Training Preseason Training Thread - 2024/25

[Keys]

 

[PremiershipNo4]

So do we still have a spot on the list for Burgiel?

From the training reports, where he is way back with the talls in the running drills, he really needs to pull his finger out to prove he deserves a chance.
I know he’s had injuries, but hasn’t really shown much.

 

[We_The_West]

Did anyone catch a glimpse of Friday's training? Anything to report outside the two articles?

 

[DorothyG]

I want to see Chesser and Johnston and the young blokes getting 20+ touches in the WAFL and impacting games before they get called up to the AFL to man the gimp wing...

This will be Chessers 4th season, approaching the 50 game mark.
As one of our few top 20 picks of that era, he really needs to be at the point where he is regularly getting 20+ in the League team, let alone the WAFL. And if he is running around with the Beagles, he needs to be dominating games.
20 touches in the WAFL would be a disappointing result for mine

 

[nameless]

To put this in context Geelong paid 17 for Bailey Smith and wouldn't budge.

So 14 for Baker seems a good deal then?

Smith coming off an ACL, has attitude problems, won't be in any leadership groups and who knows if he finds his good form again?

Baker perfect for our young group, sure he's 2 years older but he brings excellent experience, leadership and is a tough player.

Talent alone no denying Smith has it, but will he continue to produce? Too many question marks for mine

 

[Grahame]

So 14 for Baker seems a good deal then?

Smith coming off an ACL, has attitude problems, won't be in any leadership groups and who knows if he finds his good form again?

Baker perfect for our young group, sure he's 2 years older but he brings excellent experience, leadership and is a tough player.

Talent alone no denying Smith has it, but will he continue to produce? Too many question marks for mine

Yep both the up and down sides for Smith are far far greater than Baker - who we were pretty assured we knew what we were getting. Smith's a gamble a top side can take.

Also, undiscussed, is that maybe getting Baker possibly meant we also got another solid citizen in Graham for SFA. That is, 14 for Baker (and Graham)?

 

[WCE_phil]

The difference between Bailey Smith

3

Bailey Smith

Age

24

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

and Baker is huge. Yes Smith is much more talented, younger and has shown a higher ceiling. However he's a mercenary with major off field issues who only wanted to go to Geelong.

Baker had decided to come to West Coast however if a suitable deal couldn't be sorted and we didn't get Graham across he was happy to stay at the Tigers, at least for a year.

Did Clarke make mistakes. Yes he did, he telegraphed the commitment and made a really, really stupid comment publicly however the tigers team aren't morons and knew exactly what was going on. They held the upper hand to begin with no matter who was negotiating.

After the Hawks traded out pick 14 we were between a rock and a hard place and as I've already mentioned pick 3 was going to be split anyway. We knew Lalor was rising up the board and he was the target for pick 3. Once we knew it was at best 50/50 that neither Lalor or FOS would be available it was always going to be split.

Carlton had already talked to North as soon as they knew they were getting pick 14 for a trade up and were turned down.

Even if you look at the absolute best case scenario it would have been our second + future second. The club would have ended up with 12,14 and still picked the same 2 player as we did with 12 and 26 and likely the same trade with Port to get what ended up being pick 46.

The only thing Clarke can really be disparaged for is upsetting not only the Hawks but also the rest of the WCE team during the Hawks negotiations so that he had to be pulled from the table. We ended up with what I consider a bloody good deal out of the Hawks all things considered even if I do say so myself.

Clarke will have learnt a lot, Pyke a fair bit too. Overall mistakes were made but it was a very productive trade and draft period and the club not only ended up with everything they were chasing but also an improved draft hand for next year.

 

[squashface]

The difference between Bailey Smith and Baker is huge. Yes Smith is much more talented, younger and has shown a higher ceiling. However he's a mercenary with major off field issues who only wanted to go to Geelong.

Baker had decided to come to West Coast however if a suitable deal couldn't be sorted and we didn't get Graham across he was happy to stay at the Tigers, at least for a year.

Did Clarke make mistakes. Yes he did, he telegraphed the commitment and made a really, really stupid comment publicly however the tigers team aren't morons and knew exactly what was going on. They held the upper hand to begin with no matter who was negotiating.

After the Hawks traded out pick 14 we were between a rock and a hard place and as I've already mentioned pick 3 was going to be split anyway. We knew Lalor was rising up the board and he was the target for pick 3. Once we knew it was at best 50/50 that neither Lalor or FOS would be available it was always going to be split.

Carlton had already talked to North as soon as they knew they were getting pick 14 for a trade up and were turned down.

Even if you look at the absolute best case scenario it would have been our second + future second. The club would have ended up with 12,14 and still picked the same 2 player as we did with 12 and 26 and likely the same trade with Port to get what ended up being pick 46.

The only thing Clarke can really be disparaged for is upsetting not only the Hawks but also the rest of the WCE team during the Hawks negotiations so that he had to be pulled from the table. We ended up with what I consider a bloody good deal out of the Hawks all things considered even if I do say so myself.

Clarke will have learnt a lot, Pyke a fair bit too. Overall mistakes were made but it was a very productive trade and draft period and the club not only ended up with everything they were chasing but also an improved draft hand for next year.

I feel like not much is being spoken about that being a really fckn weird request from Baker.

“I’ll only come if you sign Jack Graham too”

Why does a professional footballer being paid a helluva lot of money need his friend to come with him?

 

[WCE_phil]

I feel like not much is being spoken about that being a really fckn weird request from Baker.

“I’ll only come if you sign Jack Graham too”

Why does a professional footballer being paid a helluva lot of money need his friend to come with him?

They are very close friends and both hugely positive individuals. It was a package deal and the tigers knew it. If we could have got Richmond band 3 instead of band 4 compo we would have been in a better situation. Personally I feel as though the AFL ****ed us over there and Richmond to a lesser extent considering how generous they were particularly with Battle.

I'd much rather slightly overpay for good people than to miss the target (Even if it's not my target or my decision). Will clubs like Essendon, Geelong and Port continue to be complete campaigners to us? Likely, however the club has really, really good relationships with pretty much every other team in the league.

Yes I know Baker is nowhere near the level of Judd, but Judd did the exact same thing for the eagles that Baker did for Richmond in making sure that the club he had won premierships with were adequately compensated.

The club has/had a leadership shortage on field and on the track. Bringing in Woosh and Hurn off field as well as getting Harry Taylor out there as well combined with Baker and Graham as mature players on the field will make a huge difference.

Sure we might not get there, we might not even get close but the club is aiming for a minimum of 8 wins next year.

Also whilst I might have been a big sceptical before Mini came to the club ever since walking in that door every single step he's taken has been a winner. Energised, positive around the group, heavily involved in what he is chasing through the trade and draft periods and how to progress. I now having spent time around him believe we 100% made the right decision.

I also don't think people realise just how much of a positive it has been having Woosh back at the club either. He may have been a pretty good but not great coach but as a leader and dual premiership captain with his experience and in particular his enthusiasm back the club imo is in a really great place off field now.

Yes we're still short of about 7-8 good talents with 1-2 of those needing to be elite level talents but if we can secure that over the next couple of years I believe we now have the major pieces in place to develop a list that can challenge for a premiership.

6 months ago I honestly didn't even really have hope of that.

 

[DorothyG]

I feel like not much is being spoken about that being a really fckn weird request from Baker.

“I’ll only come if you sign Jack Graham too”

Why does a professional footballer being paid a helluva lot of money need his friend to come with him?

Happens in alot of industries, senior/experienced employees move between companies and if they are moving to a more managerial/leadership roles position, it's not uncommon for them to try and bring loyal/trustworthy work colleagues along with them. You want good deputies by your side.

Just a quirk of the AFL where employee movement is a bit more nuanced

 

[Mattman93]

Even if you look at the absolute best case scenario it would have been our second + future second. The club would have ended up with 12,14 and still picked the same 2 player as we did with 12 and 26

Wouldn't have gone Allan and M.Reid (if available), given we had them 8 and 10?

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

Take this how you will.
Karl Langdon mentioned on radio week or so back that he'd been talking to Mark Stone, (new Perth Demons coach).
Stone had done an analysis of injuries across the WAFL past x number of years and Lathlain was clearly No 1.
The insinuation was that the surface is an issue.
Unsure if this has any relevance to the dethatching.
Mark Stone is very thorough.

Mark leaves no stone unturned

 

[Dark Sharks]

Phil goes BANG


Just like he does in Boracay

 

[eaglevision]

Phil goes BANG


Just like he does in Boracay

Cocomangas inbound!

 

[Bender_]

Cocomangas inbound!

Depends which island he's on - could just as likely be gonzagas inbound.

 

[eaglevision]

Depends which island he's on - could just as likely be gonzagas inbound.

What’s your bet? My money’s on Boracay.

 

[flamingEMBERS]

They are very close friends and both hugely positive individuals. It was a package deal and the tigers knew it. If we could have got Richmond band 3 instead of band 4 compo we would have been in a better situation. Personally I feel as though the AFL ****ed us over there and Richmond to a lesser extent considering how generous they were particularly with Battle.

I'd much rather slightly overpay for good people than to miss the target (Even if it's not my target or my decision). Will clubs like Essendon, Geelong and Port continue to be complete campaigners to us? Likely, however the club has really, really good relationships with pretty much every other team in the league.

Yes I know Baker is nowhere near the level of Judd, but Judd did the exact same thing for the eagles that Baker did for Richmond in making sure that the club he had won premierships with were adequately compensated.

The club has/had a leadership shortage on field and on the track. Bringing in Woosh and Hurn off field as well as getting Harry Taylor out there as well combined with Baker and Graham as mature players on the field will make a huge difference.

Sure we might not get there, we might not even get close but the club is aiming for a minimum of 8 wins next year.

Also whilst I might have been a big sceptical before Mini came to the club ever since walking in that door every single step he's taken has been a winner. Energised, positive around the group, heavily involved in what he is chasing through the trade and draft periods and how to progress. I now having spent time around him believe we 100% made the right decision.

I also don't think people realise just how much of a positive it has been having Woosh back at the club either. He may have been a pretty good but not great coach but as a leader and dual premiership captain with his experience and in particular his enthusiasm back the club imo is in a really great place off field now.

Yes we're still short of about 7-8 good talents with 1-2 of those needing to be elite level talents but if we can secure that over the next couple of years I believe we now have the major pieces in place to develop a list that can challenge for a premiership.

6 months ago I honestly didn't even really have hope of that.

Great to hear some positive things about our recruits and coach. We definitely need positive people and leaders around the club.

Nisbett, Simpson and the credits crew have a lot to answer for.

 

[Seadog]

Surely you can understand though. And it's not like it was just the average pundit thought the deal didn't make sense. To put this in context Geelong paid 17 for Bailey Smith and wouldn't budge.

It depends which picks you have in your pocket doesn't it? We didn't have a late teens pick for Baker which is probably what his value was. You have to play with the cards you've got. We folded too easily I agree but at the end of the day the sun goes down, comes up the next morning and we move on.

 

[DorothyG]

It depends which picks you have in your pocket doesn't it? We didn't have a late teens pick for Baker which is probably what his value was. You have to play with the cards you've got. We folded too easily I agree but at the end of the day the sun goes down, comes up the next morning and we move on.

I've made this point before re. trading picks for players.

The pick number traded is irrelevant to what the players is worth. You can only trade what you have and only trade with other willing clubs.

 

[Cornelius Roy]

They are very close friends and both hugely positive individuals. It was a package deal and the tigers knew it. If we could have got Richmond band 3 instead of band 4 compo we would have been in a better situation. Personally I feel as though the AFL ****ed us over there and Richmond to a lesser extent considering how generous they were particularly with Battle.

I'd much rather slightly overpay for good people than to miss the target (Even if it's not my target or my decision). Will clubs like Essendon, Geelong and Port continue to be complete campaigners to us? Likely, however the club has really, really good relationships with pretty much every other team in the league.

Yes I know Baker is nowhere near the level of Judd, but Judd did the exact same thing for the eagles that Baker did for Richmond in making sure that the club he had won premierships with were adequately compensated.

The club has/had a leadership shortage on field and on the track. Bringing in Woosh and Hurn off field as well as getting Harry Taylor out there as well combined with Baker and Graham as mature players on the field will make a huge difference.

Sure we might not get there, we might not even get close but the club is aiming for a minimum of 8 wins next year.

Also whilst I might have been a big sceptical before Mini came to the club ever since walking in that door every single step he's taken has been a winner. Energised, positive around the group, heavily involved in what he is chasing through the trade and draft periods and how to progress. I now having spent time around him believe we 100% made the right decision.

I also don't think people realise just how much of a positive it has been having Woosh back at the club either. He may have been a pretty good but not great coach but as a leader and dual premiership captain with his experience and in particular his enthusiasm back the club imo is in a really great place off field now.

Yes we're still short of about 7-8 good talents with 1-2 of those needing to be elite level talents but if we can secure that over the next couple of years I believe we now have the major pieces in place to develop a list that can challenge for a premiership.

6 months ago I honestly didn't even really have hope of that.

Kudos on the lalor call, I remember you calling him as a favourite from pretty much day 1 this year.

In addition to mini do you have any insight into clay halls early season at the club. I was a little bit down on him towards the end of last year but seeing how he’s come back, the link with Ginbey and things like attending draftees I’m really liking his contributions/leadership and now pulling for him to lock down a starting role in the team.

 

[Dark Sharks]

Today's the day ladies. Gird your loins..

Who's at the airport?

 

[We_The_West]

Anyone heading down to training today?

 

[Byron_Clanger]

I assume everyone's back on deck today? Hope we get some good shots of the new blokes out on the track...young and old

Sure we'll get a write up from Splinters soon enough

 

[Dark Sharks]

In the absence of Keys, I took a trundle down to check them out on ret........

 

[LittleFires]

Anyone heading down to training today?

 

[Ghossein]

heard the boys ran out to start training and Grego ran through the pack like a bowling ball to assert dominance and now the entire squad has entered concussion protocols