinless of course.


There is absolutely no supporting evidence it is truth. Once again your claim to truth is - like all the other claims to truth you have made so far - is totally unsupported by evidence.
Your request for robust evidence is just a defence- you have searched for reasons NOT to believe and you will adhere to those readings and you will never be moved.
 
Your request for robust evidence is just a defence- you have searched for reasons NOT to believe

What you have just said is an excuse not to provide any robust evidence. There is no supporting evidence to believe your claims to truth. So why should I?
and you will adhere to those readings and you will never be moved.

Because you supply no robust evidence in support of your claims. Why should I believe Lucifer / Satan is anything more than a figment of the human imagination? Why should I believe that people such as Jesus or Lazarus or any other Biblical figure was resurrected from being truly dead? Why should I believe there was a "Fall?" And so on. If you claims are true, prove that they are true. Believing in something on the basis of nothing more than 'faith' is simply not good enough
 
What you have just said is an excuse not to provide any robust evidence. There is no supporting evidence to believe your claims to truth. So why should I?


Because you supply no robust evidence in support of your claims. Why should I believe Lucifer / Satan is anything more than a figment of the human imagination? Why should I believe that people such as Jesus or Lazarus or any other Biblical figure was resurrected from being truly dead? Why should I believe there was a "Fall?" And so on. If you claims are true, prove that they are true. Believing in something on the basis of nothing more than 'faith' is simply not good enough
Spending more time with God by reading His Word, prayer, and fellowship with other believers is critical.
Admittedly, time here is comparatively worthless, although I have enhanced my faith merely by engaging with people in this thread.
 
Spending more time with God by reading His Word, prayer, and fellowship with other believers is critical.

Critical for what? Why should I believe Lucifer / Satan is anything more than a figment of the human imagination? Why should I believe that people such as Jesus or Lazarus or any other Biblical figure was resurrected from being truly dead? Why should I believe there was a "Fall?" And so on. If you claims are true, prove that they are true. Believing in something on the basis of nothing more than 'faith' is simply not good enough
Admittedly, time here is comparatively worthless, although I have enhanced my faith merely by engaging with people in this thread.

What you have presented has done absolutely nothing to convince me of the truth of the claims you make. I see absolutely no good reason to believe your claims to truth are actually true. Believing in something on the basis of nothing more than 'faith' is simply not good enough.
 
'Lucifer' is a figment of the human imagination. In Roman folklore Lucifer ("light-bringer" in Latin) was the name of the planet Venus. The motif of a heavenly being striving for the highest seat of heaven only to be cast down to the underworld has its origins in the motions of the planet Venus. Isaiah 14:12 applied to a king of Babylon gave rise to the general use of the Latin word for "morning star", as the original name of the devil before his fall from grace, linking Isaiah 14:12 with Luke 10. ("I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven"),

Even so the history of conflating Lucifer with Satan is long and complicated.

The figure of Satan effectively has its origins in the older Persian religion of Zoroastrianism, which is centralised on Ahura Mazda vs. Angra Mainyu (Ahriman). Zoroaster taught that Ahura Mazda and Ahriman would continually battle each other until the God of Evil (Ahriman) is finally defeated. At this time, the dead will be resurrected, a Last Judgement will divide all the people that have ever lived into two groups; the evil go to Hell for all eternity; the good go to Paradise.



What Fall?


I am sinless of course.


There is absolutely no supporting evidence it is truth. Once again your claim to truth is - like all the other claims to truth you have made so far - is totally unsupported by evidence.
Are you a vehicle mechanic?
If not, you should be.
If my car's engine is misfiring, you'd be the guy I would go to.
 
Critical for what? Why should I believe Lucifer / Satan is anything more than a figment of the human imagination? Why should I believe that people such as Jesus or Lazarus or any other Biblical figure was resurrected from being truly dead? Why should I believe there was a "Fall?" And so on. If you claims are true, prove that they are true. Believing in something on the basis of nothing more than 'faith' is simply not good enough


What you have presented has done absolutely nothing to convince me of the truth of the claims you make. I see absolutely no good reason to believe your claims to truth are actually true. Believing in something on the basis of nothing more than 'faith' is simply not good enough.
At least you are fully aware of the concepts, and you are aware of who Jesus said He is.
All readers here are.
That is a start.
 

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Christians are easily startled, but they'll soon be back. And in greater numbers 36:11


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