Moira Deeming v John Pesutto

[Sttew]

Oh yay, two toll roads that absolutely nothing to solve congestion!

You really are ignorant!

Do you think Melbourne is a static city? In 1996 its population was 3 million. It’s now 5.5 million.

The two tunnels and Citylink connected three freeways and you mock it as inconsequential?

Architecturally nice, but didn't even last 20 years before it needed a major expansion

MCEC was expanded 20 years after it was built, and it will be expanded again and again. That is testimony to the success of Melbourne’s conference and exhibition calendar.

The convention centre built in Sydney in the late 80’s was demolished and rebuilt twice the size.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

You really are ignorant!

No u

Do you think Melbourne is a static city? In 1996 its population was 3 million. It’s now 5.5 million.

The two tunnels and Citylink connected three freeways and you mock it as inconsequential?

Yes. And I actually know what I'm talking about, since I work in the field. New highways do nothing for alleviating congestion because of the induced demand effect. They encourage more people to drive, thus restoring the previous congestion within a couple of months.

The only ways to actually solve congestion are by building infrastructure for transport modes that can handle the induced demand effect more efficiently because they need far less dedicated space to move the same number of people: walking, cycling and public transport. If the goal is alleviating congestion, then building more highways is like flushing money down the toilet.

MCEC was expanded 20 years after it was built, and it will be expanded again and again. That is testimony to the success of Melbourne’s conference and exhibition calendar.

The convention centre built in Sydney in the late 80’s was demolished and rebuilt twice the size.

There's this principle called do it once, do it right. Build at too small a scale and you'll be back doing it again well before the life expectancy of the infrastructure. Abbott and Turnbull screwed up the NBN this way.

 

[Festerz]

Thier next best owned a Krispy Kreme.

Only because Mr Whippy vans are no longer a thing.

 

[nobbyiscool]

Need some state Teals

I grew up in Tassie during a period when we came to loathe tree tories.

 

[hamohawk1]

This is legit essendonesque by the liberals.
Were looking likely to walk the next election, primed for change - yet do this and may be at sea for another 4 years.

The fact they also turfed any women to have an all male cabinet lol

 

[QuietB]

Vic Libs are now the Pentecostal party, never let these absolute nutjobs gain an ounce of power

Is Brad Battin confirmed Pentecostal?

 

[QuietB]

I grew up in Tassie during a period when we came to loathe tree tories.

Why?

 

[QuietB]

Only because Mr Whippy vans are no longer a thing.

In Berwick they are

 

[Bunk Moreland]

 

[Abers]

So the 2024-25 public service wage bill was forecast at $34.77 billion, and it's now been upgraded to $37.52 billion.

Note- it was $18.8 billion in 2014. Doubled in a decade.

But, how does this actually happen?

How is it even possible to be under by almost 10%?

Did Pallas sit there with a bottle of wine, throwing darts at numbers on a wall. "Oh $34 billion, that sounds nice!"

What they all doing?

 

[Abers]

Obviously it was going to be extended past 2002 - how else is Scotch college going to pay for their building program

Another fine example of how the private sector does things best

Scotch College controls the Victorian Labor Party?

 

[Frank Bunn]

Yes. And I actually know what I'm talking about, since I work in the field. New highways do nothing for alleviating congestion because of the induced demand effect. They encourage more people to drive, thus restoring the previous congestion within a couple of months.

The only ways to actually solve congestion are by building infrastructure for transport modes that can handle the induced demand effect more efficiently because they need far less dedicated space to move the same number of people: walking, cycling and public transport. If the goal is alleviating congestion, then building more highways is like flushing money down the toilet.

You completely missed Sttew's point. There wouldn't need to be huge infrastructure projects and induced demand if Melbourne's population hadn't almost doubled in size in 30 years. Politicians of all shades love high immigration because they can claim 'economic growth'. But no one voted for Melbourne's population to double in such short space of time.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

You completely missed Sttew's point.

No I got the point, I just ignored it because it's completely irrelevant to the workings of state politics. State governments do not control the immigration rate, so there's no use complaining about immigration in that regard. Their role is to provide the infrastructure and services that they're responsible for. If they choose to build inefficient infrastructure, then they're just frittering away taxpayer money while the residents of the state suffer a continued strain on infrastructure.

Mind you, I have the same criticisms of Dan Andrews for his ridiculous West Gate Tunnel, though at least that's not quite as much of a turkey as East-West Link would have been.

There wouldn't need to be huge infrastructure projects and induced demand if Melbourne's population hadn't almost doubled in size in 30 years.

I must have explained induced demand really badly if your conclusion is it wouldn't happen with a smaller increase in population. Here's a short video on the topic.

Politicians of all shades love high immigration because they can claim 'economic growth'. But no one voted for Melbourne's population to double in such short space of time.

Since this topic has been brought up, I think it's incorrect to blame all the population growth on immigration when there was internal migration towards Melbourne in that time frame too. A significant number of people moved from Sydney to Melbourne, for example.

 

[PJays]

The Age reporting in multiple articles that Battin is "non-religious" and a "self-described atheist".

Apologies for bringing that news to the peanut gallery of BigFooty!

 

[treeebeard]

Shows how out of touch whoever decides the most livable city is as Melourne is a dirty over populated piece of crap probably only more livable than Sydney out of our capitals and will fall below them soon the way things are going.

There is a reason more and more long term residents are heading to Geelong and Ballarat.

On SM-A136B using BigFooty.com mobile app

They go by more than the feels you have. The EIU’s report examines 173 cities using 30 indicators divided into several categories, including stability, healthcare, culture, environment, education and infrastructure, then ranks them on a 100-point scale. The aim? To show how comfortable these cities are to live in.

 

[Frank Bunn]

No I got the point, I just ignored it because it's completely irrelevant to the workings of state politics. State governments do not control the immigration rate, so there's no use complaining about immigration in that regard. Their role is to provide the infrastructure and services that they're responsible for. If they choose to build inefficient infrastructure, then they're just frittering away taxpayer money while the residents of the state suffer a continued strain on infrastructure.

The old 'states don't control immigration' chestnut.

Morrison went to COAG wanting to gain the states’ co-operation in lowering Australia’s migration rate. Andrews maintained he was neutral on Melbourne's population growth but he voted against the proposal. Only Gladys Berejiklian for NSW was in favour.

Andrews supported high immigration because it allowed him to claim economic growth. It's fake because GDP growth per person is stagnant. Victorians are not getting better off financially, while Melbourne is becoming an overcrowded shit hole.

 

[adogsfan5]

The Age reporting in multiple articles that Battin is "non-religious" and a "self-described atheist".

Apologies for bringing that news to the peanut gallery of BigFooty!

 

[Rob R]

The old 'states don't control immigration' chestnut.

Morrison went to COAG wanting to gain the states’ co-operation in lowering Australia’s migration rate. Andrews maintained he was neutral on Melbourne's population growth but he voted against the proposal. Only Gladys Berejiklian for NSW was in favour.

Andrews supported high immigration because it allowed him to claim economic growth. It's fake because GDP growth per person is stagnant. Victorians are not getting better off financially, while Melbourne is becoming an overcrowded shit hole.

Scomo could have done the right thing and made targeted cuts to immigration but in reality he didn't want to as both parties are addicted to the fake growth that excessive immigration brings and the donor money that profits from it. He just went to COAG as an excuse not to do anything as he knew the state premiers wanted the floodgates left open .

On SM-A136B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[peetoo]

Scomo could have done the right thing and made targeted cuts to immigration but in reality he didn't want to as both parties are addicted to the fake growth that excessive immigration brings and the donor money that profits from it. He just went to COAG as an excuse not to do anything as he knew the state premiers wanted the floodgates left open .

On SM-A136B using BigFooty.com mobile app

Scomo? Dutton was supremo of all things immigration. Complained about not enough discretionary power but the whole thing sucked under him anyway

 

[PJays]

I only started following politics in 2010 and then stopped in 2014 - you squibbed my question so why should I bother with yours

Ok, I'll take your bait.

Achievements of Liberal in Victoria since Kennett:

1. Not being Labor and not leading Victoria into the mess we currently find ourselves in.

If you need more than that....

2. In 2013, under a Liberal government, Victoria was the only Australian state rated AAA by all major credit agencies.

3. Surplus budget positions. $2 billion surplus in 2014.

4. The Royal Commission on Institutional child abuse.

5. Founded IBAC.

6. In 2012 Ted Bailleau visited China for a trade event attended by 400 Victorian businesses with events in 26 Chinese cities. At that time, Australia's largest ever trade delegation in China.

A solid list of achievements.

Nonetheless, I have no interest in defending Liberal's record. I'm not a Liberal party supporter. I'm also not a fan of Bailleau or Napthine particularly as individuals.

My position is simply that Victoria's in a worsening position in many respects, and terrible governance by Labor has contributed to that worsening position. After a decade, we need a change.

Now, feel free to answer my question.

Which of these crucial areas are in better shape than 2014?

- Health system

- Budget position & financial sustainability

- Education

- Crime rates

- Justice system

 

[peetoo]

Ok, I'll take your bait.

Achievements of Liberal in Victoria since Kennett:

1. Not being Labor and not leading Victoria into the mess we currently find ourselves in.

If you need more than that....

2. In 2013, under a Liberal government, Victoria was the only Australian state rated AAA by all major credit agencies.

3. Surplus budget positions. $2 billion surplus in 2014.

4. The Royal Commission on Institutional child abuse.

5. Founded IBAC.

6. In 2012 Ted Bailleau visited China for a trade event attended by 400 Victorian businesses with events in 26 Chinese cities. At that time, Australia's largest ever trade delegation in China.

A solid list of achievements.

Nonetheless, I have no interest in defending Liberal's record. I'm not a Liberal party supporter. I'm also not a fan of Bailleau or Napthine particularly as individuals.

My position is simply that Victoria's in a worsening position in many respects, and terrible governance by Labor has contributed to that worsening position. After a decade, we need a change.

Now, feel free to answer my question.

Which of these crucial areas are in better shape than 2014?

- Health system

- Budget position & financial sustainability

- Education

- Crime rates

- Justice system

Did wonders for every other Australian state as engineers and other infrastucture professsionals left victoria in huge numbers

 

[Not Important]

just what the reactionaries need: two wallopers as leaders. from his presser, battin has had a charisma bypass. and having the wet behind-the-ears former tennis player as the best they can do as deputy shows how barren they are for talent. talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

might have a gander at labor’s odds.

this, from the age of yesterday:

“In truth, the party room he inherits from John Pesutto is riven by the same divisions and rivalries that devoured an opposition leader who was popular with the public, beating Labor in the polls and positioning his party for a serious tilt at government.”

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Ok, I'll take your bait.

Achievements of Liberal in Victoria since Kennett:

1. Not being Labor and not leading Victoria into the mess we currently find ourselves in.

If you need more than that....

2. In 2013, under a Liberal government, Victoria was the only Australian state rated AAA by all major credit agencies.

3. Surplus budget positions. $2 billion surplus in 2014.

4. The Royal Commission on Institutional child abuse.

5. Founded IBAC.

6. In 2012 Ted Bailleau visited China for a trade event attended by 400 Victorian businesses with events in 26 Chinese cities. At that time, Australia's largest ever trade delegation in China.

A solid list of achievements.

Nonetheless, I have no interest in defending Liberal's record. I'm not a Liberal party supporter. I'm also not a fan of Bailleau or Napthine particularly as individuals.

My position is simply that Victoria's in a worsening position in many respects, and terrible governance by Labor has contributed to that worsening position. After a decade, we need a change.

Now, feel free to answer my question.

Which of these crucial areas are in better shape than 2014?

- Health system

- Budget position & financial sustainability

- Education

- Crime rates

- Justice system

Not sure the financial position and “achievements” are much to take credit for when you get there by just selling everything the government owns or runs.