Jonathan O'Rourke

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Was at the game yesterday and watched him closely because he was on my side of the ground, I would love for him to make it but it's just not going to happen .

To be fair I thought he was never a pick 2 let alone pick 10 in his draft year , he just doesn't have any better then avg traits poor decision making doesnt have clean hands and has lost all pace. It shows in the way he plays that he has lost all confidence in his body aswell.
 
Is there any point still referring to him as a pick 2 six years on? Especially considering it wasn't out Pick 2?
 
He can stand strong in a tackle and weave through players in congestion. His fumbling let him down. He needs to keep playing. The beauty is he's not going to cost much to keep and he can really kick on next year with more confidence and chemistry with the team.
 

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daniel23 said:
he just doesn't have any better then avg traits poor decision making doesnt have clean hands and has lost all pace. It shows in the way he plays that he has lost all confidence in his body aswell.
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How can we be sure that the first set of issues don't all stem from the last point you make?

Here are the kind of things people were saying about him pre-draft:
"Although he can win his own ball, and does it when games are up for grabs, O'Rourke is most damaging with the ball in his hands and with some space. He sets up play, measures kicks to teammates, and moves forward to kick goals. He was the the main man in Vic Metro's win over South Australia during the championships, and was named as an All-Australian after the carnival." (predicted pick #2)

"He is fast, explosive and damaging, however he is also capable as an inside midfielder, although in his first couple of seasons I can’t see him being played there with his medium-frame. His explosiveness from packs is similar to Patrick Dangerfield’s, which is an extreme call, and he generally finds targets up field with his kicking skills. Is a good finisher when he has the ball within the vicinity of goal." (predicted pick #6)

"Polished midfielder will give the Giants engine room a coat of gloss. Accelerates away from stoppages and hits targets." (predicted pick #2)

"Another product of the Calder Cannons footy factory, Jonathan O’Rourke’s professionalism and leadership are key attributes that the Western Bulldogs will be looking at strongly in this year’s National Draft. The Dogs are crying out for ball-winning, goal-kicking, classy midfielders and O’Rourke fits the bill with a high-possession game style, also possessing the ability to double up as a blue-collar midfielder but with poise, class and an uncanny nous to always hit up a target and rack up damaging disposals, always using the ball well as an outside midfielder. Operating at 77% disposal efficiency, O’Rourke also capped off an impressive year with All-Australian honours and was a graduate of the AFL-AIS Academy." (predicted pick #5)

"O'Rourke is another classy onballer who makes life much, much easier for his forwards, zooming towards the 50-metre line and placing the ball up in front of them. It took him a while to hit form this year but he's one of those players who can arch his back, duck back to get around a player rushing at him, dash off and kick while fully balance." (predicted pick #5 - actually #4 as Daniher listed as pick #1 in that list and he went f/s).

I don't disagree with your assessment of what we are seeing now, but either all those pundits were blind or something has gone badly wrong for O'Rourke since being drafted, and I find it very easy to believe that the something wrong is an inability to develop and a massive blow to his confidence, both due to being constantly injured. Deciding he's not going to make it , just as he seems poised to finally get some continuity seems premature to me. I also wonder if his lighter than average frame for an inside capable mid when drafted was mismanaged by GWS, setting him up for the injury problems that have taken him so long to overcome. It was probably harder for GWS to play soft-softly with young players with immature bodies given so much of their list was comprised of those types. Having said that, he did his first hammy in his first pre-season at GWS and also had a shoulder issue, meaning he didn't debut until round 16, so its not like he was overplayed that year, but I'd still wonder about his training loads.
 
eldorado said:
Hardy ha ha...
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HARDISTY Jared.png
 
tige19 said:
If people can't see the progression in the kid in just the last 3 weeks you have rocks in your head, slowly and slowly they are increasing his game time. Yesterday he actually had the confidence to physically take hits and give them back, his cleanliness improved substantially and his overall running capacity improved hence why he was getting some easy footy on the spread.

In reality we have a 2nd year footballer, this is legitimately the 1st time in his whole career his has put together a dozen games in a row at senior level (VFL and AFL). The more I watch him, the more I feel with confidence he will become a very decent B-Grade and supporting mid to our top liners.
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I agree Tige, and if you look back to Jaeger's early games with us, they weren't brilliant, but look where he is at now!

I think we need to give JOR time to build up his confidence also, so I hope he keeps improving and gets to play some footy in September, because, if he does, then our bottom six would have gone up a notch, and that's a positive.
 
hk89 said:
How can we be sure that the first set of issues don't all stem from the last point you make?

Here are the kind of things people were saying about him pre-draft:
"Although he can win his own ball, and does it when games are up for grabs, O'Rourke is most damaging with the ball in his hands and with some space. He sets up play, measures kicks to teammates, and moves forward to kick goals. He was the the main man in Vic Metro's win over South Australia during the championships, and was named as an All-Australian after the carnival." (predicted pick #2)

"He is fast, explosive and damaging, however he is also capable as an inside midfielder, although in his first couple of seasons I can’t see him being played there with his medium-frame. His explosiveness from packs is similar to Patrick Dangerfield’s, which is an extreme call, and he generally finds targets up field with his kicking skills. Is a good finisher when he has the ball within the vicinity of goal." (predicted pick #6)

"Polished midfielder will give the Giants engine room a coat of gloss. Accelerates away from stoppages and hits targets." (predicted pick #2)

"Another product of the Calder Cannons footy factory, Jonathan O’Rourke’s professionalism and leadership are key attributes that the Western Bulldogs will be looking at strongly in this year’s National Draft. The Dogs are crying out for ball-winning, goal-kicking, classy midfielders and O’Rourke fits the bill with a high-possession game style, also possessing the ability to double up as a blue-collar midfielder but with poise, class and an uncanny nous to always hit up a target and rack up damaging disposals, always using the ball well as an outside midfielder. Operating at 77% disposal efficiency, O’Rourke also capped off an impressive year with All-Australian honours and was a graduate of the AFL-AIS Academy." (predicted pick #5)

"O'Rourke is another classy onballer who makes life much, much easier for his forwards, zooming towards the 50-metre line and placing the ball up in front of them. It took him a while to hit form this year but he's one of those players who can arch his back, duck back to get around a player rushing at him, dash off and kick while fully balance." (predicted pick #5 - actually #4 as Daniher listed as pick #1 in that list and he went f/s).

I don't disagree with your assessment of what we are seeing now, but either all those pundits were blind or something has gone badly wrong for O'Rourke since being drafted, and I find it very easy to believe that the something wrong is an inability to develop and a massive blow to his confidence, both due to being constantly injured. Deciding he's not going to make it , just as he seems poised to finally get some continuity seems premature to me. I also wonder if his lighter than average frame for an inside capable mid when drafted was mismanaged by GWS, setting him up for the injury problems that have taken him so long to overcome. It was probably harder for GWS to play soft-softly with young players with immature bodies given so much of their list was comprised of those types. Having said that, he did his first hammy in his first pre-season at GWS and also had a shoulder issue, meaning he didn't debut until round 16, so its not like he was overplayed that year, but I'd still wonder about his training loads.
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You have to laugh at posters wanting to cross him out after 3 games of senior footy, this is legitimately the very first time out of juniors he has strung together a dozen games in a row, there is absolutely no way he is running above 60-70%. How much evidence do people need to see before understanding that players, especially mids need 6-10 games in a row at the elite level to really produce. I know for a fact 110% that Jono had it in his mind that he was going to ping his hammy every game time he stepped out on the ground, it has been the last 3-4 games he has played where that mindset has shifted a little.

Great example of patience is Paul Ahern, both he and Jono and identical players, both guys who are mid sized on-ballers, both have adequate speed, both have no outstanding skill set yet Ahern with some consistent looks at it as a AFL footballer has started to hit his straps. Ahern is NOT more talented than Jono, he is simply a high class junior who has never had a legitimate run at things at AFL level, and now that he is we are starting to see kid who is starting to feel like he belongs.

Ahern is now 8 GAMES, yes 8 bloody games into his season, Jono is 3 games in and has improved substantially in every key indicator and stat. We aren't talking about TOB who has an injury free and sustained chance to be senior footballer, we are talking about a guy who has never had 6 games in a row.
 

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Would like to see him get a run of games together in the seniors. I'm not confident he can make it but he has been improving week to week.

Either way he will never be a star. Bad drafting considering the talent at the giants and we managed to pick out one without any standout qualities. Ahern looked very impressive on the weekend as a comparison.
 
Move P said:
.

Bad drafting considering the talent at the giants and we managed to pick out one without any standout qualities. Ahern looked very impressive on the weekend as a comparison.
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People talk about this as if GWS is just a big supermarket, and we accidentally bought the wrong brand of mayo because we forgot to take our glasses.

It has to someone they are willing to trade, someone who wants a move, and at a price amenable to both. We paid pick 19 for an ex pick 2, who had been injured a bit. It was obviously someone the Hawks had followed.

It hasn't gone that well so far, but it's not as if we could have just chosen Kelly for the same price if we'd been smarter...
 
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I don’t get it....

I feel like he is gone but I want to see what he has with a consistent run at senior level.

I’d love to know if there are moderate KPIs that he must reach before the end of the season.

Build him up to get him to play senior level. Test his Hamstring.
Send him back to BH & hit it hard 90-95% without getting injured for 2-3 weeks & play out the season in the seniors.

We are lacking another inside/outside mid & he fits the mould. His possessions improved & so did his game time.

I hope this is a management omission
 
PhatHQ said:
I don’t get it....

I feel like he is gone but I want to see what he has with a consistent run at senior level.

I’d love to know if there are moderate KPIs that he must reach before the end of the season.

Build him up to get him to play senior level. Test his Hamstring.
Send him back to BH & hit it hard 90-95% without getting injured for 2-3 weeks & play out the season in the seniors.

We are lacking another inside/outside mid & he fits the mould. His possessions improved & so did his game time.

I hope this is a management omission
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Hard to read from outside the club. One interpretation is that they think he's already done enough for a new contract and that these few games were a reward for getting his body right. If that isn't the case and they are going to axe him after so few consecutive games, then I question why he was given the games to start with. There is no way he could prove much in such a small number of games at the top level. Will be interesting to see what happens with him at the end of the season. I'm hoping he gets extended, but I realise many think he's had more than enough chances to get right.
 
tige19 said:
You have to laugh at posters wanting to cross him out after 3 games of senior footy, this is legitimately the very first time out of juniors he has strung together a dozen games in a row, there is absolutely no way he is running above 60-70%. How much evidence do people need to see before understanding that players, especially mids need 6-10 games in a row at the elite level to really produce. I know for a fact 110% that Jono had it in his mind that he was going to ping his hammy every game time he stepped out on the ground, it has been the last 3-4 games he has played where that mindset has shifted a little.

Great example of patience is Paul Ahern, both he and Jono and identical players, both guys who are mid sized on-ballers, both have adequate speed, both have no outstanding skill set yet Ahern with some consistent looks at it as a AFL footballer has started to hit his straps. Ahern is NOT more talented than Jono, he is simply a high class junior who has never had a legitimate run at things at AFL level, and now that he is we are starting to see kid who is starting to feel like he belongs.

Ahern is now 8 GAMES, yes 8 bloody games into his season, Jono is 3 games in and has improved substantially in every key indicator and stat. We aren't talking about TOB who has an injury free and sustained chance to be senior footballer, we are talking about a guy who has never had 6 games in a row.
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well said
 
tige19 said:
You have to laugh at posters wanting to cross him out after 3 games of senior footy, this is legitimately the very first time out of juniors he has strung together a dozen games in a row, there is absolutely no way he is running above 60-70%. How much evidence do people need to see before understanding that players, especially mids need 6-10 games in a row at the elite level to really produce. I know for a fact 110% that Jono had it in his mind that he was going to ping his hammy every game time he stepped out on the ground, it has been the last 3-4 games he has played where that mindset has shifted a little.

Great example of patience is Paul Ahern, both he and Jono and identical players, both guys who are mid sized on-ballers, both have adequate speed, both have no outstanding skill set yet Ahern with some consistent looks at it as a AFL footballer has started to hit his straps. Ahern is NOT more talented than Jono, he is simply a high class junior who has never had a legitimate run at things at AFL level, and now that he is we are starting to see kid who is starting to feel like he belongs.

Ahern is now 8 GAMES, yes 8 bloody games into his season, Jono is 3 games in and has improved substantially in every key indicator and stat. We aren't talking about TOB who has an injury free and sustained chance to be senior footballer, we are talking about a guy who has never had 6 games in a row.
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With you on this. Not quite as bullish but I think that there is something there we can’t fully see because the guy has been in rehab far too many times. At least we know he can come in and add value if we have an injury. I think at this point clarko is still trying to put the game plan for finals together and he wants to play they guys he expects to be in the best 22. Jono probably out of time for this year. Hope they give him one more.
 
tige19 said:
You have to laugh at posters wanting to cross him out after 3 games of senior footy, this is legitimately the very first time out of juniors he has strung together a dozen games in a row, there is absolutely no way he is running above 60-70%. How much evidence do people need to see before understanding that players, especially mids need 6-10 games in a row at the elite level to really produce. I know for a fact 110% that Jono had it in his mind that he was going to ping his hammy every game time he stepped out on the ground, it has been the last 3-4 games he has played where that mindset has shifted a little.

Great example of patience is Paul Ahern, both he and Jono and identical players, both guys who are mid sized on-ballers, both have adequate speed, both have no outstanding skill set yet Ahern with some consistent looks at it as a AFL footballer has started to hit his straps. Ahern is NOT more talented than Jono, he is simply a high class junior who has never had a legitimate run at things at AFL level, and now that he is we are starting to see kid who is starting to feel like he belongs.

Ahern is now 8 GAMES, yes 8 bloody games into his season, Jono is 3 games in and has improved substantially in every key indicator and stat. We aren't talking about TOB who has an injury free and sustained chance to be senior footballer, we are talking about a guy who has never had 6 games in a row.
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This post is spot on and exactly how we should be framing his career at this point
 
Brishawk said:
With you on this. Not quite as bullish but I think that there is something there we can’t fully see because the guy has been in rehab far too many times. At least we know he can come in and add value if we have an injury. I think at this point clarko is still trying to put the game plan for finals together and he wants to play they guys he expects to be in the best 22. Jono probably out of time for this year. Hope they give him one more.
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Whitey ahead of him is a weird one for me
 

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