Mid East Israel declare war after Hamas attack III

[Markfs]

The question of racism and antisemitism reminds me of Whoopi Goldberg who steadfastly says that she is jewish. Her father was named Johnson and was a baptist minister. Her mother was a black nurse. She's never been in a temple but she says that she remembers the holidays. Evidently in the distant past there were Goldbergs.

The quote from Wiki that I love is "One account suggests that her mother, Emma Johnson, thought the family's original surname was "not Jewish enough" for her daughter to become a star." So evidently she changed it from Johnson to Goldberg.

Whoopi got into a little bit of trouble a while back when she said that she didnt equate anti-semitism with racism. She saw NY Jews as european. Read what happened to her. Evidently, certain people in power didnt like the idea of jews not being a separate race. She got banned for a while there.

 

[Markfs]

Netanyahu has also said the Syrian Golan Heights will be part of Israel "for eternity". So there's no slow-down in his war criminality....

I think you'll find that Trump will settle things down by giving east ukraine to the russians, and the west bank and the golan heights and southern lebanon to Israel's promised land

 

[faible]

There’s an uncomfortable amount of using Jews to refer to Israel these last few days.

Perhaps don’t become what you’re opposing.

 

[Markfs]

There’s an uncomfortable amount of using Jews to refer to Israel these last few days.

Perhaps don’t become what you’re opposing.

Wasn't the connection made between the local synagogue and change in Australia's vote in the UN? A bob each way...

 

[faible]

Wasn't the connection made between the local synagogue and change in Australia's vote in the UN? A bob each way...

I think we can do and be better than Netanyahu when we speak of such things.

‘Jews’ are not a homogenous entity where each member is responsible for the actions of a nation state any more than all Arabs should be the direct of hatred for the actions of extremist groups.

Netanyahu and co try to conflate the two in order to use antisemitism as a shield from legitimate criticism of a nation state. We’re smart enough to see through that and separate the two.

 

[sr36]

Yeah, I was just building on your point. Surely the bar should be that it's planned to have a political outcome, but also is a violent enough attack to genuinely strike fear. And I don't mean the fear of the picture of a watermelon.

Below is the descriptor of a terrorist act in Australia:

It was clearly "serious damage to property". It crosses that bar, but politicians shouldn't be pressuring each other or the police to call something a terrorist act the way that has happened here. It actually requires a pretty significant investigation to have cause to have it investigated as terrorism, as the first two dot points below are all about motive - and a hate crime isn't a terrorist act, without the dot-pointed intentions. It being investigated as terrorism is more than just a word. It is significant as it falls under a different jurisdiction with far greater investigative powers and powers of detention than a hate crime being investigated by the state police.

https://www.ag.gov.au/national-security/australias-counter-terrorism-laws

A terrorist act is an act, or a threat to act, that meets the following criteria:

• it is done with the intention of advancing a political, religious or ideological cause,
• it is done with the intention to intimidate the public, or coerce, or influence by intimidation, any government, and
• it causes one or more of the following
  
  • death, serious harm or endangers the life of a person
  • serious damage to property
  • a serious risk to the health or safety of the public
  • serious interference with, disruption to, or destruction of critical infrastructure such as a telecommunications or electricity network.

Advocating, protesting, dissenting or taking industrial action are not terrorist acts where the person doing the activity does not intend to cause serious harm to a person or create a serious risk to public safety.

 

[Markfs]

I think we can do and be better than Netanyahu when we speak of such things.

‘Jews’ are not a homogenous entity where each member is responsible for the actions of a nation state any more than all Arabs should be the direct of hatred for the actions of extremist groups.

Netanyahu and co try to conflate the two in order to use antisemitism as a shield from legitimate criticism of a nation state. We’re smart enough to see through that and separate the two.

I dont see the world in such an idealistic light...

We're going to get legislated against in the next few years because of whatsapp groups of individuals and associated organisations putting pressure and bribing politicians. One of the first things to be affected will be the right to protest. I've said previously that it's crude and ineffective but a lot of people like the democratic feel of them. I support that view.

And actually, I'm better than Netty. I don't murder people.

 

[Saint]

Below is the descriptor of a terrorist act in Australia:

It was clearly "serious damage to property". It crosses that bar, but politicians shouldn't be pressuring each other or the police to call something a terrorist act the way that has happened here. It actually requires a pretty significant investigation to have cause to have it investigated as terrorism, as the first two dot points below are all about motive - and a hate crime isn't a terrorist act, without the dot-pointed intentions. It being investigated as terrorism is more than just a word. It is significant as it falls under a different jurisdiction with far greater investigative powers and powers of detention than a hate crime being investigated by the state police.

https://www.ag.gov.au/national-security/australias-counter-terrorism-laws

A terrorist act is an act, or a threat to act, that meets the following criteria:

• it is done with the intention of advancing a political, religious or ideological cause,
• it is done with the intention to intimidate the public, or coerce, or influence by intimidation, any government, and
• it causes one or more of the following
  
  • death, serious harm or endangers the life of a person
  • serious damage to property
  • a serious risk to the health or safety of the public
  • serious interference with, disruption to, or destruction of critical infrastructure such as a telecommunications or electricity network.

Advocating, protesting, dissenting or taking industrial action are not terrorist acts where the person doing the activity does not intend to cause serious harm to a person or create a serious risk to public safety.

I don't think it meets the second dot point. I think it was aimed at a specific group, not "the Public" otherwise that dot point is so broad it might as well not exist.

How was this terrorism if the bomb on the bonnet of the Pro-Palestine protester in Sydney wasn't??

I think we have to probably add the sub-text of the additional dot point, that being that the intended victim/group is white-skinned.

 

[faible]

I dont see the world in such an idealistic light...

We're going to get legislated against in the next few years because of whatsapp groups of individuals and associated organisations putting pressure and bribing politicians. One of the first things to be affected will be the right to protest. I've said previously that it's crude and ineffective but a lot of people like the democratic feel of them. I support that view.

And actually, I'm better than Netty. I don't murder people.

Not at all idealistic.

Israel is not all Jews. All Jews are not responsible for the actions of Israel the nation state.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Israeli military has moved within 30km of Damascus. THey've struck over 250 targets including military barracks. They're just straight-up murdering the Syrian defence forces as a pre-emptive strike on a Government that doesn't even exist yet.

They're putting themselves in a position so that the Syrians will have to fight back, and then Israel will play the Victim Card again.

Netanyahu has also said the Syrian Golan Heights will be part of Israel "for eternity". So there's no slow-down in his war criminality....

Surely they want to go all the way to the Euphrates , cos god said....

 

[Markfs]

Not at all idealistic.

Israel is not all Jews. All Jews are not responsible for the actions of Israel the nation state.

Yes, the majority of palestinian population within israel dont want to kill everyone in gaza. I recognise that. A minority of the jewish population do. That evaluation is supported by surveys.

And as I've noted previously, Israel's basic law states that Israel is a state for jews.

 

[peetoo]

“america is something you can easily manoeuvre”

Thankfully we don’t generalise that all Jews are slippery like this fake

Gobsmacking that he criticise the Australian PM in any way

 

[sr36]

I don't think it meets the second dot point. I think it was aimed at a specific group, not "the Public" otherwise that dot point is so broad it might as well not exist.

How was this terrorism if the bomb on the bonnet of the Pro-Palestine protester in Sydney wasn't??

I think we have to probably add the sub-text of the additional dot point, that being that the intended victim/group is white-skinned.

Specific groups are part of the public.

The first dot point is aunknown without investigation, as is whether the intention was to intimidate that group of the public. Basically, you can't know whether something should be categorised as terrorism or not without investigating it and establishing some evidence of the intention of the action. Politicians should shut up rather than pressuring each other and the state police - who's job it is to investigate and then pass it on to a federal terrorist unit if they have reasonable grounds to do so.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Israeli military has moved within 30km of Damascus. THey've struck over 250 targets including military barracks. They're just straight-up murdering the Syrian defence forces as a pre-emptive strike on a Government that doesn't even exist yet.

They're putting themselves in a position so that the Syrians will have to fight back, and then Israel will play the Victim Card again.

Netanyahu has also said the Syrian Golan Heights will be part of Israel "for eternity". So there's no slow-down in his war criminality....

Syrians are literally in the streets with numerous foreign armies celebrating the fall of the dictatorship, but your anti-jew (sorry, "zionist") mindset makes you twist it.

 

[FreoRicci]

The hypocrisy of the Jewish community is baffling. Albanese had to get to Melbourne ASAP after the attack? Since when? The police, state government are dealing with it.
If that’s the case, he would be going to a random city everyday to calm things down.

Shame on Benjamin to add fire to this as well. Trying to uprise the Jewish community in a free country of multi religion and cultures.

 

[Saint]

Syrians are literally in the streets with numerous foreign armies celebrating the fall of the dictatorship, but your anti-jew (sorry, "zionist") mindset makes you twist it.

What am I twisting? Israel have taken the chance to invade Syria after Syria have kicked out the Iranians and Russians.

Israel are saying parts of Syria are now parts of Israel. No other foreign army has done that.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I think we can do and be better than Netanyahu when we speak of such things.

‘Jews’ are not a homogenous entity where each member is responsible for the actions of a nation state any more than all Arabs should be the direct of hatred for the actions of extremist groups.

Netanyahu and co try to conflate the two in order to use antisemitism as a shield from legitimate criticism of a nation state. We’re smart enough to see through that and separate the two.

Or in concise terms "Don't be like them, be better than them."

Someone i know quite well regards himself as Jewish, but is fairly casual about the religious side of things. His parents are more adherent. He was born in Chile, where his parents had gone to escape the happenings in Europe. When Chile started getting ugly ( here we go again ) they escaped from there and went to Israel.
They simply didn't like Israel. Horrible vibe, didn't want to stay there. They came to Australia and liked it , because it was like Australia, and not like Israel.
Knowing this guy and his background , there is no way i can conflate him and his family with Israel. ( Years ago he said to me that what the Israelis were doing with their "settling "was outrageous ). There are probably people in Australia who support the actions of the current Israeli regime, but unless they do so publicly i have no way of knowing who they are.
Certainly i can't assume that any particular religious or ethnic group does.

 

[Markfs]

Thankfully we don’t generalise that all Jews are slippery like this fake

Gobsmacking that he criticise the Australian PM in any way

Excellent post. I find it comforting to see that Netty and myself are in agreement. I cant be ant-semitic.

 

[Markfs]

Or in concise terms "Don't be like them, be better than them."

Someone i know quite well regards himself as Jewish, but is fairly casual about the religious side of things. His parents are more adherent. He was born in Chile, where his parents had gone to escape the happenings in Europe. When Chile started getting ugly ( here we go again ) they escaped from there and went to Israel.
They simply didn't like Israel. Horrible vibe, didn't want to stay there. They came to Australia and liked it , because it was like Australia, and not like Israel.
Knowing this guy and his background , there is no way i can conflate him and his family with Israel. ( Years ago he said to me that what the Israelis were doing with their "settling "was outrageous ). There are probably people in Australia who support the actions of the current Israeli regime, but unless they do so publicly i have no way of knowing who they are.
Certainly i can't assume that any particular religious or ethnic group does.

It's a nice story. You should ask him whether he'll go and visit jerusalem when they rebuild the temple on the mount. I'd be interested to know his answer.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

It's a nice story. You should ask him whether he'll go and visit jerusalem when they rebuild the temple on the mount. I'd be interested to know his answer.

He's been in Australia since he was very young. Never been back to Israel, so the answer to your bullshit question is probably NO.
Why would you think he would? Are you using your vast religious stereotype skills?

 

[Markfs]

He's been in Australia since he was very young. Never been back to Israel, so the answer to your bullshit question is probably NO.
Why would you think he would? Are you using your vast religious stereotype skills?

I didnt say that he would. It was just a question that I'd like to ask him. You seem to have indicated that he shrugged his shoulders at the behaviour of the settlers. I was thinking of something that was more focused.

I was nominally a catholic. My mother died a pretty strong one. I used to ask her questions about the priests etc. I like to know how people think about things. I wouldnt stereotype all catholics as child molesters but if they attended mass presided over by a known molester, I'd ask questions.

 

[sr36]

I didnt say that he would. It was just a question that I'd like to ask him. You seem to have indicated that he shrugged his shoulders at the behaviour of the settlers. I was thinking of something that was more focused.

I was nominally a catholic. My mother died a pretty strong one. I used to ask her questions about the priests etc. I like to know how people think about things. I wouldnt stereotype all catholics as child molesters but if they attended mass presided over by a known molester, I'd ask questions.

Very believable. No dog whistling at all.

"Years ago he said to me that what the Israelis were doing with their "settling "was outrageous."

Is almost identical to:

You seem to have indicated that he shrugged his shoulders at the behaviour of the settlers.

 

[sr36]

Syrians are literally in the streets with numerous foreign armies celebrating the fall of the dictatorship, but your anti-jew (sorry, "zionist") mindset makes you twist it.

Israel has seized control of a buffer zone around the Golan Heights. They say it's temporary, but could very well be expansionary.

 

[Markfs]

Israel has seized control of a buffer zone around the Golan Heights. They say it's temporary, but could very well be expansionary.

Are you saying the israelis are lying?

 

[Saint]

Are you saying the israelis are lying?

They're not even bothering to lie any more.

Bibi is saying this certain part of Syria is part of Israel for "Eternity"

Benjamin Netanyahu says Golan Heights will remain part of Israel ‘for eternity’

PM’s words follow Israeli takeover of previously demilitarised zone in Syrian-controlled territory

www.theguardian.com

Mark Dreyfus stepped in and ended the prosecution of Mark Regev for incitement to genocide. Refusing to charge on fairly clear-cut case. The GOvt will do anything to protect Israel and abandon International law.