Autopsy Round 24, 2024 - Saints defeat Boos

[hayes]

I’m staggered by how many shots on goal Phillipou is getting just quietly. He’s looking special.

 

[Jade Buddha]

The thing about culture is you can’t turn it on and off like a tap.
You can’t decide to lose then just decide to start winning.
It’s something that permeates the club from top to bottom. It’s not accepting 2nd best.
People outside of the saints community have always talked about us as having a loser mentality.
If we start choosing when to win and when to lose we will lose again and again.

In regards to list management.
There’s 2 sides to the coin.
Drafting and trading.
Drafting takes endless hours of work finding the talent and then having the system in place to grow that talent- part of that is also having the culture where players inspire each other with acts of bravery, skill and risk. Our last minute yesterday was one such moment. Jack Higgins got on the end of it but how good were the players that got it to him.

Trading requires players from opposition clubs to believe what you have is worth moving for. They also want inspiration.

Yes a high draft pick is good but maybe what we were also trying to do as a culture with our wins was say to the whole league. Anytime, anywhere. This is what we stand for as a club and playing group.

 

[St Kilda Death]

Reckon philipou rushed that kick in the end, just needed to take a moment there to settle and he will learn from it.

 

[SG34]

Can anyone recall/or have seen in print(my memory cells are fading quicker than Josh Battle's tenure at Rsea) the last time that we won a game after hitting the front with under 20 seconds left to play?

Surely yesterday's 12 seconds must be the shortest time in the last 50-60 years.

Fair question.
I wonder.
..and I remember..
Was it Robbie Gray in Adelaide..
It feels slightly healed.

 

[Diehard Saint]

The thing about culture is you can’t turn it on and off like a tap.
You can’t decide to lose then just decide to start winning.
It’s something that permeates the club from top to bottom. It’s not accepting 2nd best.
People outside of the saints community have always talked about us as having a loser mentality.
If we start choosing when to win and when to lose we will lose again and again.

In regards to list management.
There’s 2 sides to the coin.
Drafting and trading.
Drafting takes endless hours of work finding the talent and then having the system in place to grow that talent- part of that is also having the culture where players inspire each other with acts of bravery, skill and risk. Our last minute yesterday was one such moment. Jack Higgins got on the end of it but how good were the players that got it to him.

Trading requires players from opposition clubs to believe what you have is worth moving for. They also want inspiration.

Yes a high draft pick is good but maybe what we were also trying to do as a culture with our wins was say to the whole league. Anytime, anywhere. This is what we stand for as a club and playing group.

Great post 100%

 

[Ads734]

So….Pou’s missed goal yesterday when he could’ve passed it to someone closer.

In the end, it didn’t affect the result, and the result didn’t really matter, so it’s with hindsight I’m saying it, but I actually didn’t mind that he wanted to do it himself. Shows confidence and big match temperament.

I think he was about to but the risk of turnover was there, mate the correct decision to have the shot

 

[Ads734]

I’m staggered by how many shots on goal Phillipou is getting just quietly. He’s looking special.

And Wilson , has had 7 shots in two weeks.

 

[malevu]

Have to admit I was a bit conflicted during the game. We’re still 2-3 mids short which could’ve been solved this year and that win took us a bit further out of the Bont/Oliver type draft range. Just makes it that little bit harder. We’re not getting into premiership contention by investing in guys like Jones and Stocker, I’m sorry but it’s just the reality.

Nothing we can do about it now but based on the type of players we drafted last year I’m still confident we can find another couple of good young players.

The only way that argument has legs is if the top 10 picks is preordained and everyone knows the merit of each player. History would suggest that is not the case and from all reports especially not this year. Not my area of expertise but there doesn't appear to be any Daicos or Reid's waiting to be claimed this year.

 

[Saint Watto]

Fair question.
I wonder.
..and I remember..
Was it Robbie Gray in Adelaide..
It feels slightly healed.

I'd almost erased that night from my memory SG34.

Port actually won the game that night which was an absolute horror finish for us.

An earlier poster teamed with Diehard to establish that in the 2015 game against the Dees at Marvel....Joey kicked the winner with 19 seconds left on the clock.

Cue Richo going into meltdown.

 

[CursingFijian]

And with that in mind, we might relax just a wee bit about having to draft two elite mods this year

Has StFly been delisted?

 

[CursingFijian]

Somewhere on the weekend there was a young lad who was tipped to go pick 7 who did a quiet fist pump watching the Saints pip Carlton.

And there’s another young lad who is tipped to go pick 5 who threw his hat on the floor and is googling furiously to try and find out if the consensus is that Petracca is staying or leaving.

 

[SG34]

The only way that argument has legs is if the top 10 picks is preordained and everyone knows the merit of each player. History would suggest that is not the case and from all reports especially not this year. Not my area of expertise but there doesn't appear to be any Daicos or Reid's waiting to be claimed this year.

Agree. It sounds like the poster suggests we lost a new Bont and a new Pretracca because of that win. And for our efforts we will get another Stocker and Jones instead. We go from two Brownlows to two journeyman!! ? Come on. Sounds far fetched…fetched from the twilight of the Gods.

 

[GTrains Mullet]

It might be recency bias… but I’m more confident with the how the list developing that I have been in a fair while:

King: much maligned but on his day can be a match winner. Think he needs some luck with injury, but his best footy is ahead of him.

Camaniti: a free hit and we hit a 6. Kids got heart, and great hands.

Sharman: he’s got an elite leap, will take mark of the year contenders for years to come. Has a great attitude and kick for goal.

Wilson: been an elite runner since he’s been at the club. Starting to grow in confidence and show us more elite traits. A chance for the rising star.

Pou: shows glimpse of his talent and great attitude last year. Used that great attitude to his benefit this year, by overcoming the second year blues with a stint at Sandy. How promising has his return been!

Owens: he’s continuing to develop. Not at his best earlier in the season, but like the whole team worked into it as the season progressed.

Windy: kids got talent and work rate. Feel like Steele did he’ll progress away from more defensive roles in the years to come.

Schoemaker: kicking is the best and most damaging at the club. Needs to develop an afl tank and improve his defensive work but that will come in time.

Garcia: going early on him, but the kids got it. Excited to see him get more game time in the first.

We haven’t had a good look at afl level yet but Keeler, Hastie, Collard have x factor and will hopefully come on.

I’m sure I’m missing a few but seems like we have a good core group to work with in the years ahead.

Finally being at the game on the weekend with me blues mad best mate and family, was a strange feeling. My head wanted pick 5&6 but my heart wanted a win. The way the game played out both were likely late.
I wasn’t actually stressed as both result had upside and when the siren went I enjoyed it as much as anyone.

Time to move on and hope we continuing drafting like we have recently and hope for the season ahead.

Go Saints!

 

[gringo2011]

Just seems like a weird hill to die on.

I don’t know why people get so triggered about people having an alternative point of view. It would be a boring circle jerk without them on here.

 

[gringo2011]

It's less his opinion and more the childish manner in which he expresses it and goes after people. Clogging up the thread with mindless dross

Have you read the rest of the forum? It’s 99% dross.

 

[gringo2011]

Really good analysis.

A couple of things, anybody still saying Hill was not a good trade has rocks in their head. Instrumental in the fact Byrnes could get the ball into the 50 by creating the space. Ironic that Acres was the one who dropped the mark.
Also Saints had no reason to be contesting so hard. Carlton in front, all to play for, we had no reason apart from discipline, drilling and great coaching to still set up perfectly. This was a meaningless game apparently, but the will and culture of the players and muscle memory just kicked in. Great signs for the team and club.
Leigh Matthews saying how important Higgins is to the team up forward not just with goals but what he does off the ball with blocks, angle running and physical stuff. All Kane Cornes could say is 'he gets out the back' basically completely dismissing everything Mattews said and continues the lying trope of that Higgins is a cheat. What a populist simpleton that bloke is.

No one has ever said he’s a bad player. He was a misstep in the rebuild because when we should have been drafting we were topping up to avoid bottoming out.
Obviously too grand a concept for you.

 

[Sarcoidevo]

Have you read the rest of the forum? It’s 99% dross.

Interesting fact that I have only contributed 1% to the forum

 

[Madas]

Thanks you lot
sorry we couldn’t seal the deal

Was at the pub in Optus Stadium when Higgins kicked the sealer , place went nuts .
was the best win we’ve had for weeks

 

[gringo2011]

I'll admit I wasn't a fan of Byrnes ... though in the last few weeks he has definitely taken a few steps in the right direction.

For me he is showing a lot more composure with ball in hand ... previously he was a bit of a panic merchant but he is now seems to be more comfortable with the speed of the game and this decision making/pressure aspect will improve even further with more senior game day experience.

He is still a bit small and could well do to work on his strength/stamina to win more contested situations and eventually play a larger role in center square rotations but he has good speed and his skills are no issue .... very neat kick nowadays

And he is still only 23

He’s super dedicated to his craft. Been a kid who puts in everything since being drafted. Worked with Logan Austin as a PT to increase fitness and always in the group doing extras outside training over the off season. He’s not an elite talent but he’s one with elite effort. He won’t take it for granted.

 

[gringo2011]

Is having an earlier pick better in general than a later pick, yes. But it is not true that an earlier pick will get you a better player. An earlier pick gives you are better chance of a better player, but this does not mean that chance will occur.

To pull figures out of my behind, if pick 5 gives you a 10% chance of a brownlow medallist and pick 7 only an 8% chance, it is simply untrue to assume you will get said medallist with pick 5 & not with pick 7.

The coaching staff are experts, they clearly decided that the win was more important than the lower pick. History would tend to suggest they are correct, Carltank failed, Meltank did win a flag but only after the club imploded and Roos saved the day. The pick number 1 Meltank got, Jack Watts did not win them that flag.

Winning and losing are habits, let us develop the correct habit. Also losing to Carlton is NEVER acceptable.

Pick 6 is legit cursed.

 

[gringo2011]

You’re in!! - so far it’s you and me …hang tough the sycophants will be in shortly but you got my back right ?

Don’t you usually pot all my posts because I’m not a sycophant?

 

[PoppedCorn]

 

[Saintbloke]

It might be recency bias… but I’m more confident with the how the list developing that I have been in a fair while:

King: much maligned but on his day can be a match winner. Think he needs some luck with injury, but his best footy is ahead of him.

Camaniti: a free hit and we hit a 6. Kids got heart, and great hands.

Sharman: he’s got an elite leap, will take mark of the year contenders for years to come. Has a great attitude and kick for goal.

Wilson: been an elite runner since he’s been at the club. Starting to grow in confidence and show us more elite traits. A chance for the rising star.

Pou: shows glimpse of his talent and great attitude last year. Used that great attitude to his benefit this year, by overcoming the second year blues with a stint at Sandy. How promising has his return been!

Owens: he’s continuing to develop. Not at his best earlier in the season, but like the whole team worked into it as the season progressed.

Windy: kids got talent and work rate. Feel like Steele did he’ll progress away from more defensive roles in the years to come.

Schoemaker: kicking is the best and most damaging at the club. Needs to develop an afl tank and improve his defensive work but that will come in time.

Garcia: going early on him, but the kids got it. Excited to see him get more game time in the first.

We haven’t had a good look at afl level yet but Keeler, Hastie, Collard have x factor and will hopefully come on.

I’m sure I’m missing a few but seems like we have a good core group to work with in the years ahead.

Finally being at the game on the weekend with me blues mad best mate and family, was a strange feeling. My head wanted pick 5&6 but my heart wanted a win. The way the game played out both were likely late.
I wasn’t actually stressed as both result had upside and when the siren went I enjoyed it as much as anyone.

Time to move on and hope we continuing drafting like we have recently and hope for the season ahead.

Go Saints!

Good points made there. I'm still a bit on the fence about Owens and Windy- both show good patches, and work hard, but Owens doesn't at all look like a natural forward, and Windy just needs to have a really good year free of injury and get his attacking game going..we'll see. I think Hastie will be one to watch when he builds himself up in the next couple of seasons.

 

[True Believer]

Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard. RTB values those that leave everything on the paddock no matter what, because he knows you need some of them in a team. Everyone can't be an NWM type with lasers for feet. I think Owens and Windy will be there for the the leadership they provide and the example they set with giving everything they have in the pursuit of improvement!

 

[The Punter]

So….Pou’s missed goal yesterday when he could’ve passed it to someone closer.

In the end, it didn’t affect the result, and the result didn’t really matter, so it’s with hindsight I’m saying it, but I actually didn’t mind that he wanted to do it himself. Shows confidence and big match temperament.

On Pou's miss... I wanted Nas to back himself to kick the goal. The kick from him to Phillipou was delightful, but I feel backing his skills to kick long goals is the last piece of the puzzle for Nas.