Preview Round 12 Fremantle v St Kilda

[TheLastEmperor]

just doing the ladder predictor and this game is about as important as they come. if we drop it i still have us finishing with 15 wins as well as freo but then percentage comes into player. right now there's only a few goals separating us. we win and freo have little chance of finishing above us.

 

[sainter]

We'll need to improve a hell of a lot to win this one but perhaps it's the challenge we need. Looking back at the Eagles game over there, it was the big guns who stood up when it counted and they'll need to play equally well this time around. I was concerned going into that game because I felt our defensive structure would not work on the bigger ground but was happily proven wrong.

A one week suspension to Sandilands would help our task no end. However we're pretty used to not getting the rub of the green from the MRP and I imagine this time tomorrow we'll be bemoaning the 1 week suspension to Hayes and the availability of Sandi.

Blake on Riewoldt didn't work and I think we'll have to play Chips on Pav from the start. That's even if Zac is available. I was surprised (and a little concerned) with our work at the stoppages the other night. Considering the strength of our midfield I didn't expect Richmond to belt us in the clearances but if it's only the statistical category we lose, as was the case the other night, we'll still win far more games than we'll lose.

I'm really looking forward to the game. A win over the Dockers in Perth would be a massive result but unfortunately signal the end of our time flying under the radar. Collingwood won again so we can at least enjoy one more week without much publicity.

BTW, Kosi is struggling. I don't think there's a need to tiptoe around the issue because it's a fact. That's not to say we all don't want him to succeed. Nothing would make us happier than seeing him find his confidence. Simon Templar has it spot on.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

BTW, Kosi is struggling. I don't think there's a need to tiptoe around the issue because it's a fact. That's not to say we all don't want him to succeed. Nothing would make us happier than seeing him find his confidence. Simon Templar has it spot on.

yep he's dreadfully out of form but he's still in our best 22. we can't drop him period. he's a better target then stanley and mcevoy and gardiner is required in the ruck. there's definitely no one in sandy that would be performing better than him and we have enough smalls i.e milne, schnieder and mcqualter. ppl calling for kosi to be dropped need to chill and think about what they are saying. the positive side of it is we don't have rooey, kosi is out of form and we're still sitting entrenched in the top 4 with a 8-3 record. happy days.

 

[Plugger35]

Yeah I think Fisher would be the best opponent for Pavlich, he's probably the only one of our players that can match him around the ground. He may not be able to provide as much run from defence as usual if he is on Pavlich but we'd still have Gilbert, Goddard and Raph Clarke for that.

If Fisher can at least break even with Pavlich and keep him to less than 3 goals it would be a win for us.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

We'll need to improve a hell of a lot to win this one but perhaps it's the challenge we need. Looking back at the Eagles game over there, it was the big guns who stood up when it counted and they'll need to play equally well this time around. I was concerned going into that game because I felt our defensive structure would not work on the bigger ground but was happily proven wrong.

A one week suspension to Sandilands would help our task no end. However we're pretty used to not getting the rub of the green from the MRP and I imagine this time tomorrow we'll be bemoaning the 1 week suspension to Hayes and the availability of Sandi.

Blake on Riewoldt didn't work and I think we'll have to play Chips on Pav from the start. That's even if Zac is available. I was surprised (and a little concerned) with our work at the stoppages the other night. Considering the strength of our midfield I didn't expect Richmond to belt us in the clearances but if it's only the statistical category we lose, as was the case the other night, we'll still win far more games than we'll lose.

I'm really looking forward to the game. A win over the Dockers in Perth would be a massive result but unfortunately signal the end of our time flying under the radar. Collingwood won again so we can at least enjoy one more week without much publicity.

BTW, Kosi is struggling. I don't think there's a need to tiptoe around the issue because it's a fact. That's not to say we all don't want him to succeed. Nothing would make us happier than seeing him find his confidence. Simon Templar has it spot on.

Wouldn't put Dawson on Pavlich in a fit, and I don't think Chips is the right person either. Try to play a key back on him and he will run off into the midfield. Would almost be worth playing Goddard on him, but maybe Gilbert could.
Kosi is quite simply our best full forward ATM. With only Cahill and Walsh doing much in the VFL. Maybe we could try someone else after Nick is back if he hasn't found his feet. Personally I think a run in the VFL, where he could learn to enjoy playing footy again, would do him a world of good.

 

[ChrisFooty]

Stanley is going to give Kosi some competition up forward. You would think only one of those two will be playing when Riewoldt gets back. Maybe Kosi future is in the ruck, as it looks like he is having very minimal impact up forward. Maybe the ruck is the way forward for Kosi? Gardiner and King can not go on forever.

 

[ChrisL#12]

Kosi is an easy target and quite frankly it's really really boring.....I'd rather have him there than not.....

Well the coaching staff disagree with you Chris......Or do you think you know more.

The anti Kosi comments are BORING and PREDICTABLE..... not to mention DISLOYAL.....

LAY OFF KOSI. Kosi is ok. Kosi will come good when you least expects it.

Well that's the problem isn't it?

 

[sainter]

Wouldn't put Dawson on Pavlich in a fit, and I don't think Chips is the right person either. Try to play a key back on him and he will run off into the midfield. Would almost be worth playing Goddard on him, but maybe Gilbert could.
Kosi is quite simply our best full forward ATM. With only Cahill and Walsh doing much in the VFL. Maybe we could try someone else after Nick is back if he hasn't found his feet. Personally I think a run in the VFL, where he could learn to enjoy playing footy again, would do him a world of good.

That's why Pav is such a champion I suppose.

You play him as a key forward and he'll give you a dozen marks and a handful of goals every week. However if the other team has a bit of momentum they can just stick him in the centre and he'll invariably win the next centre clearance.

I agree with you that Fisher couldn't go with him when he's playing in the midfield. In that situation we'd just have to back our own midfielders to win it out of the middle. You're right that Goddard and Gilbert would be good match-ups for him but I wouldn't think Ross would be prepared to give them a role that would force them to sacrifice their attacking prowess. While Chips is equally effective in that role, I just reckon he has to be the sacrificial lamb because he's more adept as a key defender.

 

[ChrisL#12]

BTW, Kosi is struggling. I don't think there's a need to tiptoe around the issue because it's a fact. That's not to say we all don't want him to succeed. Nothing would make us happier than seeing him find his confidence. Simon Templar has it spot on.

Well said sainter .

Also, I wasn't at all surprised about Richmond smashing us in the clearances. They have a very good bunch of midfielders despite what people think. Cousins, Cotchin, Foley, Martin, Deledio etc. All these players get more than their fair share of clearances so I wasn't too upset. What concerned me was that they went straight from the clearance to Reiwoldt forward. We didn't seem to force the turnover like we normally would have. Hopefully this is rectified come the Freo game this week.

 

[karmafree]

Starting to get a bit concerned about Schneider, I think he may come under pressure if he doesn't lift a little more. I'd have to say Kosi does look much better in the ruck running around like a mad man for brief periods of time. I am expecting a big improvement in the skills level from the Saints this week, they will be working on them during the week as such I think we are in for a easy win this week. Freo is about to hit a flat spot, young bodies are beginning to get tired, if it was the week after the bye I would be more concerned.
Plugger that was apathetic effort against the Eagles when we were over there! Where are you man? Couldn't see you. You have your seat already, let us know where to look for you from the TV angle. Get a poster or sign up...."The Knife Strikes!".
By the way all you Saints supporters did great against the Eagles, keep up the volume.

 

[mysainters]

Gwilt played OK on Goodes, had the big body to compete....he could be worth a try on Pav at times?

I think I have been guilty of judging Zac's form, without putting enough emphasis on his importance to the structure.

Jack Riewoldt would have had an entirely different experience with Jason Blake had Zac played, we need Blake playing the support role of getting back to help spoil the contest.

 

[Plugger35]

Starting to get a bit concerned about Schneider, I think he may come under pressure if he doesn't lift a little more. I'd have to say Kosi does look much better in the ruck running around like a mad man for brief periods of time. I am expecting a big improvement in the skills level from the Saints this week, they will be working on them during the week as such I think we are in for a easy win this week. Freo is about to hit a flat spot, young bodies are beginning to get tired, if it was the week after the bye I would be more concerned.
Plugger that was apathetic effort against the Eagles when we were over there! Where are you man? Couldn't see you. You have your seat already, let us know where to look for you from the TV angle. Get a poster or sign up...."The Knife Strikes!".
By the way all you Saints supporters did great against the Eagles, keep up the volume.

I'm in the opposite pocket to last time down at the city end which is more in view of the cameras so I might have a better chance of getting my head on tv this time. I'll try to organise a Stanley Knife sign, hopefully it won't get confiscated by the Nazi security guards that work there.

Not sure I agree with you about this being an easy win. Freo may have quite a few young players that may tire as the season goes on but they are still very tough to beat at Subi in front of their home crowd, as they showed against Geelong earlier this year.

If we approach this like a final and play with finals like intensity we should have a good chance as I think Freo are still susceptible under real finals like pressure.

 

[The Punter]

I'm making the trip west.

Eddy will be safe, as he was significantly better v Richmond than he was v Adelaide.

Dawson in for Geary, I think.

 

[Plugger35]

Really? I thought Geary was pretty good against Richmond and I'd definitely pick him ahead of Eddy.

 

[DarrenR]

Well that's the problem isn't it?

If Kosi gets back into form when we least expect it, then that will be every week, coz I expect stuff all from him and that's what I get. If the anti kosi complaints are getting boring it's probably because his form has been so consistently poor.
It always seems that the lowest five possession winners every round are the same group of circulating chaff, that can't seem to pull themselves out if the whirlpool created by the flushed toilet ie Geary, Eddy, Stanley, McEvoy, Stevens. Seems its been a while since a young player has demanded inclusion on form. Perhaps Dawson most recently.
Our younger players haven't come on like our imported rejects.

 

[Persevering Saint]

Goddard doesn't play in a position. He just does whatever the hell he wants.

Love that.

 

[The Punter]

Times in St Kilda's bottom five possession winners this year:

Gardiner 8
Dawson, McQualter 6
King, Koschitzke 5
McEvoy 4
Stanley 3
Eddy, Heyne, Armitage, Geary, Schneider 2
Steven, S Fisher, Peake, Clarke, Pattison, Baker, Gram, Riewoldt 1

 

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

If Kosi gets back into form when we least expect it, then that will be every week, coz I expect stuff all from him and that's what I get. If the anti kosi complaints are getting boring it's probably because his form has been so consistently poor.
It always seems that the lowest five possession winners every round are the same group of circulating chaff, that can't seem to pull themselves out if the whirlpool created by the flushed toilet ie Geary, Eddy, Stanley, McEvoy, Stevens. Seems its been a while since a young player has demanded inclusion on form. Perhaps Dawson most recently.
Our younger players haven't come on like our imported rejects.

Factor in our lowest draft pick since 2002 has been pick 9 I think? Can't recall who we took in 04 or 05...did we trade them? And we all know what happened in 09.

Plus the fact we've been in a premiership window all this time, means we can't fast track them like Carlton has, and Melbourne has done this year.

Ross also loves his 'apprenticeships'...

So all together I can see why we haven't had a Joel Selwood, Dan Rich, Rhys Palmer or Michael Hurley.

But then Freo proves all that wrong with Broughton, Barlow, De Boer et al. But then again, they probably didn't think they'd be fighting for a top 4 spot halfway through the season.

 

[Plugger35]

If Kosi gets back into form when we least expect it, then that will be every week, coz I expect stuff all from him and that's what I get. If the anti kosi complaints are getting boring it's probably because his form has been so consistently poor.
It always seems that the lowest five possession winners every round are the same group of circulating chaff, that can't seem to pull themselves out if the whirlpool created by the flushed toilet ie Geary, Eddy, Stanley, McEvoy, Stevens. Seems its been a while since a young player has demanded inclusion on form. Perhaps Dawson most recently.
Our younger players haven't come on like our imported rejects.

I think you're being a bit unfair on some of those younger players.

Geary has been pretty much the best and most consistent of our younger midfielders. Thought he was good against Richmond and I'd like to see him given an extended run in the team providing his form warrants it.

McEvoy and Stanley have showed some good signs at times and are worth sticking with. Most young big men take a while to develop and become consistent performers. Steven has a lot of potential too as a young midfielder but also lacks consistency.

Eddy is the only one who I would question as to whether he is up to AFL standard. He has been given a number of opportunities but hasn't shown any real progress so far and I doubt whether he has the upside to become a good AFL player. He works hard and has a go but I just think he lacks the required skill to be successful. He could maybe be turned into a tagger like Clinton Jones or just used as a depth player but I think Geary, Armitage, Steven or Heyne offer more upside and should be given opportunities ahead of him.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Factor in our lowest draft pick since 2002 has been pick 9 I think? Can't recall who we took in 04 or 05...did we trade them? And we all know what happened in 09.

Plus the fact we've been in a premiership window all this time, means we can't fast track them like Carlton has, and Melbourne has done this year.

Ross also loves his 'apprenticeships'...

So all together I can see why we haven't had a Joel Selwood, Dan Rich, Rhys Palmer or Michael Hurley.

But then Freo proves all that wrong with Broughton, Barlow, De Boer et al. But then again, they probably didn't think they'd be fighting for a top 4 spot halfway through the season.

First round pick 2004 was Mini, and I see no obvious picks we missed by going for him.
2005 trade for Watts, blahhhh , but once again no-one obvious in the draft there.
And no offense but out 2006 pick needs to pull his finger out when he's over his injury. In this case we could have had J Riewoldt, J Frawley, A Everitt.

 

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

First round pick 2004 was Mini, and I see no obvious picks we missed by going for him.
2005 trade for Watts, blahhhh , but once again no-one obvious in the draft there.
And no offense but out 2006 pick needs to pull his finger out when he's over his injury. In this case we could have had J Riewoldt, J Frawley, A Everitt.

Haha, you don't have to preface that with 'no offence'. I know he's not going good enough. Funnily enough I was annoyed when we took him over Roo II, but developed a love for him soon after.

Really hoping that these comparisons don't feature heavily on this board for the next couple months to years though...

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Haha, you don't have to preface that with 'no offence'. I know he's not going good enough. Funnily enough I was annoyed when we took him over Roo II, but developed a love for him soon after.

Really hoping that these comparisons don't feature heavily on this board for the next couple months to years though...

Apart from those I mentioned though, there are plenty of others in that draft that still need to make their mark, and Everitt is probably running on potential as well.

 

[sainter]

According to the MRP results just released, Lenny Hayes has received a reprimand and Sandilands has been cleared.

While it would have been nice to play the Dockers without Sandi the right decision was made in both instances.

Here are the results in full:

Lenny Hayes, St Kilda, has been charged with a Level One striking offence against Jeromey Webberley, Richmond, during the first quarter of the Round 11 match between St Kilda and Richmond, played at Etihad Stadium on Friday June 4, 2010.

In summary, he can accept a reprimand and 60 points towards his future record with an early plea.

The incident was assessed as negligent conduct (one point), low impact (one point) and high contact (two points). This is a total of four activation points, resulting in a classification of a Level One offence, drawing 80 demerit points and a reprimand. He has no existing good or bad record. An early plea reduces the sanction by 25 per cent to a reprimand and 60 points towards his future record.

Other MRP results here

 

[Defacto]

This game is going to be extremely tough. Was hoping sandilands would be out to give us the upper hand.

This is a must win. Freo have an easier draw after this.

 

[purpleblood29]

This game is going to be extremely tough. Was hoping sandilands would be out to give us the upper hand.

This is a must win. Freo have an easier draw after this.

Thats the main reason we need to win this game. Because our first half of the year has been ridiculously difficult. So if Fremantle can get as much wins as possible in that half, the second half I don't reckon should be a collapse.

A big game though, I have barely tipped freo all year so I don't reckon that would change. I'm a bit of a superstitious person when it comes to this kind of stuff .