Discussion Random Discussion

[MUFKilda]

What's the APEX gang?

 

[CursingFijian]

https://www.msnbc.com/the-beat-with-ari-melber/watch/key-mueller-witness-i-lied-and-i-m-ready-to-die-in-jail-1383185475967?v=railb&

Fascinating.

 

[gringo2011]

What's the APEX gang?

South Sudanese teenagers that apparently terrorise people but I've never seen any of them. They are almost mythical in Melbourne, our federal politicians claim you can't go out at night to restaurants because they roam in packs. Sensationalist media talk about them all the time. My daughter has a friend from Burundi and she gets told to get out of shops because she's obviously a gang member if she's black. I'm sure there are African teens that commit crimes and some are violent but the idea that there is a big gang that gets around terrorising the general population is false. There is more likely some disaffected youth that steal cars and commit robberies that happen to be in small groups all acting independently.

 

[MUFKilda]

South Sudanese teenagers that apparently terrorise people but I've never seen any of them. They are almost mythical in Melbourne, our federal politicians claim you can't go out at night to restaurants because they roam in packs. Sensationalist media talk about them all the time. My daughter has a friend from Burundi and she gets told to get out of shops because she's obviously a gang member if she's black. I'm sure there are African teens that commit crimes and some are violent but the idea that there is a big gang that gets around terrorising the general population is false. There is more likely some disaffected youth that steal cars and commit robberies that happen to be in small groups all acting independently.

I wonder what these folk would make of it? Pauline Hanson's predecessors, 1962? The old boy at 5:32 might be a relative of hers

 

[bergholt]

The problem is you never know the purity of the stuff or what it’s been cut with plus you have the added problem that junkies will take just about anything in a pinch and there’s heaps more shit on the streets.

Pretty easy to fix that. Legalising drugs obviously makes the purity known and reduces the prices/danger of getting them. That minimises harm. Not sure I'd legalise everything but just doing pot would be a good start. I'd investigate the possibility of doing ecstasy as well, maybe even heroin - very few people on those drugs damage others.

 

[gringo2011]

Pretty easy to fix that. Legalising drugs obviously makes the purity known and reduces the prices/danger of getting them. That minimises harm. Not sure I'd legalise everything but just doing pot would be a good start. I'd investigate the possibility of doing ecstasy as well, maybe even heroin - very few people on those drugs damage others.

Portugal decriminalised heroin with success in reducing prison numbers, crime and deaths. Costs them a heap less policing drugs too.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Pretty easy to fix that. Legalising drugs obviously makes the purity known and reduces the prices/danger of getting them. That minimises harm. Not sure I'd legalise everything but just doing pot would be a good start. I'd investigate the possibility of doing ecstasy as well, maybe even heroin - very few people on those drugs damage others.

Not sure anyone ever OD'd on Pot. ( so your legalisation of it is not effective for that).
E has all sorts of unknown health effects.
Heroin, in its pure state not so much.

South Sudanese teenagers that apparently terrorise people but I've never seen any of them. They are almost mythical in Melbourne, our federal politicians claim you can't go out at night to restaurants because they roam in packs. Sensationalist media talk about them all the time. My daughter has a friend from Burundi and she gets told to get out of shops because she's obviously a gang member if she's black. I'm sure there are African teens that commit crimes and some are violent but the idea that there is a big gang that gets around terrorising the general population is false. There is more likely some disaffected youth that steal cars and commit robberies that happen to be in small groups all acting independently.

The orignal group was a family who lived in Apex street in Dandenong North.
No they're not that organised but it really pisses people out in the burbs here off when you CBD dwellers start to claim they aren't real.

My 19 year old daughter came home one day, while the cars including hers were backed up at the lights, they started going along the lines with bats, smashing windscreens in. She was pretty relieved when the cops arrived and the "non-gang" ran off.
I often eat out in Dandenong, never had a problem, and there are plenty of blacks around, you'd be nuts to assume they are all criminals.
But there ARE criminals, they have connections with other criminals and they are scary shit.
And sometimes they all get together in a big group. Lately even in your CBD there have been some messed up scenes lately.

 

[Yawkey way]

South Sudanese teenagers that apparently terrorise people but I've never seen any of them. They are almost mythical in Melbourne, our federal politicians claim you can't go out at night to restaurants because they roam in packs. Sensationalist media talk about them all the time. My daughter has a friend from Burundi and she gets told to get out of shops because she's obviously a gang member if she's black. I'm sure there are African teens that commit crimes and some are violent but the idea that there is a big gang that gets around terrorising the general population is false. There is more likely some disaffected youth that steal cars and commit robberies that happen to be in small groups all acting independently.

I wouldn’t play it up but talking it down isn’t right either.

They have caused havoc around here robbing the same jewellery stores several times assaulting staff, assaulting beach goers and trashing St Kilda McDonald’s the assaults and attack of beach goers and the staff at Donovan’s.

It may well be a small number of people from that diaspora but car jacking, assault and violent home invasions are real crimes with real victims. They are disproportionately responsible for some violent crimes here in Melbourne that is a fact.

I’ve seen some of these guys in action they’re not just kids and the level of disrespect for the law is breathtaking. Driving down neapean highway at extreme speed with 8 or so in a car making threats to others is something to see. Watching two big guys load up a trolley at Safeway and walk out without paying threatening staff yep great stuff.

To have someone rent an air bnb then completely trash it with an uncontrolled party must be another good laugh. They had some African music nights next to the George for a while and they were banned because of the violence, now that’s something given the area and what passes for acceptable at times.

They’re not the only group behaving badly that’s true however when it’s reportedly a cultural norm to assemble and travel in rather large groups and some of those groups commit violent crimes then expect it to make headlines.

 

[pebblesofsand]

No doubt Sudanese are over represented in the crime figures in Melbourne - 0.1% of the population but 1% of the crime but that doesn't mean the the balance of the Sudanese population should be demonised by the media and politicians.

Facts are you are 70 times more likely to be bashed by someone born in Australia.

 

[Yawkey way]

Pretty easy to fix that. Legalising drugs obviously makes the purity known and reduces the prices/danger of getting them. That minimises harm. Not sure I'd legalise everything but just doing pot would be a good start. I'd investigate the possibility of doing ecstasy as well, maybe even heroin - very few people on those drugs damage others.

I saw a great doco many years ago about people I believe it was in London who were supplied herion as part of a trail.

They seemed to go about their lives in a normal fashion and held down good jobs, one was a lawyer.
So I tried to find it and couldn’t but I did find that some people do in fact get their herion and even cocaine on the nhs. It’s fearfully expensive at around $14,000 plus pounds per year and I’m still trying to find out if it’s a trial that’s being conducted or just a random quirk in the system, strangely I think it’s the latter.

 

[Yawkey way]

No doubt Sudanese are over represented in the crime figures in Melbourne - 0.1% of the population but 1% of the crime but that doesn't mean the the balance of the Sudanese population should be demonised by the media and politicians.

Facts are you are 70 times more likely to be bashed by someone born in Australia.

100% some federal politicians made a meal of it and how did that work out for them?.

I think it’s the level of violence, the types of crime being committed and the size of the groups. I don’t watch the news on tv but I do read the paper and yes they report violent crimes all the time and often with a description of the offenders, take a look at the age right now. That’s a white guy he’s described as Caucasian as he clearly is, why when you’re after an offender and have a description would you choose not to use it.

The police have talked it down but so long as the crime continues it will be reported which is fair enough imo. That was an extraordinary thing to release the names and photos of juvenile offenders this week that should give you some idea of the level of the crime committed.

 

[gringo2011]

I wouldn’t play it up but talking it down isn’t right either.

They have caused havoc around here robbing the same jewellery stores several times assaulting staff, assaulting beach goers and trashing St Kilda McDonald’s the assaults and attack of beach goers and the staff at Donovan’s.

It may well be a small number of people from that diaspora but car jacking, assault and violent home invasions are real crimes with real victims. They are disproportionately responsible for some violent crimes here in Melbourne that is a fact.

I’ve seen some of these guys in action they’re not just kids and the level of disrespect for the law is breathtaking. Driving down neapean highway at extreme speed with 8 or so in a car making threats to others is something to see. Watching two big guys load up a trolley at Safeway and walk out without paying threatening staff yep great stuff.

To have someone rent an air bnb then completely trash it with an uncontrolled party must be another good laugh. They had some African music nights next to the George for a while and they were banned because of the violence, now that’s something given the area and what passes for acceptable at times.

They’re not the only group behaving badly that’s true however when it’s reportedly a cultural norm to assemble and travel in rather large groups and some of those groups commit violent crimes then expect it to make headlines.

Are they Apex gangs robbing jewellers or people of African origin robbing them which gets reported as part of a huge organised gang that terrorises the community. I'm just suggesting in the media that it's reported as a gang when they aren't. A white group of guys steal a car and do petty crimes and they are just hooligans, African kids do it and it's a crime gang.

There is definitely a lack of respect for the law though, not sure it's just them.

 

[mightymalaka]

100% some federal politicians made a meal of it and how did that work out for them?.

I think it’s the level of violence, the types of crime being committed and the size of the groups. I don’t watch the news on tv but I do read the paper and yes they report violent crimes all the time and often with a description of the offenders, take a look at the age right now. That’s a white guy he’s described as Caucasian as he clearly is, why when you’re after an offender and have a description would you choose not to use it.

The police have talked it down but so long as the crime continues it will be reported which is fair enough imo. That was an extraordinary thing to release the names and photos of juvenile offenders this week that should give you some idea of the level of the crime committed.

Well the Age must be the only news agency that doesn't then!
As far I can see, just about every time there is a crime committed these days
The media have been on the front foot to make sure everyone knows that
They were African in origin!

 

[mightymalaka]

The whole scaremongering and fear reporting of the so called out of control
Crime wave and violence in Melbourne is way overblown and as usual led by an already
Hopelessly out of touch right leaning pollies and media ie Mr Murdoch!

We saw how well that went down with the mass population at
The election polls last week!

 

[mightymalaka]

I wonder what these folk would make of it? Pauline Hanson's predecessors, 1962? The old boy at 5:32 might be a relative of hers

That is classic! Very interesting indeed.
As you can see a lot of the fear is ignorance based More than a
Pathological hatred of all other races! Bar a couple of Ol geezers!

Was that the Queen at 1.40? lol

 

[Yawkey way]

Are they Apex gangs robbing jewellers or people of African origin robbing them which gets reported as part of a huge organised gang that terrorises the community. I'm just suggesting in the media that it's reported as a gang when they aren't. A white group of guys steal a car and do petty crimes and they are just hooligans, African kids do it and it's a crime gang.

There is definitely a lack of respect for the law though, not sure it's just them.

Yes the apex thing was overdone but really this African kids thing gives the impression that it’s just kids and at the minor end of offences.

Car jacking is not just stealing a car it’s a serious crime often involves violence and isn’t a bit of harmless fun, that and it’s a pretty new type of offence here. Visit the jewellers whose staff are traumatised and tell them it’s petty crime or the guys sitting in hospital beds having been beaten with poles etc.

It’s not all Sudanese anybody with half a brain understands that, it’s a serious problem from many different angles that needs serious solutions.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Six and a half foot tall guy kicks in your front door , holds a knife at your throat and asks for your car keys.
Its happened out my way more than once.

Its disgusting and you can play political games here all you like with your talk about elections etc.
Its bullshit, and we shouldn't need to live in gated communities cos thats the "cool thing to do overseas".

 

[mightymalaka]

Six and a half foot tall guy kicks in your front door , holds a knife at your throat and asks for your car keys.
Its happened out my way more than once.

Its disgusting and you can play political games here all you like with your talk about elections etc.
Its bullshit, and we shouldn't need to live in gated communities cos thats the "cool thing to do overseas".

Never said it's not a problem SS!
Clearly in certain areas they have a bigger presence and that kind of
Lawlessness is not on in any society!
My comment re elections is that for all the fear mongering and misrepresentation
The right media goes on with their attacks on minorities
That most discerning citizens see the truth behind the spin!

 

[bergholt]

Not sure anyone ever OD'd on Pot. ( so your legalisation of it is not effective for that).
E has all sorts of unknown health effects.
Heroin, in its pure state not so much.

I don't really care about the health effects on the individual, those exist already. Nicotine and alcohol have some pretty solid health effects too.

I'd be legalising so that people aren't pushed into the underworld attempting to get these things. I've bought my share of drugs over the years, been to some pretty dodgy places to do so. When they try to upsell you to ice or crack, given you're already talking to a dodgy dude it seems pretty natural. If you were buying some pot in a servo and there was no ice or crack available, it wouldn't be an option.

 

[bergholt]

No doubt Sudanese are over represented in the crime figures in Melbourne - 0.1% of the population but 1% of the crime but that doesn't mean the the balance of the Sudanese population should be demonised by the media and politicians.

No, but 0.1% and 1% is a clear statistical anomaly. Not sure what to do about it, and demonising the whole group is only going to make it worse, but presumably behind the scenes someone in law enforcement is trying to fix it.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

No, but 0.1% and 1% is a clear statistical anomaly. Not sure what to do about it, and demonising the whole group is only going to make it worse, but presumably behind the scenes someone in law enforcement is trying to fix it.

I "think" its getting better.
Some of the more serious repeat offenders have been deported i think.

Other issues relate to them getting arrested , given a chance, getting arrested again, getting let off because they have no priors, getting arrested , getting out on bail, breaching bail- no action taken.

My car was recovered ( trashed ). Prior to that some items were returned to me that were found in a park. Yeah some of it was mine, but there were manuals from five different cars. They caught some guys but had insufficient evidence to charge them. So the cops out here are getting pissed off at it all.
Now if they had charged them, the Statistics would have related 1 car theft to 1 person. As it stands ...unsolved.

 

[Joffaboy]

They have black skin, easy to demonize.
There are crims in all races, but expediate for the hard right of politics to play it up.

Worked a treat for the conservatives in the recent Victorian election. NOT.

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[gringo2011]

No, but 0.1% and 1% is a clear statistical anomaly. Not sure what to do about it, and demonising the whole group is only going to make it worse, but presumably behind the scenes someone in law enforcement is trying to fix it.

The Vietnamese had higher rates of crime, the Italians etc. Once they are a generation in they tend to blend in a lot more. There are plenty of Sudanese and Africans generally that are living a very normal existence but when they **** up it's more obvious. You tend to get a negative idea of races by the way they are reported. People think Indigenous Australians are poor marginalised people and while there are some there are plenty who are just citizens leading a normal life like everyone else. It's unhelpful to stigmatise races or religions because it changes the way they are viewed which leads to less chance to settle in and perpetuate the problem.

I heard a basketball coach on SEN saying he worked with Sudanese kids and they were respectful and lovely kids but the stadiums won't let them in to the competitions because they are worried about gangs. If they get left out of normal activities like that then it just encourages them to join in with other disaffected dick heads that cause trouble. Same as any race of young disaffected males who see limited futures.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

They have black skin, easy to demonize.
There are crims in all races, but expediate for the hard right of politics to play it up.

Worked a treat for the conservatives in the recent Victorian election. NOT.

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

Thanks for making it a racist issue

For what its worth.
I'd consider there are some pretty rough groups of Sudanese and sometimes Maori's round my area. I'm sorry if they don't group up like a TV sitcom, with 3 white guys, one of them gay, a token black and maybe an Asian for your super simple politically correct world.
I don't think there are any particular issues with dark skinned Australians, Indians, Americans. That's not to say that some of them aren't trash.

As was stated above the Sudanese are over-represented. There are well know reasons for it, mostly to do with the environment they came from, and its not because they are black. I do have issue with people not predicting that they were going to be trouble and we end up with them cruising the nearby suburbs looking to steal things and hurt people, and laughing at how soft our cops are compared to those back home.

Idiots like you telling people its not happening don't help. Now take your politics out of it.
If groups of Lithuanians were kicking in peoples doors and bashing them, I'd be racist against Lithuanians in your (partially closed ) eyes , for daring to mention it.

 

[gringo2011]

Thanks for making it a racist issue

For what its worth.
I'd consider there are some pretty rough groups of Sudanese and sometimes Maori's round my area. I'm sorry if they don't group up like a TV sitcom, with 3 white guys, one of them gay, a token black and maybe an Asian for your super simple politically correct world.
I don't think there are any particular issues with dark skinned Australians, Indians, Americans. That's not to say that some of them aren't trash.

As was stated above the Sudanese are over-represented. There are well know reasons for it, mostly to do with the environment they came from, and its not because they are black. I do have issue with people not predicting that they were going to be trouble and we end up with them cruising the nearby suburbs looking to steal things and hurt people, and laughing at how soft our cops are compared to those back home.

Idiots like you telling people its not happening don't help. Now take your politics out of it.
If groups of Lithuanians were kicking in peoples doors and bashing them, I'd be racist against Lithuanians in your (partially closed ) eyes , for daring to mention it.

Come on man, I like debating you on here because you are a considered and rational even though we don't always see eye to eye, but Joffa didn't all of a sudden turn it a racial issue. I think it was well and truely that before hand.