Coach Michael Voss

[Ezayyak]

I'm a big person on stats. Do analysis for a living. Having said that, the fact that we are number 1 in the comp for scores from turnovers but we are getting progressively worse probably indicates more so that our midfield is clearly not performing well enough, we are relying on either forward pressure or rebounding out of defence.

One area we are not good at, even when we were winning, was the ability to get overlap run with 3 or 4 players or setting up at a stoppage when we require to the get the ball out when we win it. Very rarely you see first possession followed by a quick release and then release again to another player running past.

 

[Benaly28]

Wow... So we really must be poorly coached then!

Found this very interesting.



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[Stormzy]

I back Voss, but I would love if we could bring in an assistant that has had some premiership success, like a Leppitsch or something similar to Choc Williams at Melbourne, just someone that can challenge him and ask questions.

 

[jj1978]

I back Voss, but I would love if we could bring in an assistant that has had some premiership success, like a Leppitsch or something similar to Choc Williams at Melbourne, just someone that can challenge him and ask questions.

Simpson probably only one available.. but he may need a break.

 

[Benaly28]

Adam Simpson would be a fantastic addition.


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[Arr0w]

Adam Simpson would be a fantastic addition.


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Head of footy or senior assistant if Hansen leaves?

 

[JustaBattler]

I'm a big person on stats. Do analysis for a living. Having said that, the fact that we are number 1 in the comp for scores from turnovers but we are getting progressively worse probably indicates more so that our midfield is clearly not performing well enough, we are relying on either forward pressure or rebounding out of defence.

One area we are not good at, even when we were winning, was the ability to get overlap run with 3 or 4 players or setting up at a stoppage when we require to the get the ball out when we win it. Very rarely you see first possession followed by a quick release and then release again to another player running past.

Yep

The game plan is out of balance because of the underperformance of midfield in clearances - no surprises since Walsh out #1 runner cant bend over to pick up a loose ball, Kennedy is playing forward when he isnt playing back, Cerra is being played back and we are left with Cripps Pittonet and Hewett as the prime movers - Fogarty/E Hollands arent the rotations you want against the better midfields when Cripps is resting or Walsh is blowing up s he has been lately and TDK is out now-...

people expect players to try harder and want it more and all kinds of rah rah - forgetting that a fit decent midfield against a not fit midfield is probably going to win over 4 quarters...

we are where we are - not anywhere else - surprise surprise - injuries matter.

 

[BlueBayou]

I'm not sure where to post this , so mods please move as appropriate.

Coming to you as a person who floated the pooh pooh'd idea of playing H as 2nd ruck.

I have a bit of a radical idea to solve the 2nd KPD. Could we do a reverse SDK and play TDK as a CHB? (I know he is injured, this is speculative)
There are some who will immediately say 'but he is our best ruck option, we cannot go ahead with Pitto as first ruck'. That is only partly correct IMHO. Pitto is no TDK in the ruck, but he is servicable, and our biggest structural weakness is in the key defender post.
Tom is certainly more than adequate in the air, is competative, has the size to play on the Gorilla's, is fantastic below his knees for a huge man. Weiters could trust him.

Yes, I know we would lose his contested possession game in the centre bounce, but what is the bigger problem?

Radical idea, but food for thought?

 

[frank_frankson]

Head of footy or senior assistant if Hansen leaves?

Would he accept the role? May want to bide his time and see the lay of the land after 12 months or so.

On SM-A536E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Soapy V]

I'm a big person on stats. Do analysis for a living. Having said that, the fact that we are number 1 in the comp for scores from turnovers but we are getting progressively worse probably indicates more so that our midfield is clearly not performing well enough, we are relying on either forward pressure or rebounding out of defence.

One area we are not good at, even when we were winning, was the ability to get overlap run with 3 or 4 players or setting up at a stoppage when we require to the get the ball out when we win it. Very rarely you see first possession followed by a quick release and then release again to another player running past.

100%

 

[Soapy V]

I back Voss, but I would love if we could bring in an assistant that has had some premiership success, like a Leppitsch or something similar to Choc Williams at Melbourne, just someone that can challenge him and ask questions.

Williams is a great teacher of young players and big on working on getting your skills right. Something I feel we lack. I would love him at the club in a development/skills coach

 

[Soapy V]

I really like Voss and think he has done a great job, but like all coaches he has weaknesses.

My question is do we support him with the right people? My gut feel is Voss isn't a massive tactical person and is not very flexible in changing things up.

Hansen is apparently very good tactically but I don't see much in the others.

Personally, I would like us to change a few things around our coaching set up at years end and bring in some fresh ideas

 

[katmanblue]

Williams is a great teacher of young players and big on working on getting your skills right. Something I feel we lack. I would love him at the club in a development/skills caoch

We've got Greg. He'll teach them classes on how great he was.

On SM-F946B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Accidental genius]

I really like Voss and think he has done a great job, but like all coaches he has weaknesses.

My question is do we support him with the right people? My gut feel is Voss isn't a massive tactical person and is not very flexible in changing things up.

Hansen is apparently very good tactically but I don't see much in the others.

Personally, I would like us to change a few things around our coaching set up at years end and bring in some fresh ideas

Agree….but I am getting tired of our recent coaches all needing support etc. I want a coach that can coach tactically and emotionally.

The modern day footy coach needs to be innovative…and come up with a game plan and a list that is effective during that era.

Clarko the grub and hawks were super impressive with their maintain possession and good kicking style which netted them 3-4 flags.

Hardwick introduced the forward press and a list that played it so well - 3 flags

Fly went to filth with a clear plan …tweaked the list and played an effective game plan which produced a flag. Winning so many tight finishes could not have been coincidence…they had a plan

We’re in no man’s land still trying to learn the turnover game with a list that doesn’t appear to be suitably skilled for it. Our mids can’t sustain good slick ball movement often enough to creat goal opportunities from.

We also have one of the best forward combos in H and Charlie but our delivery is often crap…our go to is kick it long h or Charlie will sort it out. Doesn’t work against good defending teams unfortunately.

We are playing catch up whilst other teams are developing game plans that are blowing oppos out of the water…latest being the hawks…again.

Imagine us going to Adelaide to thrash the crows??

 

[Benaly28]

Head of footy or senior assistant if Hansen leaves?

Senior assistant


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[Arr0w]

We've got Greg. He'll teach them classes on how great he was.

On SM-F946B using BigFooty.com mobile app

He loves a good photo shoot

 

[Soapy V]

Agree….but I am getting tired of our recent coaches all needing support etc. I want a coach that can coach tactically and emotionally.

The modern day footy coach needs to be innovative…and come up with a game plan and a list that is effective during that era.

Clarko the grub and hawks were super impressive with their maintain possession and good kicking style which netted them 3-4 flags.

Hardwick introduced the forward press and a list that played it so well - 3 flags

Fly went to filth with a clear plan …tweaked the list and played an effective game plan which produced a flag. Winning so many tight finishes could not have been coincidence…they had a plan

We’re in no man’s land still trying to learn the turnover game with a list that doesn’t appear to be suitably skilled for it. Our mids can’t sustain good slick ball movement often enough to creat goal opportunities from.

We also have one of the best forward combos in H and Charlie but our delivery is often crap…our go to is kick it long h or Charlie will sort it out. Doesn’t work against good defending teams unfortunately.

We are playing catch up whilst other teams are developing game plans that are blowing oppos out of the water…latest being the hawks…again.

Imagine us going to Adelaide to thrash the crows??

Some very fair points

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

Agree….but I am getting tired of our recent coaches all needing support etc. I want a coach that can coach tactically and emotionally.

The modern day footy coach needs to be innovative…and come up with a game plan and a list that is effective during that era.

Clarko the grub and hawks were super impressive with their maintain possession and good kicking style which netted them 3-4 flags.

Hardwick introduced the forward press and a list that played it so well - 3 flags

Fly went to filth with a clear plan …tweaked the list and played an effective game plan which produced a flag. Winning so many tight finishes could not have been coincidence…they had a plan

We’re in no man’s land still trying to learn the turnover game with a list that doesn’t appear to be suitably skilled for it. Our mids can’t sustain good slick ball movement often enough to creat goal opportunities from.

We also have one of the best forward combos in H and Charlie but our delivery is often crap…our go to is kick it long h or Charlie will sort it out. Doesn’t work against good defending teams unfortunately.

We are playing catch up whilst other teams are developing game plans that are blowing oppos out of the water…latest being the hawks…again.

Imagine us going to Adelaide to thrash the crows??

those coaches all had the same thing in common. They used the list to do what the list was best at.

Hawks, tigers, Geelong, even the pies have pretty different game plans (recent pies similar to tiges but old pies ~2010 not) which come down to answering 'what are my personnel best at'

What are Carlton's personnel best at? Are they used that way?

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Where was this "Carlton is badly coached" hit piece when we belted Geelong just 6 weeks ago?

Coaches make mistakes, Voss is not immune to that, but I think the way he was able to get the group to turn things around last year and where he's taken us so far... he's earned respect. Let's not call for his head just yet.

 

[Soapy V]

Where was this "Carlton is badly coached" hit piece when we belted Geelong just 6 weeks ago?

Coaches make mistakes, Voss is not immune to that, but I think the way he was able to get the group to turn things around last year and where he's taken us so far... he's earned respect. Let's not call for his head just yet.

Who's called for his head?

 

[CarmenSandiego]

View attachment 2062808

Found this very interesting.



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I'm not interested more sackings, but I'm a bit underwhelmed with the coaching staff in terms of strategy & consistency thus far into Voss' tenure. It seems Voss has very little to do with tactics and is focused on man management - which is fine; so I'm not laying the blame at anyone in particular.

- We seem to have no real identity with the way we play - it was clearances but that's sort of been found out and we simply rely on talent to move the ball up the ground. We're that talented that we can generally get by and be in games doing this, which is kinda scary.

- In regards to clearances, our strategy seems to be simply to run forward of the footy at every 50/50 contest. It punishes teams when it works out but when it doesn't, we're punished even worse.

- It wouldn't surprise me one but if selection integrity was putting noses out of joint - Cerra came straight back in at the expense of Hewett, has underperformed, has now been hidden in the backline at the expense of Boyd (who was fit to play on the weekend? Happy to be corrected on that). Cottrell has come straight back in, struggled and is keeping Binns out (who is taking the piss in the VFL). The MC seems to be very talent orientated, they seem to give games based on name and potential - eg Fantasia & making Owies sub, and now what we're seeing with Cottrell & Cerra.

- I don't buy that our personnel needs work - sure it would be great if we had another KPD or a speedy midfielder, but honestly - Pies won a flag with Frampton as their KPD, Richmond won three flags with Castagna, they lost Rance and won 2 flags afterwards. No list is ever complete without holes, the salary cap doesn't allow for it. It's up to the coaches to develop a game style that covers any small position deficiencies - have our coaches done that on a consistent basis? I don't reckon.

Anyway, all part of the ebbs and flows. Our window will be open for the next few years, I didn't think we'd be ready until 2025-2026, but geez given how open - and in my opinion, weak - the comp is this year, it's a golden opportunity to snag it and I have a feeling if we did, this groups confidence would make us almost unbeatable going into the next 4-5 years.

 

[Blue Pulse]

Agree….but I am getting tired of our recent coaches all needing support etc. I want a coach that can coach tactically and emotionally.

The modern day footy coach needs to be innovative…and come up with a game plan and a list that is effective during that era.

Clarko the grub and hawks were super impressive with their maintain possession and good kicking style which netted them 3-4 flags.

Hardwick introduced the forward press and a list that played it so well - 3 flags

Fly went to filth with a clear plan …tweaked the list and played an effective game plan which produced a flag. Winning so many tight finishes could not have been coincidence…they had a plan

We’re in no man’s land still trying to learn the turnover game with a list that doesn’t appear to be suitably skilled for it. Our mids can’t sustain good slick ball movement often enough to creat goal opportunities from.

We also have one of the best forward combos in H and Charlie but our delivery is often crap…our go to is kick it long h or Charlie will sort it out. Doesn’t work against good defending teams unfortunately.

We are playing catch up whilst other teams are developing game plans that are blowing oppos out of the water…latest being the hawks…again.

Imagine us going to Adelaide to thrash the crows??

Agree with this, a coaches job is to bring out a teams strengths and hide their weaknesses, I believe we rely too much on the natural talent of our stars rather than a team gameplan.

 

[jj1978]

those coaches all had the same thing in common. They used the list to do what the list was best at.

Hawks, tigers, Geelong, even the pies have pretty different game plans (recent pies similar to tiges but old pies ~2010 not) which come down to answering 'what are my personnel best at'

What are Carlton's personnel best at? Are they used that way?

Bingo, hence why these layers are doing my head in. If you want specific layers, then recruit players apt for those layers, if you don't have the (fit/available) players that can do it then you have to play to the strengths of the ones you have. Nothing wrong with plan B's and C's, but don't sell Peter to pay Paul.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Who's called for his head?

Just think hit pieces with a headline saying "Carlton is badly coached" will encourage it

 

[Soapy V]

Agree with this, a coaches job is to bring out a teams strengths and hide their weaknesses, I believe we rely too much on the natural talent of our stars rather than a team gameplan.

Question I have is when Voss started and we were struggling his message was all about defence first. It seemed to be his entire focus and it looked to be clicking in the 2nd half of last year.

That seems to have fallen away dramatically all over the ground.

What happened?