List Mgmt. List Management 2024-25

[Addy23]

Farrell probably the only one with some value of that lot, but I'd prefer to keep him.

If we can get anything remotely useful for Burton, surely they'll convince him to move. With Evans coming out of nowhere and Bergman settling as a medium defender, his spot is gone.

I think DBJ holds some value (maybe a late 2nd which I'd still take in this draft)

My reasoning for Farrell being expendable is because I think we have similar players to him in our side and also because he's not really a defender. He's merely an attacking half-back that isnt defensively involved as much (also part of the reason our high press doesnt work).

100% agree regarding Burton, the only way I see him back in the side is play a Half-forward role now, which would see him going back to his junior years. He's capable of that and I think there's a spot there for him to take but our coaching staff ain't as creative.

 

[davesnothere]

Is there any scenario moving forward where Ivan Soldo

13

Ivan Soldo

Age

28

Ht

204cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.0

2star

K

3.9

2star

HB

4.1

3star

CL

2.4

4star

HO

24.2

5star

D

7.3

2star

K

3.1

1star

HB

4.1

3star

CL

2.4

4star

HO

23.0

5star

D

6.4

2star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.4

3star

CL

1.6

4star

HO

21.4

5star

gets traded back to Victoria at years end. I’m just spitballing but with his gf heading oversees rather than staying I. Adelaide and with Sweet holding his own and Dante developing could a club come for him.

Injury is the issue with Soldo.

We would be trading him for nothing because he's a injury prone 29 year old next year.

His GF is likely to stay in Dubai regardless.

 

[Total Power]

Soldo was another missing pieces trade from Stinkley. We got so many "missing pieces" now, we have just become a missing pieces team mostly.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

I think DBJ holds some value (maybe a late 2nd which I'd still take in this draft)

My reasoning for Farrell being expendable is because I think we have similar players to him in our side and also because he's not really a defender. He's merely an attacking half-back that isnt defensively involved as much (also part of the reason our high press doesnt work).

100% agree regarding Burton, the only way I see him back in the side is play a Half-forward role now, which would see him going back to his junior years. He's capable of that and I think there's a spot there for him to take but our coaching staff ain't as creative.

I'm not a Burton fan but could he be an impact forward like a Dewie Stew, 4 quick kicks for 4 goals. I mean, he definitely has the boot for it.

 

[sobrave]

Injury is the issue with Soldo.

We would be trading him for nothing because he's a injury prone 29 year old next year.

His GF is likely to stay in Dubai regardless.

Oh no, how will he cope without ms plastic Hootie mcboob?

 

[Brian McGee]

I hate the “missing piece” talk around our trades. It’s bullshit peddled by the media and crows fans. Ever single team in the afl trades for players that they think will make them better or have a need for. We had a need for an experienced ruck, and a back up. Both soldo and sweet trades were astute. Soldo’s injuries have been a frustration but sweet has proven to be an adequate back up. If we left the first ruck role with no back up to a developing visentini this year we would have struggled even more.

 

[Chrizzt]

I hate the “missing piece” talk around our trades. It’s bullshit peddled by the media and crows fans. Ever single team in the afl trades for players that they think will make them better or have a need for. We had a need for an experienced ruck, and a back up. Both soldo and sweet trades were astute. Soldo’s injuries have been a frustration but sweet has proven to be an adequate back up. If we left the first ruck role with no back up to a developing visentini this year we would have struggled even more.

The 'missing piece' was accurate when we got Ryder. That genuine ruckman who could both win taps and mark would have been a 2-3 goal per game improvement on our 2014 side. Unfortunately Hinkley also decided to run with some ultra-defensive gameplan in 2015 which then causes holes in other areas of our side.

Pretty much all other trades are like you said, just grabbing best available to fill list spots. Every team does it when they can.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Both soldo and sweet trades were astute.

Bullshit.

The Sweet trade was fine. The Soldo trade was us splitting a top 10 pick to use on a guy who's been no better than another guy who we got for about pick 50.

We didn't need both. Sweet was significantly cheaper but offers about the same on field. Should've just let Soldo through to the keeper.

 

[TeeKray]

It's a strange position we've found ourselves in with three rucks all on roughly the same level. If I had to pick a team to play in a grand final tomorrow I'd probably go Soldo then Visentini then Sweet, but if someone had a totally different order I wouldn't go to war with them over it.

 

[philthy05]

I hate the “missing piece” talk around our trades. It’s bullshit peddled by the media and crows fans. Ever single team in the afl trades for players that they think will make them better or have a need for. We had a need for an experienced ruck, and a back up. Both soldo and sweet trades were astute. Soldo’s injuries have been a frustration but sweet has proven to be an adequate back up. If we left the first ruck role with no back up to a developing visentini this year we would have struggled even more.

The media might push it but in our case it is true.


The clubs admin were desperate to give Hinkley ready made players in order to validate giving him yet another contract.

There would have been anything wrong with getting most of these guys at the right price but we didn’t, we overpaid because we were desperate and teams knew it.

Bullshit.

The Sweet trade was fine. The Soldo trade was us splitting a top 10 pick to use on a guy who's been no better than another guy who we got for about pick 50.

We didn't need both. Sweet was significantly cheaper but offers about the same on field. Should've just let Soldo through to the keeper.

It was totally foreseeable as well. I mean the dude had never played more than 14 games in a season and had just finished that previous season with a whopping 8 games.


There was every chance he was going to continue that trend. And you don’t pay 3 2nd rounders for that.

I called it at the time and said that if Richmond kept him there was every chance he wouldn’t even get another contract offer from Richmond / they would get 0 for him.


Can anyone imagine port getting 3 2nd rounders for a player in our reserves with 1 year left on his contract and just notching 8 games for the season? **** no.

Softcocks.

 

[Brian McGee]

At full fitness soldo is still the best of the 3 ruckman we have. He is good, not great. It was worth paying what we did for him, with the caveat of getting a solid backup in sweet. If we play finals, he will still be the best option for us. The issue is wether or not it was worth breaking up our first rounder for any of the players we traded for or could we have managed it another way? I thought at the time we could have, but our list management guys obviously didn’t.

I don’t subscribe to the theory that everything we do as a club is aimed at getting Ken another extension or saving his job. Rightly or wrongly the feel we are in a window for a premiership, and work towards that.

 

[Brian McGee]

The 'missing piece' was accurate when we got Ryder. That genuine ruckman who could both win taps and mark would have been a 2-3 goal per game improvement on our 2014 side. Unfortunately Hinkley also decided to run with some ultra-defensive gameplan in 2015 which then causes holes in other areas of our side.

Pretty much all other trades are like you said, just grabbing best available to fill list spots. Every team does it when they can.

I agree. Ryder should have propelled us up a level.

 

[Brian McGee]

The media might push it but in our case it is true.


The clubs admin were desperate to give Hinkley ready made players in order to validate giving him yet another contract.

There would have been anything wrong with getting most of these guys at the right price but we didn’t, we overpaid because we were desperate and teams knew it.




It was totally foreseeable as well. I mean the dude had never played more than 14 games in a season and had just finished that previous season with a whopping 8 games.


There was every chance he was going to continue that trend. And you don’t pay 3 2nd rounders for that.

I called it at the time and said that if Richmond kept him there was every chance he wouldn’t even get another contract offer from Richmond / they would get 0 for him.


Can anyone imagine port getting 3 2nd rounders for a player in our reserves with 1 year left on his contract and just notching 8 games for the season? **** no.

Softcocks.

None of the picks we traded for him were high ones though. Pick 41 last year and whatever freos pick turns out to be this year. It’s not a huge price by any stretch.

 

[Long live PAFC]

The media might push it but in our case it is true.


The clubs admin were desperate to give Hinkley ready made players in order to validate giving him yet another contract.

There would have been anything wrong with getting most of these guys at the right price but we didn’t, we overpaid because we were desperate and teams knew it.




It was totally foreseeable as well. I mean the dude had never played more than 14 games in a season and had just finished that previous season with a whopping 8 games.


There was every chance he was going to continue that trend. And you don’t pay 3 2nd rounders for that.

I called it at the time and said that if Richmond kept him there was every chance he wouldn’t even get another contract offer from Richmond / they would get 0 for him.


Can anyone imagine port getting 3 2nd rounders for a player in our reserves with 1 year left on his contract and just notching 8 games for the season? **** no.

Softcocks.

Bit of licence taken here mate.

Pick 49 for pick 50. Pick 41, which technically is still in the second round but drops out of the traditional first 36 picks. A freo’s second rounder. So two second rounders, with one sitting more like a third rounder.

 

[Schulzenfest]

None of the picks we traded for him were high ones though. Pick 41 last year and whatever freos pick turns out to be this year. It’s not a huge price by any stretch.

And what did we pay to get Freo's pick again?

 

[Long live PAFC]

So what should we have done differently last trade period?

Bearing in mind, I agree that a first rounder was a heavy price, how do we get what we needed?

Maybe pry Cox loose from Freo? McKay didn’t seem keen on Adelaide, Grundy didn’t seem to want to come although I’ve heard conflicting things on this.

We needed key backs and rucks. Maybe we could have shifted Todd back? Or trialled Scully there in the hope he produced something?

So what should we have done?

 

[Schulzenfest]

So what should we have done differently last trade period?

Bearing in mind, I agree that a first rounder was a heavy price, how do we get what we needed?

Maybe pry Cox loose from Freo? McKay didn’t seem keen on Adelaide, Grundy didn’t seem to want to come although I’ve heard conflicting things on this.

We needed key backs and rucks. Maybe we could have shifted Todd back? Or trialled Scully there in the hope he produced something?

So what should we have done?

Sweet and BZT were enough. We've lost nothing of consequence replacing the injured Soldo with Sweet, and we actively look better without Esava.

Bypass Soldo and Sav, trade a third rounder for Sweet, offer a second rounder for BZT, tell Dodoro to get ****ed and PSD him if they refuse to accept that. Keep our first rounder. Probably keep Duursma too for whatever that's worth.

 

[Long live PAFC]

Sweet and BZT were enough. We've lost nothing of consequence replacing the injured Soldo with Sweet, and we actively look better without Esava.

Bypass Soldo and Sav, trade a third rounder for Sweet, offer a second rounder for BZT, tell Dodoro to get ****ed and PSD him if they refuse to accept that. Keep our first rounder. Probably keep Duursma too for whatever that's worth.

Soldo is marginally better than sweet but take your point and agree re Esava. I think both have been shown to be questionable additions.

I’m not sure we could go into a season with only two rucks and two key backs though. We would have gone nuts if someone got injured.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Soldo is marginally better than sweet but take your point and agree re Esava. I think both have been shown to be questionable additions.

I’m not sure we could go into a season with only two rucks and two key backs though. We would have gone nuts if someone got injured.

We'd have four key backs even without Esava. And when Esava got injured we were happy to give Bergman more responsibility rather than bringing in one of the backups anyway.

As for Soldo, just keep Hayes (hell, even keep ****ing Teakle) or draft the best mature age state league ruck available. You don't use top 10 picks to make sure you have adequate ruck depth players.

 

[RangaInTeal]

We'd have four key backs even without Esava. And when Esava got injured we were happy to give Bergman more responsibility rather than bringing in one of the backups anyway.

As for Soldo, just keep Hayes (hell, even keep ****ing Teakle) or draft the best mature age state league ruck available. You don't use top 10 picks to make sure you have adequate ruck depth players.

We got screwed for Esava, would get Alipate to spend some time with him or Darryl/Shane Wakelin. Isn’t a natural, but is a specimen in terms of athletic profile. I think his best position will be as a Ruckman.

Soldo was very good early in the year, agree the fact he had only ever played 14 games in a season is concerning, but we were unsure Sweet would be as good as he has been and Visintini ‘should’ yet be two years away from the form he has strung together. The only way we aren’t made to look silly is if Sweet, Soldo and Visintini can play forward and Second Ruck. Their Ruck craft is all pretty good, all summer I would be investing the entire off season into developing their forward craft and putting together a game plan they can play within.

So we have Lord, Scully, Sweet, Visintini, Soldo and Rategolea all that should be minimum part time Ruckmen on our list.

 

[Addy23]

Soldo is marginally better than sweet but take your point and agree re Esava. I think both have been shown to be questionable additions.

I’m not sure we could go into a season with only two rucks and two key backs though. We would have gone nuts if someone got injured.

How has Soldo proven to be better than Sweet so far this? Based on their previous clubs, sure I agree but Sweet has been way more effective in the ruck, at least to the naked eye, and is a good presence around the ground. Gone forward to kick a couple goals recently too.

Bring Soldo in was a poor trade when we already had Visentini and Sweet also wrapped up basically. I dont think the list management expected Sweet to be as good as he's been which has made the Soldo trade look worse. But logically speaking, bringing in 2 rucks that were 2nd choice at their respective clubs was also going to bring about this scenario.

I dont think Soldo's been bad, but I would get on the phone with Melbourne and see if they'd like a back up ruck for a late 2nd rounder/early 3rd rounder. As it stands, we gave away picks 36, 41, 49 and 68 for Soldo and pick 50.

That pick 36 is really bothering me as it would've been in this draft!

 

[Addy23]

We got screwed for Esava, would get Alipate to spend some time with him or Darryl/Shane Wakelin. Isn’t a natural, but is a specimen in terms of athletic profile. I think his best position will be as a Ruckman.

Soldo was very good early in the year, agree the fact he had only ever played 14 games in a season is concerning, but we were unsure Sweet would be as good as he has been and Visintini ‘should’ yet be two years away from the form he has strung together. The only way we aren’t made to look silly is if Sweet, Soldo and Visintini can play forward and Second Ruck. Their Ruck craft is all pretty good, all summer I would be investing the entire off season into developing their forward craft and putting together a game plan they can play within.

So we have Lord, Scully, Sweet, Visintini, Soldo and Rategolea all that should be minimum part time Ruckmen on our list.

I agree re Esava, I still dont think his long term future is as a defender and given his age and athletic profile, he could be the other option we need instead of Finlayson to play fwd/ruck, especially if Dixon retires at the end of the year.

I reckon defensively, we look best when its Aliir, BZT, Bergman and Jones (if only Jones can be less consistent with his fumbling which has improved as the season has gone on)

 

[philthy05]

None of the picks we traded for him were high ones though. Pick 41 last year and whatever freos pick turns out to be this year. It’s not a huge price by any stretch.

Not high? We traded this years first to acquire one of those draft picks.


Not high? It’s arguably a bigger haul then we’ve gotten for any of Ladhams , hombsch impey young, duursma , ah chee , Ryder and arguably not far from what we got for a much younger and contracted for an eternity Dougal Howard.

So what should we have done differently last trade period?

Bearing in mind, I agree that a first rounder was a heavy price, how do we get what we needed?

Maybe pry Cox loose from Freo? McKay didn’t seem keen on Adelaide, Grundy didn’t seem to want to come although I’ve heard conflicting things on this.

We needed key backs and rucks. Maybe we could have shifted Todd back? Or trialled Scully there in the hope he produced something?

So what should we have done?

What should we have done?

Not bent over spread our cheeks and say have at it boys.

Maybe when we have a contracted player wanting out we put our foot down, like every other team has done to us and say give us what we ask or we keep him.



I said at the time, we should only really have 3rd rounders on the table for zerk and esava, and made it clear that if we only land one we can live with that. They were uncontracted.

We could have made a reasonable offer for soldo, a player with a vast injury history who wasn’t getting a game for tigers. 1 2nd rounder would have been kind.

We shouldn’t have sold our 1st, it was a bad decision then and it’s even worse now.

 

[Ropable]

So what should we have done differently last trade period?

Bearing in mind, I agree that a first rounder was a heavy price, how do we get what we needed?

Maybe pry Cox loose from Freo? McKay didn’t seem keen on Adelaide, Grundy didn’t seem to want to come although I’ve heard conflicting things on this.

We needed key backs and rucks. Maybe we could have shifted Todd back? Or trialled Scully there in the hope he produced something?

So what should we have done?

Retrospectively, in my opinion we should have never traded away a first round pick for Ratugolea, let Fantasia walk nor been strong armed into the BZT trade

The Sweet and Soldo trades still would have happened

BZT would walk to the PSD as an expensive, toxic flight risk and still ended up here

Fantasia would have proved useful and provided the ever-lacking forward depth with a proper pre-season

And the kicker? We wouldn't be watching a washed Boak attempting to play football on the Wing and instead at Half-Forward over DBJ.

I believe the Ratugolea mistake occured purely to save face, as we clearly promised to get him last season and it didn't materialise. On top of that we were clowned for not having the goods down back time and time again. For example:



Paint a better picture of what we should have done? Now when this fraud of a coach decides to do a tell all about why he'd failed for 12 seasons straight, it'll be because we were "Missing the right pieces" - Not because of repeated, evident mistakes made time and time again.

Edit: Damned autocorrect.

 

[Powerade 08]

Soldo would have been a good get if we were a normal football club that had a chance of winning important games.

Visentini will become a better player than Soldo before that happens