Current Trial Russell Hill & Carol Clay - Wonnangatta *Pilot Greg Lynn Pleads Not Guilty to Murder

[Kurve]

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On the Greg Lynn committal proceedings Crown Prosecutor Mr Dickie said 'It is clear hopefully from the document, and if it's not clear from the document it's clear hopefully from the charges put before the court, that it is alleged of course that the accused acted with murderous intent when he allegedly killed the two victims.'

 

[Better Loosen Up]

As I understand things without an admission a Blue Patrol owner / driver confirmed to be camping at Wonnangatta and departing the Friday night 20th of March is not enough on its own to get an arrest warrant. It obviously is suspicious that they have not come forward yet but that alone isn't enough for an arrest. There would need to be extra evidence and/or an admission from that person(s) to arrest them.

If I were the Patrol owner in question and knew I was completely innocent, I'd be down at the local police station immediately... They are definitely on to something.

 

[Zidane98]

If I were the Patrol owner in question and knew I was completely innocent, I'd be down at the local police station immediately... They are definitely on to something.

They are but the question remains - is being the blue patrol driver who left the wonnangatta on the Friday night enough on its own to arrest someome?

 

[MiguelM]

They are but the question remains - is being the blue patrol driver who left the wonnangatta on the Friday night enough on its own to arrest someome?

Not on its own. Hopefully they have some DNA, phone data maybe? strong evidence linking the driver to the scene.

Sounding like they are not far away from an arrest IMO

 

[austcrime]

I've read articles in the past where people are boasting about threats to shoot down; or have actually shot down offending nuisance drones ....

So if Russel had his drone shot down by a hail of bullets ... that may have caused him to snap and to come out swig'n??

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

 

[Zidane98]

Hopefully they have some DNA, phone data maybe? strong evidence linking the driver to the scene.

Sounding like they are not far away from an arrest IMO

Im thinking DNA. The coppers have never said they didnt find someone elses DNA at the scene.

Blue Patrol driver + confirmation they were in the 'Gatta at the same time as the disappearance (mobile phone records entering and then matching the image on the Great Alpine Rd leaving) might be enough for them to be subpoenaed for a DNA test.

Get a DNA hit and that should be enough to lay charges.

 

[BigPond101]

Im thinking DNA. The coppers have never said they didnt find someone elses DNA at the scene.

Blue Patrol driver + confirmation they were in the 'Gatta at the same time as the disappearance (mobile phone records entering and then matching the image on the Great Alpine Rd leaving) might be enough for them to be subpoenaed for a DNA test.

Get a DNA hit and that should be enough to lay charges.

Do police even need permission to take DNA now days? I thought they would just grab something he handled out of his bin and test it

 

[Zidane98]

Do police even need permission to take DNA now days? I thought they would just grab something he handled out of his bin and test it

Absolutely they do. Cant be taking DNA samples wily nily. Needs to be a clear custody trail of a DNA sample. Do it covertly would risk it being dismissed due to the defence claiming contamination etc.

Theres a significant legal process involved in takng DNA samples for criminal investigations that must be followed to ensure a conviction can be made.

 

[sprockets]

Absolutely they do. Cant be taking DNA samples wily nily. Needs to be a clear custody trail of a DNA sample. Do it covertly would risk it being dismissed due to the defence claiming contamination etc.

Theres a significant legal process involved in takng DNA samples for criminal investigations that must be followed to ensure a conviction can be made.

Likely test some items from his bin (but could have been handled by anyone in the family) and if you get a match test something you know he's definitely handled, and finally take a DNA test via warrant of the actual suspect. That last step is the evidence one.

 

[Toil83]

Likely test some items from his bin (but could have been handled by anyone in the family) and if you get a match test something you know he's definitely handled, and finally take a DNA test via warrant of the actual suspect. That last step is the evidence one.

From memory when they had a suspect for the Claremont murders they collected an empty bottle of lemonade he threw in the bin at the movies for testing.

I think they did the same thing with a cigarette butt for the East Area Rapist suspect too.

 

[Better Loosen Up]

They are but the question remains - is being the blue patrol driver who left the wonnangatta on the Friday night enough on its own to arrest someome?

Of course not but the fact they're not coming forward is probably confirming their suspicions

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Of course not but the fact they're not coming forward is probably confirming their suspicions

Didn’t manage to photograph the rego anywhere?

 

[Alberto_Magnifico]

Didn’t manage to photograph the rego anywhere?

I say yes, the police have mentioned that the blue patrol has been recorded twice on traffic cameras near Hotham, and presented a still of one of those to the public.
My question is that If those cameras cannot capture the rego then what is their purpose?

 

[austcrime]

Interesting about the blue patrol rego....

I agree; the roadside cameras should have been capable of capturing the vehicle Rego...

However it was reported in the media today that police say that the 'photo released of the vehicle is the best photo they have"... (quote unquote).

(So police have either airbrushed out the captured rego); or more likely the cameras somehow did not see the rego; OR my guess; the perp(s) mudded out, or otherwise concealed the rego....

If they're capable of murder; they're capable of doing that ....

And how exactly do the police know that the perps did a complicated 30 point turn at the locked gate / escape route?

The way I read about it - the police were implying that a witness down there saw them attempting to turn around....

But that seems very unlikely; (a witness)... So what is the police motivation for putting that story out there....

Sure; report that they are onto something because they can see gazillions of tyre tracks at the turn; but saying a witness saw the event? Why...

Then the artist's sketch of blue 4wd patrol .... Looking at it from the small screen on my phone; it appears that there is some tyre damage sketched in at about the 2 o'clock on tbe front tyre, (I think it was?) ...

So have the police taken plaster casts of tyre tracks; (as they ought to have done) - including the distinctive tyre damage - but do not want to reveal that info to the perp in the hope that he/she doesn't get rid of those tyres and valuable evidence?

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[Jamie007]

Jamie007 lol, solved it with his car pics ? Though i mind thinking i must of read


What was 20 months ago, someone explain what i cant no doubt see . I thought Jamie007 may have solved it on Monday.

They disappeared 20 months ago so the footage of the car and the stickers on the windows were 20 months ago.

 

[Alberto_Magnifico]

My interpretation was that a nearby camper heard a 4x4 doing the turn near the gate.

In the dead of the night, and in particular on a still night, the sound of a 4x4 travelling carries hundreds of metres, even kms. And the sound of a Austin Powers style 30 point turn in a petrol 4x4 would be pretty distinct and imply a trailer contributing to the difficulty, the track is narrow, but even still a 3-6 point turn would be sufficient.

As to the wheel tracks interesting theory, noting though that I don't think the cops got up there for at least a week or maybe two after the 20th, would be pretty hard to examine IMO.

 

[Zidane98]

My interpretation was that a nearby camper heard a 4x4 doing the turn near the gate.

In the dead of the night, and in particular on a still night, the sound of a 4x4 travelling carries hundreds of metres, even kms. And the sound of a Austin Powers style 30 point turn in a petrol 4x4 would be pretty distinct and imply a trailer contributing to the difficulty, the track is narrow, but even still a 3-6 point turn would be sufficient.

As to the wheel tracks interesting theory, noting though that I don't think the cops got up there for at least a week or maybe two after the 20th, would be pretty hard to examine IMO.

If the witness only heard it how can the coppers be sure it was the blue Patrol that was turning around at the closed gate?

20 point turn easy if its a narrow track with a trailer if you are by yourself in the dark. Wheel track evidence unlikely to be reliable a week later.


First coppers on the scene trekked up from Sale a week after the incident.

 

[BomberManU]

Didn't someone in this thread imply that the Button Man was the witness to the car turning around at the gate?

 

[Stjonesy]

Didn't someone in this thread imply that the Button Man was the witness to the car turning around at the gate?

Doubt it, button man camps a long way from the valley . I've heard that he likes to know who is coming in and out of the area but, so I think he was helping police with who he saw coming through around that time

 

[Alberto_Magnifico]

If the witness only heard it how can the coppers be sure it was the blue Patrol that was turning around at the closed gate?

20 point turn easy if its a narrow track with a trailer if you are by yourself in the dark. Wheel track evidence unlikely to be reliable a week later.


First coppers on the scene trekked up from Sale a week after the incident.

Correlation of timing I suspect. All the reports I read mention a witness "seeing" the patrol near Hills camp and another "hearing" it leave around midnight. If it's the gate I'm thinking off (up near the helipad) then there is no one camping super close
Maybe the person who heard the patrol caught a glimpse of it as it went past their camp towards the gate, but if that were the case surely VicPol would just say "it was seen around midnight"
Not super reliable but they must have a few more pieces to this puzzle

 

[Alberto_Magnifico]

A clearer photo taken from DailyMail.
I wonder if it takes single images, series or video? If there was a still a few frames forward you would see the plate, also is it just me or does the plate shadow look weirdly pixelated? (unnatural black rectangular shape) Like it has been doctored.

Also interesting to note it's clearly sunlight and the shadows could indicate morning travelling north-ish, which might fit in say if he was busy a couple hours digging a hole before getting up to Hotham for Sunrise.

 

[austcrime]

Zooming in from my phone; so not precise; is that sunlight I can see illuminating a bit of the inside of the box trailer?

If so; it may not be particularly full; (of bodies and other evidence); that the perps are attempting to exist with....

Also; (looking at the distance between the underside of the trailer wheel arches and the top of the tyres) - the trailer looks to be travelling potentially without much weight inside?

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[faible]

A clearer photo taken from DailyMail.
I wonder if it takes single images, series or video? If there was a still a few frames forward you would see the plate, also is it just me or does the plate shadow look weirdly pixelated? (unnatural black rectangular shape) Like it has been doctored.

Also interesting to note it's clearly sunlight and the shadows could indicate morning travelling north-ish, which might fit in say if he was busy a couple hours digging a hole before getting up to Hotham for Sunrise.

View attachment 1278770

They may have blacked out those bits before releasing it to the public

 

[sprockets]

It might have been a foggy morning or condensation on the camera lens.

 

[Alberto_Magnifico]

It might have been a foggy morning or condensation on the camera lens.

View attachment 1278939

Drivers window looks open, might be a smoker.
What are the chances that a random black smudge covers just the plate, and at the same time the vehicle and trailer perfectly in frame? Seems to me that this image was doctored and released to the public for a very specific reason.

 

[sprockets]

Drivers window looks open, might be a smoker.
What are the chances that a random black smudge covers just the plate, and at the same time the vehicle and trailer perfectly in frame? Seems to me that this image was doctored and released to the public for a very specific reason.

I did my best to zoom in and enhance (separately) to that numberplate and came to the same conclusion, although if they have the rego the driver would be found by now, so dunno...