Should footy fans be concerned about Dustin Martin?

[Catsmaninamerica]

It must be true if you say so.

I hope Hardwick reads your post and immediately councils him and give him his 4th warning for the year.

It is honestly hilarious that while he grown ups have a rational informed
Discussion, the same tired flogs are on here blindly supporting their player, unable to step outside of being a 12 year old fan "no he plays for Richmond and would never do that" to being a rational grown up, capable of discussion that's not influenced by club bias.

 

[Bazzar]

It is honestly hilarious that while he grown ups have a rational informed
Discussion, the same tired flogs are on here blindly supporting their player, unable to step outside of being a 12 year old fan "no he plays for Richmond and would never do that" to being a rational grown up, capable of discussion that's not influenced by club bias.

What is hilarious are all the experts like yourself who appear to have this incredible inside knowledge of Dustin Martins mental and physical well being.

No doubt its only a matter of time before he gets a semi automatic and goes on a rampage, because according to BF that's where his mindset is at.

 

[nineteen eighty]

...
The whispers that constantly come out of Melbourne's party/club scene about him. Same sorts of things we were hearing about Ben cousins circa 04

He's in some real trouble IMO, and life trouble at that. Not just footy drama.

I just want to know what whispers?? The ones on BF?? Really...are they the ones??

I don't buy into the clubs story about sleeping pills etc.. from last year. I think there was more to it than that. But I also recognise that he's still a kid and is working his way through coming to grips about discipline required to be a footy star.

However, not one of my mates / acquaintances in Melbourne has heard any whispers. They play footy and party and the only whispers they hear is on BF.

Are these the whispers one hears?? If that's the case, I suggest you move on.

I do however have my concerns that he may not be able to settle into a lifestyle required of an AFL listed footballer. But that's based on what happened last year and also on the blast from Hardwick late last year. Fingers and legs crossed he can settle down as he's a star in the making.

 

[santa claws]

well he was too big initially, although it does seem that could have been a puppy fat issue, and he didn't do himself any favours the shape he was in after his first off-season. I think it was in combination with him not having the capacity to have the tank required, which is pretty unfair really as it's rare the player who can step in in his first few years and have the endurance required to run in an AFL midfield.

Whilst it's the preseason and all guys look good, he looks fit as in that picture. Good to see.

i get the impression you think hes to big and was too big initially. ive
gotta disagree. hes exactly the same size now as when he was drafted. with his natural strength and size it has been a maintenance thing rather than a need to add bulk.

its his size and core strength that gives him one of his greatest assets. the ability to keep his feet and run thru tackles. how many times do you see him tackled to the ground.

straight of i can think of 3 brownlow medalists playing today who have this trait. judd, watson, and ablett.
is your own jobe watson too big at 190 / 94. no his size is an assett not a hindrance.hes not quick but its his ability to get to contests and use that size that makes him such a damaging player.in other words his motor is super important to him.
ablett is 182 and 88kg does his size hurt him.he seems impossible to tackle for a reason. size and core.
judd is 189cm and 88kg the most streamlined if you like of the 3. phenominal core strength.and he is a size.
its funny watson started out at 189/ 86 or close. not dissimilar to martin, hes actually lumped the weight on.has it hurt him.
ironically both ablett and watson took time to develop motors. jobe himself has admitted it took some time for him to get his head around what he needed to do to make it.
abletts run in with team mates is well documented.at the same stage of their careers martin is a long way in front of these two. and on a par with judd.what is there to be disappointed about.

at this point in time i have no concerns on martin at all. i dont think any one could have asked for more than what hes given to date. his first three yrs are up there with just about anyone. again whats to be disappointed about. and hes done this with a serious weakness to his game. a weakness that will get better and better the longer hes in the system.

his size does not affect his ability to run. he moves quite well is not slow as some here think.like jobe he may not be the quickest going around over 100 metres but id say martins can be explosive though over a much shorter distance.

the one problem he has has nothing to do with running in itself. its his tank. its fitness thing. we do measurments on all draftees to measure their capcity for endurance.
like most things in the afl players are different. some are naturrally big and dont have to bulk while others spend their first 3 yrs in the gym.
some guys are top kicks some have to work on it.
some guys have big motors built in. some guys like martin really have to work on it. it may take 5 or more yrs for martin to get his motor to where it needs to be. it wont be from lack of effort on the track he works damn hard there.

when he gets that motor some deficiencies will just disappear. like his ability to go both ways.his ability to get more ball which is very decent at 21 possesions agame atm. defensively hes poor because of his motor it will improve..
i hope he he stops taking on players so much and get rid of the ball a bit quicker at times. he definately needs to temper his kicking. in that he often tries for a pin point pass that has no room for error and creates a turnover. he sometimes needs to take the easier option. he needs work on his non preferred foot.

theres lots of areas that have room for improvement and they will because he actually works hard.

as for the behavior off field. who really gives a toss id bet my bottom dollar the vast majority are doing regularly things the media would jump on. hes 21 for christ sake and hes learning all about the fish bowl that is the afl. with experience he will learn how to keep it out of the media and imo that is more of what its about. instead of getting pissed at a club the boys will do it at home etc.
footy fans really are kidding themselves if they think a large chunk of 18 to 30 yr olds full of testosterone dont want to experience life like any other person. they are out there not being role models ,and the media are all over them..
i hate social engineering forcing people to act in a way or say waht they dont really believe. it really has become a joke.

 

[NUFC Tiger]

and the response by Newman was very telling. He is always going to spin it as positively as he can

What and the media and other clubs don't try and spin things? For clubs, it's called PR.

Of course the media will try and ensure their questions get as interesting a response as they can. That's just a reality of the business. Anything they can get to make a headline or story would be free game.

Also, I think people should note that the article said the 'stern words' were spoken "a few weeks ago". That's about as vague as you can be - a few months, that could be anything from 2-6 odd weeks in reality. For all we know, this could just be a rehashed article from the past.

Here's an article from November 2012 where Dimma comments on Dustin - how do we know that the journo's question isn't a follow up to this article? You could also argue that this interview/article are only "a few weeks" old.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/richmond-young-gun-dustin-martin-needs/story-e6frf9io-1226508879715

Frankly, I would be hugely surprised if every club didn't have player coach discussions from time to time. Dustin's might have been about his off field behaviour and if that is the case, then I would argue that it's good the club is aware of it and are trying to work with him to settle him down. I would be much more concerned if the club wasn't aware or if the club let him slip through the cracks.

Clubs probably need to micromanage every player to some degree - obviously some more than others. We need to remember he is still only 21 and as Newman said, he's very much still working on getting it all together on and off the field.

Given the lack of substance in the Age's article (i.e tangible quotes from people in the know about when, where and what was actually said, the official club responses/statements on the matter etc), this article is basically nothing more than speculation and fluff or a paper filler.

 

[laminex]

He's a wild child let him have some fun, he is a gun a absolute gun player with a crazy streak in him.

 

[Beer n Skittles]

ironically both ablett and watson took time to develop motors. jobe himself has admitted it took some time for him to get his head around what he needed to do to make it.
abletts run in with team mates is well documented.at the same stage of their careers martin is a long way in front of these two. and on a par with judd.what is there to be disappointed about.

at this point in time i have no concerns on martin at all. i dont think any one could have asked for more than what hes given to date. his first three yrs are up there with just about anyone.

Fair point except this bit, Judd was clearly better than Martin in his third year.

What and the media and other clubs don't try and spin things? For clubs, it's called PR.

You missed LUC's point by a long way there

 

[Catsmaninamerica]

I just want to know what whispers?? The ones on BF?? Really...are they the ones??

I don't buy into the clubs story about sleeping pills etc.. from last year. I think there was more to it than that. But I also recognise that he's still a kid and is working his way through coming to grips about discipline required to be a footy star.

However, not one of my mates / acquaintances in Melbourne has heard any whispers. They play footy and party and the only whispers they hear is on BF.

Are these the whispers one hears?? If that's the case, I suggest you move on.

I do however have my concerns that he may not be able to settle into a lifestyle required of an AFL listed footballer. But that's based on what happened last year and also on the blast from Hardwick late last year. Fingers and legs crossed he can settle down as he's a star in the making.

I've personally heard stories about him from outside of BF.

 

[Catsmaninamerica]

What is hilarious are all the experts like yourself who appear to have this incredible inside knowledge of Dustin Martins mental and physical well being.

No doubt its only a matter of time before he gets a semi automatic and goes on a rampage, because according to BF that's where his mindset is at.

Idiotic biased head in the sand post bookmarked for when he is either sacked or checks into rehab.

 

[santa claws]

Fair point except this bit, Judd was clearly better than Martin in his third year.



You missed LUC's point by a long way there

statistically they are very close i cant remember judds 3rd yr so i can only go by stats. i will say at a guess judds game was more rounded than martins and he probably made more impact but there is not much between them at all statistically.
juddys pace and ability to run lines and run a long way has always been very good this is where martin has to improve. again it comes back to his motor and it will take a little time.he probably will never get close to judds running ability but im sure it will improve enough to make him a well rounded and frighteningly good player.

i have little expectation of dramatic improvement from martin this yr it takes time to build up your aerobic ability and i cant see it improving enough to allow him to do what he needs to do.
small steps are the way it is with somethings.

 

[mjr_42]

statistically they are very close i cant remember judds 3rd yr so i can only go by stats. i will say at a guess judds game was more rounded than martins and he probably made more impact...

Chris Judd won the Brownlow Medal in 2004. It was his third year of senior football.

 

[telsor]

Clearly Dusty is a terrible guy.

I mean, just look at what he's on record as having done...taking some prescription drugs he shouldn't have which led him to sleep in and be late for training and having some self discipline issues!

I mean, compared to the charges laid against the drug dealers at Geelong, the racists assaults from Essendon, the sexual misdeeds from St Kilda, the drug abuse at the weagles, the various drunk episodes from numerous clubs (including Richmond), not to mention the laundry list of 'incidents' from Collingwood, that is just so much worse.

Thank god for the giant media conspiracy to cover up his misdeeds, after all, an organisation that thinks Brian Lake getting drunk and abusive is a major news item, and seems to stick the boot into Richmond as much as any club, can be relied on to, en masse, look after the wellbeing of both the kid and the Richmond football club in this matter.



Or to put it another way, to all those who 'know' he's such a bad guy, put up or shut up and stop creating/believing gossip.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Clearly Dusty is a terrible guy.

I mean, just look at what he's on record as having done...taking some prescription drugs he shouldn't have which led him to sleep in and be late for training and having some self discipline issues!

I mean, compared to the charges laid against the drug dealers at Geelong, the racists assaults from Essendon, the sexual misdeeds from St Kilda, the drug abuse at the weagles, the various drunk episodes from numerous clubs (including Richmond), not to mention the laundry list of 'incidents' from Collingwood, that is just so much worse.

Thank god for the giant media conspiracy to cover up his misdeeds, after all, an organisation that thinks Brian Lake getting drunk and abusive is a major news item, and seems to stick the boot into Richmond as much as any club, can be relied on to, en masse, look after the wellbeing of both the kid and the Richmond football club in this matter.



Or to put it another way, to all those who 'know' he's such a bad guy, put up or shut up and stop creating/believing gossip.

I think you're being a touch sensitive, although clearly some posters have been over the top.

I don't know any of those things about Martin, but comparing to an incident 3 years ago with Hurley is a bit silly IMO. Yes, it was a heinous incident, but the thing here is about patterns and repeated behaviours. If Martin is exhibiting repeated behaviours - and I repeat, I have no inside whispers - then that's when it becomes a concern. If Hurley was to bash someone else, I'd be leading the charge in calling for his head.

 

[santa claws]

its well known yes even among afl players that if you take certain prescription tablets with alcohol you get a high.

i really do ask how many do it. more than you think id say.its not do they do it but how many are doing it or similar.
they train they have skin folds and all sorts of things that have to be met. rather than a skinful of booze the night before and then get up and try and train hung over its a bourbon and coke with a sleeping tablet.

reckon similar happens all the time.
i look upon the 700 odd afl players as a microcosm of society. eg if 1 in 4 aged between 18 and 30 do recreational drugs regularly it would be a reasonable bet that is mirrored in afl.
how many 18 to 30 yr olds go out and get drunk every weekend. i bet the afl is a reflection of that. we kid ourselves if we think other wise.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Idiotic biased head in the sand post bookmarked for when he is either sacked or checks into rehab.

To be fair to some of the posters, how often do we hear "XXXXX is on the gear, I've heard it from mates in the know", and it turns out to be complete tripe?

We have posters saying several players are addicted to some serious drugs on this thread, with their proof being nothing to rumours from mates who have heard rumours from other people.

its a lot of take as gospel and sack a player over

 

[Catsmaninamerica]

To be fair to some of the posters, how often do we hear "XXXXX is on the gear, I've heard it from mates in the know", and it turns out to be complete tripe?

We have posters saying several players are addicted to some serious drugs on this thread, with their proof being nothing to rumours from mates who have heard rumours from other people.

its a lot of take as gospel and sack a player over

Great point. But to be honest, we're coupling those rumors with the constant press speculation In this instance. And the last time there were this many jungle drums beating about a player in the media was for Ben cousins.

 

[telsor]

I think you're being a touch sensitive, although clearly some posters have been over the top.

I don't know any of those things about Martin, but comparing to an incident 3 years ago with Hurley is a bit silly IMO. Yes, it was a heinous incident, but the thing here is about patterns and repeated behaviours. If Martin is exhibiting repeated behaviours - and I repeat, I have no inside whispers - then that's when it becomes a concern. If Hurley was to bash someone else, I'd be leading the charge in calling for his head.

What is he doing?

Seriously.

Internet gossip aside, that nobody ever backs up, what has he done?

 

[telsor]

Great point. But to be honest, we're coupling those rumors with the constant press speculation In this instance. And the last time there were this many jungle drums beating about a player in the media was for Ben cousins.

The press is speculating he's on drugs? link?

 

[Bazzar]

Given the lack of substance in the Age's article (i.e tangible quotes from people in the know about when, where and what was actually said, the official club responses/statements on the matter etc), this article is basically nothing more than speculation and fluff or a paper filler.

Clearly a 8 second beat up in response to Newmans 10 minute presser.
http://www.richmondfc.com.au/video/2013-01-14/newman-press-conference

 

[Jobe Watson]

Idiotic biased head in the sand post bookmarked for when he is either sacked or checks into rehab.

Dusty is walking the line at the moment. One more particular stuff-up and he's in serious trouble. Richmond supporters can choose to believe that or not, or continue what they've been doing; blocking their ears and repeating "lah lah lah lah" to themselves.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

What is he doing?

Seriously.

Internet gossip aside, that nobody ever backs up, what has he done?

why don't you ask Newman? This thread only exists because he personally made the comment that more than implies that Martin is falling outside of the expected behaviours for off-field behaviour at Richmond

 

[telsor]

Dusty is walking the line at the moment. One more particular stuff-up and he's in serious trouble. Richmond supporters can choose to believe that or not, or continue what they've been doing; blocking their ears and repeating "lah lah lah lah" to themselves.

Care to back that up, or are you just gossiping like a little girl like everyone else?

Put up or shut up.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Great point. But to be honest, we're coupling those rumors with the constant press speculation In this instance. And the last time there were this many jungle drums beating about a player in the media was for Ben cousins.

Actually this is wrong. This is the same media trick they do with any coach, player, or club when there is some blood in the water - swarm all over the issue, and escalate speculation in the hope that something drops out. Cousins wasn't the last example of this, but he was by far the biggest in the current era.

If you restrict to just drugs suspicions, Dane Swan's press attention is still a mile ahead of the attention Martin is getting. And Pies fans, not saying its true, just commenting on the level of media attention (and of course media reporting that the media attention must be indicative of something being true).

My main hope with Martin not being a complete crack head like some allege here is also the knock the same people make of him - he ain't that bright. Do you seriously think Dusty is the type who can micro manage use and amounts to ensure trace levels are not present in his system when tested? Again, not saying he is a clean skin, but the allegations are he is an addict, not an irregular user. Dodging the testers with infrequent small use is one thing, dodging it when you are an off your nut addict is another. Also if his mates are like Connors, doubt they will be any help because he cant even figure out how to work an alarm clock.

When he was busted for the pills last year, apparently he folded very quickly - guy ain't good at lying or deception. If he was using like some here allege, I personally suspect he lacks the tools to keep it quiet, AND dodge the testers, AND avoid the media, AND not drop his training output.

EDIT - just to note on testing, personally I have no doubts Dusty would be on the targeted list since last year - and I'd actually be disappointed if he wasn't (getting busted for using a non-prescribed sleeping pill must at least get you a bit more attention with the pee bottle)

 

[telsor]

why don't you ask Newman? This thread only exists because he personally made the comment that more than implies that Martin is falling outside of the expected behaviours for off-field behaviour at Richmond

Yes, he lacks the self discipline required to be a professional footballer sometimes. Not just from Newman, but the club in general have conceded that.

Now look at what 'everyone knows' in this thread.

Do you see a slight disparity there?

 

[CF]

As long as Martin brings it when it counts then who cares if he is a 'bad boy' whatever that means anyway. Nice to see a player have a bit of a personality for a change. The question of whether his personality will hold him back or see him traded out in a few seasons is a difficult call to make.

I can only compare it to what I have heard Cam Mooney talk about being a young man in the system. He says it took him years to stop being a selfish young man wanting to hit the piss and party, to recognising what he needed to do to play AFL footy and be successful. He talks about his immaturity as young bloke openly and while I am not saying Martin is like Mooney I think it important to remember that he is still a young man who might have some growing up to do.

He is a very talented player but he is also a human being, not a football robot.