Do we have a heart and a soul

[Gadzorks]

I'm a tragic who loves the lesser talents with the massive hearts.

Yes that's robbo and beast mode (I'd have loved him in the middle of the freo field bashing and crashing and giving our gentlemen players the corridor they seem to need).

I think that motty is in that mould and McCarthy and Darcy. They will ruin themselves in the hunt for wins.

Charlie is cut from that cloth but has a downside with his frustration impacting his performance.

Is the missing ingredient the boofhead, over achiever on field type player?

The player who's over achieving is embarrassing the 'talent' to lift?

Which players have filled this role through the lions history?

Are there any in the twos that should be given a chance?

We have a very gentlemanly, talent will show in time attitude. I don't like it.

Bring in some mongrel I say ... If we have it.

 

[notliondown]

Something that hit me earlier today...

Who is our Toby Greene

4

Toby Greene

Age

31

Ht

182cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

22.7

5star

K

12.5

5star

HB

10.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

3.0

5star

G

1.2

4star

D

17.5

4star

K

9.5

4star

HB

8.0

4star

M

4.8

4star

T

1.0

2star

G

2.3

5star

D

26.6

5star

K

12.4

5star

HB

14.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

3.6

5star

G

0.0

1star

??

What I would give to have him in Lions colours. Problem solved.

 

[Lazza16]

I'm a tragic who loves the lesser talents with the massive hearts.

Yes that's robbo and beast mode (I'd have loved him in the middle of the freo field bashing and crashing and giving our gentlemen players the corridor they seem to need).

I think that motty is in that mould and McCarthy and Darcy. They will ruin themselves in the hunt for wins.

Charlie is cut from that cloth but has a downside with his frustration impacting his performance.

Is the missing ingredient the boofhead, over achiever on field type player?

The player who's over achieving is embarrassing the 'talent' to lift?

Which players have filled this role through the lions history?

Are there any in the twos that should be given a chance?

We have a very gentlemanly, talent will show in time attitude. I don't like it.

Bring in some mongrel I say ... If we have it.

I agree Gadzzzz, the injured ZZ has a bit of a scary look to him, maybe Starc but I can't think of anyone else. Zorks could easily be a sniper but being a father now? Perhaps that x Richmond captain can inspire some hurt. Bottom line Gadzzz these days if Ur naughty Ur not gunna last long...Pike , Scott bros a thing of the past unless you play for a big Melb club...I won't mention names but u could win a brownlow or premiership and get away with it.

 

[martinson]

I agree Gadzzzz, the injured ZZ has a bit of a scary look to him, maybe Starc but I can't think of anyone else. Zorks could easily be a sniper but being a father now? Perhaps that x Richmond captain can inspire some hurt. Bottom line Gadzzz these days if Ur naughty Ur not gunna last long...Pike , Scott bros a thing of the past unless you play for a big Melb club...I won't mention names but u could win a brownlow or premiership and get away with it.

Muzza ,Les Parish , Mickey Conlan , David McMahon , Scottie Clayton, Roger, Scott Bros , Pikey.

Love any one of those.

 

[Tom14]

Robbo is just the sort of heart and soul, team player type we need right now.

Sorry photo unrelated, trying to delete it!

 

[Tom14]

You know who else were great heart and soul players?

Michael Voss and Jonathan Brown.

 

[martinson]

You know who else were great heart and soul players?

Michael Voss and Jonathan Brown.

The were champs as well.

Left nothing on the park.

Now that I'm reflecting do we have one ?

 

[Tom14]

The were champs as well.

Left nothing on the park.

Now that I'm reflecting do we have one ?

No. None of our players are as good as any of our great players from the early aughts.

Game has different requirements due to fitness etc, but the pure combination of great skill and character isn’t there. I just wish we had more skill.

 

[M Malice]

Not in the Voss, Brown mould but Hugh McCluggage

6

Hugh Mccluggage

Age

26

Ht

185cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.3

5star

K

11.4

4star

HB

7.9

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.0

5star

CL

2.2

4star

D

19.0

4star

K

12.0

5star

HB

7.0

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

2.0

4star

D

13.2

4star

K

7.8

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

4.2

4star

T

1.8

4star

CL

0.6

3star

gives his absolute all every game, gut runs all game, the other who always goes bloody hard at it is Linc McCarthy.

 

[rye]

lots of posters here criticised zorko for the mongrel and niggling aspects to his game

 

[Nuggo]

We have plenty of heart and soul, just that this years hasn't started as well as we would like. Perhaps it will be down year, so be it but I am tipping a fight back.

 

[Dalions]

Would like to see some Heart and Soul from the team next week that’s for sure.

 

[Tom14]

lots of posters here criticised zorko for the mongrel and niggling aspects to his game

Yes, correctly.

 

[Lazza16]

Muzza ,Les Parish , Mickey Conlan , David McMahon , Scottie Clayton, Roger, Scott Bros , Pikey.

Love any one of those.

You forgot Ross Lyon

 

[Grasshopper17]

I try not to get overly personal with my thoughts wherever possible. Watching on Sunday tho I did form the impression that we were being overly "nice".

I know that societal norms change over time etc, and maybe I'm a bit old fashioned these days, but I thought the amount of our blokes checking in on the Freo chap when he got concussed and stretchered off was a bit on the nose.

If we have a good lead, maybe, but given the position we were in at the time I would certainly have been discouraging any focus on the well-being of an opponent.

I was just longing for a bit of mongrel. A bloke who is tough and hard and says "come with me boys" but without the accompanying ill-discipline that plagued Robbo from time to time. Dunkley perhaps but I thought he was disappointing on Sunday. Darcy Fort

32

Darcy Fort

Age

31

Ht

204cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.6

2star

K

5.8

2star

HB

2.9

3star

M

1.9

2star

T

1.8

4star

G

0.8

4star

D

9.2

2star

K

6.0

2star

HB

3.2

2star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.8

3star

G

0.2

3star

D

7.6

2star

K

5.4

2star

HB

2.2

2star

M

2.0

3star

T

1.2

3star

G

1.2

4star

maybe. I was impressed with his ground level follow up in the practice matches he played.

Perhaps it's a side-effect of the focus on recruiting skillful players during the Fagan years. Skill and mongrel don't necessarily need to be mutually exclusive, but it's uncanny how often they seem to be.

 

[M Malice]

Perhaps it's a side-effect of the focus on recruiting skillful players during the Fagan years. Skill and mongrel don't necessarily need to be mutually exclusive, but it's uncanny how often they seem to be.

The Swans and Giants seem to be recruiting players with the elite disposal and endurance combination. I know a small sample size but they have both been so bloody impressive in their first 2 games, both improved from last season, and that is a scary thought re the Giants after a 1 point loss in a Prelim. Both also have that bit of mongrel/toughness/ruthlessness about them.

Unfortunately on the same sample size apart from 30-40 minutes against the Blues we have regressed badly, we are lucky that we have another 21 games to turn it around, get to it boys.

 

[SizeMatters]

We have pea hearted players. Show ponies.

Our leaders are too passive. Our players are too passive. We just don't have the crazed look in their eyes types. Pies have one of every line...

Maybe we need to unearth or recruit a bastard or two.

 

[werdna78]

One of the only players I can remember doing this recently is Jaxon Prior. Him and Dev went after an opposition player after he sniped someone.

On reverse of that I remember Alex Witherden

23

Alex Witherden

Age

26

Ht

188cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.7

5star

K

15.2

5star

HB

5.5

4star

M

6.2

5star

T

1.8

4star

MG

386.5

5star

D

13.0

3star

K

10.0

4star

HB

3.0

2star

M

7.0

5star

T

0.0

1star

MG

201.0

3star

D

24.0

5star

K

15.4

5star

HB

8.6

5star

M

5.8

5star

T

2.2

4star

MG

380.2

5star

getting his head pushed into the ground by tom Lynch and not reacting. I knew then, he was not a player we would desperately try and hold onto and he was traded to West Coast at the end of season.

 

[Nathan Barley]

I do wonder if we have recruited great off field leaders but not on field leaders

Everything people have whinged about in this thread a lot of our players have shown including the more maligned ones like JBerry (even on the weekend)

I don’t think we can take the past 2 weeks as a good example of anything that our players are capable of however.

I also don’t think apart from that flog Maynard Collingwood have many of these types but they’ve still shown a lot of heart. So a lot of what people are looking for in this thread really doesn’t matter

 

[Sproj]

Here was me thinking this thread would be a deep existential discussion about life

 

[On the quiet]

We have plenty of heart and soul, just that this years hasn't started as well as we would like. Perhaps it will be down year, so be it but I am tipping a fight back.

I agree, and whilst I believe Collingwood were the better team in the GF, we showed plenty of fight to get within a kick of winning, in what is regarded as one of the best GF's in recent times.

Gone are the days of one v one punch ups
I also believe players are now more cautious (rightly so) with running back with the flight of the ball, and arguably putting their head over the ball, and of course modifying their tackling techniques. There is a long life after footy.

That said, there is no excuse for not demonstrating committed two way running, and the hunger to compete in the air.

 

[Gadzorks]

Here was me thinking this thread would be a deep existential discussion about life

I'll give existential a try. I coached teenage/early twenties runners for 20+ years.

The behavioral problems with their anger and bluster and energy and low skill base and lack of discipline were my favorites.

When they got a PB group energy was MASSIVE. And the better runners feed on that energy and improved/PB'd.

We need the lesser lights energy to make the better best, and that's wider than running and footy. It's a human thing.

We need to recruit raw, energetic outside the rails players and tap their energy while hoping like hell we can manage them.

 

[M Malice]

We need to recruit raw, energetic outside the rails players and tap their energy while hoping like hell we can manage them.

The player that sprang immediately to mind re that description is Darcy Wilmot.

 

[KissKiss]

Heart and soul players dont need to be the niggling dirty fighters these days but you definitely want the guys who just wont quit.

Who is chasing and desperately making the second or third defensive effort? Who is making the desperate smother on the goal line? Or the last moment spoil?

 

[SizeMatters]

Heart and soul players dont need to be the niggling dirty fighters these days but you definitely want the guys who just wont quit.

Who is chasing and desperately making the second or third defensive effort? Who is making the desperate smother on the goal line? Or the last moment spoil?

Exactly.