Club Focus Collingwood 2024

[Ticky009]

Data from footywire. To check the draft order see the thread here.

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[Kobe Gryant]

There is going to be the mother of all cliffs coming in the coming years.

Not necessarily, you just have to make some smart list decisions over the next 18 months.

Find a way to get back into the draft, get games into the likes of McInnes, Macrae, Jiath, Demattia, & Allen if they're earning them...and most importantly, don't give up good future picks for B graders like Shultz.

Maynard, Daicos, Naicos, McCreery, JDG, Moore, Cameron, & Quaynor is enough quality to keep the list competitive while the youngsters develop.

It's really just about the next couple years, Geelong went through very similar projection '18/19.

If we'd traded quality picks for players who are 'just okay' and ignored the draft/playing kids we would've been well and truly f***ed by 2022 and still in that position now.

You pick up an SDK, COS, Holmes & Clark, trade in Bruhn & Henry, and get games into some later gems by keeping your picks (Close, Miers, Dempsey, Atkins, JHenry, Stengle DFA) and it changes very quickly.

Collingwood's a well run club, I've got no doubt they'll be planning to avoid what happened to the Eagles/Hawks.

 

[loki04]

Not necessarily, you just have to make some smart list decisions over the next 18 months.

Find a way to get back into the draft, get games into the likes of McInnes, Macrae, Jiath, Demattia, & Allen if they're earning them...and most importantly, don't give up good future picks for B graders like Shultz.

Maynard, Daicos, Naicos, McCreery, JDG, Moore, Cameron, & Quaynor is enough quality to keep the list competitive while the youngsters develop.

It's really just about the next couple years, Geelong went through very similar projection '18/19.

If we'd traded quality picks for players who are 'just okay' and ignored the draft/playing kids we would've been well and truly f***ed by 2022 and still in that position now.

You pick up an SDK, COS, Holmes & Clark, trade in Bruhn & Henry, and get games into some later gems by keeping your picks (Close, Miers, Dempsey, Atkins, JHenry, Stengle DFA) and it changes very quickly.

Collingwood's a well run club, I've got no doubt they'll be planning to avoid what happened to the Eagles/Hawks.

You will never build a dynasty side building a list like that on the run, it will at best pinch one with a bit of luck and momentum.

Norf, Hawks and WC are having birthing pains but the worm will turn and they will with the right trades, likely have an extended window of contention in another 3 or 4 seasons.

Even though many teams have stuffed full rebuilds I still believe it’s the best way to build a multi flag team, recent builds by Cats, Swans and current Pies are designed to make use of an older core and pinching one whilst they have some run in their legs.

 

[tiger_tough]

In breaking news on the midweek tackle - The AFLs oldest list is looking at a big turnover of its list in the next 2-3 years. Huge scoop

Oh and they're going to hold onto their 1st rounders, even though they don't have one this year.

 

[Jen2310]

In breaking news on the midweek tackle - The AFLs oldest list is looking at a big turnover of its list in the next 2-3 years. Huge scoop

Oh and they're going to hold onto their 1st rounders, even though they don't have one this year.

going forward lol should never have been given away last year.. but whats done is done.
Thankfully it seems they have realised its best to keep those 1st rounders, especially when you have an aging list.

Going by what they mentioned, just using FA to get players, no trading for high profile players hence the keeping onto the 1sts.
So maybe FA, draft, rookie and SSP? The stuff thats worked in recent times.

Have a few NGA players this year.

 

[markm106]

going forward lol should never have been given away last year.. but whats done is done.
Thankfully it seems they have realised its best to keep those 1st rounders, especially when you have an aging list.

Going by what they mentioned, just using FA to get players, no trading for high profile players hence the keeping onto the 1sts.
So maybe FA, draft, rookie and SSP? The stuff thats worked in recent times.

Have a few NGA players this year.

How highly are the NGA players rated? The changes have made it very hard to get access to elite talent via NGA now. It’s out to pick 40 to gain access to a player.

 

[Go Woods]

In breaking news on the midweek tackle - The AFLs oldest list is looking at a big turnover of its list in the next 2-3 years. Huge scoop

Oh and they're going to hold onto their 1st rounders, even though they don't have one this year.

$5Mil war chest is going to help us target and land a number of FA's over the next 2-3 years and no longer trade away 1st rounders, obviously this is from 2025, unless we trade back into the 1st round end of this year. Exciting times ahead.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

You will never build a dynasty side building a list like that on the run, it will at best pinch one with a bit of luck and momentum.

Norf, Hawks and WC are having birthing pains but the worm will turn and they will with the right trades, likely have an extended window of contention in another 3 or 4 seasons.

Even though many teams have stuffed full rebuilds I still believe it’s the best way to build a multi flag team, recent builds by Cats, Swans and current Pies are designed to make use of an older core and pinching one whilst they have some run in their legs.

North, Hawks, and WCE are an interesting topic. I think the experience of the last 20 years has been that adding through the draft is not sufficient really to build a dynasty team.

Melbourne hit the draft for how many years? It was actually a full clean out of the off field departments and trades for May and Lever that got them over the line and as yet they're more pinching one than dynasty.

 

[loki04]

North, Hawks, and WCE are an interesting topic. I think the experience of the last 20 years has been that adding through the draft is not sufficient really to build a dynasty team.

Melbourne hit the draft for how many years? It was actually a full clean out of the off field departments and trades for May and Lever that got them over the line and as yet they're more pinching one than dynasty.

You need build the core from the draft then look at trade ins once you have the basis in place.

Trade for list holes and weaknesses after you hit the low end draft for 2-3 years and start the climb.

Yes Melbourne should have won more but the nose beers have cut that short also think Grundy trade was a mistake and resources could of been better spent in other areas that went to him.

I always find it funny when people comment on dipping for 2 or 3 years then compare it to extreme tanking teams who sold off all the experience on the list so no one was left to usher in said top talents. That was thier mistake and manipulation of wins and loss.

I'm talking normal rebuilds that happen through ageing and attrition usually teams will have a natural cycle. But recently teams have tried to subvert that by hitting trades to stay finals relevant with old cores from previous rebuilds.

 

[Jen2310]

How highly are the NGA players rated? The changes have made it very hard to get access to elite talent via NGA now. It’s out to pick 40 to gain access to a player.

Yeah, they arent in that protected bracket I wouldn't think. But think the AFL are reviewing the NGA, possibly bringing it back to top 20? whether thats this year or next, not sure.

 

[Daka]

The salary cap went up by 30% and will be 17m+ in 2025.
I think it's fair to say all clubs have a lot of money to spend now.

I think it's a bit overstated how the media are saying Collingwood have a warchest most clubs do now.

 

[jakson68]

You will never build a dynasty side building a list like that on the run, it will at best pinch one with a bit of luck and momentum.

Norf, Hawks and WC are having birthing pains but the worm will turn and they will with the right trades, likely have an extended window of contention in another 3 or 4 seasons.

Even though many teams have stuffed full rebuilds I still believe it’s the best way to build a multi flag team, recent builds by Cats, Swans and current Pies are designed to make use of an older core and pinching one whilst they have some run in their legs.

There is nothing wrong with pinching one.

Ask St Kilda if they would care if they "pinched one".
Or any other team that haven't one a flag for many, many years.

Collingwood dont win it every year but they more often than not, keep us in contention.

Thats good enough for me.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

You need build the core from the draft then look at trade ins once you have the basis in place.

Trade for list holes and weaknesses after you hit the low end draft for 2-3 years and start the climb.

Yes Melbourne should have won more but the nose beers have cut that short also think Grundy trade was a mistake and resources could of been better spent in other areas that went to him.

I always find it funny when people comment on dipping for 2 or 3 years then compare it to extreme tanking teams who sold off all the experience on the list so no one was left to usher in said top talents. That was thier mistake and manipulation of wins and loss.

I'm talking normal rebuilds that happen through ageing and attrition usually teams will have a natural cycle. But recently teams have tried to subvert that by hitting trades to stay finals relevant with old cores from previous rebuilds.

Yeah maybe, I just think you're maybe understating the value of winning a premiership. Like it's not worth it if you don't win 3 or something.

Also I just don't see trading and drafting as mutually exclusive strategies either. Geelong traded in 2x 20 year olds in 2022 and drafted a 3x mature agers last year. Which one is the rebuilding move and which one is to stay relevant?

 

[Babylove]

The salary cap went up by 30% and will be 17m+ in 2025.
I think it's fair to say all clubs have a lot of money to spend now.

I think it's a bit overstated how the media are saying Collingwood have a warchest most clubs do now.

I’m assuming they mean $5mil on top of any money available because of the salary cap increases. Also there will be players around the league who will have a clause in their contract for their remuneration to adjust in line with any CBA increases. I don’t know the percentages but I believe it is a fairly common cause so the number of players with this clause would probably be significant and across all clubs. So whilst the cap may be increasing by 30% it’s not necessarily the case that those funds are unallocated and available to spend on recruitment.

 

[EBERT THE KING]

Genuine question to pies fans.

What would you be willing to part with to get back into the first round?

 

[ahhhhhh]

Last year’s trade period was a disaster no matter which way you look at it. Classic Graham Wright with an aging list moves.

 

[Robroy22]

Last year’s trade period was a disaster no matter which way you look at it. Classic Graham Wright with an aging list moves.

Yep....classic Graham Wright Premierships here, there and everywhere.

 

[Robroy22]

Genuine question to pies fans.

What would you be willing to part with to get back into the first round?

Genuine answer....make your play.

 

[EBERT THE KING]

Genuine answer....make your play.

Could be tempted to part with one of our first rounders for De Goey.

 

[vindaloo]

Could be tempted to part with one of our first rounders for De Goey.

I doubt the club would do that. They need support in the middle for Nick Daicos, and to not drive him into the ground. Surely Collingwood is in a position to take advantage of a Jack Bowes type salary dump.

 

[Go Woods]

Last year’s trade period was a disaster no matter which way you look at it. Classic Graham Wright with an aging list moves.

A 'disaster' what an over exaggeration.
We just won the flag, and topped up with a quality player, stop jumping on the coat tails of the goose, Cornes.

 

[Go Woods]

Could be tempted to part with one of our first rounders for De Goey.

2 firsts minimum, but we're not trading JDG.

 

[BEEG]

Genuine question to pies fans.

What would you be willing to part with to get back into the first round?

We don't really have much that would net us a 1st.

Daicos, Moore, Degoey, Maynard are untouchable.

Only one I can really think of is Quaynor.

Can't see any others netting us a First.

 

[markm106]

I doubt the club would do that. They need support in the middle for Nick Daicos, and to not drive him into the ground. Surely Collingwood is in a position to take advantage of a Jack Bowes type salary dump.

Were the AFL trying to stamp out those salary dumps? Or was it stamp out the way that one was done.

 

[adammania9]

A 'disaster' what an over exaggeration.
We just won the flag, and topped up with a quality player, stop jumping on the coat tails of the goose, Cornes.

Right intentions can have adverse outcomes

The club weren’t out of their minds to ship off Ginnivan who didn’t suit the game style and add Schultz who is a quality player and has been a nice pick-up, forgetting the cost at which he was acquired.

But the Pies gambled on two things with these two trades and they’ve both gone belly up
1. Collingwood remain a top four side and give up pick 15+ for Schultz
2. Collingwood finish significantly higher than Hawthorn, giving themselves decent upgrades in this year’s draft

Both haven’t worked, and have hampered our chances to add a top talent in this year’s draft. The difference in Ginnivan and Schultz has been little, almost negligible.

It’s a horrid trade period.

 

[Rusty Beam]

Right intentions can have adverse outcomes

The club weren’t out of their minds to ship off Ginnivan who didn’t suit the game style and add Schultz who is a quality player and has been a nice pick-up, forgetting the cost at which he was acquired.

But the Pies gambled on two things with these two trades and they’ve both gone belly up
1. Collingwood remain a top four side and give up pick 15+ for Schultz
2. Collingwood finish significantly higher than Hawthorn, giving themselves decent upgrades in this year’s draft

Both haven’t worked, and have hampered our chances to add a top talent in this year’s draft. The difference in Ginnivan and Schultz has been little, almost negligible.

It’s a horrid trade period.

Yep. Ginni simply didn’t have the ability to apply pressure the way our system demanded. That was evident through his performances at AFL level and massive stints in the VFL. (I was one of his biggest detractors on our board)

Just because he’s doing so well at the Hawks doesn’t mean he’d be currently doing as well for us.

Whether or not that system is broken and needs to be re-designed, or simply needs tinkering, is another question all together.

The real stuff up from a Collingwood list management POV was not playing hard ball and simply giving up last years first for Schultz.