Malthouse V Buckley
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Gone Critical
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Maybe you should stick to the Collingwood board were you can talk up your list without any counter arguments. Maybe join in the discusion that Sidebottom is better than Ziebel or that Beams and Blight were both rated first round picks and Collingwood were prepared to use pick 11 on either but were wrapt and suprised the 3 players you targeted you got.
Then again maybe you could have a little more balance in your arguments. Things change rapidly in football. Look at the metamorphosis Geelong underwent about round 5 2007 when a previously young but inconsistent list transformed into a powerhouse seemingly overnight. The truth was the Cats success was laid down in the careful management and recruiting in the previous seasons. But if you had come out in round 3 and made the claims of success that did occur in 2007 you would have been laughed at.
Collingwood and all other clubs are attempting the same thing as Geelong has achieved already. If you wanted to add some balance to you thread you would say that a team full of young players at collingwood has achieved good results in the last few seasons,. They have put themselves in a position where it wont be a suprise to see success in the next few seasons. Its not guaranteed but the Pies are doing some good things.
You may accuse some Pie fans of being over the top in their assessments but do you think your blinkers have made you overly critical, or is nothing positive at all happening at Pieland
I think Scott will be a great coach but I also don't see Buckley flopping, MM has had his time and Buckley is already having a major influence according to the younger players at the club .Beams quote to a family member posted on another forum:
http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/viewtopic.php?t=54623
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- #79
Yeah, I think Buckley will be a very good coach too.
But I also think the handover to Bucks won't go as smoothly as Eddie dreams it will.
But I also think the handover to Bucks won't go as smoothly as Eddie dreams it will.
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My gut feel is Scott is a gun coach in waiting but you posess an
almighty turdburger of a list minus a couple of recent draftees.
Hope the supporters & board have plenty of patience, doubt you'll be seeing a GF appearance in 3rd year like MM achieved.
One poster wrote about if Buckley does have success while Malthouse is his assistant it will take a fair bit of gloss of the cup Buckley wins which I thought was a great point.
I doubt Pies supporters would care as the premiership is all that matters but I'm sure Buckley wouldn't like the idea of an "assisted" premiership win. If that was to occur in his first or second year as coach who would you give more kudos too?
I doubt Pies supporters would care as the premiership is all that matters but I'm sure Buckley wouldn't like the idea of an "assisted" premiership win. If that was to occur in his first or second year as coach who would you give more kudos too?
I think the recruiting department has wasted the resources of the club not malthouse. I have always thought the lists at his helm have been average, with a few stars here and there. The fact that he gets them around the mark year in year out is an absolute credit to Malthouse. He is one of the best.
Buckley because I already believe Malthouses game plan and player selection is holding us back.
When Buckley takes over he will have the say in these things atm he has to follow orders.
Zahki
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I think Eddie's set up something that a lot of other clubs would kill to have. Two of the best minds in football locked in to stay with Collingwood for the next 5 years. A smooth transition between coaches in 2 years. It's a great plan and should work out fine.
I think Malthouse has done the best job he could personally. He hasn't won a premiership but came damn close in 2002. It just unfortunate our best shots at it have had us go up against probably the best team of the decade. What can you do? Get back up and try again next season. For what it's worth I don't think any person could have coached Collingwood better over this last decade.
I think Malthouse has done the best job he could personally. He hasn't won a premiership but came damn close in 2002. It just unfortunate our best shots at it have had us go up against probably the best team of the decade. What can you do? Get back up and try again next season. For what it's worth I don't think any person could have coached Collingwood better over this last decade.
i'm not sure i'm sold on the idea of succession planning yet, although it seems to be in vogue with every AFL club at the moment. Buckley's an untried coach at any level and to be promised the job in 2 years time is a big call. and it's a call that wouldn't have been made had he not been a collingwood person, which suggests that there's a fair bit of 'romance' in the decision.
a lot of things remain to be seen though: who will be calling the shots in regards to recruiting? malthouse, who will surely want to win a flag in the next two years, or buckley, who would be wanting to look for the future (given the recruting this year of two guys in their mid-late 20's i'd say the former is the case)
now, there are many cats fans who say 'we're geelong and what we're doing is obviously right', and i'm not one of them. but with thompson announcing he's leaving in two years, probably co-inciding with the closing of our premiership window, and a bunch of players probably due for retirement, it's an ideal time for a new coach to over-see the transition, clean out players and build his own team. i don't want to see any sort of succession plan unless one of the current assistants is genuinely seen as a super-coach in the making who we couldn't bare to lose. one era ends and another begins. when the coach departs we'll elect the best possible candidate
i can understand the rationale behind it - buckley's a club champion and if i was a collingwood fan i'd hate to see him coach somewhere else, but i think the situation is far from ideal
Eddie on one hand says Malthouse is at the peak of his powers and then immediately puts a plan in place to sack him 2 years out. Do you think that in 2 years his supposed powers will diminish that quickly?
It doesnt equate Eddie. Just admit it, you were too gutless to sack your overly glorified failed coach, so you set in place this contrived situation which will have the senior coach always looking over his shoulder at his succesor for those 2 bullshit years you set in place.
It doesnt equate Eddie. Just admit it, you were too gutless to sack your overly glorified failed coach, so you set in place this contrived situation which will have the senior coach always looking over his shoulder at his succesor for those 2 bullshit years you set in place.
IMO this apprenticeship strategy will deliver Collingwood a premiership if it works, or could ensure they don't challenge for one for a long time if it doesn't.
It's a huge risk as I think they would have been a legitimate flag threat in the next 2-3 years with or without Buckley.
It's a huge risk as I think they would have been a legitimate flag threat in the next 2-3 years with or without Buckley.
well, wrong, Nathan Buckley stepped up as a first-time coach to lead Vic Country undefeated through the national U16 championships.
Many people are making guesses as to what's going to happen within the inner sanctum. I believe that Buckley will be like any respected assistant coach and be a 'trusted advisor'.
Time will tell if this is going to work. The issues that come with being ambitious and wanting to succeed to top jobs (in any industry) is really knowing when your time will come. Since Buckley knows when his time is coming I'm willing to suggest he has the mental maturity to behave in a manner befitting until 2012.
The fact that people suggest that there's going to be some sort of mutiny is possibly undermining the fact that Buckley is missing some maturity/intelligence, which I don't believe is the case.
of course, like anything, time will tell....
Gone Critical
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- #91
It does equate Fu and its pretty simple. The arrangement was not put in place not because of Malthouses waning powers but because of a desire to to get the best out of the Malthouse /Buckley combination. Eddie and most other judges see both these men as being fantastic acquisitions and to team them as he has done is bold and innovative. Far from the "gutless description you adhere to
Its not a guarantee but I am sure the 2 are committed to make it work and I for one am rapt
Gone Critical
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- #92
Buckley is the biggest, arrogant w***er in the AFL (apologies to Eddie McGuire & Adrian Anderson)
He reminds me of a Cancer that keeps spreading until it kills you off.
RIP Collingwood Football Club
Did you come up with this concept all on your own Omen. Perhaps mummy helped you with the homework again. Dont worry you will grow up one day.
Its hardly innovative and nimble if you didnt get your man.
Luckily for North, your second choice fell into your laps because he was collateral damage from the Collingwood role being locked away for the next 5+ years. And he's going to be a quality coach. Theres no point in being bitter about losing Buckley because Scott will be every bit as good.
Actually thats what you hope. You're entitled to take a wild guess, thats your prerogative, but theres no substance to your prediction.
Great response. Can't disagree with anything in there.
Maybe.
No question my disappointment at Buckley's decision is multifold.
Probably a different discussion for different day, but I reckon it's a bit rough to say that Collingwood, and by progression Malthouse and the playing group, have "ultimately failed".
I realise as AFL followers that we've all been conditioned to believe to the only success is Premiership success, and that anything less is unacceptable and deemed to be failure. But I don't personally subscribe to that. If I was an AFL coach, then maybe I too would push that line to my players. However, as a supporter I believe that there are many different layers of success.
Nothing can replace the ultimate success of a Flag, but a season shouldn't be defined as either "success" or "failure" based purely on whether or not silverware is added the trophy cabinet.
By my definition, Mick Malthouse has been a success at Collingwood.
And you hope it will work. You're entitled to take a wild guess, thats your prerogative, but theres no substance to your prediction.
Harsh?
You guys would have won the premiership in 2007 had you gotten an extra goal against the Cats in the prelim.
................except that Buckley and Malthouse have worked successfully together for over ten years and know and understand the way each other thinks and operates. Theres probably not a tighter relationship between coach/captain (now assistant) in the game.
Theres a lot of reasons to suggest this novel handover approach will work. Suggesting it will fail is based on jealousy and hatred. And thats ok but its not very rational.
Zahki
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Agree totally. The premiership is the ultimate goal, but if you brand any year where you don't win it a failure then you're going to be disappointed most years.
