Roast Matt Hass is garbage and the Crows fitness is below AFL standard

[texas_ranger]

4th year physio student? truly impressive.

I'm a data analyst employed by a state health service and working at a hospital dealing with clinical information on a daily basis.

What I quoted wasn't 'an article on the internet', it was from the kangatech official website btw.

No matter where you got it from you still fail to understand what Kangatech is, players don't train on Kangatech machines. I couldn't care less what you do as it is irrelevant to the topic at hand whereas the product is designed for use by physios as a replacement for muscle testing which is subjective. It provides measurable results that can be tracked and would typically be used for testing strength post-injury.

 

[Vhaluus]

No matter where you got it from you still fail to understand what Kangatech is, players don't train on Kangatech machines. I couldn't care less what you do as it is irrelevant to the topic at hand whereas the product is designed for use by physios as a replacement for muscle testing which is subjective. It provides measurable results that can be tracked and would typically be used for testing strength post-injury.

So you know the technology better than the companies own website is your argument?

 

[texas_ranger]

So you know the technology better than the companies own website is your argument?

And your argument is that the technology is useless because we are unfit?? as though this one piece of equipment can have such a profound impact on player fitness.

 

[Vhaluus]

And your argument is that the technology is useless because we are unfit?? as though this one piece of equipment can have such a profound impact on player fitness.

My argument is the technology is utterly unproven scientifically and therefore shouldn't be used until it's validity and safety have been properly studied.

 

[texas_ranger]

My argument is the technology is utterly unproven scientifically and therefore shouldn't be used until it's validity and safety have been properly studied.

It simply measures strength output, can't understand how it would be bad and almost every club would be using some form of isokinetic testing by now.
Fast-twitch performance in Adelaide have recently sold similar type machines to the Dallas Mavericks and Chicago Bulls so its becoming the norm world wide. If you want to see research papers on this type of equipment look up isokinetic testing, Kanga tech is simply a newer more advanced version of something that has been in place for years now.

 

[Vhaluus]

It simply measures strength output, can't understand how it would be bad and almost every club would be using some form of isokinetic testing by now.
Fast-twitch performance in Adelaide have recently sold similar type machines to the Dallas Mavericks and Chicago Bulls so its becoming the norm world wide. If you want to see research papers on this type of equipment look up isokinetic testing, Kanga tech is simply a newer more advanced version of something that has been in place for years now.

But we aren't just using it as a measuring device, we are using it to set training. Put your finger in your ears about that all you want, it's the reality.

 

[texas_ranger]

But we aren't just using it as a measuring device, we are using it to set training. Put your finger in your ears about that all you want, it's the reality.

As we should, if the player is shown to have weak glutes then i'd be far more concerned if they weren't adding more glute work into his program, there's no point of testing if we aren't using the results to reduce injury rates which we've done quite successfully in regard to preventable injuries. Nothing can really be done to prevent whats happened to Milera, Sloane and Fogarty as they've had contact injuries

 

[Vhaluus]

As we should, if the player is shown to have weak glutes then i'd be far more concerned if they weren't adding more glute work into his program, there's no point of testing if we aren't using the results to reduce injury rates which we've done quite successfully in regard to preventable injuries. Nothing can really be done to prevent whats happened to Milera, Sloane and Fogarty as they've had contact injuries

Except we are letting their software do the dictating of the training load, which again is unproven.

There is a difference between seeing the measurement from a machine and making decisions based on it and plugging those numbers blindly into a piece of software and following what it spits out.

Saunders wouldn't be trying to claim his system is revolutionary the way he does if all it was is a machine that makes recordings slightly more accurately than its predecessors.

 

[texas_ranger]

Except we are letting their software do the dictating of the training load, which again is unproven.

There is a difference between seeing the measurement from a machine and making decisions based on it and plugging those numbers blindly into a piece of software and following what it spits out.

Saunders wouldn't be trying to claim his system is revolutionary the way he does if all it was is a machine that makes recordings slightly more accurately than its predecessors.

It doesn't do that though, the practitioner in this cause saunders would then use his own knowledge and develop a program that caters to the player's needs, the machine doesn't say this player must perform this exercise for x number of sets and reps. You're out of your depth stop arguing for the sake of it, Saunders machine is better than others due to the number of different tests it can perform, it's a highly versatile piece of equipment. Older models typically look similar to a leg extension machine and only test quad and hamstring strength.

 

[King Elvis]

I mean since Saunders has come on we've had less soft tissue injuries, which is good. But our players seem to be well behind in strength and conditioning. Whether those two things are tied is anyone's guess.

It was obvious that Burton’s response to destroying our list with soft tissue injuries was to over correct in the other direction.

 

[spexau]

It was obvious that Burton’s response to destroying our list with soft tissue injuries was to over correct in the other direction.

It's pretty obvious we aren't as conditioned as most of the comp. Saunders is the physio which is fine. He's doing his job. Hass is head of high performance so it's on him.

 

[feenix67]

That is what is called anecdotal evidence. Also you're linking to his own pages, he isn't exactly going to post negative reviews is he?

If his system had any actual credibility there would be clinical papers written about it, but there's nothing.

Nah you're wrong on this one. Kangatech is designed to measure loads and identify physical tolerance levels. It's a medical.tool, not a fitness tool. Hence, when dickhead Burton didn't know how to use it, we were pinging hammys left and right.

It's a proven tool in multiple sports. It isn't the problem.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

4th year physio student? truly impressive.

I'm a data analyst employed by a state health service and working at a hospital dealing with clinical data on a daily basis.

What I quoted wasn't 'an article on the internet', it was from the kangatech official website btw.

So what are you doing about the high level of HAC's (costing the state more than $60m), LOS/ cost per NWAU inefficiencies or significant number of patient exceeding their NEAT target....

 

[Vhaluus]

Nah you're wrong on this one. Kangatech is designed to measure loads and identify physical tolerance levels. It's a medical.tool, not a fitness tool. Hence, when dickhead Burton didn't know how to use it, we were pinging hammys left and right.

It's a proven tool in multiple sports. It isn't the problem.

Go read Kangatechs own website, they're marketing it as a fitness tool.

 

[Vhaluus]

So what are you doing about the high level of HAC's (costing the state more than $60m), LOS/ cost per NWAU inefficiencies or significant number of patient exceeding their NEAT target....

1)I'm a data analyst, I analyze data. So none of youre questions are really relevant, I'm not a decision maker. I provide information.
2)I also don't work with the financial side of things, though I will say the NWAU is only half the picture, I assume you've got a state based funding model in addition to the federal one. At the end of the day LOS is a clinical decision so all you an really do is make sure you're coding to recover as much funding as possible as well as capturing opportunties for OSR wherever possible (pretty much any other funding source will pay more than the government does).
3)I'm doing a bit of NEAT related work, specifically around imlementing a model to predict ED attendance in a more sophisticated way than has been productionized previously (lots of papers written showing better systems can work in theory, but all just looking at historical data so we're in the process of seeing how they work in the real world). However ED is actually only a part of the NEAT picture, best practice currently across most of the nation is to adopt a 2-1-1 split of the 4 hour window so already you have 50% of the target outside the hands of the ED (1hr is for a specialist consultant to attend and make the decision to admit and the other 1 hr is for bed managers to find a bed and actually admit them). But even within the 50% that falls under the banner of the ED you have issues with testing and imaging often causing delays.

But you weren't really looking for a genuine answer were you?

 

[cm_perfect]

1)I'm a data analyst, I analyze data. So none of youre questions are really relevant, I'm not a decision maker. I provide information.
2)I also don't work with the financial side of things, though I will say the NWAU is only half the picture, I assume you've got a state based funding model in addition to the federal one. At the end of the day LOS is a clinical decision so all you an really do is make sure you're coding to recover as much funding as possible as well as capturing opportunties for OSR wherever possible (pretty much any other funding source will pay more than the government does).
3)I'm doing a bit of NEAT related work, specifically around imlementing a model to predict ED attendance in a more sophisticated way than has been productionized previously (lots of papers written showing better systems can work in theory, but all just looking at historical data so we're in the process of seeing how they work in the real world). However ED is actually only a part of the NEAT picture, best practice currently across most of the nation is to adopt a 2-1-1 split of the 4 hour window so already you have 50% of the target outside the hands of the ED (1hr is for a specialist consultant to attend and make the decision to admit and the other 1 hr is for bed managers to find a bed and actually admit them). But even within the 50% that falls under the banner of the ED you have issues with testing and imaging often causing delays.

But you weren't really looking for a genuine answer were you?

Interesting though

 

[Interloperer]

Saunders' disclaimer on the end of the Galluci injury report was definitely bizarre.

 

[moogerfooger]

Whatever aspect of performance - whether its physical fitness, mental fitness, motivation, preparation, recovery - these are all the responsibility of the High Performance Manager. We've gone from 2nd to bottom in three and a half seasons under his tenure. Now we're the worst performing team of the modern era, as bad as the expansion clubs when they were filled with kids. You would expect a decline with an aging list. But not to this extent. Effort and competitiveness have fallen off a cliff. Whether its mental or physical, it's an indictment on him.

He's the obvious target for replacement. Along with the CEO who hired him.

 

[feenix67]

Go read Kangatechs own website, they're marketing it as a fitness tool.

I've done plenty of research on Kangatech. I've also seen some of the software the Crows bought to replace the stupid spreadsheets Burton was incorrectly using to analyse the data Kangatech was providing, because the club was too tight to buy the full package and Burton wrongly thought he could track and analyse the data using the existing spreadsheet templates Poulos had set up for his own program..

Stop cherry picking testimonial quotes and read the very front page their site.

 

[CrowBloke]

Scorpus, I've often wondered how Hass survived --- dun dun DUUUUUN --- "the review". I've not seen a single poster in any thread comment on what a good job he's done. My take on it was this [edited today], posted in another thread on Saturday, but more relevant here:
"Our fitness looked well below AFL levels today. Hass is responsible.
I betcha he has worked it out. He'll be:
--- great at Networking, getting people onside, keeping them in the loop etc
--- the one who submits many brilliant written reports (ALL that work!! the man's a machine!) which detail how any failures relating to his role have nothing to do with him
--- while explaining that any successes are a direct result of his tireless efforts.
Betcha.
It's how all selfish, Empire-building incompetents pull the wool over their gullible [employers' eyes]."

 

[Vhaluus]

I've done plenty of research on Kangatech. I've also seen some of the software the Crows bought to replace the stupid spreadsheets Burton was incorrectly using to analyse the data Kangatech was providing, because the club was too tight to buy the full package and Burton wrongly thought he could track and analyse the data using the existing spreadsheet templates Poulos had set up for his own program..

Stop cherry picking testimonial quotes and read the very front page their site.

View attachment 926946

Cherry picking?

What I quoted was literally from the 'product' page of their website

Products

The KT360 Testing and Training platform consists of a portable, adaptable, easy to use fixed frame dynamometry system that allows accurate and reliable measurement of isolated neuromuscular strength, endurance and control. Advanced software analytics allow sport specific athlete profiling to...

kanga-tech.com

 

[Vhaluus]

Scorpus, I've often wondered how Hass survived --- dun dun DUUUUUN --- "the review". I've not seen a single poster in any thread comment on what a good job he's done. My take on it was this [edited today], posted in another thread on Saturday, but more relevant here:
"Our fitness looked well below AFL levels today. Hass is responsible.
I betcha he has worked it out. He'll be:
--- great at Networking, getting people onside, keeping them in the loop etc
--- the one who submits many brilliant written reports (ALL that work!! the man's a machine!) which detail how any failures relating to his role have nothing to do with him
--- while explaining that any successes are a direct result of his tireless efforts.
Betcha.
It's how all selfish, Empire-building incompetents pull the wool over their gullible [employers' eyes]."

Because given Burtons incompetence above him they couldn't 100% pin it on him in the review.

I'm sure if we actually got to read the review it'd be fairly critical of Hass but basically say 'it can't be proven he was responsible, ultimately he was working under failed leadership and directions from Burton'

 

[CrowBloke]

I remember reading this article from just after the bye last and being concerned ...
We all know how far we've fallen since then. Not only is our ability to cover the ground gone but there has been no physical development in nearly all of our players in the last two years. We've watched opposition players just waltz out of tackles, use their body to out mark our players and get separation in contested situations. ...

The Crows' standing in that 2019 table is shocking. Dismal.
LAZIEST team in the Comp. Least fit. Most dispirited, maybe?

Do you have any data on 2020 distances covered/sprints etc?

 

[CrowBloke]

Because given Burtons incompetence above him they couldn't 100% pin it on him in the review.
I'm sure if we actually got to read the review it'd be fairly critical of Hass but basically say 'it can't be proven he was responsible, ultimately he was working under failed leadership and directions from Burton'.

Wasn't Hass a job-for-the-boy appointment on Burton's recommendation, ex-Brisbane?
Who's responsible for retaining him, now? Any details on his contract?

 

[feenix67]

Cherry picking?

What I quoted was literally from the 'product' page of their website

Products

The KT360 Testing and Training platform consists of a portable, adaptable, easy to use fixed frame dynamometry system that allows accurate and reliable measurement of isolated neuromuscular strength, endurance and control. Advanced software analytics allow sport specific athlete profiling to...

kanga-tech.com

View attachment 926956

Nothing on that page contradicts what I said, or supports your view. It is clearly not a "fitness" system.