Is Nic Naitanui ridiculously overrated?

[Clay Davis]

Did you even answer the question at all?

Yep.

Point is that a 200cm bloke that looks good at under 18 level will generally do so because his body is more mature than all the other 200cm blokes. That doesn't mean he will end up better than those guys once he is 25.

Who would you rather have - Cox or Fraser? Same age, one is a number one draft pick, the other came from the rookie list.

 

[kfleong2000]

That's a bit unfair on Fraser - he's been cruelled by injuries the past couple of seasons and has shown a lot anyway in his career so far.

Of course if you think it's more worth it to pick up a player through the rookie draft, then that is preferable, but Nic Nat has displayed not only a heap of athletic ability in juniors, but also displayed things like winning his own clearances, winning the contested balls, and winning the ball at ground level, things you expect from smaller midfielders.

Point is, it all depends on how you rate a player and whether he is enough of a sure thing to expend a high draft pick, or much more of a gamble that he is a speculative rookie pick (like Cox and Sandi). Obviously, West Coast recruiters (and loads of others at other clubs) rated NN as someone you had to take with your first pick. Drafting nowadays anyway is more of an exact science, at least relative to a decade ago.

 

[lewigie]

Naita looked good at WAFL level.

So your point is blown out of the water.

 

[DrummoSolo]

For all those screaming that he shouldn't win the Rising Star, can you give me a player who should? If it's game-by-game impact, Scully and Trengove are about on level standing with him (decent in most games, great in one or two), and I don't know if anyone else has shown anything more than those three. Maybe Hannebery?

EDIT - And Banfield!

 

[melbournemartin]

Is his current ability overrated? Yes, massively. Yes he has talent but commentators go nuts when he does reasonably simple things like break a tackle or kick a long ball. Watch David Rodan if you want to see broken tackles.

Is his potential ability overrated? Saying that he'll revolutionalize ruckwork is probably going too far but it would not be naive to say he's a star of the future. He will probably end up in the top handful of players from that draft, possibly even the best.

Would the hype be the same if he were a freckled red head with a crew cut? No

 

[Deefolt]

everyone having a go a fraser is harsh, so far the players (that have had enough time from memory that have been picked early, kreuzer, jeff white, fraser, and nik nat,

Fraser is a serviceable player,
Jeff White was the best ruck till they changed the centre bounce clearance, then he couldnt jump, was still alright though
Kreuzer, playing very well
Niknat, very young but showing random glimpses of what he can be

The fact that ruckmen seem to be showing higher results for top 10 picks is a damn good percentage, thus i think you wouldnt be doing the wrong thing choosing ruckmen, in fact jamar and cox werent early picks and both are again VERY serviceable players.

Ruckmen are too hard to tell IMO

 

[tcwaters]

He'll get stronger, fitter, faster and smarter.

And most of you know this.. Put him down while you still can

 

[Toriola]

He'll get stronger, fitter, faster and smarter.

You could say the same thing about any player starting out their career.

 

[DivideandMultiply]

Troll OP with mostly troll comments.

NN's drop in form has corresponded with his drop in TOG and in the ruck.

His best games are those where he has been the main ruckman.

The challenge now is for him and the coaching staff to find an additional role where he can impact and develop.

 

[r dub 19]

Would the hype be the same if he were a freckled red head with a crew cut? No

Stupid comment.

Is there a freckled red head that can do what Naitanui can? No.

 

[melbournemartin]

Stupid comment.

Is there a freckled red head that can do what Naitanui can? No.

I thought that my comment implied that this hypothetical red head had the exact same athletic and football abilities and characteristics as Naitanui, just without the dark skin, good looks and dreadlocks.

I guess I needed to really spell that out.

 

[r dub 19]

I thought that my comment implied that this hypothetical red head had the exact same athletic and football abilities and characteristics as Naitanui, just without the dark skin, good looks and dreadlocks.

I guess I needed to really spell that out.

Until you can provide an example of a white player that can do the same thing NN can do your hypothetical arguments are irrelevant.

Sick of people having a sad over people being hyped because they are black. We have bigger d**** than you get over it.

 

[Roby]

The same things were said about Franklin when he started playing. Also there were a lot of critics saying he was media hype. I would head caution making such pessimistic future predictions.

 

[r dub 19]

The same things were said about Franklin when he started playing. Also there were a lot of critics saying he was media hype. I would head caution making such pessimistic future predictions.

Ye I remember the same BS,

"If franklin was white, he wouldn't get so much coverage".

 

[placebo]

Troll OP with mostly troll comments.

NN's drop in form has corresponded with his drop in TOG and in the ruck.

His best games are those where he has been the main ruckman.

The challenge now is for him and the coaching staff to find an additional role where he can impact and develop.

This sums it up perfectly. Nothing at all more should need to be said.

 

[Stig O'Hara]

Yes, yes and yes.

Biggest hype since Sigue Sigue Sputnik

 

[melbournemartin]

Until you can provide an example of a white player that can do the same thing NN can do your hypothetical arguments are irrelevant.

Sick of people having a sad over people being hyped because they are black. We have bigger d**** than you get over it.

Are you taking the piss or was this a serious post?

 

[Rack Watts]

You cannot teach most of his attributes, what you can teach is positioning, and how to get more of the ball, his flaws are all the same as Paddy Ryders. Will be similar players at the end of their careers.

 

[Scotland]

He's definitely overrated, though the commentator reactions to his 'leaps' and 'efforts' are no more over the top than those to Jack Watts' 'hands'.

Commentators regularly fall into the same trap with great players - they do something remarkable a few times and from then on every time they go near the ball the commentators gush with excitement. Judd's inside work, Archer's courage, Rioli's evasiveness. Etc. These players (Archer excepted of course as he's retired) regularly do simple run of the mill things that every other player does and the commentators cream themselves. It's really just another case of the footy media being pretty stupid.

NickNat is an exciting talent, but played today like you'd expect a 20 year old ruckman to fairly often - had little impact on the game as was amongst our bottom few players. He'll bounce back.

 

[tcwaters]

You could say the same thing about any player starting out their career.

Thanks Ben.

 

[gytre]

Yes, he is ridiculously overrated - at this stage. Naitanui seems to be very much a "burst" player. Does the odd great thing then goes missing for long periods. For all the talk about his athleticism, I'll suggest he actually doesn't have great stamina. And as suggested, he doesn't appear to have great football smarts.

But you definitely see glimpses of brilliance. Some of his ruckwork is outstanding. Ditto for his clearance work. No question that his physical appearance makes him stand out and gets a lot of people overly excited, including commentators.

He has the talent and physique to be a superstar IMO. It's a matter of how well he can learn the game. The ball's in his court.

 

[Haydos]

Don't think he is overrated. He is the best 20 year old ruckmen I have seen.

 

[Underdog]

Yes, he is ridiculously overrated - at this stage. Naitanui seems to be very much a "burst" player. Does the odd great thing then goes missing for long periods.

That's because he is a backup ruckman and getting very little game time. If you extended his stats yesterday toa full games worth he probably would have ended up with out 15 disposals and 30 hitouts. Pretty handy for such a young ruckman.

For all the talk about his athleticism, I'll suggest he actually doesn't have great stamina.

You are right, he has not built up his stamina yet. He had a knee injury last pre-season so this was his first pre-season. Certainly something to work on in future season. It will allow him to get to and influence more contests.

He has the talent and physique to be a superstar IMO. It's a matter of how well he can learn the game. The ball's in his court.

I'm not sure that even matters. If he can increase his stamina and experience as well as maintain his current ball winning abilities, his inability to win cheap possessions around the ground is not going to be a major problem. A perfect example of quality over quantity.

 

[blueborl]

Don't think he is overrated. He is the best 20 year old ruckmen I have seen.

Mathew Kreuzer is a far better footballer than NN.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

LOL at people who think they aren't racist, yet make comments like "black guys are really good athletes " as if everyone with dark skin fits some sort of stereotype mould, and it makes no difference if they are Fijian, one of the many african races, or indigenous Australian.