Review Round 8, 2018 - Western Bulldogs vs. Brisbane Lions

[Gadzorks]

He has a finger that is knackered. One of the pinky fingers.

He could do a Daniel Chick and have it amputated to prolong his footy career.

I personally think that's actually insane but each to his own.

 

[M Malice]

He could do a Daniel Chick and have it amputated to prolong his footy career.

I personally think that's actually insane but each to his own.

They do say if you don't use it you lose it.

 

[lions27]

On another night Hippy kicks 6... no way we drop him.

 

[jackess]

On another night Hippy kicks 6... no way we drop him.

Yeah I think we can 'carry' someone that's getting 6 shots on goal a game.

I was skeptical about OMac but I love our current forward setup. The talls are holding their own with defensive pressure. If we can allow Cameron enough space in the forward line to get dangerous we should be able to kick winning scores more often.

 

[jackess]

Also, on the Curnow vs Hipwood comparison I think we have a Curnow and it's McStay. They play more of a similar role and are both strong pack marks.

Hipwood is going to play a similar style to Buddy and use his athleticism.

 

[3KZ is Football]

On form I'd like to see Hipwood get some game time a CHF in the twos, slow the game down for him to get confidence and to hone his craft to a point where he can step back up.
Oscar at that deep forward role and Walker to come up the field , would have to be a better option than Hippy.
Still have no doubt that Hipwood will be a star, it should be seen as part of the process when players go back to the twos as an opportunity to learn things at a slower pace , decision making, goal kicking , marking.
It is not all about been beaten by a bigger body , so with that in mind there is always opportunity in the Twos to learn processes, technique roles, skills, you can keep going.
Thats why he goes back for mind.

Great post, but I wouldn’t drop Hipwood yet. Give him the swing man role and see how he goes with that.

 

[SacksonvilleJags]

Having read all the posts so sorry if this has been covered but on OMac... how many tackles did make during the game?

 

[jackess]

Having read all the posts so sorry if this has been covered but on OMac... how many tackles did make during the game?

4 after having had 7 against the pies. Surprisingly good tackler.

 

[3KZ is Football]

Also, on the Curnow vs Hipwood comparison I think we have a Curnow and it's McStay. They play more of a similar role and are both strong pack marks.

Not sure about this. McStay averages less than one contested mark per game (0.92) over his career, while Curnow sits at 1.62.
This year I know McStay has played back a bit, but he has only taken 8 contested marks for 6 goals, while Curnow has taken 14 for 13 goals. I think it would be good to see McStay come on, but he has got to improve his marking. He did take a contested mark on Saturday night (which he failed to convert from 35 metres out) but the uncontested mark he dropped early in the first quarter was a howler and cost us a goal.

 

[scoman]

Does it make anyone else even more depressed when you realise we are 0 and 8 and we are at full strength?

 

[dlanod]

Not sure about this. McStay averages less than one contested mark per game (0.92) over his career, while Curnow sits at 1.62.
This year I know McStay has played back a bit, but he has only taken 8 contested marks for 6 goals, while Curnow has taken 14 for 13 goals. I think it would be good to see McStay come on, but he has got to improve his marking. He did take a contested mark on Saturday night (which he failed to convert from 35 metres out) but the uncontested mark he dropped early in the first quarter was a howler and cost us a goal.

His defensive work does make it hard to compare. He's averaging 1.75 contested marks a game this year since moving forward but I'm not convinced that's sustainable. If we use games in which he's kicked at least one goal or behind as a proxy for playing up forward he's averaging 1.3 contested marks a game as a forward over his career - so a bit over halfway between his career averages and Curnow.

 

[DanT7]

https://digest.bps.org.uk/2018/05/1...are-especially-prone-to-believing-neuromyths/

 

[KissKiss]

Was the wife's bday so only got to watch the game yesterday and then just have a flick through this thread now and it again seems the usual over reactions all over the shop. I get it was another frustrating close loss but the signs are really there that we are improving. Just need to get that one win to get the confidence going. I've talked to many a Richmond and Melbourne fans over the last years about how their teams didnt know how to win, but at some point (maybe Melbourne haven't quite got there) the confidence clicked. We'll get there soon but I can see it coming. Damn I'd love to be playing Essendon at home next week.

On the game:
I was worried that we went in too tall at both ends but think I was half right with that. The front half were good-ish. O and McStay both showed some great signs and worked well. Hippy had such an almost game. He almost had a monster game if he had kicked straight. I don't know if a game in the 2's would help or hinder him. He kicked straight and I reckon we win. At times all 3 talls were all flying at the same mark and we needed to work at separation a bit more. Think that woulld come with time playing together. The smalls need to work a little better at one over the back and one front and square. Pretty good signs though.

In the back half also was worried we were too tall and think that was a little true too. Harro had another great game and honestly those who cant see the star in making there are kidding themselves. At his age he is already in the top few defenders in the comp. Gardiner was reasonable - having a much improved year. Eagles I like what he is bringing to the team but still isnt quite up to speed on when to go and went to stay. That will only come with time. We maybe dont need all 3 talls every week but it is ok for the time being.

Hodge looked a bit slow and sore but think that is a case of it being hard back there. Rich was a little off but he was good last week and only just getting up to speed after injury. Witherden is still only how many games into his career? Think people should be appreciative how well he is going at his age.

The middle was a bit concerning. Beams was clearly struggling and we need more senior support there. Robbo was ok but not great and Christensen was down as well.

I said before the game we needed to tag Macrea and think that was clearly a mistake to not. He killed us and coaches need to look at that. Too many opposition stars kill us.

Berry and McClugg are both way ahead of the curve and doing amazing for their age. Bailey is showing signs and has some clear talent.

Rayner looked sore - might be time for a rest. Maybe time for Starc to get a run?

Martin and O were great in the ruck. I know the dogs didnt try and compete in the air much and focused on sharking the tap but they are one of the best in the comp at that. We did try and whack it around in different ways which was good to see - the dogs just a little too good there. That will again just take time to get right.

Good to see Zorko not get tagged out of a game. Some spark is back there. he and Charlie were both really good.

Going into next week I reckon Rayner and maybe Bailey could take a break or games in the twos. I could still happily see a tall player go out for balance reasons. Who is a tough question?

Think Keays and maybe Mayes could come in as well

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

I thought he was good. Just needs to learn when to go and when to stay.

And also he was manning The Bont when he went forward and most defenders would find that a challenge, let alone someone in his second game. Definitely some positives from his two appearances; has no doubt learnt a lot even if he does get a rest this week.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

We lost by 14 points. We only played reasonably when we fell behind. That sort of quality deserved a 40-60 point loss

In previous seasons we would have been flogged by 40 to 60 points after an effort like that. There's your improvement right there. We make fewer errors and convert a few of those in front chances and we come away victors.

 

[dlanod]

His defensive work does make it hard to compare. He's averaging 1.75 contested marks a game this year since moving forward but I'm not convinced that's sustainable. If we use games in which he's kicked at least one goal or behind as a proxy for playing up forward he's averaging 1.3 contested marks a game as a forward over his career - so a bit over halfway between his career averages and Curnow.

I guess an additional caveat that might see this year's contested mark average be more representative is that now he's playing as a third tall behind Hipwood and Oscar, whereas before he was more of a second or even first scoring option. We'll have to wait and see.

 

[3KZ is Football]

His defensive work does make it hard to compare. He's averaging 1.75 contested marks a game this year since moving forward but I'm not convinced that's sustainable. If we use games in which he's kicked at least one goal or behind as a proxy for playing up forward he's averaging 1.3 contested marks a game as a forward over his career - so a bit over halfway between his career averages and Curnow.

Thanks dlanod. That level of detail sheds further light on the topic. It would be good to see McStay come on, but he needs to do more.

 

[3KZ is Football]

https://digest.bps.org.uk/2018/05/1...are-especially-prone-to-believing-neuromyths/

Thanks for this DanT7. You might have gotten away with it this time, but in future...

 

[Tassie4ever]

Just a few things. One- how anyone can argue we are improving, or better than last year, is completely beyond me. We are 8 and 0. No wins. That's zero. Haven't won any. Nil.

And, from my reading of the state of affairs, stuffed if I can work out who we might beat. Sincerely hope I'm wrong. I don't watch every match each weekend, but what I do watch suggests we are the worst team in the comp by a fair margin. Again, hope I am proven wrong. Nevertheless, we'll still turn up every home game, regardless. Hope springs eternal. Another "miracle on grass"- please. Soon.

Re McStay- still trying to take mark of the year and bugger the rest, even goal kicking. I mean, who cares? It's all about moi- right? Re Rich- needs a serious talking to. Son, don't take your spot for granted. We'll be counting your bruises every Monday and if there aren't any look out. You're a senior- act like it.

Re state of the nation- watched the Tigers v Kangas game yesterday. Great game. Never mind the Lions. North are truly a busted-arse club. No dough, facilities woeful, etc etc. And there they were, with anything like fair treatment from the officials, might well have knocked off the reigning premiers. Have recruited well. The difference with the Lions? See second last sentence.

We need to do something urgently with our ball-handling. We are simple nowhere near adequate. Try something different- whatever we are doing ain't working. Someone asked me a question I had no response to- do we employ a psychologist? If we do- sack him or her. If we don't- get one urgently, with, as a priority, a chat to Hipwood.

Last observation- the Tigers tread a very fine line, often totally blurred, between fair play and unfair play. Prediction- it won't be long before there is a real backlash.

 

[3KZ is Football]

Except that horrid turnover, I was right behind him, it defied any logic. Looked up, saw a Dogs player, turned, aimed, kicked, hit him directly/ lace out 30 meters away with no Lions player within 20 meters, never seen anything like it. Love Cuts but he is king of the 'coach killer'.. needs to limit them a bit more.

On the flip side, that was him wasn't it who delivered the ball to Oscar in the last quarter? It was a great pass inside 50, whoever it was.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Had enough of this bullshit written by so called Brisbane Lions Supporters. More than half of you suck big. With supporters such as yourselves, our players list should all be looking to leave as soon as they can....anywhere where supporters dont pile crap on their heads while busting their guts to improve & learn. Time for a break me thinks.

We all say things on here about individual players we probably shouldn't, out of frustration, including you after the Collingwood game:
Taylor sh--s me the way he works hard down the forward line if there is a chance to get a cheap goal. But if a turnover occurs, he simply jogs back as if he doesn't have to move with any urgency. Lazy just like Green IMO& the one of the reasons we struggle to win a game.
Plus the fact he missed 2 easy goals that, in hindsight, would have put us in the frame.
Rising Star....PFFFT!!! Front runner more like it. He needs to be more of a team player. He has the skills but not the commitment right now.
We should all concentrate on supporting the players and not bagging them after every loss, me included. The tide will turn, just not as quickly as we would like.

 

[dlanod]

Just a few things. One- how anyone can argue we are improving, or better than last year, is completely beyond me. We are 8 and 0. No wins. That's zero. Haven't won any. Nil.

Improving and winning are not necessarily the same thing. I have a feeling it will fall on deaf ears but here goes...

• We'd won a single game by this point in 2017.
• We'd won a single game by this point in 2016.
  
• We'd won two games (!) by this point in 2015, although we proceeding to not win a third for another 12 weeks.
  
• We'd won a single game by this point in 2014.

You're lamenting over the fact that we've won a whole one game less than we usually do.

As a counterpoint:

• We've been outscored by an average of 26 points in 2018.
• We'd been outscored by an average of 39 points in 2017.
  
• We'd been outscored by an average of 46 points in 2016.
  
• We'd been outscored by an average of 38 points in 2015.
  
• We'd been outscored by an average of 46 points in 2014.

So one less game won, but we've been an average of two goals better a game.

And, from my reading of the state of affairs, stuffed if I can work out who we might beat. Sincerely hope I'm wrong. I don't watch every match each weekend, but what I do watch suggests we are the worst team in the comp by a fair margin. Again, hope I am proven wrong. Nevertheless, we'll still turn up every home game, regardless. Hope springs eternal. Another "miracle on grass"- please. Soon.

OTOH it also won't surprise me if we continue to lose. We need to play a team on a day off on a day where we're not also having a day off. Going off previous years our best bet is to wait until we come up against a club that's basically quit on their coach (or had him fired) late in the season.

 

[Hollow Knight]

OTOH it also won't surprise me if we continue to lose. We need to play a team on a day off on a day where we're not also having a day off. Going off previous years our best bet is to wait until we come up against a club that's basically quit on their coach (or had him fired) late in the season.

So Essendon then?

 

[dlanod]

So Essendon then?

Yeah, they'd fit. I'd also count the Saints but I can't be arsed looking up to see if we play them a second time (I'm guessing no).

 

[Hollow Knight]

Yeah, they'd fit. I'd also count the Saints but I can't be arsed looking up to see if we play them a second time (I'm guessing no).

Correct.